- - -=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
This is a fairly trivial change.
manoj
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vote stil being colected? If so, could a link to the graphs be
made public, please?
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(persuade how many of the? All? Super majority? rough
consensus?) how a package should be maintained. I don't think that is
how we have behaved, though, as a project.
manoj
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just
patches).
Most upstreams, if they don't use Debian, do not know about
debhelper. At least my packages try to be self contained, and most
upstreams know Make. I think I win this one.
manoj
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On Wed, Mar 31 2010, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mardi 30 mars 2010 à 15:42 -0700, Manoj Srivastava a écrit :
I might agree that maintenance of my packages might raise a
competence bar for the would-be-maintainer, and some people might fail
to meet that bar.
Let’s say we find
On Wed, Mar 31 2010, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mercredi 31 mars 2010 à 05:03 -0700, Manoj Srivastava a écrit :
I just update code in one place, test it, and then run a script
that does a git pull for all my packages. The next time I build the
package, it will pull in the change
On Wed, Mar 31 2010, Joey Hess wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
Abillity to understand fairly simple shell script is not a
matter of tenure. It is a matter of competence. I am dismayed that a
fairly bland invocation of find seems opaque, in your opinion, to
people coming
On Tue, Mar 30 2010, Marc Haber wrote:
On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 11:16:01AM +0200, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
On Thu, 25 Mar 2010, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
What did you say? What difference does it make what tool is used
when the result is equal?
It doesn't make a difference
On Tue, Mar 30 2010, Russ Allbery wrote:
Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org writes:
Le mardi 30 mars 2010 à 07:18 -0700, Manoj Srivastava a écrit :
I am not sure that follows. How has my not using debhelper made
it harder for newcomers?
Your packages are absolutely impossible to maintain
of standardization we can stifle all
variation and innovation.
Ah, needless conformity, the hobgoblin of ...
manoj
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requirements.
Is this what is being considered?
manoj
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On Wed, Aug 12 2009, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
Manoj Srivastava dijo [Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 03:08:52PM -0500]:
I basically oppose such a GR, as it is is merely speculative (who
knows _now_ or at the GR voting time when we will be close to
achieving our release goals?), and because it is a ruling
sayings -- including this one.
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On Tue, Aug 11 2009, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mardi 11 août 2009 à 15:08 -0500, Manoj Srivastava a écrit :
Perhaps you should look at this less confrontationally. The vote
is a non-binding recommendation, it is an information gathering vote
where people provide feedback
, and the dictates of free
software; and the solution we have come up with is called contrib and
non-free areas in our archive.
Isn't that perfectly clear?
manoj
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it.
Such was my understanding as well.
manoj
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for the pessimism. I think we are drifting from
the social contract, really.
manoj
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while. Ambrose Bierce
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I, Mudd, stardate 4513.3
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I think Joey Hess is right.
manoj
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call. Kelvin Throop III, The Management Dictionary
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On Fri, May 01 2009, Luk Claes wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Fri, May 01 2009, Don Armstrong wrote:
On Fri, 01 May 2009, Luk Claes wrote:
A position statement is a decided on proposal that clarifies the
position of the Debian project, but does not explicitly amend a
foundation document
written)
So, I think any efforts to package the current devotee code are
a bit of a waste of time, but I won't stop people from doing so.
manoj
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. By the time you hack
that in and verify it ...
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Franklin
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deciding
collectively?
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notice for the chat program)
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On Fri, Dec 19 2008, Marc Haber wrote:
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 12:09:55AM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
For what it is worth, at work we had to install Lenny on
machines which have the broadcom netextreme 2 ethernet cards (bnx2
firmware needed). The netinst installer worked
that would govern the statement
above.
