Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Dear all I should have asked this question before I got to this stage: Intranet; Win2k / CF5 Which DB should I use? Background: I've an intranet which has been working on Win2k / CF5 / Access just fine for the last couple of years.About 6 months ago I warned the big chiefs that the DB was beginning to get rather large and it was a good idea to consider moving to a proper DB for all the good reasons discussed here and elsewhere many times. M$ SQL server was the obvious choice but when they looked into it they got a big fright on the licensing costs; something around 15 - 20,000 GBP apparently.(some 200 clients use this intranet). I did a brief test of MySQL on my dev server - all too brief as it turns out -and it looked OK so Why not use MySQL? says I, commercial licence is 500 Euros, unlimited clients, and the new version supports all the 'advanced' features you need. Last week at a meeting with all the bigwigs it was agreed. So what happens?I've got a really intractible problem where text fields longer than 255 aren't being returned properly.Whether it's an ODBC problem, a DB problem or a simple configuration problem I don't know, I'm trying to find out, but at the moment my conversion has fallen over at the first hurdle as client vars in CDATA.DATA aren't being returned properly. This is MySQL 4.1I expect I could go to an earlier version, but this new version supports transactions, subqueries and UNION statements, and this intranet app is stuffed full of all of them.It would be a hell of a job to undo all that -- Regards; Richard Meredith-Hardy - r.mh[at]flymicro.com Tel: + 44 (0)1462 834776 FAX: + 44 (0)1462 732668 [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Get this one: http://www.microsoft.com/sql/msde/downloads/download.asp Basicly mssql without the licensing cost (and without some management tools) You can use access as the frontend with this one and upgrading your access db to sql is mostly painless - Original Message - From: Richard Meredith-Hardy To: CF-Talk Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 10:16 AM Subject: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? Dear all I should have asked this question before I got to this stage: Intranet; Win2k / CF5 Which DB should I use? [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
don't forget you can use the normal SQL admin console to admin MSDE jb. On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 10:24:38 +0200, Dirk De Bock - Listclient [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Get this one: http://www.microsoft.com/sql/msde/downloads/download.asp Basicly mssql without the licensing cost (and without some management tools) You can use access as the frontend with this one and upgrading your access db to sql is mostly painless - Original Message - From: Richard Meredith-Hardy To: CF-Talk Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 10:16 AM Subject: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? Dear all I should have asked this question before I got to this stage: Intranet; Win2k / CF5 Which DB should I use? [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
OK... interesting.A couple of questions: I had a look and about the only significant limitation seems to be the 2Gb max size.Whilst I don't expect the current DB will be even a 100th of this I will have to give my clients some sort of idea of longevity. Is there any correlation between a compacted .mdb file size and when the same data is put in MSDE? I have ordinary SQL server enterprise edition running on my dev server for other apps I look after.Will MSDE run alongside it on the same box happily enough?For dev purposes can I get to either thru Enterprise manager? John Beynon wrote: don't forget you can use the normal SQL admin console to admin MSDE jb. On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 10:24:38 +0200, Dirk De Bock - Listclient [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Get this one: http://www.microsoft.com/sql/msde/downloads/download.asp Basicly mssql without the licensing cost (and without some management tools) You can use access as the frontend with this one and upgrading your access db to sql is mostly painless - Original Message - From: Richard Meredith-Hardy To: CF-Talk Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 10:16 AM Subject: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? Dear all I should have asked this question before I got to this stage: Intranet; Win2k / CF5 Which DB should I use? [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
I had a look and about the only significant limitation seems to be the 2Gb max size.Whilst I don't expect the current DB will be even a 100th the amount of concurrent users are also throttled. of this I will have to give my clients some sort of idea of longevity. if the db grows bigger than swap to real sql server. same db will work w/it, just install new engine. Is there any correlation between a compacted .mdb file size and when the same data is put in MSDE? absolutely not. happily enough?For dev purposes can I get to either thru Enterprise manager? you can certainly use em w/msde though i'm not sure of licensing issues, though if you already own enterprise i guess it might not matter. [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
RE: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
So is there any reason to use Access anymore? Ade -Original Message- From: Paul Hastings [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 September 2004 11:09 To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? I had a look and about the only significant limitation seems to be the 2Gb max size.Whilst I don't expect the current DB will be even a 100th the amount of concurrent users are also throttled. of this I will have to give my clients some sort of idea of longevity. if the db grows bigger than swap to real sql server. same db will work w/it, just install new engine. Is there any correlation between a compacted .mdb file size and when the same data is put in MSDE? absolutely not. happily enough?For dev purposes can I get to either thru Enterprise manager? you can certainly use em w/msde though i'm not sure of licensing issues, though if you already own enterprise i guess it might not matter. [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
