Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Martin Spott
Ampere K. Hardraade wrote: That was a proposal from me. The idea is to have a program (could be a modified version of KPDF) to read a vector based PDF file such as this: http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0510/00375AD.PDF and spit out the taxiway outlines. Ampere K. Hardraade wrote: [...] the

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Ralf Gerlich
Hi, Ampere K. Hardraade schrieb: [SNIP] Time might as well be spent on thinking of how we are going to convince Robin to use our new format instead of thinking of a way to expand Robin's database. I think that Robin could actually be pretty open for this:

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Erik Hofman
Martin Spott wrote: So: However somebody is going to design a new airports description format we always should have a method to merge Robin's updates. Additionally we need someone who tracks these updates on a regular basis because we don't want to loose a nifty feature that some X-Plane user

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Ralf Gerlich
Hi, Ampere K. Hardraade schrieb: [SNIP] One can use rectangular or bent taxiway sections but when you get to all the weird and wonderful taxiway layouts it's impossible to do with a generic taxiway structure. This is very apparent where taxiways intersect other taxiways, runways or aprons. The

Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..we're not re-inventing pcproxy?, was

2005-10-17 Thread Erik Hofman
John Wojnaroski wrote: you might try http://sourceforge.net/projects/openatc It died a quiet death when no one showed up for the network field test Hmm, it looks like it started when the time wasn't right. I think we have enough momentum right now for a restart. Erik

RE: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Norman Vine
Erik Hofman writes: Martin Spott wrote: So: However somebody is going to design a new airports description format we always should have a method to merge Robin's updates. Additionally we need someone who tracks these updates on a regular basis because we don't want to loose a nifty

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Erik Hofman
Norman Vine wrote: Erik Hofman writes: This can be done by requesting a new designator number as an alternative taxiway entry. That way it would be possible to have both the old and new format available in the file. Doesn't that just create another problem ? Now the tools will need to check

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Multiplayer ports

2005-10-17 Thread Oliver Schroeder
Am Saturday 15 October 2005 11:30 schrieb Jim Campbell: Anyone transmitting un-encrypted data across a world wide internet (as opposed to a private intranet) needs to think ahead a little. Every hacker will be rubbing their hands with glee before trying to hit you on these ports you have just

Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..we're not re-inventing pcproxy?, was README.multiplayer update

2005-10-17 Thread Oliver Schroeder
Am Saturday 15 October 2005 23:45 schrieb Arnt Karlsen: ..we're not re-inventing pcproxy, are we? No, at least I surely won't. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org

Re: [Flightgear-devel] [PATCH] README.multiplayer update

2005-10-17 Thread Oliver Schroeder
Am Sunday 16 October 2005 19:20 schrieb Andy Ross: Oliver Schroeder wrote: So the server has to reread the port from the UDP header everytime it reseives new data from the client and recreate a socket for it (and clse the existing one of course). Er, no. Check the man page of sendto. :)

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Curtis L. Olson
Erik Hofman wrote: Norman Vine wrote: Erik Hofman writes: This can be done by requesting a new designator number as an alternative taxiway entry. That way it would be possible to have both the old and new format available in the file. Doesn't that just create another problem ? Now the

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Instant replay broken?

2005-10-17 Thread David Luff
On 17/10/2005 at 02:01 George Patterson wrote: Yes, It's just you :-P You can stop the replay by select the View menu, select instant replay. On the Instant Replay dialog check the Disable replay. and click Ok. Believe me, I've tried that. It simply doesn't work AFAICT. On Linux the

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Instant replay broken?

2005-10-17 Thread David Luff
On 16/10/2005 at 18:19 Erik Hofman wrote: David Luff wrote: Is it just me, or is it completely impossible to escape from instant replay once engaged in the current CVS? You can end the repeating loop by pressing 'p' twice. Ah, OK, that works. It's not exactly intuitive though! How about I

[Flightgear-devel] Re: [Simgear-cvslogs]

2005-10-17 Thread Martin Spott
Erik Hofman wrote: Update of /var/cvs/SimGear-0.3/SimGear/simgear/scene/model In directory baron:/tmp/cvs-serv31442 Modified Files: shadanim.cxx Log Message: Harald JOHNSEN: I have corrected a few bugs with the owner draw gauge, weather radar code and heat-haze effect. This is

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Erik Hofman
Curtis L. Olson wrote: I haven't had a lot of time over the past weeks to contribute here and I'm going out of town later this week, but we've discussed much of this before. I know, but if there's one area where FlightGear can use an eminent update then it's the airport layout. In the

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Martin Spott
Erik Hofman wrote: p1 ++ p3 || || || p2 ++ p4 Additionally we need junctions if the plan should make sense. Junctions like this one:

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Erik Hofman
Martin Spott wrote: Additionally we need junctions if the plan should make sense. Junctions like this one: When carefully designed this could be done with the quad approach (although it would not be easy). So the data should be quad based. It is up to the taxidraw developers on how to make

