an questions/concerns.
Thanks
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
For more information about this list (subscribe, unsubscribe, FAQ, etc),
please see http://www.eskimo.com/~robla/em
---
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
For more information about this list (subscribe, unsubscribe, FAQ, etc),
please see http://www.eskimo.com/~robla/em
Hi everyone,
I received the following private message about burying preferences in a
Condorcet election. I'll also send my response so that you can see what
I've already said, but I'd also like to understand if the various
improvements to Condorcet (e.g. Condorcet-SSD) have any effect on this.
Here's my response, with light editing in [] (I caught a thinko in my
original response)
-- Forwarded message --
Subject: Re: unsatisfied with implications of Condorcet method
This is a really good question, and one I'd like to take to the Election
Methods list, if you don't mind
Hi all,
I've been somewhat following the various approval strategy threads, and
I'm still a little skeptical. In addition to the three-way problem that
Richard Moore points out, I think a more troubling problem will be in
getting good polling data.
When asked in some
On Thu, 11 Apr 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Has anyone thought of researching the 1860 Presidential race? Lincoln's
win with less than 40% of the popular vote gave us the Civil War.
Hi Paul,
I've used the 1860 election as an example in the past. It's a classic
example of how strong
Hi all,
I've updated the webpage for this list, added a new jargon list that can
be collaboratively edited, and I'm now tacking the list information onto
the end of all messages. Part of the reason for this message is to test
that functionality (and I apologize in advance if I need to send
On Sat, 30 Mar 2002, Donald Davison wrote:
Mike wrote:
But 3 different Australians have told me that it's common for
preferrers of 3rd parties to insincerely rank one of the big-2 in
1st place, so as not to waste [their] vote.
Donald: I don't believe this. Either those three Australians
. If the opportunity arises, we should
encourage legislatures to use ballots in ballot access laws to ensure
that this remains the case.
Regardless, this discussion seems to have unnecessarily become a flamewar.
Flame-utio ad adsurdumb.
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
Hi Mike,
Thanks for all of the replies. Lots of food for thought. What I'm not
replying to I either agree with or I'm still thinking about. More inline:
On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, MIKE OSSIPOFF wrote:
Rob Lanphier wrote:
As a mental exercise, IRV may be a necessary stepping stone to methods
on that strength, and make sure that we
continue to push hard for the use of Condorcet in brainiac associations.
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
and Duverger's Law: An
Essay on the History of Political Science American Political Science
Review, 76 (December, 1982), pp. 753-766.
http://www.jstor.org/cgi-bin/jstor/printpage/00030554/di961007/96p0002q/0.pdf
(This link is only accessible on universities with JSTOR access)
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL
that it does.
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
a magazine article
on either #1 or #2 is doubtful, but I too would love to see it.
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
/2002/2/2/214045/7030
I've already posted a reply to this, and I encourage you all to do the
same.
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
lists. Something like what's used
on Advogato (http://www.advogato.org) would be great. Any ideas?
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Mon, 9 Apr 2001, Craig Carey wrote:
Before Approval is commented on, can an exact high quality
PNG (or JPG or GIF) image of the typical Approval Vote
voting paper be posted?. Last time I was inquiring into
that, Rob Lanphier ruled that Mike Ossipoff did not have
to answer that question (I
on-methods-list, and
subscribe to the digest.
As an added bonusyou'll be able to automatically control whether or
not you can post to this list.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
_their_ head off will be
provided for you.
Grouch cop, Elmo in Grouchland
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
through to the list. If
this becomes a problem, I'll turn it back off, but I don't think it will
be.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 23:28:20 -0800 (PST)
From: Rob Lanphier [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED
Donald,
You are an idiot.
Love,
Rob
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001, I Like Irving wrote:
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 07:16:38 -0500
From: I Like Irving [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "[EM]" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [EM] Mike-O to be on `America's Funniest Home Videos'
Resent-Date:
temptation to influence rankings on party-generated voter
cheatsheats with raw cash.
