** Changed in: nautilus
Status: New => Expired
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Title:
"Unmount" in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and
** Description changed:
- If I right click a removable device in computer:// there is an Unmount
- Volume option. There's two issues with this:
+ If I right-click a removable device in computer://, there is an Unmount
+ Volume option. There are two issues with this:
- 1) Unmount is a technical
Reopening as part of a review of closed paper cuts.
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Status: Invalid = New
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Title:
Unmount
After more thinking about the way it should work, I have some more
details.
Once a removable media is inserted (but not explicitly mounted), there
should be an icon in the notification area with a symbol representing
such media or a plug of some sort. The icon should have a check-mark to
show
Hi Oliver
On 16 September 2010 17:14, Oliver Joos 28...@bugs.launchpad.net wrote:
@Luca: I understand your point. But it sounds a bit like: omit special
terms in Gnome, lets only use words we already know. Okay, taking a DVD
or USB stick from a PC has something to do with our physical world,
I guess Luca's wish to unmount automatically comes from the scary
error dialog when you just rip off an USB stick after writing to it. But
this would better be solved by more frequent syncing for filesystems on
removable media. Then it could become obsolete to Unmount explicitly.
I did not fully
The vast majority of users don't want to know about mounting or
unmounting; they don't even like knowing that they're supposed to
safely remove in Windows - it makes them uncomfortable or guilty when
they accidentally pull the thing out, which is what they really should
be able to do.
** Changed in: nautilus
Importance: Unknown = Medium
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My point of view is that in my daily 'objects' experiences I never see
something close to 'mount' and 'unmount' verbs.
I can see objects named like: eject, remove, detach, attach, plug, unplug,
switch off, plug in and so on as you can test on your real life and the life of
your direct
The (un)mount thing is tipically a case where the design is framed around the
implementation model rather than the user’s mental model.
Please fix it
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@Luca: I understand your point. But it sounds a bit like: omit special
terms in Gnome, lets only use words we already know. Okay, taking a DVD
or USB stick from a PC has something to do with our physical world, so
eject is intuitive. But temporarily unregistering a filesystem from
the OS is an
see also https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=598690
Changelog of nautilus-2.31.90
* Don't show Unmount when showing Eject/Safe Removal
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/desktop/2.31/2.31.90/NEWS
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and undiscoverable
There are devices that can be Powered Down, Ejected or Safely
Removed manually. The problem I see here is that Ubuntu 10.04 alpha 2
still uses these terms slightly incorrect. E.g. when I connect my mobile
through USB I can Safely Remove or Eject it. I never saw it jumping
out of the USB slot when
2010/1/6 Psy[H[] vovik-...@bk.ru:
Power down is more correct than Remove, because neither OS, nor computer
can not remove device physically, but they can power it down.
...
But Unmount is Unmount and Power down is Power down there is no
ambiguity here, so these words would be preferable. Fear
Chauncellor wrote on 2009-12-09:
Unmount is to unmount the partition
Eject is to unmount all partitions of the drive
Safely Remove is to unmount all partitions of the drive and power off the
device.
If only that were a real behavior... that would be just perfect. BUT:
eject not only unmounts
i like proposal within comment #78
maybe it could be completed, i.e. keep unmount word but make it
understandable by adding something (in preparation for removing)
3 possibilities :
- keep unmount where needed
- change unmount for something more understandable
- keep unmount and make some
Well, the problem is who to please. For average users, you only ever see
Eject or Safely Remove From Windows and MacOS. That's because the
average user just wants to plug in their thumb drive and move stuff.
Nothing more to it.
It seems that GNOME is trying to appease all parties. While not quite
On the desktop, a USB flash drive has the options Eject, Unmount,
and Safely Remove. It is totally unclear what is the difference
between these. Is there a clearer way to distinguish these? Which one
should I do before I remove my USB drive?
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak
Jeffrey: Gnome pulled the It's a feature, not a bug card again.
Unmount is to unmount the partition
Eject is to unmount all partitions of the drive
Safely Remove is to unmount all partitions of the drive and power off the
device.
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=598690#c5
** Bug
I'd like to have another option to Unmount and change the wall paper is it
possible to get that feature also ?
Maybe 3 options to safely remove a key is already a bit too much...
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You
While I do think that antistress' formulation is a bit provocative, I do
agree with the conclusion; three options to safely remove a device is
indeed to much.
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Then let your voice be heard on the gnome bug report (or the mailing
list for that matter).
