Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS-Disposable victims
-Caveat Lector- J FROST wrote: I started the dope debate to collect all arguments. I had no idea that I would get so many. I have created a folder to put all the post so I could sort out the arguments pro and con. The above is the only part of your e-mail that sounds half way intelligent. After this you go down hill quick. Did you smoke some pot? Probably not. I have rarely run into a pot head who was less rational then you seem to be. If pot is a means to "get stupid" as you often referred to it as, you do not need it. You seem to be operating on a natural "high". Howard Davis A good observation. Perhaps massive doses of St. John's Wort will provide some relief to this highly agitated individual. flw DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS bible.B
-Caveat Lector- #1 You support the "freedoms" of drunks, dope users and all the above to endanger and sacrifice a % of innocent victims or #2 You do not support the freedoms of people to endanger and sacrifice any victims? #3 or .. you are a two face hypocrite who denies others the same freedoms you wish to grant drunks and dope users? Which is it Jethro? /// Your arguments are specious and you jump to ridiculous conclusions. My opinion of course. The connections you make in your e-mails are not valid. It boils down to freedom, as you say, but freedom to do as one pleases as long as it does not hurt someone else or damage property that does not belong to you. \\\ * Note how this one WILL NOT RESPOND TO THE QUESTIONS. * Next he says it is his opinion but he does not give HIS opinion of any other possibilities then the 3 listed (THERE ARE NONE !) * The connections I make are not valid, but he has no reason why they are not valid. His original arguments were it is the "freedom" of people to endanger others and sacrifice a % of others so they can get their cookies off. Every one of my examples fit HIS arguments. * Next he says people should have their freedoms as long as it does not harm others, BUT THE FACT IS dopers/drunks... when in a stupor DO Cause us to pay higher taxes, cause us to pay higher insurance, injure and kill innocent people ! == Another began to quote bible to make his argument and when I countered with bible that exposed his "bible" arguments, he says: For some people, religion is a teacher of morals. Morals help shape good character. How can you be a good judge of character if you don't examine the foundation of a person's morals and ethics? /// It was you who quoted bible verses as some kind of CHRISTIAN proof to protect dope users. You wish to pretend like the bible is some truth UNTIL that same bible trashes your arguments ... and then that TRUTH is only some moral teaching? In my years I have identified atheist, homosexuals, humanist, pagans ... God haters of all kinds. BUT when it fits their purpose, how they quote bible scriptures to prove some truth ! There is another nice little "moral" teaching from the bible... By their fruits, you will know them (evil beings) If the bible be true or nay, the hypocrisy of the bible haters expose them for what they are. === In the last couple of days the only arguments I have seen have been "whats-a-matter-wit-you". In debate, I have found the golden proofs/arguments are those one's adversary will not respond to. When they begin to dance around the arguments and change the issues to whats-a-matter-wit-you, they are grasping for straws. Who's delusions of the truth is right? Like any good investigation the process of elimination works very well. Look for those who keep on changing their story. Look for those who must have double standards. Look for those who change the questions to an attack on others. Look for those who will not reply to the questions posed. Now I need only arrange your arguments in the categories they belong in and present them before the jury. Thank you Mr pervert, Mr bleeding heart liberal, Miss wiccan, Mr atheist ... you have provided all the pieces of the puzzle and each juror will be able to arrive at their own verdict. DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS bible.B
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 2/7/99 11:21:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: #1 You support the "freedoms" of drunks, dope users and all the above to endanger and sacrifice a % of innocent victims or #2 You do not support the freedoms of people to endanger and sacrifice any victims? #3 or .. you are a two face hypocrite who denies others the same freedoms you wish to grant drunks and dope users? Which is it Jethro? ((MY ANSWERS: #1 NO, the way you have stated it is do I support those groups being allowed to sacrifice innocent victims, absolutely not, no one should be allowed to hurt another (innocent) person, period. #2 That is correct I do not support a persons freedom to harm others, I THOUGHT I MADE THIS CLEAR. #3 I don't want to give ANYONE the freedom to hurt others, period, whether dope users or drunks, or Joe Tea-totaler either. AGAIN, you make the specious argument that being allowed to drive drunk is THE SAME as harming or "sacrificing" someone, IT IS NOT! UNTIL AN INJURY HAS BEEN DONE TO PERSON OR PROPERTY NO CRIME HAS BEEN COMMITTED. It's simple, why can't you get it? NO ONE HAS THE "RIGHT" TO HARM ANOTHER INNOCENT PERSON, PERIOD. /// Your arguments are specious and you jump to ridiculous conclusions. My opinion of course. The connections you make in your e-mails are not valid. It boils down to freedom, as you say, but freedom to do as one pleases as long as it does not hurt someone else or damage property that does not belong to you. \\\ * Note how this one WILL NOT RESPOND TO THE QUESTIONS. ((Done)) * Next he says it is his opinion but he does not give HIS opinion of any other possibilities then the 3 listed (THERE ARE NONE !) ((Done, No one has the right to harm others. Neither dope