It's definitely a problem that needs addressing, but it's one that I'd
much rather have than the one we have in the U.S. today.
Rob
Rob Lanphier wrote:
An Australian MP is claiming that it may be time
An Australian MP is claiming that it may be time to rethink preference
voting, adopting a first-past-the-post system instead, because how-to-vote
tickets improperly influence voting behavior:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newslink/weekly/newsnat-29nov2000-26.htm
Ugh.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED
ute
for International Affairs.
``Why should it work?'' he asked in an interview with Reuters last
week. ``You may have a situation where the candidate who wins in the
electoral college may not win the popular vote -- it is an
extraordinary political system not to be emulated by an
te, you aren't going to offend me in the
slightest.
Rob
-
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
t position you are advocating. Are you advocating that
we pay more attention to Craig, to Brams, to Saari, or to some other
theorist?
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
physicist leave out friction in trying to understand
more fundemental principles -- it's often a noise variable that's better
left as a tail end calculation).
Ignoring strategy in voting is like ignoring energy in physics, or
selfishness in economics. It's just not done.
Carry on :)
f there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and
fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to
be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."
- US Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
: should I allow outside postings? (more info
on spam can be found at http://stopspam.oreilly.com/)
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 12:45:04 -0600 (CST)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Rob Lanphier [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Donald Saari [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Democratic symmetry (fwd)
Dear Mr. Lanphier,
Thanks for posting my message. When I glanced at your
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 12:11:44 +
From: Tom Standage [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Borda, again
FWIW, I went and read the discussion about my article on your list at
eGroups, and I wanted to clarify something.
My article arose from
ted a relevant snippet to the mailing list, and a lively
discussion is already ensuing.[3] I encourage you, Dr. Saari, and your
readers to participate in the debate about this subject.
Thank you,
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
[1] Election Methods Mailing li
ong with the state of the art in Social Choice
theory when work of such poor quality is still taken seriously by academics.
-- Norm Petry
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
tm#D7
Rob
(who fully realizes this anecdote has almost nothing to do with Borda)
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
,
2000:
http://link.springer.de/link/service/journals/00199/tocs/t0015001.htm
Donald G. Saari:
research articles: Mathematical structure of voting paradoxes
I. Pairwise votes
II. Positional voting
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Tue, 7
.
---
D- Absent an EM FAQ, I suggest that all such pages (with their URL's for
folks who copy text only) should be on the EM subscription page at
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla/em/
Actually, it has been on this page for some time. Look under "Frequently
Asked Questions List".
Rob Lanph
elections, the system is ideal.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
t pints that deserve highlighting.
Rob
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Mon, 7 Feb 2000, Blake Cretney wrote:
Rob Lanphier wrote:
Another message from Mike...
...
Here's why I claim that Blake Cretney's Margins method
isn't as good as Schulze, or any other genuine Condorcet
version. (The translations of Condorcet's words indicate that
Condorcet judged
Another message from Mike...
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 07:59:46 GMT
From: MIKE OSSIPOFF [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Why Margins isn't as democratic or ethical as votes-against
Rob--
This is my letter about why
- what/where was the original posting regarding the Debian
rules ???
I posted a few days ago. The constitution in question is at
http://www.debian.org/devel/constitution
Rob
-
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
Mail from Mike O. regarding the Debian pairwise voting...
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 03:51:43 GMT
From: MIKE OSSIPOFF [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Debian pairwise voting
Hi--
If the Debian rules are strictly
Order B A SQ
Even though B does not have a 13 margin directly against SQ, it does through
a path. B qualifies, and is therefore the winner.
---
Blake Cretney
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
as distributed through the e-lection mailing list.
For info and archives see http://www.research.att.com/~lorrie/voting/
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
t I'm not sufficiently engaged in the
discussion these days to maintain this list. I may have to externally
reference someone else's list.
Thoughts?
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
other
introductory document). I personally haven't had the time to do this, and
I haven't been successful in convnicing someone else to complete this, but
I do believe it's very important.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
lection, I'd imagine that would be
a listed option.
