Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-26 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Alessandro Vesely wrote: Rodrigo Severo wrote: b) try to detect the specific situation when this problem occurs with simple non-obstrusive code and use a more convoluted strategy to choose MXs only then; That apparently implies saving host status information. Storing host status only

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-26 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Rodrigo Severo wrote: Well, there is obviously a third and much more concrete option: the one Sam effectively provided in Courier 20050626. My first impression after a quick look at it is that this solution is uneffective but I can't elaborate more on it now as I need more time to better

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-25 Thread Alessandro Vesely
Rodrigo Severo wrote: [...] I'm wondering if it might be better to: a) not to deal with it at all because there might be so few cases Appealing as this option can be, to make an informed decision we still need a sharp view of what we don't want to deal with. Your clear analysis of the

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Alessandro Vesely
Sam Varshavchik wrote: A real DNS server returns records in random order. That's a fundamental function of DNS: load balancing. Is it random or round robin? For multihoming, load balancing should imply that querying from net A results in (at least averagely) different addresses than

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Alessandro Vesely wrote: Sam Varshavchik wrote: A real DNS server returns records in random order. That's a fundamental function of DNS: load balancing. Is it random or round robin? I've checked bind9's documentation, it's random-cyclic as they call it, i.e., they just randomly

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Scott Morizot
On 24 Jun 2005 at 8:30, Rodrigo Severo wrote: As far as I can understand this would result in much less than reasonable load balancing for MX records. I still couldn't get a comment from Sam on this matter but I really think that Courier's current strategy for MX choosing isn't very

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Sam Varshavchik
Rodrigo Severo writes: I still couldn't get a comment from Sam on this matter but I really think that Courier's current strategy for MX choosing isn't very reasonable as it relies on the randomness of the list provided by bind. It's fast but rather uneffective. I'm thinking about it.

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Scott Morizot wrote: On 24 Jun 2005 at 8:30, Rodrigo Severo wrote: As far as I can understand this would result in much less than reasonable load balancing for MX records. I still couldn't get a comment from Sam on this matter but I really think that Courier's current strategy for MX

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Scott Morizot
On 24 Jun 2005 at 10:42, Rodrigo Severo wrote: I bet you haven't followed the discussion from the begining. As a quick resume, the load-balancing talk entered the discussion as a side-effect of the information Sam provided that Courier relies on the random order DNS answers are usually seem

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Sam Varshavchik wrote: Rodrigo Severo writes: Let's see this example: 10 brsmtp02.br.abnamro.com 10 brsmtp04.br.abnamro.com 15 naxpf001.abnamro.com 15 naxpf002.abnamro.com 15 naxpf003.abnamro.com 15 naxpf011.abnamro.com 15 naxpf012.abnamro.com 15 naxpf013.abnamro.com 30 plum03ap.abnamro.com

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Gordon Messmer
Rodrigo Severo wrote: I've checked bind9's documentation, it's random-cyclic as they call it, i.e., they just randomly choose the new first member of the list and then recreate the list in the same order from this point. As far as I can understand this would result in much less than

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Gordon Messmer
Rodrigo Severo wrote: Being dependent on the way bind randomizes it's answers the distribution won't have anything near a 50/50 distribution, I'm afraid. Let me explain why. The way bind randomizes it's answers, only 10 different answers are possible: ... What do you know... That /is/

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Gordon Messmer wrote: Rodrigo Severo wrote: To use the example you provided later: Let's see this example: 10 brsmtp02.br.abnamro.com 10 brsmtp04.br.abnamro.com 15 naxpf001.abnamro.com 15 naxpf002.abnamro.com 15 naxpf003.abnamro.com 15 naxpf011.abnamro.com 15 naxpf012.abnamro.com 15

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Scott Morizot
On 24 Jun 2005 at 12:48, Rodrigo Severo wrote: I agree completely. It isn't bind randomness strategy per si that creates the distortion. Nor is Courier's MX choosing strategy either. It's the *interaction* of bind randomness strategy and Courier MX choosing strategy that produces the

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Sam Varshavchik
Scott Morizot writes: On 24 Jun 2005 at 12:48, Rodrigo Severo wrote: I agree completely. It isn't bind randomness strategy per si that creates the distortion. Nor is Courier's MX choosing strategy either. It's the *interaction* of bind randomness strategy and Courier MX choosing strategy

Re: [courier-users] MX randomizing: trying to understand thesources.

2005-06-24 Thread Rodrigo Severo
Scott Morizot wrote: On 24 Jun 2005 at 12:48, Rodrigo Severo wrote: I agree completely. It isn't bind randomness strategy per si that creates the distortion. Nor is Courier's MX choosing strategy either. It's the *interaction* of bind randomness strategy and Courier MX choosing strategy