On 10/11/10 19:31, Bruno Wolff III wrote:
On Mon, Oct 11, 2010 at 11:41:13 +0100,
Richard W.M. Jonesrjo...@redhat.com wrote:
Some of the things it does which are IMHO better:
- starts disk formatting / copying / installing in parallel
with asking user questions
I think that is a
Hi,
Striving for usability and pleasantness for the untechnical users certainly is
a good thing. It gets problematic when you choose to make things technically
inferior just to please those kind of users.
We don't have to make things inferior to improve usability. To stick
with the
Le Lun 11 octobre 2010 23:44, Farkas Levente a écrit :
imho, the never drop any feature since raid, lvm, iscsi are important
(what's more i use them:-), BUT most user don't ie. 80% of the users
never use them.
If you fail one way or another 20% of users you fail period. That's not an
On Wed, 6 Oct 2010 12:50:00 -0600 Kevin Fenzi wrote:
On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 09:19:08 +0200
Michal Schmidt mschm...@redhat.com wrote:
In the policy I do not see as clear distinction between F(n)
(current stable) and F(n-1) (old stable) as Jaroslav proposes. The
closest to it is this sentence:
On 10/12/2010 09:53 AM, Gilboa Davara wrote:
the other point of richards is what the whole fedora community and
redhat should have to understand: most users like ubuntu rather then
fedora/redhat. why? because:
-... better is what most user like. period.
Following your simplistic logic,
On 10/12/2010 10:28 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote:
Hi,
Striving for usability and pleasantness for the untechnical users certainly
is
a good thing. It gets problematic when you choose to make things technically
inferior just to please those kind of users.
We don't have to make things
On 10/12/2010 02:16 PM, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
On 10/12/2010 10:28 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote:
Hi,
Striving for usability and pleasantness for the untechnical users certainly
is
a good thing. It gets problematic when you choose to make things technically
inferior just to please
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 8:16 AM, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn
denni...@conversis.de wrote:
On 10/12/2010 10:28 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote:
Hi,
Striving for usability and pleasantness for the untechnical users certainly
is
a good thing. It gets problematic when you choose to make things
Compose started at Tue Oct 12 08:15:31 UTC 2010
Broken deps for x86_64
--
Inventor-2.1.5-39.fc14.i686 requires
/usr/share/fonts/liberation/LiberationMono-Regular.ttf
Inventor-2.1.5-39.fc14.i686 requires
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 6:17 AM, Michal Schmidt mschm...@redhat.com wrote:
- remove any features
Michal
How do you guys update Gnome then? ;)
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On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:43:16 -0400 Brandon Lozza wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 6:17 AM, Michal Schmidt wrote:
- remove any features
Michal
How do you guys update Gnome then? ;)
Perhaps you're confusing me with someone else. I have nothing to do with
Gnome.
But did Gnome ever
Anaconda goes though everything step-by-step instead, asking one
question after another, doing some work inbetween (partitining), asking
more questions (packages to install) ...
We have worked a little to reduce this over time, too. If you remember
we used to have a confirmation screen
On 10/12/2010 02:57 PM, Jean-Francois Saucier wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 8:16 AM, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn
denni...@conversis.de wrote:
On 10/12/2010 10:28 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote:
Hi,
Striving for usability and pleasantness for the untechnical users
certainly is
a good thing. It
2010/10/11 Gilboa Davara gilb...@gmail.com:
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 12:09 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 17:39 +0200, Gilboa Davara wrote:
Comparing the Ubuntu 10.04 DVD installer (which I use a couple of weeks
ago) to Fedora 13 DVD installer is like comparing the Cessna to a
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 02:16:49PM +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
The only way to accomplish this without actually removing the features is
to have two anaconda modes one for easy desktop installation and one full
featured mode. This mode should be chosen not by the user but by the spin
Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
On 10/12/2010 10:28 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote:
Hi,
Striving for usability and pleasantness for the untechnical users
certainly is a good thing. It gets problematic when you choose to make
things technically inferior just to please those kind of users.
We
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 9:48 AM, Michal Schmidt mschm...@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:43:16 -0400 Brandon Lozza wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 6:17 AM, Michal Schmidt wrote:
- remove any features
Gnome is known for removing features, it was a joke.