users, or drunks as you say, nor someone who is perfectly sober. I support everyone's right to do WHATEVER they want as long as they do no injury to person or property (excluding their own). When injury is done they lose that right and should be punished. Simple, that is the other option.)) * The connections I make are not valid, but he has no reason why they are not valid. His original arguments were it is the "freedom" of people to endanger others and sacrifice a % of others so they can get their cookies off. ((Someone driving drunk is not a criminal since no damage has been done to property or person just by his act of driving. You assume that he automatically is guilty of killing or hurting property. Not so. If he injures person or property he loses his rights and is subject to punishment. PERIOD. Your arguments make assumptions that are invalid. People who take drugs or drink are not universally "stupid" or "in a stupor" to such a point that they AUTOMATICALLY kill or injure.)) Every one of my examples fit HIS arguments. ((NO they don't. You address nothing directly.)) * Next he says people should have their freedoms as long as it does not harm others, BUT THE FACT IS dopers/drunks... when in a stupor DO Cause us to pay higher taxes, cause us to pay higher insurance, injure and kill innocent people ! ((So do SOBER PEOPLE who have never had a drink. Or perhaps you deny that anyone who is sober does anything that causes your taxes or insurance to go up? Does your criteria support these people's punishment? I ask you, should they be punished to? )) Teo1000 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS-Disposable victims
-Caveat Lector- I started the dope debate to collect all arguments. I had no idea that I would get so many. I have created a folder to put all the post so I could sort out the arguments pro and con. When people take a stand from scratch or when they are emotionally involved, they can not see the forest for the trees... but if they can stand back and see both sides of the argument before they step into the debate, they can take their choice as to where they stand from all info. I will post this last note and then collect your responses and put into my dope folder. === The only argument I have seen that is left is: This is not a valid argument IMO. Besides I would submit that there are plenty of people who are crazy who walk around all the time with a loaded weapon and DON'T shoot anyone. Should they all be punished simply because they MIGHT do something wrong? The POTENTIAL for crime is not a sufficient reason to charge illegality and People can not be stopped from doing what they want because they MIGHT hurt someone else. == Freedom = being able to do what you want. In this argument any one should be able to do any thing they want ... for the purpose of their own profit or to get their cookies off people must be allowed to endanger and kill innocent victims. A while back I asked these questions: *** Here your argument is (I think) should people be stopped from doing something just because it MIGHT result in harming others. #1 Do you believe in equal rights ... yes or no #2 Should every one have the same right to profit, get stupid or do any thing they want because their acts only have the potential to harm others? #3 or should only a select group have the right to endanger others? Let me know before I post a list of people who are fined and imprisoned for endangering others and then I will ask why you are not defending them. *** I don't remember the exact statistic now, but if they said 60% of all prisoners who were released early would be sent back as repeat offenders. 60 out of every 100 is going to rob, rape, kill or beat the bloody hell out of an innocent victim. So, knowing that not all prisoners will commit another crime, they let out a batch of 100.. And for every 100 let out, 60 of them are going to rob, rape, kill or beat the bloody hell out of an innocent victim. = On the theme that you are going to allow people to have their freedoms in spite of the fact a % of them will sicken, injure or kill others, you have agreed that the innocent disposable victims are with the freedoms of the perverts. The bleeding heart liberals creed, people must have their freedoms to profit, get their cookies off or do damn well please at the expense of innocent victims. #1 Do you believe in equal rights ... yes or no #2 or should only a select group have the right to endanger others? DO ANY THING YOU WANT AT THE RISK AND SACRIFICE OF A % OF INNOCENT VICTIMS. If all bleeding heart liberals hold the same standard for everyone then: Tell me if you defend people's rights to * Should ex convicts be able to carry guns, after all every ex con would not shoot some one. * I saw where a baby crib manufacturer sold over 100,000 cribs and only 7 babies were killed, so why should that manufacture lose their freedom to profit, just because some babies were killed? * Do you support kid's right to drag race on the streets. Why take away their rights because after all drag racers do not kill innocent people. * Why should your employer be forced to pay thousands of dollars to make sure you do not get hurt, after all, only a percent of people will be injured or killed. Why shouldn't your employer have the right to risk your safety and life? * Do you protect parent's rights to lock their little kids in a car on a summer day... after all only a small % of kid's lives will be sacrificed so the parents can do what they want. * Run through stop signs after all, ever one who runs through a stop sign does not injure or kill others. Now Mr bleeding heart liberal, do you stick by your "principals" that disposable victims must be sacrificed so people can have their "freedom" to profit or get their cookies off? In the list above I have shown several categories of such people, do you support ALL pervert's rights to sacrifice disposable victims or are you a double standard hypocrite who has a different philosophy for others? #1 You support the "freedoms" of drunks, dope users and all the above to endanger and sacrifice a % of innocent victims or #2 You do not support the freedoms of people to endanger and sacrifice any victims? #3 or .. you are a two face hypocrite who denies others the same freedoms you wish to grant drunks and