So is there any reason to use Access anymore? to my mind, there never was a reason to use it in the first place. [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Paul the amount of concurrent users are also throttled. Max 25 it says.With 200 - 300 intranet users I don't think this would be an issue, would it? I haven't got any stats but it's not exactly as if they're hitting it all day long, its primary use is calendar timesheets (client is a publishing house and has half macs half PC's which is why they need it at all). Paul Hastings wrote: I had a look and about the only significant limitation seems to be the 2Gb max size.Whilst I don't expect the current DB will be even a 100th the amount of concurrent users are also throttled. of this I will have to give my clients some sort of idea of longevity. if the db grows bigger than swap to real sql server. same db will work w/it, just install new engine. Is there any correlation between a compacted .mdb file size and when the same data is put in MSDE? absolutely not. happily enough?For dev purposes can I get to either thru Enterprise manager? you can certainly use em w/msde though i'm not sure of licensing issues, though if you already own enterprise i guess it might not matter. [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Richard Meredith-Hardy wrote: Max 25 it says.With 200 - 300 intranet users I don't think this would be an issue, would it? If ColdFusion is the only client connecting to it, there won't be more concurrent users as there are concurrent requests in the CF administrator. IIRC that defaults to 6, so you could connect 4 CF servers to it and still have one left for Enterprise Manager :) Jochem [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
RE: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
More so now? -Original Message- From: Paul Hastings [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 September 2004 11:21 To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? So is there any reason to use Access anymore? to my mind, there never was a reason to use it in the first place. [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
As I said earlier - I should have consulted this list first MSDE would probably do the job for the forseeable future, and that's for free (M$ 'free' ...? can't quite believe it...) with the option of a $4,600 upgrade if MSDE runs into problems.This probably wouldn't have been too difficult if it wasn't for the fact that in my ignorance I've already sung the praises of MySQL and pursuaded the big cheeses they can get the job done for 500 Euros under MySQL commercial licence. I have now got some info on workarounds for my problems with MySQL but when people tell you in that condition -sometimes- this happens it all seems a bit flaky - Somehow I feel I am shortly going to have to do some super-diplomatic back-paddling Adam Churvis wrote: M$ SQL server was the obvious choice but when they looked into it they got a big fright on the licensing costs; something around 15 - 20,000 GBP apparently.(some 200 clients use this intranet). You can pick up a 1 CPU license to the Standard Edition for under $4,600 from Buy.com. Respectfully, Adam Phillip Churvis Member of Team Macromedia Advanced Intensive Training: * C# ASP.NET for ColdFusion Developers * ColdFusion MX Master Class * Advanced Development with CFMX and SQL Server 2000 http://www.ColdFusionTraining.com Download CommerceBlocks V2.1 and LoRCAT from http://www.ProductivityEnhancement.com The ColdFusion MX Bible is in bookstores now! [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Wait...wait... wait when MS/SQL Server Team say 25 concurrent clients and we're running only CF to access that stored data in MSDE DB will have only 1 client connection(CF ODBC/JDBC connection)? Mistake? Cheers Richard Meredith-Hardy wrote: Max 25 it says.With 200 - 300 intranet users I don't think this would be an issue, would it? If ColdFusion is the only client connecting to it, there won't be more concurrent users as there are concurrent requests in the CF administrator. IIRC that defaults to 6, so you could connect 4 CF servers to it and still have one left for Enterprise Manager :) Jochem [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
RE: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
I have ordinary SQL server enterprise edition running on my dev server for other apps I look after. Will MSDE run alongside it on the same box happily enough? I'm a bit confused. If you already have SQL Server Enterprise Edition installed on a machine, why would you want to install MSDE on that same machine? Why not just use the (presumably licensed) copy of SQL Server instead? You will probably have some issues getting MSDE to coexist with an existing SQL Server installation, actually, as they're both essentially the same thing. If you installed SQL Server using named instances, MSDE will probably install ok, although I can't guarantee it since I've never tried it myself. If you installed SQL Server using a default instance, I doubt you can easily install MSDE unless you can install it as a named instance. I don't know enough about MSDE installation to know whether it can be customized enough to make that work. Even if you could get them both running, I'm not sure what that buys you, though. For dev purposes can I get to either thru Enterprise manager? Yes. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ phone: 202-797-5496 fax: 202-797-5444 [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
RE: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Ditto _ From: Paul Hastings [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 September 2004 11:21 To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? So is there any reason to use Access anymore? to my mind, there never was a reason to use it in the first place. _ [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
RE: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Yes, this is correct, you can easily use MSDE to host an up BUT there are some limitations (well at least there used to be...) MSDE will -- 1. Support up to 2Gb RAM. 2. 2GB database size limit - this can restrictive if you have a text datatype heavy DB 3. Supports up to 2 CPU on Windows NT or Windows 2000 box. 4. Has No publishing for transaction replication. 5. No Database Server Failover Support. 6. No Full-text search. 7. No OLAP. 8. No English Query. 9.No SQL Books Online. Some of these may not be true now but they certainly used to be... From: Web Specialist [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 September 2004 13:34 To: CF-Talk Subject: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB? Wait...wait... wait when MS/SQL Server Team say 25 concurrent clients and we're running only CF to access that stored data in MSDE DB will have only 1 client connection(CF ODBC/JDBC connection)? Mistake? Cheers Richard Meredith-Hardy wrote: Max 25 it says. With 200 - 300 intranet users I don't think this would be an issue, would it? If ColdFusion is the only client connecting to it, there won't be more concurrent users as there are concurrent requests in the CF administrator. IIRC that defaults to 6, so you could connect 4 CF servers to it and still have one left for Enterprise Manager :) Jochem [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
Re: Now I'm in a fix. Which DB?
Max 25 it says.With 200 - 300 intranet users I don't think this would be an issue, would it? i used to be *5*. it used to be an issue. [Todays Threads] [This Message] [Subscription] [Fast Unsubscribe] [User Settings] [Donations and Support]