I have seen either side in the firmware debate staunchly believe
the other side was, err, insane.
manoj
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that the project might
have moved on from the principles that were in effect when we joined
the project.
manoj
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On Fri, Dec 19 2008, Russ Allbery wrote:
Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org writes:
I think we will keep coming back to this biennial spate of
disagreement we have, as we determine whether or not we can release
with firmware blobs or what have you. This also would help developers
.
manoj
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by the virtuous. -- Marion J. Levy, Jr.
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boredom. It is not
always an easy sacrifice.
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inducted in before we had a
constitution are somehow not bound by it, unless we voted in favour? I
do not see the logic here.
manoj
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On Fri, Dec 19 2008, Luk Claes wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
Hi,
I like the idea of clarifying what the principles of the project
actually are, since, as aj said, all the decisions about lenny would
fall out from the position the project take about the foundation
documents
On Fri, Dec 19 2008, Anthony Towns wrote:
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 09:54:08AM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Fri, Dec 19 2008, Anthony Towns wrote:
I tend to come down hard on the side of not compromising my
principles for temporary convenience or popularity (or, if you
the fish.
manoj
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pgp2lxH7BuPql.pgp
Description: PGP signature
until the secretaries term ran out.
manoj
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On Fri, Dec 19 2008, Steve Langasek wrote:
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 02:46:35PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
* Why does releasing despite DFSG violations require a 3:1 majority now
when it didn't for etch? It's the same secretary in both cases. What
changed? I didn't find any
on the topic,
I cannot approve such a manipulation of the vote.
You do not think that the former being incompatible with the
DFSG had something to do with the difference?
manoj
--
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Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org http
Secretary is failing to act in a manner that
safeguards the integrity of that office.
In the interest of keeping the discussion civil, I shall not
respond to this.
manoj
--
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Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org http
on to the ballot. If I had added options
willy-nilly, you would have screamed again of abuse of power.
manoj
--
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world.-- Tadahiro Sekimoto, president, NEC Corp.
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DFSG. The not needing to comply with the DFSG bit is what makes the
super majority come in, and which is why we have a choice 5 on the
ballot.
manoj
--
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them. Thucydides
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for the gr_lenny vote was not
shortened. I'll send out a new CFV.
Sorry about that.
manoj
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is the kind we keep thinking will turn into a tune. Kin
Hubbard, Abe Martin's Sayings
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On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Luk Claes wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Sun, Dec 14 2008, Pierre Habouzit wrote:
On Sun, Dec 14, 2008 at 03:02:17AM +, Debian Project Secretary wrote:
And FWIW I still believe this vote is an horrible mix-up of really
different things, is completely confusing
just see hows of protest were I to rectify: or apply editorial
changes to the proposals.
manoj
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good faith with Manoj as with
everyone else.
The title for ballot lines are proposed by the proposer when
titling their proposals. Ask the proposer.
manoj
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a general resolution
actions that go against a foundation document need the supermajority,
in my opinion.
manoj
--
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above all, be a sheep. Albert Einstein : Understanding the world
Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org http
they can. This I think is the
distinction between option 4 and FD.
Why were these clarifying questions not asked of the proposers
in the discussion period?
manoj
--
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Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org http
majority
requirements? What are the constraints on their ability to decide on
this? What should they be looking at, apart from the constitution, to
decide whether a super majority rule should apply?
manoj
--
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noose.
Manoj
all
kinds of related proposals to be set up on different ballots.
Frankly, I think that kind of gaming of the voting system that
is being proposed now, and I am not comfortable letting that happen.
manoj
--
If you stop to think about it, you're already dead.