Re: [CTRL] Party punks/ [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS-Disposable victims
-Caveat Lector- Concerning your diatribes: If you wish to be on the list, please do it without the invective rhetoric. This is not a list about political theories of right vs left. And as to which delusions are correct. Continue this offtopic nonesense and ill-behaviour and your ability to post will be curtailed. Simple. Om K - Aloha, He'Ping, Om, Shalom, Salaam. Em Hotep, Peace Be, Omnia Bona Bonis, All My Relations. Adieu, Adios, Aloha. Amen. Roads End Kris DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS**
-Caveat Lector- "Brown, Jeremy" wrote: -Caveat Lector- MJ, I admit I'm quite puzzled by your post. You say that I'm afraid of freedom, however you have produced nothing to support that claim. What I am afraid of is that more people, like my friend, will die because we all sit by plucking daisies and turning our heads to something we can work together to prevent. Also, you have said that a potential is not a crime. You're right, but..(this may shock you)...DRUNK DRIVING IS It's illegal! You can't even have an open container in the car with you. That's the issue. And, again, I'll try and explain it to you in simple terms. I agree that if what you do does not harm anyone but yourself, by all means do it until you drop dead. That was not what I am saying. I'm saying that when your actions have negative impacts on those around you it becomes a problem. So please, everybody...stop thinking that I'm challenging freedom. I'm not! I'm only saying that there have been far to many good people cut down by drunk drivers. Something needs to be done. And, MJ, for you to even use the term "discrimination" in the same sentence as drunk driving is downright offensive. Jeremy I believe that in the common law there was such an offense as "reckless endangerment". If someone observed another by HIS ACTIONS endangering others that person could be prosecuted. If a jury of his peers decided that, in fact, he had violated other's rights by acting recklessly he could be convicted. The rights of both the person doing the "reckless endangerment" and those he might effect were protected. The laws that are above mentioned are not designed in a similar way in that the charge may or may not follow actions which indicate that the possible offender was acting in a way which endangered others. This is the major problem with drunk driving laws, in my opinion. However, in the majority of instances offenders of drunk driving laws are apprehended subsequent to actions that are indicative of recklessness. Howard Davis DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 2/4/99 12:05:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You wouldn't let a crazy person walk through a shopping mall with a loaded pistol, correct? This is not a valid argument IMO. Besides I would submit that there are plenty of people who are crazy who walk around all the time with a loaded weapon and DON'T shoot anyone. Should they all be punished simply because they MIGHT do something wrong? The POTENTIAL for crime is not a sufficient reason to charge illegality against someone. Remember that during the end of the 19th century and the early 20th century the people in charge thought it was "best" that certain people not breed because they had the "potential" to have children who were deformed, and etc. Thus they rationalized their arguments for sterilization, which they subsequently carried out. Mind you I am NOT saying it is necessarily saying it is a good thing to drive drunk, just pointing out the ridiculousness of laws that punish for potential, not for action. Teo1000 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 2/4/99 3:27:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Why blame the little addict when it's the gov. pushing in the first place??My humble opinion as it is.hmmm... Excellent point lost in the shuffle by some probably! Teo1000 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS
-Caveat Lector- Teo One Thousand wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 2/4/99 3:27:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Why blame the little addict when it's the gov. pushing in the first place??My humble opinion as it is.hmmm... Excellent point lost in the shuffle by some probably! Teo1000 Why thank you, did you catch my grave error in stating that MT didn't have an opencontainer law? Well, I was wrong, I guess that's changed...and a speed limit is coming our way soon.but the bars here still give go cups as you walk out the door..make sense?? barley DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS 05 Equality.A
-Caveat Lector- I would submit that there are plenty of people who are crazy who walk around all the time with a loaded weapon and DON'T shoot anyone. Should they all be punished simply because they MIGHT do something wrong? /// People can't help it that they are crazy but sane people are held accountable for their choices. I'll bet crazy people aren't allowed to have guns. Here your argument is (I think) should people be stopped from doing something just because it MIGHT result in harming others. #1 Do you believe in equal rights ... yes or no #2 Should every one have the same right to profit, get stupid or do any thing they want because their acts only have the potential to harm others? #3 or should only a select group have the right to endanger others? Let me know before I post a list of people who are fined and imprisoned for endangering others and then I will ask why you are not defending them. DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS 03 My Body.B