Perhaps you're confusing me
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 11:11 -0400, Chris Lumens wrote:
- downloads updates in parallel too
Package updates?
- uses IP geolocation to guess the user's timezone and keyboard
settings (it's been 100% correct for me each time)
We can do this, it's just never really been brought up.
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 11:41 +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
I installed and played with Ubuntu 10.10 over the weekend (in a VM),
and I have to say that their installer is very smooth indeed. It's
starting to make anaconda look distinctly clunky.
Some of the things it does which are IMHO
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 19:23 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 15:44 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
Sadly enough, this means that a shiny Ubuntu installer is to the whole
distribution what GNOME shell is to the GNOME project. It doesn't matter
if you've got a lot of bells and
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On 10/12/10 7:20 AM, Rudolf Kastl wrote:
I am doing the same setup, nice to see someone else with those
requirements. actually without kickstart setting up softraid in
anaconda was broken (try it manually without precreated partitions...
it will
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On 10/12/10 7:20 AM, Matthew Miller wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 02:16:49PM +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
The only way to accomplish this without actually removing the features is
to have two anaconda modes one for easy desktop
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 08:06:59AM -0700, Jesse Keating wrote:
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On 10/12/10 7:20 AM, Matthew Miller wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 02:16:49PM +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
The only way to accomplish this without actually removing the
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On 10/12/10 8:13 AM, Chuck Anderson wrote:
Making advanced only a choice at the beginning of a 10 step process
is a non-starter and leads to the problem you describe above. If
instead there were Advanced Options... in each step along the way
Compose started at Tue Oct 12 13:15:43 UTC 2010
Broken deps for x86_64
--
antlr3-python-3.1.2-7.fc14.noarch requires python(abi) = 0:2.6
gnome-pilot-conduits-2.0.17-4.fc13.x86_64 requires
libgpilotdconduit.so.2()(64bit)
The lightweight tag 'perl-Net-SSH-Perl-1.34-8.fc14' was created pointing to:
aabdbf4... Use hunspell back-end for spell check test
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The lightweight tag 'perl-Math-GMP-2.06-5.fc14' was created pointing to:
4f8e760... Use hunspell dictionary for spell check test
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Hello Fedora 14 Blocker Bug Owners (all copied on this message),
The list of bugs below are currently blocking the final release of
Fedora 14. These bugs MUST be fixed by this coming Monday, 2010-10-18
(Final Change Deadline) or Release Engineering will be unable to create
the Final Release
Greetings testers!
The bugs listed below are Fedora 14 Blocker bugs that are believed to be
fixed. Help is needed to ensure Fedora 14 ships on time! You can
follow the list of ON_QA bugs at http://bit.ly/bLdmof
To get started, for each bug ...
1. Confirm reported bug is fixed, then change
Unfortunately it is not what I initially ask :(
12.10.2010 19:14, matt_dom...@dell.com wrote:
Correct, it's simply a git merge specifying the merge method, to ensure there
are no merge conflicts - just make an exact copy of the origin/master branch
onto the current branch. You must still
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 16:40 +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
On 10/12/2010 04:20 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 02:16:49PM +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
The only way to accomplish this without actually removing the features is
to have two anaconda modes one for
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 10:53 -0400, Neal Becker wrote:
I don't agree. There's nothing unusual about a dumbed-down interface for
novices, with an 'advanced' tab hiding more options.
As someone else has pointed out, a lot of usability experts consider
this a bad idea, for two reasons:
1)
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 10:53 -0400, Neal Becker wrote:
I don't agree. There's nothing unusual about a dumbed-down interface for
novices, with an 'advanced' tab hiding more options.
As someone else has pointed out, a
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 09:30:45AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
2) it creates a confusing decision point for *everyone*: how do you know
if you need the 'advanced' options? You can't really know without
looking at them, so you have to look at them to decide if you need them,
so essentially
I've just tagged libgpod 0.8.0 for F13 updates-testing. This is the
first step to an updated Banshee (1.8.0) in F13 as well as better
iPhone/iPad support in the existing Rhythmbox. I'd really like to get
some testing on this, so please, if you are using updates-testing and
have any Apple-brand
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 18:34 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 10:53 -0400, Neal Becker wrote:
I don't agree. There's nothing unusual about a dumbed-down interface for
novices, with an 'advanced' tab
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 7:03 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 18:34 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 10:53 -0400, Neal Becker wrote:
I don't agree. There's nothing
On Mon Oct 11 15:39:44 UTC 2010, Gilboa Davara wrote:
Comparing the Ubuntu 10.04 DVD installer (which I use a couple of weeks
ago) to Fedora 13 DVD installer is like comparing the Cessna to a Boeing
747.
