Re: [FFmpeg-devel] How to correctly handle Matroska timestamps

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
MattKC: > ==Summary== > > I've been implementing ffmpeg/libav into an application, and have run > into timing-related issues when playing back Matroska/MKV videos created > by my application in VLC. I tried asking about this on the libav-user > mailing list and received no response so I thought

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] fftools/cmdutils: don't print build configuration by default

2021-08-07 Thread Gyan Doshi
On 2021-08-06 11:34 pm, James Almer wrote: From: Matthieu Patou Suggested-by: ffm...@fb.com Signed-off-by: James Almer --- fftools/cmdutils.c | 5 +++-- 1 file changed, 3 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-) diff --git a/fftools/cmdutils.c b/fftools/cmdutils.c index 912e881174..fc58277df7

[FFmpeg-devel] How to correctly handle Matroska timestamps

2021-08-07 Thread MattKC
==Summary== I've been implementing ffmpeg/libav into an application, and have run into timing-related issues when playing back Matroska/MKV videos created by my application in VLC. I tried asking about this on the libav-user mailing list and received no response so I thought I'd try here.

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v3] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
Commit c8140fe7324f264faacf7395b27e12531d1f13f7 had introduced a check for value_len > UINT16_MAX. As a consequence, attached images of sizes larger than UINT16_MAX could no longer be read. Signed-off-by: softworkz --- libavformat/asfdec_f.c | 2 +- 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > James Almer > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 03:19 > To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression > bug when reading image attachments > > On 8/7/2021 10:00 PM, Soft Works

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > James Almer > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 03:19 > To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression > bug when reading image attachments > > On 8/7/2021 10:00 PM, Soft Works

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread James Almer
On 8/7/2021 10:00 PM, Soft Works wrote: -Original Message- From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of James Almer Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 02:47 To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments On 8/7/2021

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > Carl Eugen Hoyos > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 03:03 > To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches de...@ffmpeg.org> > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression > bug when reading image

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Carl Eugen Hoyos
Am So., 8. Aug. 2021 um 03:00 Uhr schrieb Soft Works : > > > -Original Message- > > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > > James Almer > > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 02:47 > > To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org > > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression > > bug

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > James Almer > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 02:47 > To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression > bug when reading image attachments > > On 8/7/2021 9:38 PM, Soft Works

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] fftools/cmdutils: don't print build configuration by default

2021-08-07 Thread Carl Eugen Hoyos
Am Sa., 7. Aug. 2021 um 18:14 Uhr schrieb James Almer : > > On 8/7/2021 1:06 PM, Derek Buitenhuis wrote: > > On 8/6/2021 7:04 PM, James Almer wrote: > >> From: Matthieu Patou > >> > >> Suggested-by: ffm...@fb.com > >> Signed-off-by: James Almer > >> --- > >> fftools/cmdutils.c | 5 +++-- > >>

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread James Almer
On 8/7/2021 9:38 PM, Soft Works wrote: -Original Message- From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of Carl Eugen Hoyos Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 01:58 To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > Carl Eugen Hoyos > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 01:58 > To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches de...@ffmpeg.org> > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression > bug when reading image

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Carl Eugen Hoyos
Am So., 8. Aug. 2021 um 01:33 Uhr schrieb Carl Eugen Hoyos : > > Am So., 8. Aug. 2021 um 01:26 Uhr schrieb Soft Works : > > > > Commit c8140fe7324f264faacf7395b27e12531d1f13f7 had introduced a check for > > value_len > UINT16_MAX. > > As a consequence, attached images of sizes larger than

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Carl Eugen Hoyos
Am So., 8. Aug. 2021 um 01:53 Uhr schrieb Soft Works : > > Commit c8140fe7324f264faacf7395b27e12531d1f13f7 had introduced a check for > value_len > UINT16_MAX. > As a consequence, attached images of sizes larger than UINT16_MAX could no > longer be read. > > Signed-off-by: softworkz > --- > v2:

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > Soft Works > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 01:53 > To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org > Subject: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug > when reading image attachments > > Commit

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
Commit c8140fe7324f264faacf7395b27e12531d1f13f7 had introduced a check for value_len > UINT16_MAX. As a consequence, attached images of sizes larger than UINT16_MAX could no longer be read. Signed-off-by: softworkz --- v2: Fix without changing variable type libavformat/asfdec_f.c | 2 +- 1

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > Carl Eugen Hoyos > Sent: Sunday, 8 August 2021 01:33 > To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches de...@ffmpeg.org> > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug > when reading image attachments >

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] mxf : correct previous commit