-Caveat Lector- There is no such thing as "stupid/illegal." "Stupid" and "illegal" are different words. They have different meanings. To conjoin them is disingenuous /// The words have different meanings ... like water you are different things, but when you get in the water you are all wet. When someone altars their minds with dope/booze they make them self stupid. While crime is a different thing than stupid, stupid people commit more crimes. People who make them selves stupid, make me pay higher insurance. People who make them selves stupid, make me pay higher taxes. People who make them selves stupid, sicken, injure, assult and kill innocent people. Even when they don't kill people by intent in their stupor, their victims are just as dead. You can tell a dirt bag when they create different standards than they have for themselves, so what do you say to this law... When some drunk kills someone's little kid, the drunk should be made sober and their kid be tied to a tree and hit by a car. After all we know liberals believe in equality don't they? How about anyone intoxicated on the job will be denied insurance coverage when they have an accident? How about the next time some one on a stupor rapes a woman, your mother will be taken to prison to be raped by some convict? If these suggestions enrage you, you are a dirt bag, you are willing to allow such things to happen to other people's families but not your own? boo hoo = GUNS VS DOPE Like guns, drugs themselves cause no harm until they are used by those who can't handle them /// What kind of people use guns in crimes.. Less than 3% of all weapon crimes are used in emotional crimes (Most domestic disputes, some in a fit of rage) When people become highly emotional, they are not rational, they even call it temporary insanity... ( crime - not accidents) #1 Less than 7 % of weapon crimes are used when emotions cause the brain to malfunction. #2 and over 89 % of all weapon crimes are used by dopers and drunks. WHEN THE BRAIN IS MALFUNCTION Get your own statistics from the disease control center and then explain to us why those with altered brains do what they do. Booze and dope makes the brain malfunction. There are thousands of people in gun clubs who meet with their guns and NEVER kill anyone. Cops are NEVER called to this group of people ... but look at the groups of people who meet in liquid dope establishments and get the police reports to see how many times the cops have been there! == Guns have been at every one's finger tips for the last 200 years. When I was a kid there was no rules against carrying a knife in school (except switch blades) Kids could get guns from home, but they weren't going to school with guns. Guns and knives were ready available for the last 200 years ago but it has not been until the last 45 years after the dope revolution that kids have been murdering kids and metal detectors are in schools. /// Drugs has been around and in use since Neanderthal times. Never were they fought over until they were prohibited by law. What ever harm \\\ Well when I was in school, if someone mentioned the word pot, the only thing that would have came to my mind is the thing you had to empty in the out house in the morning. Cocaine .. just something you might see in a movie, crack, that vertical line up your rear. speed, something that was good at the drag strip .. Dope was non existent when I was in school No, not until after the drug revolution did crimes multiply and today (48 Hours) 80% of all those in prison are drunks/dope users. Guns have always been available, it was not until after the drug revolution that kids had to pass metal detectors to get in school. In 1986 I was ripped off for my tools, the ones with which I was feeding my family at the time. There is no doubt whatsoever that they were stolen by a cocaine addict. There is no doubt whatsoever that he sold them to buy cocaine. There is also no doubt that elements of the United States Government aid, abet ... Hmmm I never thought about it that way but you are right. If we were allowed to defend ourself we could blow a hole through the heads of dope users and/or drunks who commited crimes against us, they could/would not harm us or anyone else again, BUT it is the government who 1) Protects the criminials so we can not protect ourselves. 2) They make us pay to keep the criminials and then 3) They turn the criminials lose to get stupid and rob, rape, beat and/or kill another victim. So we have the unofficial criminials on the streets and the official criminials in the government. === Billions are made because of prohibition. It has corrupted our society at every level, from the cop on the
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS 05 Equality.A
-Caveat Lector- Frosty wrote: #1 Do you believe in equal rights ... yes or no MJ: Yes. but based upon the Natural Rights Ideal of an individual's RIGHT to their own life as the subjagation of might. Frosty wrote: #2 Should every one have the same right to profit, get stupid or do any thing they want because their acts only have the potential to harm others? MJ: Every action could *potentially* harm others. Only ACTUAL harm to others should 'punished'. Frosty wrote: #3 or should only a select group have the right to endanger others? MJ: Define and provide examples of 'endanger'. Frosty wrote: Let me know before I post a list of people who are fined and imprisoned for endangering others and then I will ask why you are not defending them. MJ: Non sequitur Regard$, --MJ However big the fool, there is always a bigger fool to admire him. -- Nicolas Boileau-Despréaux DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS
-Caveat Lector- One writes: The Drug War is marketed as the only way to "save our children." Yet, eighty years into the most protracted and expensive experiment in Prohibition in history, illicit drugs are more available on the streets, on our playgrounds, and in our school yards than ever. What are the real consequences of these disastrous policies? Click on any topic at right to learn more about what's gone wrong, and how we can fix it. Prohibition is the problem. You can be part of the solution. Join DRCNet today, and SAY NO to the Drug War -- your voice makes a difference. drug-related HIV/AIDS and needle exchange kids and the drug war chronic pain management people of color and the drug war drug treatment medicinal marijuana more coming soon! === Why not make robbery, rape and murder legal. /// Because those are crimes against persons...I am arguing for decriminalizing victimless crimes... \\\ When women are raped by those in a stupor When people are killed in wrecks by those in a stupor When dopers are in a stupor robbing and killing people are there no victims? === It is not legal to be drunk and drive? Of course it is illegal to be drunk and driving but after one becomes drunk, they get in a stupor and their logic/fears/reflexes are lost. Their fear of being caught drunk or doped up .. their common sense is lost... so because it was legal for them to get drunk, they got in a stupor and because they got in a stupor * It cost the rest of us money out of our pockets to pay for their stupor. * It cost injury and death to thousands of innocent each year for their right to be in a stupor. Victimless crimes? * Tell me why non drunks have to pay billions of dollars for extra cops to catch and lock up drunks (who are involved in legal dope) * Tell me why innocent people killed by drunks aren't victims? * Tell me why the families of innocent victims are not victims of drunks? Legal drunks ... Legal dope users so then the government makes their slaughter, assaults, rapes legal ? /// Most rapes, etc., are NOT done by drunks...or by dope users... \\\ Duh, did you miss 48 hours last week. What amount of rapes did they reveal happened while the pervert was in a stupor? and the statistics on all the criminals in prison, 80% of them were stupid on booze/dope when they committed their crimes. = So you ARE arguing for reinstution of Prohibition, aren't you? Just come out and admit it. /// NO, prohibition could never work in a government in which the politicians are mob bosses on the take. The only way prohibition would ever work is by having the death penalty for drunks/dope users and the death penalty for those who get rich defending them. With in a year there would be about 2000 executions and after perverts knew they could not get away with it or buy their way out of it, it would become almost non existent. After that time the perverts would stop killing themselves and innocent victims. With in 10 years there would be over 15 times more lives saved than those executed. NO, I am not stupid enough to think it will ever happen in a corrupt government in which the perverts have their rights at the loss of the rights of the innocent. I know innocent people will never have their rights in America, I only point out that perverts and their bleeding hearts are an evil force in an evil nation. It does not matter that it will not be changed, establishing the faces of the evil is my only point. == "Making dope legal will stop crime" Double Duh Booze is legal and on the cop videos and in our newspapers we see grocery stores broken into, we read about people being killed by drunks who are just getting enough money to get drunk. /// How do they know that the crimes were done by those who are alcoholics? \\\ Because they admitted to that reason, because they were caught stealing booze, because the muggers beating/killing their victims were drunks/dope users who were not robbing to by a tv, fix their car or to send money to Fawell, They beat and rob victims in order to get their next stupor. They were stupid on dope or booze while committing their crimes ! How do I know, because that is what the FACTS state. === they wouldn't have to do if heroin, etc., were available CHEAPLY to them via a government program... We'd also cut down on the incidencense of diseases which are spread via the sharing of needles... /// Take a look at the documentary on needle park and see what a crock this is. Who is going to pay for the government doctors, offices and dope... me? = Heh
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS
-Caveat Lector- It is hard to follow your schizophrenic posts, with talk back and forth on the issue, but I will respond thus. Driving while intoxicated is a choice you make, there are consequences for that choice, that you MAY hurt someone. I may go out and kill someone today just cause I feel like it, does that mean I should be restrained in my house simply for that reason? I am not defending ones right to drive drunk, because I don't want to be killed by a drunk driver any more than you do, but it is still a penalizing of POTENTIAL wrong which is nowhere supported in our system of law. Drugs have been assailed for years at a tremendous cost and what do we have now, more people on drugs and a worse situation. At the least stop the insanity of a huge military expenditure (against the Posse Comitatus anyway) to combat this and do something else. The answer does not necessarily have to be legalization, but what we have now is crap, period. As for registering and living in areas free from "perverts" well, that is something that others have tried to no good end. Since under your scheme whatever goes against my grain is "perverted" I should have the right to be free from all of the nefarious influences. I suspect you were being somewhat facetious? Teo1000 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS
-Caveat Lector- I have to jump on this one here. I think that punishing someone for the potential to do wrong, in a case such as this, IS the right thing to do. You mentioned that you may go out and kill someone because you feel like it (hypothetically, of course). I think, based on that rationale, that you should be restrained. If a person displays homicidal tendencies, as well as an inability to understand the ramifications of their actions, then they should indeed be kept under some sort of lock and key. If you drink, your judgement is impaired, right? You are no longer able to understand or fully comprehend your actions or the consequences thereof. You get behind the wheel of a car, a very dangerous piece of machinery, and you are running the very high risk of killing or hurting yourself and (worse) other people. You wouldn't let a crazy person walk through a shopping mall with a loaded pistol, correct? Yet, we see nothing wrong with letting hundreds of weekend warriors out and about with their mental faculties no less hampered with a far more dangerous and destructive piece of equipment at their fingertips. Drunk drivers are a danger and a menace. If we could nip the problem at its source, perhaps alot of lives that have already been lost (a very good friend of mine's among them), could have been spared. -Original Message- From: Teo One Thousand [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 11:27 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS -Caveat Lector- It is hard to follow your schizophrenic posts, with talk back and forth on the issue, but I will respond thus. Driving while intoxicated is a choice you make, there are consequences for that choice, that you MAY hurt someone. I may go out and kill someone today just cause I feel like it, does that mean I should be restrained in my house simply for that reason? I am not defending ones right to drive drunk, because I don't want to be killed by a drunk driver any more than you do, but it is still a penalizing of POTENTIAL wrong which is nowhere supported in our system of law. Drugs have been assailed for years at a tremendous cost and what do we have now, more people on drugs and a worse situation. At the least stop the insanity of a huge military expenditure (against the Posse Comitatus anyway) to combat this and do something else. The answer does not necessarily have to be legalization, but what we have now is crap, period. As for registering and living in areas free from "perverts" well, that is something that others have tried to no good end. Since under your scheme whatever goes against my grain is "perverted" I should have the right to be free from all of the nefarious influences. I suspect you were being somewhat facetious? Teo1000 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substance-not soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsub
Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS**
-Caveat Lector- Ed, I think you were too busy nailing together your soapbox to pay attention to what I wrote and you missed my point entirely. I agree that you have the right to do whatever you want to your body, and nowhere in my post did I challenge that. The issue I was raising was that once you get behind the wheel of a car, you have now brought people into the equation who did not ask to be a part of your choices or actions. That's when it becomes less an issue of freedom than an issue of public safety, something that should be monitored and protected. I never EVER said that the government could or should be able to dictate what we as individuals choose to do or not do. And I think if you had actually read and comprehended what I said, instead of seeing it as a means for you to drape yourself in the American flag shout about how the government is seeking to control you, you would have seen that for yourself. In the future, perhaps it is you who should apply a little common sense. JB -Original Message- From: Ed Moore [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 1:26 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS** -Caveat Lector- If I want to go to the hardware store, pick up a can of gold spray paint, bring it home and spray it into a bag and inhale..THAT'S MY RIGHT!!! I would be incredibly stupid, but it's still my right to do to my body what I want to do. If I get all screwed up on paint fumes and get into a car..my rights end because my "choice" would jeopardize other innocent people. Do you understand about "freedom of choice"? People have to and should be held accountable for their own actions if their actions interfere with other people's rights, privacy and lifestyles. If my actions don't effect anyone but myself, and I practice my choices in the privacy of my own home, then nobody, especially the hypocritical government, has any right to tell me what I can and cannot do to my own body...PERIOD! The War on Drugs is about MONEY and CONTROL!!! Alcohol, Pharmaceutical Poison and Tobacco are alright but smoking a dried out plant isn't? The War on Drugs is a fraud and people are finally seeing that by the results of the Medical Marijuana initiatives. Use common sense and see this issue for what it is and support freedom of choice! -Original Message- From: Brown, Jeremy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thursday, February 04, 1999 12:06 PM Subject: Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS -Caveat Lector- I have to jump on this one here. I think that punishing someone for the potential to do wrong, in a case such as this, IS the right thing to do. You mentioned that you may go out and kill someone because you feel like it (hypothetically, of course). I think, based on that rationale, that you should be restrained. If a person displays homicidal tendencies, as well as an inability to understand the ramifications of their actions, then they should indeed be kept under some sort of lock and key. If you drink, your judgement is impaired, right? You are no longer able to understand or fully comprehend your actions or the consequences thereof. You get behind