Manoj Srivastava
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Loïc Minier wrote:
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
The way that we achive such combinations using condorcet is to
propose such combinations as options intheir own right; and then have
people vote on the combination option along with simple options
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Luk Claes wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Tue, Dec 16 2008, Steve McIntyre wrote:
On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 04:27:22PM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote:
This is where I have a strong disagreement with Manoj and apparently with
you. I don't think there's any justification
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Russ Allbery wrote:
Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org writes:
Have we not been discussing this for weeks now? Related options
belong on the same ballot. Not doing so allows for strategic voting to
game the issue. This is not really an opinion piece
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Loïc Minier wrote:
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
I also
think that placing all related proposals on a single ballot is
relevant, it prevents an easy exploit of the voting system by simply
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, David Weinehall wrote:
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at 01:54:40PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Mon, Dec 15 2008, Russ Allbery wrote:
Thomas Weber thomas.weber.m...@gmail.com writes:
Am Montag, den 15.12.2008, 10:06 + schrieb Steve McIntyre:
I've been talking
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Luk Claes wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Tue, Dec 16 2008, Matthew Woodcraft wrote:
If the proposer of vote/2003/vote_0003 had intended it to give the
Secretary power to impose supermajority requirements on the grounds
that an option conflicts with a foundation
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Russ Allbery wrote:
Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org writes:
On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Russ Allbery wrote:
Basically, to declare this option as requiring a 3:1 majority assumes
an answer to precisely the question that's being disputed, and I don't
think that falls under
.
manoj
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On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Russ Allbery wrote:
Manoj Srivastava sriva...@debian.org writes:
I am not sure how even choice 1 is over riding that decision. Do
you believe that the release team, despite their protestations, is
bundling DFSG violatons into main? If the release team
they are the same; can you explain why those
arguments do not hold, and these are not just different solutions to
the same issue?
manoj
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On Wed, Dec 17 2008, Loïc Minier wrote:
On Wed, Dec 17, 2008, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
I do not think I meant proposed as in formal proposals to be
voted upon. I meant splitting up votes for the same issue which leads
to the results being gamed.
This is an hypothetical case you're
.
manoj
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On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le samedi 22 novembre 2008 à 19:49 -0600, Manoj Srivastava a écrit :
Could you take this tone away from -vote, please?
Manoj, please don’t take this personally,
Then do stop attacking the man, as this email does right now
. :-) Larry
Wall in [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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, and I'll create a composite
page for the rationale for various proposals, with the impact table I
have been sending in email.
manoj
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sourceless firmwares in main, except when it
come to releases, and then that is fine to the proposals 2 and 3?
I am unable to see the distinction between what you seek and
options 2/3.
manoj
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Alito
Manoj
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Steve McIntyre wrote:
Hi Manoj,
On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 11:29:51AM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
Hi,
http://www.debian.org/vote/2008/vote_003
For vote 003, if the proposers want to set up a page of
rationale, to help guide voters through their proposals
a rationale, defensible
position, etc). That would not violate the constitution.
They can't just decide, yeah, it violates the SC, but not very
much, so let us go ahead.
manoj
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Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Steve Langasek wrote:
On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 09:29:06AM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Mon, Nov 17 2008, Stephen Gran wrote:
This one time, at band camp, Josselin Mouette said:
Le lundi 17 novembre 2008 à 14:05 +0100, Peter Palfrader a écrit :
This is not part
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
On 23/11/08 at 11:29 -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
Hi,
Pages of the two issues currently under discussion are now
available (I'll note that none of the proposers ever turned in any wml
for their proposals, so this was done
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Steve Langasek wrote:
On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 02:21:47PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
The constitution does not give release teams the powers to
override the foundation documents, so the release team can not ignore
SC violations.
I can make a formal
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Pierre Habouzit wrote:
On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 07:43:05PM +, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Pierre Habouzit wrote:
I think the primary question that started this line of proposals
was how to resolve the presence of allegedly sourceless
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Steve Langasek wrote:
On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 03:13:38PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Sun, Nov 23 2008, Steve Langasek wrote:
On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 02:21:47PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
The constitution does not give release teams the powers
impolite emails
are likely to cause even more time spent other than fixing bugs.
Can we please stop these in your face emails, and return to
civil discourse, or, failing that, not post at all?
manoj
--
An ounce of prevention is worth a ton of code. an anonymous programmer
Manoj
shut up
is adding negative energy into the discussion, could you please stop?
