Re: kernel firmwares: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Marco d'Itri
On Sep 07, Thomas Bushnell BSG [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The widely accepted custom was to interpret the DFSG this way, yes. This is what matters. What is your evidence of this? My experience of 9 years in Debian, which can be verified by browsing the list archives. -- ciao, Marco

Re: kernel firmwares: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Thomas Bushnell BSG
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Marco d'Itri) writes: On Sep 07, Thomas Bushnell BSG [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The widely accepted custom was to interpret the DFSG this way, yes. This is what matters. What is your evidence of this? My experience of 9 years in Debian, which can be verified by browsing

Re: Firmware Social Contract: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Thomas Bushnell BSG
Anthony Towns [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 10:21:18AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote: We could have met those expectations of the d-i and kernel teams had taken the issue seriously before now. Their failure to do so does not translate to an emergency on my or Debian's

Re: Firmware Social Contract: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Wouter Verhelst
On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 10:19:50AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote: Marco d'Itri [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: As usual you forget that we also have that other commitment to our users, and that we used to pride ourselves in providing the best free OS. There is an absolute ranking in Debian,

Re: Firmware Social Contract: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Steve Langasek
On Thu, Sep 07, 2006 at 01:30:25AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote: On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 10:21:18AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote: We could have met those expectations of the d-i and kernel teams had taken the issue seriously before now. Their failure to do so does not translate

Re: kernel firmwares: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Marco d'Itri
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have not been the only one to be upset about the firmware situation every time it has been brought up, as can be verified by browsing the list archives. I can see that the controversy is old, but certainly not that your interpretation was widely accepted. Wrong. The

Re: Firmware Social Contract: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Martin Wuertele
Hi Steve! * Steve Langasek [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006-09-07 13:35]: There's also something of a difference, IMHO, between dropping sourceless firmware from the kernel with the result that some users will be unable to install etch at all, and requiring that you not add arbitrary other non-free

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Re: Let's vote ...

2006-09-07 Thread Bill Allombert
Hello GR proponents, before we vote I would very much appreciate example of firmware that would be affected by your proposal (and how). I already asked for something similar without answer in August. I am concerned with including in Debian firmwares whose license reduce the usefulness of

Re: Let's vote ...

2006-09-07 Thread Sven Luther
On Thu, Sep 07, 2006 at 01:51:12PM -0500, Bill Allombert wrote: Hello GR proponents, before we vote I would very much appreciate example of firmware that would be affected by your proposal (and how). I already asked for something similar without answer in August. I am concerned with

Re: kernel firmwares: GR proposal

2006-09-07 Thread Bill Allombert
On Fri, Sep 01, 2006 at 02:42:26PM -0400, Raul Miller wrote: What strikes me as ironic, with these proposals, is that we ran into something like this problem back in the 90s, back during the initial adoption of the DFSG, and we had to solve that problem then: we created the non-free and