Sure, both can accomplish the same task. Read: transporting people from
one airport to
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 19:15 +0200, drago01 wrote:
As I recall, several distros have done usability studies and found that
this isn't actually true. People have been *trained* to just press next,
next, next under specific circumstances - like Windows software
installation - but it's not
On Mon, Oct 11, 2010 at 9:42 PM, Bill Nottingham nott...@redhat.com wrote:
1) When you added this to F14/F15/EL6, you added a typo; this
broke the F-14 branched compose and the EPEL updates push.
*Please* verify your changes before pushing.
Sorry I missed it
2) Aside from that... how does
Hi all,
I've recently upgraded my system, but after that I was not able to connect
through ssh. More things are wrong (from my POV):
1)SELinux blocks all nondefault ports for ssh
I have ssh confugured to use different port than 22 for security reasons and I
think there is a lot of people doing
On 10/12/2010 05:13 PM, Chuck Anderson wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 08:06:59AM -0700, Jesse Keating wrote:
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On 10/12/10 7:20 AM, Matthew Miller wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 02:16:49PM +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
The only way to
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On 10/12/2010 01:49 PM, Michal Hlavinka wrote:
Hi all,
I've recently upgraded my system, but after that I was not able to connect
through ssh. More things are wrong (from my POV):
1)SELinux blocks all nondefault ports for ssh
I have ssh
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 16:00 +0100, Bastien Nocera wrote:
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 11:11 -0400, Chris Lumens wrote:
- suggests a username and hostname based on the user's real name
(Mac OS X's installer also does this -- it's a nice touch)
If DNS knows a hostname, we will suggest that.
- Daniel J Walsh dwa...@redhat.com wrote:
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On 10/12/2010 01:49 PM, Michal Hlavinka wrote:
Hi all,
I've recently upgraded my system, but after that I was not able to
connect through ssh. More things are wrong (from my POV):
1)SELinux
Hello,
Since the design team is using a design suite, would it be possible to
please create a group in comps for the purpose? It would make
installation of the design suite much easier for end users.
The alternative is to create a meta package which isn't welcomed.
This[1] is the tentative
Subject.
Have Fedora/RHEL service similar http://susestudio.com/ ? May be plans
to create it?
Just for information.
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Chitlesh GOORAH (chitlesh.goo...@gmail.com) said:
Milkymist community builds and enhance their own toolchain (currently
not fully supported by Fedora). They have contributors who contribute
for tools such as gcc, qemu, other libraries (too software for FEL
goals). They have many patches that
Ankur Sinha (sanjay.an...@gmail.com) said:
Since the design team is using a design suite, would it be possible to
please create a group in comps for the purpose? It would make
installation of the design suite much easier for end users.
The alternative is to create a meta package which
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On 10/12/2010 02:10 PM, Michal Hlavinka wrote:
- Daniel J Walsh dwa...@redhat.com wrote:
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On 10/12/2010 01:49 PM, Michal Hlavinka wrote:
Hi all,
I've recently upgraded my system, but after
On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 13:49:41 -0400 (EDT), Michal wrote:
Hi all,
I've recently upgraded my system, but after that I was not able to connect
through ssh. More things are wrong (from my POV):
1)SELinux blocks all nondefault ports for ssh
I have ssh confugured to use different port than 22
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 10:42 AM, Evan Dandrea e...@ubuntu.com wrote:
You can follow the path to the different desktop CDs from here:
http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download
The alternate CD can be found under the alternative downloads link,
with an explanation that it is suited
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 8:23 PM, Bill Nottingham wrote:
OK, that's clear. But I am worried that if we go down this road, we'll
eventually have 20 or 30 groups for different SoCs for embedded use,
and that seems like it will eventually be problematic. Is there some
generic moniker that could
On 10/12/2010 02:23 PM, Bill Nottingham wrote:
Chitlesh GOORAH (chitlesh.goo...@gmail.com) said:
Milkymist community builds and enhance their own toolchain (currently
not fully supported by Fedora).
