Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread James A. Donald
On 2014-11-22 03:01, d...@deadhat.com wrote: Rather than me listing names, why not just let it rip and run your own randomness tests on it? Because that won't tell me if you are performing entropy extraction. Jytter assumes an x86 machine with multiple asynchronous clocks and

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread James A. Donald
On 2014-11-22 06:31, d...@deadhat.com wrote: OK, if you think my Jytter TRNG is weak, I did not say it was weak. I said Jytter (and any other algorithm) is deterministic when run on an entropy free platform. This is a simple fact. All platforms have entropy. If they boot from a physical

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread stef
On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 08:13:31PM +1000, James A. Donald wrote: The question is, does all this entropy show up in Jytter? I rather think it does. the question is: is your adversary nature, or human nature? -- otr fp: https://www.ctrlc.hu/~stef/otr.txt

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread Russell Leidich
All, in the interest of clarity: 1. Let's do the math. Let's assume that we have a really dumb entropy extractor which waits around for 128 interrupts to occur. It just sits in a loop sampling the timestamp until this criterion is satisfied. It saves all these time stamps to a big chunk of

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread Kevin
On 11/22/2014 4:08 AM, James A. Donald wrote: On 2014-11-22 03:01, d...@deadhat.com wrote: Rather than me listing names, why not just let it rip and run your own randomness tests on it? Because that won't tell me if you are performing entropy extraction. Jytter assumes an x86 machine with

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread Sandy Harris
On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 11:58 PM, Russell Leidich pke...@gmail.com wrote: 1. Let's do the math. Let's assume that we have a really dumb entropy extractor ... that the timing of each interrupt arrives predictably, but for an error of 1 CPU clock tick, at random. ... 128 interrupts gives us 128

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread Russell Leidich
in your case, hash 128+N samples to get, say, 127.99 bits of entropy per hash output. N is small, under 20 I think. Yeah this certainly inspiring with respect to milking decent entropy from coldbootish environments. If we assume the use of a good hash, then the problem reduces to one of asking

Re: [cryptography] random number generator

2014-11-22 Thread James A. Donald
On 2014-11-23 09:47, Russell Leidich wrote: in your case, hash 128+N samples to get, say, 127.99 bits of entropy per hash output. N is small, under 20 I think. Yeah this certainly inspiring with respect to milking decent entropy from coldbootish environments. If we assume the use of a good