Bob wrote: Are we in relative agreement on the science here- that the planet is indeed getting seriously disturbed by the excesses of human presence and something needs to happen pretty soon to avoid disaster? If that's so. if we do agree on that; than what? Wondering what next- Bob the treeplanter, in middle of nowhere GA Thanks for your post, Bob. I am in agreement with you, and I worry that any productive discussion we might try to have will be sidetracked by the "flame wars" -- which, as Jane and Susan have noted, is exactly what seems to happen out there in the "real world" (if I read you right) when wars get going. How can we learn from this? Can we devise some sort of formula or technique that will help us ignore the egocentric posts and cut through to the real issues, to sift the wheat from the chaff (to paraphrase an old Arabian proverb)? Has anyone out there studied problem resolution or any of the other progressive methods by which we might get a handle on this. If we can't do it, who can? Sending you all good thoughts, --E. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Elizabeth L. MacNabb, PhD [EMAIL PROTECTED] Service Learning, Career Development Center Richmond Hall, UR, Richmond, VA 23173 phone 804-289-8686, fax 804-287-6465