2021-08-07 Thread Carl Eugen Hoyos
Am Do., 5. Aug. 2021 um 11:03 Uhr schrieb Michael Krebs : > > * Let older tags on the same place as originally > * Add new fate tests for rawvideo and v210 and update checksum for mxf tests This commit message indicates that the patch should be split. Carl Eugen

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] Nvenc: Adding support for chroma qp offset for h264_nvenc and hevc_nvenc

2021-08-07 Thread Timo Rothenpieler
On 03.08.2021 17:14, Ricardo Monteiro wrote: Hi Timo, I do wonder if that information isn't (also) available via metadata on the incoming frames, so it could be inferred from those by default. Are you talking about a transcoding scenario? Where you would load the parameters from the input

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Carl Eugen Hoyos
Am So., 8. Aug. 2021 um 01:26 Uhr schrieb Soft Works : > > Commit c8140fe7324f264faacf7395b27e12531d1f13f7 had introduced a check for > value_len > UINT16_MAX. > As a consequence, attached images of sizes larger than UINT16_MAX could no > longer be read. > > Signed-off-by: softworkz > --- >

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] libavformat/asfdec: Fix regression bug when reading image attachments

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
Commit c8140fe7324f264faacf7395b27e12531d1f13f7 had introduced a check for value_len > UINT16_MAX. As a consequence, attached images of sizes larger than UINT16_MAX could no longer be read. Signed-off-by: softworkz --- libavformat/asfdec_f.c | 7 --- 1 file changed, 4 insertions(+), 3

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] avcodec/ass_split: Rename ff_ass_split_dialog2->ff_ass_split_dialog

2021-08-07 Thread James Almer
On 8/7/2021 6:54 PM, Andreas Rheinhardt wrote: Signed-off-by: Andreas Rheinhardt --- This is in reply to James' opinion here: https://ffmpeg.org/pipermail/ffmpeg-devel/2021-August/283267.html libavcodec/ass_split.c | 2 +- libavcodec/ass_split.h | 4 ++-- libavcodec/movtextenc.c | 2 +-

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 1/3] avfilter/vf_vif: Fix mismatch in number of array elements

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
Andreas Rheinhardt: > The function definition used float *data_buf[14], although there are > only 13 elements (and only 13 are used); the declaration used 13. > Given that the type will be converted to float **data_buf anyway, > this is not in violation of the C specs, but nevertheless a bug. > >

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] avcodec/ass_split: Rename ff_ass_split_dialog2->ff_ass_split_dialog

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
Signed-off-by: Andreas Rheinhardt --- This is in reply to James' opinion here: https://ffmpeg.org/pipermail/ffmpeg-devel/2021-August/283267.html libavcodec/ass_split.c | 2 +- libavcodec/ass_split.h | 4 ++-- libavcodec/movtextenc.c | 2 +- libavcodec/srtenc.c | 2 +- libavcodec/ttmlenc.c

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 2/4] avcodec/ass_split: Remove unused ff_ass_split_dialogue()

2021-08-07 Thread James Almer
On 8/6/2021 10:47 PM, Andreas Rheinhardt wrote: Unused since 1f63665ca567fbc49fa80166d468a822c2999efa. Signed-off-by: Andreas Rheinhardt --- Shall I rename ff_ass_split_dialogue2 to ff_ass_split_dialogue? IMO, yes. libavcodec/ass_split.c | 19 --- libavcodec/ass_split.h

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 1/4] avfilter/asrc_flite: Don't define an object by accident

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
Andreas Rheinhardt: > The flite filter apparently only wanted to declare a struct, > but mistakenly also defined an unused and zero-initialized element > with external linkage. > > Signed-off-by: Andreas Rheinhardt > --- > Would not have happened if one had actually defined a typedef. > >

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] doc/developer: Add description about safely sending patches via E-Mail clients

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > Andreas Rheinhardt > Sent: Saturday, 7 August 2021 13:51 > To: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] doc/developer: Add description > about safely sending patches via E-Mail clients > > Soft Works: > >

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v3] doc/developer: Add description about safely sending patches via E-Mail clients

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
Signed-off-by: softworkz --- v3: fixed typo doc/developer.texi | 16 1 file changed, 16 insertions(+) diff --git a/doc/developer.texi b/doc/developer.texi index b33cab0fc7..86f63c49b3 100644 --- a/doc/developer.texi +++ b/doc/developer.texi @@ -494,6 +494,22 @@ patch is inline

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 1/3] Revert "fftools/ffmpeg_filter: fix the flags parsing for scaler"

2021-08-07 Thread Michael Niedermayer
On Sat, Aug 07, 2021 at 06:15:05PM +0800, Linjie Fu wrote: > From: Linjie Fu > > This reverts commit b3a0548a981db52911dd34d9de254c4fee0a8f79. LGTM thx [...] -- Michael GnuPG fingerprint: 9FF2128B147EF6730BADF133611EC787040B0FAB Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 4/4] avcodec/acelp_vectors: Add missing brackets

