Re: deliberately crashing ancient computers (was: Re: A mighty fortress is our PKI)
On Jul 28, 2010, at 11:04 AM, Jonathan Thornburg wrote: http://www.crashie.com/ - if you're feeling malicious, just include the one line JavaScript that will make IE6 crash, maybe eventually the user will figure it out. (Or maybe not). Please stop and think about the consequences before using something like this! People who are still using IE6, Windows 95, etc, are usually doing so for reasons which make sense in their lives I agree 100% with the statement that deliberately crashing other people's computers is inappropriate. Don't do that. But the reasons you give for why there are still IE6 installations out there (low computer literacy, slow connections, etc.) aren't quite right. Apparently there are many internally-developed applications at companies that are IE6-only. Often, these were developed by outside consultants for customers who have no internal development staff. These things keep the business running, and replacing them would be a large expense that the companies involved are not in a position to incur. One of the biggest and most visible of such applications was the one that the national realtor's organization used to allow its members to get access to listings. They resisted doing anything about that for many years. (I understand that within the last year or so, they finally had to respond to complaints from their members and redo the site.) It will be many years before these internal applications disappear. They are in a class similar to embedded systems, where replacement of working stuff is almost never done, and support obligations on long-obsolete software run for decades. Microsoft would love to forget that IE6 ever existed - what was once their way of dominating much of the Internet has turned into a millstone around their necks; but they can't. (Analogies to The Ring of Sauron come to mind) An interesting benefit that some of the businesses with IE6-only internal software are finding is that, if they keep their employee's machines IE6-only, their employees are increasingly unable to access most Internet sites. Talk about perverse incentives -- Jerry - The Cryptography Mailing List Unsubscribe by sending unsubscribe cryptography to majord...@metzdowd.com
deliberately crashing ancient computers (was: Re: A mighty fortress is our PKI)
On Tue, 27 Jul 2010, Jack Lloyd suggested: http://www.crashie.com/ - if you're feeling malicious, just include the one line JavaScript that will make IE6 crash, maybe eventually the user will figure it out. (Or maybe not). Please stop and think about the consequences before using something like this! People who are still using IE6, Windows 95, etc, are usually doing so for reasons which make sense in their lives, things like (a) very low computer literacy (b) slow/unreliable internet connections (dialup?) (c) old/small/slow computer ( lack of money to buy a better one) (d) English not her/his native language (to read your how-to-upgrade msg) (e) that's what all their friends professional colleagues use These people are unlikely to change just because your site makes their computer crash. (They're also unlikely to distinguish between IE6 crashed and the computer crashed, and yes, they're likely to blame your website for the problem.) I too would love to see IE6 die. Ditto Windows 95. But I don't think actively trying to crash my colleague Professor X's computer is either ethical or an appropriate solution to her ancient computer environment. (She is elderly, retired, lives in a very poor country in South America, and has only dialup internet. The local computer shops/geeks where she lives usually recommend Windows 95 for upgrades/reinstalls. I don't know what web browser they pitch...) Ultimately though, the only thing that's going to get some people off IE6 is the machines they are running it off of finally dying, either due to hardware failure or being so badly owned by worms that the machine becomes inoperable, at which point it goes into the trash and they buy a new one. Yup. -- -- Jonathan Thornburg [remove -animal to reply] jth...@astro.indiana-zebra.edu Dept of Astronomy, Indiana University, Bloomington, Indiana, USA Washing one's hands of the conflict between the powerful and the powerless means to side with the powerful, not to be neutral. -- quote by Freire / poster by Oxfam - The Cryptography Mailing List Unsubscribe by sending unsubscribe cryptography to majord...@metzdowd.com
Re: deliberately crashing ancient computers (was: Re: A mighty fortress is our PKI)
On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 11:04:30AM -0400, Jonathan Thornburg wrote: On Tue, 27 Jul 2010, Jack Lloyd suggested: http://www.crashie.com/ - if you're feeling malicious, just include the one line JavaScript that will make IE6 crash, maybe eventually the user will figure it out. (Or maybe not). Please stop and think about the consequences before using something like this! People who are still using IE6, Windows 95, etc, are usually doing so for reasons which make sense in their lives, things like [...] Personally I'm not planning on doing anything one way or another to encourage or discourage people using IE6. In the spectram of social badness, I'd view using IE6 roughly on par with using heroin - a bad idea that mostly hurts oneself with some limited (albeit real) negative externalities. As with using drug rehabilitation versus prison sentences to reduce use, the real solution to IE6 is education and assistance for those who want it, not punishment. Some will, for whatever reason, choose to ignore said educational/assistance efforts, and eventually will take the consequences of their actions without any antics by you or I. And certainly I have better things to do with my time than crash a decade-old browser. Thanks, Jack - The Cryptography Mailing List Unsubscribe by sending unsubscribe cryptography to majord...@metzdowd.com