...
OK, that's clear. But I am worried that if we go down this road, we'll
eventually have 20
Chitlesh GOORAH (chitlesh.goo...@gmail.com) said:
OK, that's clear. But I am worried that if we go down this road, we'll
eventually have 20 or 30 groups for different SoCs for embedded use,
and that seems like it will eventually be problematic. Is there some
generic moniker that could be
I honestly have no idea.
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On Mon Oct 11 21:34:08 UTC 2010 Lars Seipel wrote:
It may be nice usability-wise but it lacks support for LVM2, LUKS disk
encryption and practically everything more advanced. It can't be automated
using some equivalent to kickstart and it fails at all the stuff Anaconda
subsumes unter advanced
2010/10/12 James Antill ja...@fedoraproject.org
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 16:00 +0100, Bastien Nocera wrote:
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 11:11 -0400, Chris Lumens wrote:
- suggests a username and hostname based on the user's real name
(Mac OS X's installer also does this -- it's a nice
Greetings folks,
I'd like to draw attention to the QA retrospective wiki page for Fedora
14.
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_14_QA_Retrospective
As we did for Fedora 13 [1], I'd like to document any
gotchas/hiccups/awesome issues as they happen during a release. I don't
know about you,
On 10/12/2010 10:35 PM, Manuel Escudero wrote:
2010/10/12 James Antill ja...@fedoraproject.org
mailto:ja...@fedoraproject.org
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 16:00 +0100, Bastien Nocera wrote:
On Mon, 2010-10-11 at 11:11 -0400, Chris Lumens wrote:
- suggests a username and hostname
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Evan Dandrea e...@ubuntu.com wrote:
I honestly have no idea.
Hmm. That's unfortunate. It appears from the web pages that the
preferred way to get the alternative images is the torrent ticket (as
it appears ahead of the mirror urls). If users are meant to bump
James Laska (jla...@redhat.com) said:
1) When you added this to F14/F15/EL6, you added a typo; this
broke the F-14 branched compose and the EPEL updates push.
*Please* verify your changes before pushing.
How did the compose break?
The comps file in git failed to parse, such that the
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 16:54 -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote:
James Laska (jla...@redhat.com) said:
1) When you added this to F14/F15/EL6, you added a typo; this
broke the F-14 branched compose and the EPEL updates push.
*Please* verify your changes before pushing.
How did the compose
James Laska (jla...@redhat.com) said:
No, this is well before the tree gets to that state. It would need to
be implemented as a check on git push.
We attempt to validate comps in this test using the comps.rng in git
(see results logs posted earlier). I'm not tremendously familiar with
===
#fedora-meeting: FESCO (2010-10-12)
===
Meeting started by nirik at 19:30:01 UTC. The full logs are available at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2010-10-12/fesco.2010-10-12-19.30.log.html
Meeting summary
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Daniel J Walsh dwa...@redhat.com wrote:
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On 10/12/2010 01:49 PM, Michal Hlavinka wrote:
Hi all,
I've recently upgraded my system, but after that I was not able to connect
through ssh. More things are wrong (from
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On 10/8/10 11:58 PM, Ankur Sinha wrote:
(no one uses
rawhide for development btw,)
That's a pretty broad and unhelpful and untrue statement. I know of
plenty of people who use rawhide for development. Continuing to
perpetuate that rawhide is
Hi,
It's been a while since I've done any sort of uploading and in that time
my box died, has been rebuilt and is running happily on rawhide.
Problem is my scripts for uploading have gone! I've followed the
information on the wiki but when I try to upload, I'm getting
[p...@pb3 common]$
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On 10/8/10 7:03 AM, Pavel Alexeev (aka Pahan-Hubbitus) wrote:
In most cases I try sync all branches if there no real reasons to make
differences.
After made some changes in origin/master and commit is I also must do
for each available branches
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On 10/7/10 11:59 PM, Thomas Spura wrote:
How about let bodhi do the tagging?