I for one would love a fourth option to change my wallpaper!
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Marking as triaged there is an upstream bug and it's still open.
** Changed in: nautilus (Ubuntu)
Status: Confirmed = Triaged
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So that's a little more complex. Removable disks have the Eject and
Remove safely options, other drives don't. Asking upstream why it
words that way.
** Changed in: nautilus (Ubuntu)
Status: Fix Released = Confirmed
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and undiscoverable
Gnome 2.28 now has a Remove Safely option as well as Unmount.
Should this be closed, then?
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Agreed.
** Changed in: nautilus (Ubuntu)
Status: Triaged = Fix Released
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Status: Confirmed = Invalid
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i'm using Karmic and i don't see any improvement
see screenshot attached
** Attachment added: Unmount.png
http://launchpadlibrarian.net/35902837/Unmount.png
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The way I see it, unmount is an unfamiliar term to people. as an action,
unmount pops imagery pertaining to stepping off or climbing off
something (like a horse). Wheras Eject implies shooting out or removal.
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and undiscoverable
First of all, let's stop thinking that we are talking about Windows...
this is not Windows, this is Ubuntu and we are using the 100 papercuts
to improve not to copycat another OS, we are talking about our OS, our
UBUNTU not a cheap copy of Windows as many people compare it.
Now to the point, I
While we are trying to simplify by changing unmount to Eject ...
Win7 now uses Dismount !
So , in a few years are we going to come back to Unmount ?
We are trying to make it easier , for average users but the same
question of Eject will arise in a few years , and people will then say
, Eject is
Another good use case for the difference between unmount and eject:
card readers. With my Kingston USB multri-reader under Karmic, I went
to unmount a CompactFlash card so I could manipulate partitions on it,
using the eject icon in the Nautilus sidebar... and then was confused
when I couldn't
** Changed in: nautilus
Status: Unknown = New
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I am very pleased to hear that. Ubuntu should help new users to
distinguish between unmounting filesystems, disconnecting a whole device
or ejecting its removable. Keep them stupid is not Ubuntu.
I wonder that there was not a single comment mentioning the Disk
Mounter panel applet. It is not very
Removing from round-2, as desktop team is busy with GUADEC and this bug
requires more design discussion and I've found a more easily fixable
paper cut to take its place.
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Milestone: round-2 = None
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and
As I said above, Nautilus developers consider they have fixed this
problem using Eject all over the place, except for sub-volumes of a
disk, which still use Unmount. But this case is relatively rare, for
standard uses (USB key, audio player, external HD, network mount...)
Eject will be used - and
I was wondering what among the following should be done for notifications for
Device unsafely removed. Please disconnect/unmount device before
detaching/unplugging/removing
* a new bug
* mention in https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/386057 (which is
invalid in launchpad, as it is
OK. I have a few suggestions that I think could work both ways:
educating the users as well as using simple words without copying
Windows.
I think we should rename Unmount as disconnect. This is better than eject,
because:
1.) Eject has a physical meaning and if the CD gets Ejected when we click
Connect/disconnect and attach/detach both seem to make more sense
than mount/unmount, but this would benefit from some user testing.
We would solve the 80% case if we can avoid the eject/unmount ambiguity
in the case of a CD/DVD being ejected. If we can remove the Unmount
option in this case, it
why confuse the user about a word that could mean something different
from what they are used?
use the icon.
just the icon, and the user will be happy. That's why Win remove safely is used
by users, they don't use the eject command from the file manager.
Is a waste of time open up nautilus
This term could became a feature, something rememberable and
recognized about ubuntu as a linux distribution.
2 PeterB
I agree about change in phrase.
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Psy[H[]: mount is established between UNIX/Linux programmers, administrators
etc. These people make 1% of population. Therefore mount is *not* established
word in general population.
The specific action of unmount is to remove something from something. People
do not know what filesystem or
** Also affects: nautilus via
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576587
Importance: Unknown
Status: Unknown
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As you can see if you read the whole history of the upstream bug, this
problem should be mostly fixed in the current development version. David
Zeuthen and Alexander Larsson have improved the behavior of Nautilus so
that removable devices have an eject option that unmounts all of its
volumes and
** Changed in: nautilus (Ubuntu)
Status: Confirmed = Triaged
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Please unmount storage before unplugging device, you may damage your
data otherwise!