the wheel of a car, a very dangerous piece of machinery, and you are running the very high risk of killing or hurting yourself and (worse) other people. You wouldn't let a crazy person walk through a shopping mall with a loaded pistol, correct? Yet, we see nothing wrong with letting hundreds of weekend warriors out and about with their mental faculties no less hampered with a far more dangerous and destructive piece of equipment at their fingertips. Drunk drivers are a danger and a menace. If we could nip the problem at its source, perhaps alot of lives that have already been lost (a very good friend of mine's among them), could have been spared. -Original Message- From: Teo One Thousand [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 11:27 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS -Caveat Lector- It is hard to follow your schizophrenic posts, with talk back and forth on the issue, but I will respond thus. Driving while intoxicated is a choice you make, there are consequences for that choice, that you MAY hurt someone. I may go out and kill someone today just cause I feel like it, does that mean I should be restrained in my house simply for that reason? I am not defending ones right to drive drunk, because I don't want to be killed by a drunk driver any more than you do, but it is still a penalizing of POTENTIAL wrong which is nowhere supported in our system of law. Drugs have been assailed for years at a tremendous cost and what do we have now, more people on drugs and a worse situation. At the least stop the insanity of a huge military expenditure (against the Poss
Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS**
-Caveat Lector- MJ, I admit I'm quite puzzled by your post. You say that I'm afraid of freedom, however you have produced nothing to support that claim. What I am afraid of is that more people, like my friend, will die because we all sit by plucking daisies and turning our heads to something we can work together to prevent. Also, you have said that a potential is not a crime. You're right, but..(this may shock you)...DRUNK DRIVING IS It's illegal! You can't even have an open container in the car with you. That's the issue. And, again, I'll try and explain it to you in simple terms. I agree that if what you do does not harm anyone but yourself, by all means do it until you drop dead. That was not what I am saying. I'm saying that when your actions have negative impacts on those around you it becomes a problem. So please, everybody...stop thinking that I'm challenging freedom. I'm not! I'm only saying that there have been far to many good people cut down by drunk drivers. Something needs to be done. And, MJ, for you to even use the term "discrimination" in the same sentence as drunk driving is downright offensive. Jeremy -Original Message- From: M. A. Johnson [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 3:20 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS** -Caveat Lector- Brown, Jeremy wrote: The issue I was raising was that once you get behind the wheel of a car, you have now brought people into the equation who did not ask to be a part of your choices or actions. MJ: When ANYONE gets in a car they *COULD* kill others -- whether they are drunk, drugged, LACK ABILITY, EXHAUSTED or otherwise. A potential is NOT a crime. Why the FEAR of freedom? Brown, Jeremy wrote: I never EVER said that the government could or should be able to dictate what we as individuals choose to do or not do. MJ: You JUST did above by supporting 'drunk driving' discrimination. ANY crime which does NOT involve the violation of another's property *IS* merely an exercise in control, serves to provide legislated advantage to one or more persons and/or a revenue source for the State. Regard$, --MJ Thieves respect property. They merely wish the property to become their property that they may more perfectly respect it. -- G. K. Chesterton Government has no other end but the preservation of Property. -- John Locke DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substance-not soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS**
-Caveat Lector- Jeremy Brown: You say that I'm afraid of freedom, however you have produced nothing to support that claim. MJ: Criminalizing driving while drunk infringes upon one's freedom to do such. While it may not be SMART to participate in such an action, if *I* were to become 'shit-faced' and drive home without incident and keeping it between the lines ... HOW have *I* infringed upon *YOUR* property (life and its corolaries)? Again, why are you afraid of freedom? Jeremy Brown: What I am afraid of is that more people, like my friend, will die because we all sit by plucking daisies and turning our heads to something we can work together to prevent. MJ: 'Drunk driving' has been criminalized for many years. Has it prevented people from their own stupidity? What of those people who lack the ability to have a license (or their abilities have deteriorated) -- why do we not FINE them or criminalize THEIR actions? What of those exhausted persons who exhibit LIKE characteristics of SOME intoxicated drivers? Jeremy Brown: Also, you have said that a potential is not a crime. You're right, but..