When there is an update, you could click on tag this package, and
bodhi will do the rest. If the update is deleted or obsoleted by
another one, the tag will be deleted
On Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 00:05, Paul F. Johnson
p...@all-the-johnsons.co.uk wrote:
Hi,
It's been a while since I've done any sort of uploading and in that time
my box died, has been rebuilt and is running happily on rawhide.
Problem is my scripts for uploading have gone! I've followed the
I noticed that ethtool is not in the default install anymore (probably
for a release or so, but I didn't notice it until now). Why is that?
It is the only tool that can show and configure a variety of network
device options, such as speed/duplex negotiation, wake-on-LAN, and TCP
offloading.
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Chris Adams cmad...@hiwaay.net wrote:
I noticed that ethtool is not in the default install anymore (probably
for a release or so, but I didn't notice it until now). Why is that?
It is the only tool that can show and configure a variety of network
device
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 19:37 -0400, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Chris Adams cmad...@hiwaay.net wrote:
I noticed that ethtool is not in the default install anymore [...]
mii-tool.
The mii-tool man page claims it is deprecated in favor of ethtool. In
fact, neither
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On 10/12/10 4:28 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
I noticed that ethtool is not in the default install anymore (probably
for a release or so, but I didn't notice it until now). Why is that?
It is the only tool that can show and configure a variety of
Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell gmaxw...@gmail.com said:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Chris Adams cmad...@hiwaay.net wrote:
I noticed that ethtool is not in the default install anymore (probably
for a release or so, but I didn't notice it until now). Why is that?
It is the only tool
Chris Adams wrote:
Maybe ethtool should be added to @Base?
Or patch initscripts to use ethtool instead of deprecated cruft.
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On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 8:01 PM, Chris Adams cmad...@hiwaay.net wrote:
Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell gmaxw...@gmail.com said:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Chris Adams cmad...@hiwaay.net wrote:
I noticed that ethtool is not in the default install anymore (probably
for a release or so,
Once upon a time, Michael Cronenworth m...@cchtml.com said:
Chris Adams wrote:
Maybe ethtool should be added to @Base?
Or patch initscripts to use ethtool instead of deprecated cruft.
You cut out the part of my email where I quoted the changelog showing
that had already been done.
The
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Jeff Spaleta jspal...@gmail.com wrote:
The low activity on the Ubuntu torrent server generally really leaves
me scratching my head as to how to evaluate the applicability of the
alternative image approach.
Just to provide some closure on this. I watched the
Fedora 14 Final TC1 is now available [1]. Please refer to the following
pages for download links and testing instructions.
Installation:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Results:Current_Installation_Test
Desktop:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Results:Current_Desktop_Test
Ideally,
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 07:06:50PM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
It looks like up through F12, initscripts required ethtool (so it was
definately installed by default). I see this in the RPM changelog:
Still the case in RHEL5, FWIW.
--
Matthew Miller mat...@mattdm.org
Senior Systems Architect --
On Tue, 2010-10-12 at 20:47 -0400, Andre Robatino wrote:
Fedora 14 Final TC1 is now available [1]. Please refer to the following
pages for download links and testing instructions.
Installation:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Results:Current_Installation_Test
Desktop:
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 01:08:17PM +1000, Jeffrey Fearn wrote:
Kevin Fenzi wrote:
On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:32:15 +1000
Jeffrey Fearn jfe...@redhat.com wrote:
What do you mean leave it alone? The people using it WANT the
changes. Why are you telling them how they can use their system?
On 10/12/2010 09:25 PM, Bill Nottingham wrote:
Ankur Sinha (sanjay.an...@gmail.com) said:
Since the design team is using a design suite, would it be possible to
please create a group in comps for the purpose? It would make
installation of the design suite much easier for end users.
The
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional
comments should be made in the comments box of this bug.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=571192
Paul Howarth p...@city-fan.org changed:
What|Removed |Added
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional
comments should be made in the comments box of this bug.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=571192
--- Comment #4 from Joel Uckelman uckel...@nomic.net 2010-10-12 04:56:26 EDT
---
rvalue: no, I'm not using mod_perl.
Paul:
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional
comments should be made in the comments box of this bug.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=357641
Mark Chappell trem...@tremble.org.uk changed:
What|Removed |Added
Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional
comments should be made in the comments box of this bug.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=640752
Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com changed:
What|Removed |Added
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