I simply have to disagree here. We can demonstrate several in
production
applications which we have developed using SOAP XML
WebServices and they
perform like a champ. One of them was the runner
up for last years MAX award.
The majority of the applications we
develop use this architecture and to date
not a single time has a
client nor a user complained about the performance of
runtime data
services based on SOAP.
There are a few false rumors that
continue to creep up in the Flex
community about the performance issues
around SOAP.
There are benchmarks which show that AMF can be drastically
faster
than a SOAP call for the same data. Sometimes even 100% faster.
Yup
that's true there are. But you have to peel away the layers of
the
onion to see the reality. Statistics can be misleading. For
instance,
if AMF is 300 milliseconds and SOAP is 600 milliseconds the
100% difference
isnt even relative. How many people do you know who
can even see 1/3 of a
seconds difference? In the end raw marshalling
isnt the issue, it is the user
and their experience. Flex2 made
DRASTIC improvements it the performance of
XML parsing and in our own
benchmarks the delta between the two services
choices is often as low
as 10%.
Of a much greater impact that the
marshalling time is the UI
"shredding" and binding of the data. Most badly
performing RIA's
suffer from data being returned from the back-end in a
format that
holds no fidelity with the RIA. This requires the RIA to tear
apart
the returned structural data and place it into its own structures
and
objects and bind those to UI controls. Developing your user
experience
in a front-to-back approach which assures great fidelity
between the data
formats of the tiers can account for an order of
magnitude performance
increase. That is the kind of performance
increase users will actually
experience.
There are many other very smart things you can do like
extending
existing controls to do streaming rendering of data to provide
the
perception of speed, server side paging, caching, etc.
In the end
perception is reality. All that matters from the UI
perspective is the
experience that the user has. Worring about 300
milliseconds is like trying
to debate the number of angels that could
dance on the end of a pin. If the
user can't see them, it doesn't
matter how many there are.
The running
rumor that you simply cannot develop first class RIAs in
Flex using a SOAP
web services back-end is simply not accurate, and we
have the apps in
production with our clients to prove it.
--
Dave Wolf
Cynergy
Systems, Inc.
Adobe Flex Alliance Partner
http://www.cynergysystems.com
http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs
Email:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]stems.com
Office:
866-CYNERGY
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED]ups.com,
"Shannon Hicks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Bob-
>
>
Web Services / HTTP services are not built to be the primary backend
of
your
> flex applications. Because they are XML based, they have quite a
bit
more
> overhead than flex's built-in AMF (Action Message Format).
AMF is
smaller,
> faster and uses less bandwidth than XML. AMF is what
FDS and ColdFusion
> 7.0.2 use to communicate to a Flex app.
>
> So let's say that your question is narrowed down to "FDS or
CF?".
Adobe's
> ideal answer is "yes." They are complimentary to each
other, CF
allows for
> wonderful rapid development of Flex apps, and
FDS brings some amazing
> features to the table through it's Messaging an
Data Management
services.
>
> Web Services (SOAP) support is in
Flex primarily to consume third-party
> data, allowing you to add it to
your app.
>
> Hope this points you in the right direction.
>
> Shan
>
> _____
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]ups.com]
On
> Behalf Of rhlarochelle
> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 10:27
AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ups.com
>
Subject: [Junk E-Mail - LOW] [flexcoders] Re: Choice of backend
systems
-
> which provides best functionality
>
>
>
>
Franck,
>
> I appreciate your respons. When you say Remote
Objects/Flex Data
> Services provides the most advanced way of
interoperating with the
> backend, what specifically is possible?
>
> What are the capabilities that I would get leveraging Remote
>
Objects/Flex Data Services that I would not get (or would be difficult
>
to implement) with Web services or HTTP services. If there are
> resources
on the Adobe site that spell this out, please point me to
them.
>
> Since we are looking at the different possibilities and we have
>
somewhat of a blank slate, the more I can go into this with open eyes
>
the better. I appreciate everyone who responded being willing to guide
>
someone new to this architecture.
>
> Thanks,
> Bob
>
> --- In HYPERLINK
>
"mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com"flexcoders@..., "Franck
de
> Bruijn"
> <franck.de.bruijn@> wrote:
>
>
> > Flex is supposed to be backend independent. So you should
choose the
> > technology you're most comfortable with.
> >
> >
> >
> > There are in general 3 ways of
integrating with your back-end:
> >
> > * webservices: total
freedom, but can turn out to be hard. Especially
> > with .Net there
are some problems, although Adobe is working to fix
> it. With
>
> Java/Axis, you'll probably find no issues.
> > * Remote Objects /
Flex Data Services. The most advanced way of
> > interoperating with
your back-end, but requires JAVA on the backend.
> > * HTTP services:
simple HTTP calls. For simple interfaces it will
> > work, but for the
more complex ones it will be insufficient.
> >
> >
>
>
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Franck
> >
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> >
From: HYPERLINK
>
"mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com"flexcoders@...
>
[mailto:HYPERLINK
>
"mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com"flexcoders@...] On
>
> Behalf Of rhlarochelle
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 1:47
AM
> > To: HYPERLINK
>
"mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com"flexcoders@...
> >
Subject: [flexcoders] Choice of backend systems - which provides best
>
> functionality
> >
> >
> >
> > I am
new to Flex 2, and have the opportunity to develop a new
> >
application. Given all of the choices of back end technology out there
>
> (J2EE, Coldfusion, PHP), which will provide for the richest user
>
> experience?
> >
> > It seems that leveraging J2EE and
Java gives the best potential for
> > sharing objects (and updates to
objects ) over the wire. Have I got
> > this right?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No
virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free
Edition.
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8/21/2006
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this
outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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>