*may* ? why leave the user in doubt about the state of the drive? Can't
the system detect if there was a problem on removal instead of alarming
the user every time? Even better, is there a technical reason why a
Renaming shovel to digging stick, aren't we?
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I would like to point that the problem is even worse in french.
Unmount is translated literally to démonter which also unfortunately means
take to pieces. Thus my parents discovering Ubuntu at my home have let their
USK key a whole day connected to my computer because they were afraid to clic
mount is an established term, consistent with the environment. It
regards specific logical action - removing partition content from
filesystem. To name it unplug or detach is to confuse it with
physical action of removing stick from the port.
Another, harsh but educative option is to leave term
Given the roundabout discussion in all the comments above, I think it's
pretty evident this is not a papercut. Several solutions have been
proposed, including renaming (which is easy) and reworking the UI (which
is a little harder) and adding hooks to hardware events like CD eject
buttons (hard),
Bryce, please don't invalidate paper cuts just because there is a lot of
discussion. Nowhere have we decided that paper cuts must have a design
decision on them before they can be marked confirmed.
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Status: Invalid = Confirmed
--
Unmount in volume
Let's not confuse the individual parts of the problem. We have to deal
with three separate problems here:
1) The term 'Unmount': It is tech-speak and to understand it, users will
first have to develop a mental model of the whole mounting concept. I'm
not sure that forcing the users to learn that
** Description changed:
If I right click a removable device in computer:// there is an Unmount
Volume option. There's two issues with this:
1) Unmount is a technical term users can not be anticipated to know
what means. Remove safely or something would probably be better.
2) It is
I agree with Emmet Hikory [
https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/28835/comments/27
], instead of users having to eject removable media, have the system say
when the user should *not* physically remove said media, specially for
the common usb flash drive case.
--
Unmount in
Remaming of some commands might work, but please include on Koala CD also
gnome-media-applet
http://live.gnome.org/media-applet
PLEASE
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Right, lots of interesting thoughts and opinions, but no conclusion :)
And the bug is waiting for the fix!
Since there is no better solution than Eject, this is what we should use. It
may not be perfect, but it's much better than unmount.
Also, I suggest moving this option up (mockup attached),
ok...
i really think it should go in the places menu,
why sould i need to go to the desktop to unmount a drive. In Windows
there's a icon in the systray
why not go for something really original, instead of only change a word.
Icons are A LOT more intuitive than words.
Words will depend on the
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Milestone: None = round-2
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Please do not use the notification icon method for this. It is counter
intuitive and wastes valuable screen real estate. Let's not duplicate
Windows' flaws just because people are used to them.
I think the simplest way of doing this is to have the menu be device
dependent, after all the device
Really, the whole issue of unmounting a usbstick is not intuitive for
people. I know many people who still just yank the thing out when
they're done with it (even after warnings).
I believe the solution is to have a soft unmount after a device has
been idle for some amount of time (30 secs? 5
I propose that we at least rename Unmount to Disconnect
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Status: Confirmed = Triaged
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Ubuntu is: linux for human beens and not linux for hackers.
If someone put one CD in a computer he will use the eject button on optical
drives to remove it. It is the more logical thing to do. then I think it is not
need the notification for cdrom.
But, if you put a usb key you need to do some
This is the output for my 3,5 USB hard disk which has its own power cord:
azr...@laptop:~$ sudo lsusb -vv -d 04b4:6830
[sudo] password for azrael:
Bus 001 Device 006: ID 04b4:6830 Cypress Semiconductor Corp. CY7C68300A EZ-USB
AT2 USB 2.0 to ATA/ATAPI
Device Descriptor:
bLength
And here's what my USB flash drive shows:
azr...@laptop:~$ sudo lsusb -vv -d 13fe:1d00
Bus 001 Device 007: ID 13fe:1d00 Kingston Technology Company Inc. DataTraveler
2.0 1GB/4GB Flash Drive / Patriot Xporter 4GB Flash Drive
Device Descriptor:
bLength18
bDescriptorType
My thinking is that devices that are powered entirely by the USB port are much
more likely to be unplugged in much the same way as a stick, whereas actual
hard disks would be more likely to have a more permanent connection.
Keep in mind that most of 2.5 and 1.8 USB hard disks are bus powered,
Ajay wrote:
Perhaps we need Advanced... entry / sub-menu in the right click menu.