Or take it away from -vote, which is meant to be free of flames
and have healthy discussion of the issues we are trying to resolve?
manoj
--
Beware of friends who are false and deceitful.
Manoj
words can never express.
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of attacking people
rather than their arguments, I might be forced into a similar opinion.
manoj
--
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Street aren't one in a million, but once would be enough.
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printed
by DEC's RSTS operating system for the PDP-11
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for that. This selective
reading of the SC is one reason I believe the release team is in
violation of the social contract.
manoj
--
University: A modern school where football is taught.
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1024D/BF24424C print 4966 F272
.
If the secretary can't be convinced with this discussion, maybe we should
aim at clarifying this in the constitution itself.
That would be fine.
manoj
--
I'm a Lisp variable -- bind me!
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, cunningly devised, for the mutual
stoppage of speech at a moment when words are superfluous.
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On Tue, Nov 18 2008, Martin Wuertele wrote:
* Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2008-11-18 14:47]:
On Tue, Nov 18 2008, Martin Wuertele wrote:
* Lars Wirzenius [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2008-11-17 19:31]:
(Quote attribution elided on purpose.)
Stop your FUD.
The Release Team isn't
On Tue, Nov 18 2008, Johannes Wiedersich wrote:
Manoj Srivastava wrote:
On Tue, Nov 18 2008, Johannes Wiedersich wrote:
Ben Finney wrote:
The Debian system we provide is usable. There may be devices which are
not yet operable with Debian,
Which wireless card is supported by debian
the distinction of central and periphery and Cell processors is
likely to erode; and our DFSG definition should be forward looking.
manoj
--
It is better to be bow-legged than no-legged.
Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org/~srivasta/
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to modify the foundation
document. We can't just supersede a foundation document otherwise.
manoj
--
Q: What do you get when you cross a mobster with an international
standard? A: You get someone who makes you an offer that you can't
understand!
Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http
in the constitution, is to change it via a 3:1 vote. This is the only
way to reconcile the GR with the constitution, in my opinion.
manoj
--
If all men were brothers, would you let one marry your sister? Author
Unknown
Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org/~srivasta
of it.
manoj
--
Before destruction a man's heart is haughty, but humility goes before
honour. Psalms 18:12
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options wins the 3:1
majority, but loses to another option on the ballot. I suppose a second
vote can then be proposed separately to add the firmware exception to
the DFSG.
manoj
--
Backed up the system lately?
Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org/~srivasta/
1024D
list, please.
manoj
--
Justice is incidental to law and order. Edgar Hoover
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, with the issue on how to go about
releasing lenny, all these proposals are related.
manoj
--
'Tis true, 'tis pity, and pity 'tis 'tis true. Poloniouius, in Willie
the Shake's _Hamlet, Prince of Darkness_
Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org/~srivasta/
1024D/BF24424C
to the RMs. Which the
ballot allows.
manoj
somewhat confused
--
We don't have to protect the environment -- the Second Coming is at
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Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org/~srivasta/
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On Sun, Nov 16 2008, Adeodato Simó wrote:
* Manoj Srivastava [Sat, 15 Nov 2008 17:38:56 -0600]:
That does not seem to make sense. Either you have
'none of this non-free crap in the archive ever'
or you have
'the release team downgrades these bugs and includes non-free crap
On Sun, Nov 16 2008, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le dimanche 16 novembre 2008 à 10:04 -0600, Manoj Srivastava a écrit :
ii Do we allow the Release Team to ignore SC violation bugs: Yes
Rationale: with further discussion nothing changes. Today RMs are
empowered, by delegation, to decide
On Sun, Nov 16 2008, Frans Pop wrote:
On Sunday 16 November 2008, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
I think we can be reasonably sure that the current spate of
discussions is about releasing Lenny. For this action, any of the
ballot options will have a distinct decision; and the ballot should
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