(this may shock you)...DRUNK DRIVING IS It's illegal! MJ: So are many items which should NOT. Drunk driving like many 'crimes' serve to raise revenue for the State. What is your point. Jeremy Brown: You can't even have an open container in the car with you. That's the issue. And, again, I'll try and explain it to you in simple terms. I agree that if what you do does not harm anyone but yourself, by all means do it until you drop dead. That was not what I am saying. I'm saying that when your actions have negative impacts on those around you it becomes a problem. MJ: ALL of your actions could be construed to impact those around you. Should we do as Frosty and all live in his Authoritarian padded world where we might be able to breathe without instruction from another? Jeremy Brown: So please, everybody...stop thinking that I'm challenging freedom. I'm not! MJ: But you most certainly ARE. *You* believe drunk driving is wrong ... so you seek the Government's legalized use of FORCE to penalize others who seek the Freedom to decide for themselves. Jeremy Brown: I'm only saying that there have been far to many good people cut down by drunk drivers. Something needs to be done. MJ: Why not simply EXECUTE those persons who 'kill' other persons? Jeremy Brown: And, MJ, for you to even use the term "discrimination" in the same sentence as drunk driving is downright offensive. MJ: The FACT that Joe would be fined for 'blowing a 1.0 BAL' if stopped in a road block where Stan would be allowed to go through (even though he had not slept in 72 hours) is discriminatory. This is based upon arbitrary whim and NOT on ability or lack therof. That you refuse to see this reality is another matter. Regard$, --MJ Liberty is the only thing you cannot have unless you are willing to give it to others. -- William Allen White October 24, 1940 We see that as soon as we surrender the principle that the state should not interfere in any question touching on the individual's mode of life, we end by regulating and restricting the latter down to the smallest detail. The personal freedom of the individual is abrogated. He becomes a slave of the community, bound to obey the dictates of the majority. It is hardly necessary to expatiate on the ways in which such power could be abused by malevolent persons in authority. The wielding of powers of this kind even by men imbued with the best of intentions must needs reduce the world to a graveyard of the spirit. -- Ludwig von Mises, "Liberalism: The Classical Tradition" (The Foundation for Economic Education, Inc., 1995), p.54 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] DOPE SUPPORTERS 04 Freedom
-Caveat Lector- How exactly is passing a Law which says one cannot 'smoke a rock of crack' going to ensure 'people' are NOT going to then 'drive a school bus'? We have discriminatory drunk driving laws currently, but 'people' STILL choose this behavior. /// No law stops crime, if so there would be no crime. Law only stops those who fear getting caught. When there is no law, no one needs to fear and what ever act considered will be multiplied many folds. Why the FEAR of freedom? /// What a giggle, now perverts want to use "freedom" as their argument? #1 Freedom is the right assert one's will. #2 When there is a conflict of wills and one group has power to enact their will, then the other group loses their rights. Freedom, liberty, rights .. just pretty words to declare who gets to have their way. When ever there is a conflict of wills, then one segment of society will lose their rights in order that the other segment receive their rights. If perverts get their rights to endanger innocent victims then the innocent segment of society will lose their rights not to live in fear of perverts. If perverts have their rights to sicken/endanger/kill innocent people then innocent people will lose their rights to live. If perverts get their rights to kill innocent people then the families of those victims will lose their freedom not to have to bury their loved ones. If the non wreckless segment of society gets their rights/freedoms then the perverts will lose their rights to intimidate, injure, sicken, kill innocent people and perverts will lose their freedom to make us pay higher taxes to pay for their perverted deeds. You want to talk about freedom rights, fine Either perverts get their freedom/rights at the expense of innocent society or innocent society will get their freedom/rights at the expense of perverts. Let me see do I chose to take away the rights of innocent people to live with out terror, injury, death ... to pay for the deeds of perverts so the perverts can get their cookies off? Duh, what do you think? Perverts don't give a damn about the rights of the innocent segment of society that must pay for their perverted acts but the innocent segment of society must care about the "rights/freedoms" of perverts to get their cookies off? Right on Jethro . DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] **DOPE SUPPORTERS**
-Caveat Lector- Brown, Jeremy wrote: It appears that, in an attempt to get to the bottom of this, we have painted ourselves into a corner. MJ: ? Brown, Jeremy wrote: This is the old "fire in a crowded theater" argument. MJ: False analogy. One who yells fire in a crowded theater fraudulently incites others to 'stampede'. Brown, Jeremy wrote: Having to choose which freedoms are scared and which are not. MJ: I contend that utilizing the Natural Right standard (also identified within the Declaration of Independence) of an individual's RIGHT to their OWN life 'frees' one to choose for himself (or choose a 'guardian' to choose for him and him alone). Brown, Jeremy wrote: Driving drunk is a proven killer. MJ: So is driving while exhausted -- however, that carries no 'criminality'. Brown, Jeremy wrote: What I am saying is that steps should be taken to PREVENT drunk driving. Education, contracts for life, things like that. MJ: That is not what you previously stated. I have no problem if one desires to utilize his OWN resources in an attempt to encourage others. Brown, Jeremy wrote: I AM afraid of dying, especially such a wasted and pointless death as being run down by Joe Jock coming home from the Mellow Tiger after a real bender. MJ: Perhaps we should eliminate automobiles. :) As to Frosty's fallacy of logic ... that most certainly must be why we had so many Heroin adict children at the turn of this century when every corner 'drug store' sold heroin to anyone who asked. Regard$, --MJ No nation was ever drunk when wine was cheap. -- Thomas Jefferson DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