2021-08-07 Thread Michael Niedermayer
On Fri, Aug 06, 2021 at 06:17:25PM +0200, Andreas Rheinhardt wrote: > Before 3793caa5e2d1d16ed45771574b2ffc932497cfcf the code was > "if (...) do { ... } while (...);". After said commit this became > "if (...) av_assert0(...); do { ... } while (...);", i.e. the loop > is always executed. This

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] avcodec/mpeg12dec: report error when picture type is unknown and err_detect is EXPLODE

2021-08-07 Thread Marton Balint
On Sat, 7 Aug 2021, Michael Niedermayer wrote: On Sat, Aug 07, 2021 at 09:21:36AM +0200, Marton Balint wrote: On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, Michael Niedermayer wrote: On Mon, Aug 02, 2021 at 08:50:05PM +0200, Marton Balint wrote: Also split error message to error and warning. Signed-off-by:

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2 4/4] avdevice/decklink: support for more duplex mode for Decklink 8K Pro

2021-08-07 Thread Marton Balint
On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, lance.lmw...@gmail.com wrote: From: Limin Wang Signed-off-by: Limin Wang --- doc/indevs.texi | 16 +++- doc/outdevs.texi| 16 +++- libavdevice/decklink_common.cpp | 8 libavdevice/decklink_common.h | 11

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] avcodec/mpeg12dec: report error when picture type is unknown and err_detect is EXPLODE

2021-08-07 Thread Michael Niedermayer
On Sat, Aug 07, 2021 at 09:21:36AM +0200, Marton Balint wrote: > > > On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, Michael Niedermayer wrote: > > > On Mon, Aug 02, 2021 at 08:50:05PM +0200, Marton Balint wrote: > > > Also split error message to error and warning. > > > > > > Signed-off-by: Marton Balint > > > --- > >

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2 3/4] avdevice/decklink: add levelA configure

2021-08-07 Thread Marton Balint
On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, lance.lmw...@gmail.com wrote: From: Limin Wang Signed-off-by: Limin Wang --- just rebase the code to the master branch to fix the first warning. doc/outdevs.texi| 4 libavdevice/decklink_common.cpp | 17 +

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2 2/4] avdevice/decklink: add sqd configure

2021-08-07 Thread Marton Balint
On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, lance.lmw...@gmail.com wrote: From: Limin Wang Signed-off-by: Limin Wang --- doc/outdevs.texi| 4 libavdevice/decklink_common.cpp | 11 +++ libavdevice/decklink_common_c.h | 1 + libavdevice/decklink_enc_c.c| 1 + 4 files changed, 17

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2 1/4] avdevice/decklink: add link configuration

2021-08-07 Thread Marton Balint
On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, lance.lmw...@gmail.com wrote: From: Limin Wang Signed-off-by: Limin Wang --- doc/outdevs.texi| 5 + libavdevice/decklink_common.cpp | 9 + libavdevice/decklink_common.h | 8 libavdevice/decklink_common_c.h | 1 +

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] fftools/cmdutils: don't print build configuration by default

2021-08-07 Thread James Almer
On 8/7/2021 1:17 PM, Derek Buitenhuis wrote: On 8/7/2021 5:13 PM, James Almer wrote: It's just to reduce the amount of information printed by default. Most command line utilities don't bother showing build time configuration options outside of --version or --help output, if at all. And the

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] fftools/cmdutils: don't print build configuration by default

2021-08-07 Thread Derek Buitenhuis
On 8/7/2021 5:13 PM, James Almer wrote: > It's just to reduce the amount of information printed by default. Most > command line utilities don't bother showing build time configuration > options outside of --version or --help output, if at all. > And the string is obviously in the binary

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] fftools/cmdutils: don't print build configuration by default

2021-08-07 Thread James Almer
On 8/7/2021 1:06 PM, Derek Buitenhuis wrote: On 8/6/2021 7:04 PM, James Almer wrote: From: Matthieu Patou Suggested-by: ffm...@fb.com Signed-off-by: James Almer --- fftools/cmdutils.c | 5 +++-- 1 file changed, 3 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-) What exactly is the point of this? You've

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] fftools/cmdutils: don't print build configuration by default

2021-08-07 Thread Derek Buitenhuis
On 8/6/2021 7:04 PM, James Almer wrote: > From: Matthieu Patou > > Suggested-by: ffm...@fb.com > Signed-off-by: James Almer > --- > fftools/cmdutils.c | 5 +++-- > 1 file changed, 3 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-) What exactly is the point of this? You've provided a patch with no explanation