Advanced menu's are sign of conceptual problems and limitations, like
Other... menu options. They are *very* difficult for users because
they say this is hard which is a disincentive for users to explore
them, and
@Scott Ritchie: as far as i know, only hearing it can help... even on
other OS... it depends only on your hardware device, some have a light,
others vibrate, etc.
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Err what I meant was it possible to tell a powered entirely by the USB
port drive from one that requires an external power source, at a
software level. My thinking is that devices that are powered entirely
by the USB port are much more likely to be unplugged in much the same
way as a stick,
The trick with just removing media without warning the system is the
data write cache, such that users randomly pulling a USB drive without
unmounting may well have not fully flushed all the writes (the Not safe
to remove bit). Perhaps rather than having an explicit unmount/eject
feature, the UI
Regarding CDs: can't we control what happens when the user hits the
eject button? If there's still data to be written we could conceivably
hold it up and warn the user about the problem. I don't see any need to
unmount a cd though (similar to how you don't need to eject a USB
stick)
--
Unmount
Perhaps we need Advanced... entry / sub-menu in the right click menu.
We put the Unmount option there, along with other advanced things - we
may not want everyday users to see.
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You
UNMOUNT: only stop file activities, but let the drive powered.
EJECT: shut down the drive.
and, yes, there's a big need to have them separated. In externat drives, it's
very impotrtant, when I unmount a external hard disk, it's still powered, and
makes me thinks there's something wrong.
@Scott Not every optical drive has an eject button: some are under
software control (but may have some little pinhole into which one may
insert a paperclip: I don't think this sends a software-detectable
event). Also, my use case (A): rewriting rewritable media may require
the ability to unmount,
Is there a way to tell a powered USB drive from an unpowered one (eg a
flash stick)?
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Maybe there could be 2 options in the context menu?
1) Eject
2) Unmount
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We are back to having an unmount entry which doesn't mean anything for
users
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This could be resolved if Ubuntu will contain by default Ejecter applet.
Regarding eject button on optical drives, of course this should be fully
functional without some stupit unmounting ritual..
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and undiscoverable
why not only show an icon and let users think and UNDERSTAND what they
are used to?
i mean:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LittleDetails#Quick%20Unmount
so, there's no need for the user to read Eject or Unmount if he/she
doen't want to :D
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and
I dislike this idea. Why turn it into windows? Linux is most useful
because of its command line. unmount refers to the command being used to
detach something. People will have a harder time learning why Linux is
useful if you keep turning it into windows. Let users understand what
they are used
bah to the CLI ... my parents have ubuntu on there eee 701 there is now
way the want to know what unmount means to remove a usb key drive...
That said 'Im sure we can do better than windows because that isnt good
ethier... neither is the mac drag to trash can
I think what we really need is a
Is there any reason to have separate eject/unmount for USB sticks? To
my knowledge there's no harm from ripping out an unmounted USB stick, so
the eject button might as well simply unmount it in that case.
I'm in favor of removing eject from USB sticks altogether - all it
really does is require
While I'm not that concerned about wording, I do feel there is a use
case for unmounting without removing. Some examples might include:
A) Wishing to overwrite rewritable media from some image (e.g. writing
the newest Ubuntu ISO to a rewritable disk that may have contained
previous data).
B)
I agree with eject, I think this is a good example of an old bug that
begs for a fix :)
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Importance: Undecided = Medium
** Changed in: hundredpapercuts
Status: New = Confirmed
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and undiscoverable
** Also affects: hundredpapercuts
Importance: Undecided
Status: New
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upstream suggests using eject everywhere, discussion on
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576587
** Bug watch added: GNOME Bug Tracker #576587
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576587
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Unmount in volume right-click menu, is tech-speak and undiscoverable
May I ask you Pedro Villavicencio why this should be declined for jaunty? :-)
I think we should at least get a notification saying some like: drive
sucessfully unmounted, it is now safe to remove it if we right click on the
drive and select unmount.
Why shouldn't we?
--
Unmount in volume
Nautilus 2.24 could have an eject button that would be a great improvement
see http://blogs.gnome.org/cneumair/2008/07/08/its-done/#comments
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i was about to report a similar bug :
my father is quite new to PC and i gave him a PC with Ubuntu (he knows a
bit about MS Windows - nearly nothing actually)
This morning, i was showing him how to deal with USB Key, then he asked
me : i think there is something to do before unplugging the
I feel the best solution for this bug is to split up the various issues
into several bug reports and discuss them with the upstream developers
or follow up on existing bugs.
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