Re: picviz license (generated images as derivative work ?)
Le Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 03:45:40PM +0100, Pierre Chifflier a écrit : Note that the GPL places important restrictions on derived works, yet it does not provide a detailed definition of that term. To avoid misunderstandings, we consider an application to constitute a derivative work for the purpose of this license if it does any of the following: o Integrates source code from Picviz o Integrates images generated by Picviz o Executes Picviz and parses the results (as opposed to typical shell or execution-menu apps, which simply display raw Picviz output and so are not derivative works.) o Integrates/includes/aggregates Picviz into a proprietary executable installer, such as those produced by InstallShield. o Links to a library or executes a program that does any of the above Dear Pierre, it looks like the Picviz authors want to prevent some competitors to encapsulate Picviz in a proprietary system. In many aspects, this is already forbidden by the GPL. Perhaps you can recommend them to ask for clarifications to the FSF if necessary, and perhaps also to have a look at the AGPL if among their worries there is the case where a competitor would make a proprietary web service encapsulating Picviz. Similarly, it looks like the GPL considers the the build and install system as part of the source code, and the clarification that Picviz should not be installed via InstallShield looks therefore unnecessary. Have a nice day, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120226114307.gb8...@falafel.plessy.net
picviz license (generated images as derivative work ?)
Hi, Since a few versions, the picviz [1] license has changed for the following: ---8 Describes the terms under which Picviz is distributed. A copy of the GPL is appended after the specific Picviz license terms. * *** Specific Picviz license terms *** * BEGIN Picviz means: Picviz parsers, Picviz library (libpicviz), Picviz command line interface (CLI) and Picviz graphical user interface (GUI). Note that the GPL places important restrictions on derived works, yet it does not provide a detailed definition of that term. To avoid misunderstandings, we consider an application to constitute a derivative work for the purpose of this license if it does any of the following: o Integrates source code from Picviz o Integrates images generated by Picviz o Executes Picviz and parses the results (as opposed to typical shell or execution-menu apps, which simply display raw Picviz output and so are not derivative works.) o Integrates/includes/aggregates Picviz into a proprietary executable installer, such as those produced by InstallShield. o Links to a library or executes a program that does any of the above The term Picviz should be taken to also include any portions or derived works of Picviz. This list is not exclusive, but is meant to clarify our interpretation of derived works with some common examples. Our interpretation applies only to Picviz--we don't speak for other people's· GPL works. /END GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE Version 3, 29 June 2007 [... text of GPLv3 ...] ---8 Note: picviz is a parallel coordinates plotter which takes data (text) as input and creates an image (png, jpeg, etc.). As the maintainer of the picviz Debian package, my question is the following: Are the clarifications added to the license, and especially the fact that generated images by picviz, considered to be additional restrictions, and do they cause problems with respect to the DFSG ? Thanks, Pierre [1] http://www.picviz.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120225144540.ga6...@mail.wzdftpd.net
Re: picviz license (generated images as derivative work ?)
Note that the GPL places important restrictions on derived works, yet it does not provide a detailed definition of that term. It's so on purpose: it's copyright law that says what is a derived work. Authors can't extend the reach of their rights at will. At least when they don't sell devices that implement effective technological means /alessandro, not a lawyer, not a DD -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20120225151844.ga22...@mail.gnudd.com
Re: picviz license (generated images as derivative work ?)
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 15:45:40 +0100 Pierre Chifflier wrote:
Hi,
Hi!
[...]
*
*** Specific Picviz license terms ***
*
[...]
Note that the GPL places important restrictions on derived works, yet
it does not provide a detailed definition of that term.
Well, actually, the GNU GPL v3 does never talk about derivative
works: it talks about works based on other works...
But anyway...
To avoid
misunderstandings, we consider an application to constitute a
derivative work for the purpose of this license if it does any of the
following:
o Integrates source code from Picviz
o Integrates images generated by Picviz
Anything that incorporates any output of Picviz is considered as a
derivative work of Picviz ?!?
I am not a lawyer, but, as far as I can tell, this is inconsistent with
the actual definition of the concept of derivative work, as found in
existing copyright laws in various jurisdictions, *unless* the output
of Picviz includes substantial portions of Picviz itself.
o Executes Picviz and parses the results (as opposed to typical shell or
execution-menu apps, which simply display raw Picviz output and so are
not derivative works.)
According to this interpretation any script that does something like
VERS=`env LC_ALL=C apt-cache policy $PACKAGE | awk '/Installed/ { print $2;
}'`
should be considered as a derivative work of apt-cache?!?
Again, I am not a lawyer, but this seems to be a bit overreaching...
o Integrates/includes/aggregates Picviz into a proprietary executable
installer, such as those produced by InstallShield.
o Links to a library or executes a program that does any of the above
[...]
As the maintainer of the picviz Debian package, my question is the
following:
Are the clarifications added to the license, and especially the fact
that generated images by picviz, considered to be additional
restrictions, and do they cause problems with respect to the DFSG ?
I am under the impression that those clarifications are a bit
overreaching and thus constitute further restrictions with respect to
the GNU GPL v3.
They could cause problems with respect to DFSG #9, at least.
However, please note that the GNU GPL v3 has a clause that states that
any further restriction may be removed (see Section 7):
[...]
| All other non-permissive additional terms are considered further
| restrictions within the meaning of section 10. If the Program as you
| received it, or any part of it, contains a notice stating that it is
| governed by this License along with a term that is a further
| restriction, you may remove that term.
[...]
I think you should try to persuade upstream to drop the above-quoted
clarifications and adopt the GNU GPL, without any further restriction
or attempt to change definitions found relevant laws.
I hope this helps a bit.
Bye and thanks for taking this issue seriously.
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