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 3/3] libavfilter/graphparser: Add scale_sws_opts parse support in avfilter_graph_parse2

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
Linjie Fu: > From: Linjie Fu > > To pass the swscale options for the inserted scalers. > > ffmpeg -i input.mp4 -filter_complex \ > "scale_sws_opts=alphablend=checkerboard;format=nv12" \ > -t 0.5 output.mp4 > > Update docs. > > Signed-off-by: Linjie Fu > --- > doc/filters.texi

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 2/3] lavfi/vf_scale: dump the exact swscale_options to passed to libswscale

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
Linjie Fu: > From: Linjie Fu > > Printed verbose log doesn't match the sws_flags specified in the cmdline > for simple filter graph. > > ffmpeg .. -sws_flags bicubic .. > [auto_scaler_0] w:iw h:ih flags:'' interl:0 > [auto_scaler_0] w:310 h:449 fmt:yuva420p sar:0/1 -> w:310 h:449

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] doc/developer: Add description about safely sending patches via E-Mail clients

2021-08-07 Thread Andreas Rheinhardt
Soft Works: > (v2: fix doc build) This should be directly after the --- below. > > Signed-off-by: softworkz > --- > doc/developer.texi | 16 > 1 file changed, 16 insertions(+) > > diff --git a/doc/developer.texi b/doc/developer.texi > index b33cab0fc7..ce5500b85d 100644 >

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [FFmpeg-cvslog] fftools/ffmpeg_filter: fix the flags parsing for scaler

2021-08-07 Thread Linjie Fu
On Sat, Aug 7, 2021 at 2:33 AM Michael Niedermayer wrote: > On Thu, Aug 05, 2021 at 02:30:32PM +, Linjie Fu wrote: > > ffmpeg | branch: master | Linjie Fu | Sun > Aug 1 18:58:19 2021 +0800| [b3a0548a981db52911dd34d9de254c4fee0a8f79] | > committer: Linjie Fu > > > > fftools/ffmpeg_filter:

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 3/3] libavfilter/graphparser: Add scale_sws_opts parse support in avfilter_graph_parse2

2021-08-07 Thread Linjie Fu
From: Linjie Fu To pass the swscale options for the inserted scalers. ffmpeg -i input.mp4 -filter_complex \ "scale_sws_opts=alphablend=checkerboard;format=nv12" \ -t 0.5 output.mp4 Update docs. Signed-off-by: Linjie Fu --- doc/filters.texi | 7 ---

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 2/3] lavfi/vf_scale: dump the exact swscale_options to passed to libswscale

2021-08-07 Thread Linjie Fu
From: Linjie Fu Printed verbose log doesn't match the sws_flags specified in the cmdline for simple filter graph. ffmpeg .. -sws_flags bicubic .. [auto_scaler_0] w:iw h:ih flags:'' interl:0 [auto_scaler_0] w:310 h:449 fmt:yuva420p sar:0/1 -> w:310 h:449 fmt:yuv420p sar:0/1 flags:0x0

[FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH 1/3] Revert "fftools/ffmpeg_filter: fix the flags parsing for scaler"

2021-08-07 Thread Linjie Fu
From: Linjie Fu This reverts commit b3a0548a981db52911dd34d9de254c4fee0a8f79. This breaks the usage of swscale options, scale_sws_opts should be passed to auto-inserted scale-filters. The auto-inserted scaler accepts sws_flags in filtergraph complex which overrides the 'flags' option for

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] avutils/hwcontext: When deriving a hwdevice, search for existing device in both directions

2021-08-07 Thread Soft Works
> -Original Message- > From: ffmpeg-devel On Behalf Of > Hendrik Leppkes > Sent: Saturday, 7 August 2021 08:52 > To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches de...@ffmpeg.org> > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] avutils/hwcontext: When deriving a > hwdevice, search for existing

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] avcodec/mpeg12dec: report error when picture type is unknown and err_detect is EXPLODE

2021-08-07 Thread Marton Balint
On Fri, 6 Aug 2021, Michael Niedermayer wrote: On Mon, Aug 02, 2021 at 08:50:05PM +0200, Marton Balint wrote: Also split error message to error and warning. Signed-off-by: Marton Balint --- libavcodec/mpeg12dec.c | 14 ++ 1 file changed, 10 insertions(+), 4 deletions(-) diff

Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH] avutils/hwcontext: When deriving a hwdevice, search for existing device in both directions

2021-08-07 Thread Hendrik Leppkes
On Sat, Aug 7, 2021 at 3:46 AM Soft Works wrote: > > The test /libavutil/tests/hwdevice checks that when deriving a device > from a source device and then deriving back to the type of the source > device, the result is matching the original source device, i.e. the > derivation mechanism doesn't