The problem is that it is up to the ballot committee to decide "for us"
whether or not do-nothing "makes sense" and therefore whether or not to
include it.
If "do nothing" is a write-in option, there's no commit
Heck, if it makes
sense in the context of the particular election, I'd imagine that would be
a listed option.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Sat, 11 Apr 1998, Rob Lanphier wrote:
[One] might have a good voting system by letting people rate candidates
on a scale of 0 to 100 (or whatever range you like) and merely taking the
median rating of all of the candidates, and declaring the candidate with
the highest median rating
what name this is in academic work.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
prefer A are overstating their preference.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
This is just a test to see if the list is still functional. I haven't
gotten any complaints, but I'm seeing some weird stuff in the logs which
seems to indicate folks have been trying.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
ph? (Major reason why normal voting
doesn't work.)
Not sure, but I'm sure someone on the e.m. list would know (who I've cc'd)
Does anyone have this?
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
ON´T EXIST THIS BOOK BUT SOMEBODY MUST BE
HAVE IT.MY DIRECTION OF INTERNET IS:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
IF YOU HAVE SOME INFORMATION ABOUT THE BOOK, PLEASE WRITE ME.THANKS.
Sorry, I personally don't know how you can get this, but I've cc'd the
Election Methods list, and there may be someone there who kn
=864888697.13662HIT_NUM=0hitnum=0NTL=1
The FAQ that is being discussed is written by Phil Hunt, and at first
glance, looks really good. I have to admit that I haven't had time to
fully investigate it, but the outline looks reasonably complete. It's at:
http://www.vision25.demon.co.uk/pol/votefaq.txt
Rob
propogandists with the greatest endurance to
spread disinformation, I will shut it down.
Rob
---
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
.
This unacceptable support of lower candidates also exists in the Borda
Also true.
and Condorcet methods.
False. Please show a case where this happens.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
titles. Had I
known this was your intention, I would have nipped this at the bud.
Thank you.
Rob
---
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
.
Is there anyone prepared to be the faq-owner (responsible for posting it
to this list on a regular basis)? If not, then all the procedure in the
world isn't going to do a bit of good. If there is more than one, then we
have something to vote about.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http
On Mon, 3 Feb 1997, Steve Eppley wrote:
CVD does not run elections-reform, according to Rob Ritchie. They
launched it, and they still finance its monthly dues due to their
generosity.
nitpick: complement
Thanks much. I'll change it.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com
ked Instant Majority (RIM)
Acronyms to avoid:
Complete, Ranked and Primaryless
I'm going to bed now :)
---
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Sat, 4 Jan 1997, John De Lasaux wrote:
Where is the FAQ?
We don't have one. We really need one, but we don't have one. Any
volunteers?
---
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Thu, 2 Jan 1997, Steve Eppley wrote:
Rob L wrote:
Rob L quoted Lorrie Cranor. Please try to be careful with the
attributions.
Thanks
Rob
---
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Sun, 29 Dec 1996, New Democracy wrote:
Below is one example from Lorrie Cranor's paper on the net via Rob L.
voter 1: a b c d e
voter 2: b c e d a
voter 3: e a b c d
voter 4: a b d e c
voter 5: b d c a e
I noticed that two candidates have zero votes in the first
lease give us a tool to understand this. Your examples
are almost totally obfuscated by your notation, and many people I'm sure
don't have the patience to wade through them, nor the tools to interpret
them.
Thank you.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
and converts it into an archive.
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
e download and check -- and let
me know yes or no.
Looks fine to me. I'm assuming we are talking about:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/votelaw/voting.htm
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
he outline. Well, we're going to need an outline even if we
do the large decentralized thing. Would you agree that we need the
simpler, smaller document as well, or should we expand that out?
Rob Lanphier
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.eskimo.com/~robla
On Thu, 22 Feb 1996 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Condorcet
Based on relative comparisons and not absolute approval or disapproval
(especially for second and later choices).
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