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Martin Spott
Erik Hofman wrote: Martin Spott wrote: Additionally we need junctions if the plan should make sense. Junctions like this one: When carefully designed this could be done with the quad approach (although it would not be easy). So the data should be quad based. Show me an approach that is

RE: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Norman Vine
Erik Hofman writes: Martin Spott wrote: Additionally we need junctions if the plan should make sense. Junctions like this one: When carefully designed this could be done with the quad approach (although it would not be easy). So the data should be quad based. It is up to the

[Flightgear-devel] build break with cygwin and gcc 3.4.4 in FlightGear approach.cxx

2005-10-17 Thread Ima Sudonim
Hi, I am having a problem building flightgear on cygwin (cygwin updated last friday). I am using cvs from this morning. The GCC is cygming 3.4.4 Any ideas what's wrong or how to fix it? I've googled the error and seen a variety of 'error: expected unqualified-id before 'some token'

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Erik Hofman
Norman Vine wrote: I vote for everything being triangle based like the underlying renderer But how would one define where the center line is then? Erik ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Harald JOHNSEN
Norman Vine wrote: Erik Hofman writes: Martin Spott wrote: Additionally we need junctions if the plan should make sense. Junctions like this one: When carefully designed this could be done with the quad approach (although it would not be easy). So the data should be quad

[Flightgear-devel] Taxiway design discussion

2005-10-17 Thread Andy Ross
Martin Spott: Norman Vine wrote: I vote for everything being triangle based like the underlying renderer This puts us at risk to run into huge datasets for every taxiway junction. What about a purely symbolic representation? Store just centerline and width for each taxiway, and keep the

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Ralf Gerlich
Martin Spott schrieb: [SNIP] With the layout I've proposed you'll be able to determine everything that's needed: The taxiway direction and hence the direction of the centerline are determined by the perpendicular on the face sides of the junction, where the regular taxiways are being connected.

Re: [Flightgear-devel] build break with cygwin and gcc 3.4.4 in FlightGear approach.cxx

2005-10-17 Thread Georg Vollnhals
Hi Ima, when I tried to build a CVS version of FlightGear I had a *lot* of trouble and errors. Many developers of this list tried to help me but the break-through was an advice of *KEVIN JONES* not to use gcc 3.4.4 (what I had done until then). I followed his detailled instructions as he was

Re: [Flightgear-devel] [PATCH] README.multiplayer update

2005-10-17 Thread Andy Ross
Oliver Schroeder wrote: Andy Ross wrote: The server only needs one socket for its whole lifetime. Of course, but this solves only part of the problem. The main problem is, that a a NAT router may decide to not accept (ie. forward to the client) any packets we send back to it. It may work

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Martin Spott
Harald JOHNSEN wrote: O / / O-O-- / / O I vote for everything point and lines ;-) Well, points and lines and taxiway width is what we have now and people claim that the result looks terribly :-) Finally

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Harald JOHNSEN
Martin Spott wrote: Harald JOHNSEN wrote: O / / O-O-- / / O I vote for everything point and lines ;-) Well, points and lines and taxiway width is what we have now and people claim that the result

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Durk Talsma
On Monday 17 October 2005 06:50, Ampere K. Hardraade wrote: Regarding Robin's DB: having accurate taxiways is not the only concern. Some other items that we should take notice of include: These are valid concerns. Quite a few of these features are already available, albeit sometimes in a

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Martin Spott
Harald JOHNSEN wrote: We don't have points and lines, we have quads. My line is the center line, my point is an intersection etc. We currently have a point in the middle of a taxiway, the heading, the length and the width of that section - which enables us to determine the endpoints of a

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Paul Surgeon
On Monday 17 October 2005 19:50, Martin Spott wrote: Well, points and lines and taxiway width is what we have now and people claim that the result looks terribly :-) Finally with points and lines you won't be able to describe the _shape_ of a junction - as I understood exactly this is what

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 17:50:00 + (UTC), Martin wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: You won't be able to reverse-engineer the shape of such a junction because in real live they don't follow geometric perfection. ..maybe use some curve fitting library to generate those shapes at runtime?

RE: [Flightgear-devel] build break with cygwin and gcc 3.4.4in FlightGear approach.cxx

2005-10-17 Thread Vivian Meazza
Georg Vollnhals wrote when I tried to build a CVS version of FlightGear I had a *lot* of trouble and errors. Many developers of this list tried to help me but the break-through was an advice of *KEVIN JONES* not to use gcc 3.4.4 (what I had done until then). I followed his detailled

[Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread ojoe
Something to consider: There're more markings than just the centerline on taxiways. Edges are defined by double yellow or dashed, double yellow lines (the boundary between usable runup/apron areas and taxiways.) And there're the hold short/ILS hold short lines. All of these markings were

[Flightgear-devel] OpenATC revisited??

2005-10-17 Thread John Wojnaroski
Erik Hofman wrote: John Wojnaroski wrote: you might try http://sourceforge.net/projects/openatc It died a quiet death when no one showed up for the network field test Hmm, it looks like it started when the time wasn't right. I think we have enough momentum right now for a

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Jon Stockill
Harald JOHNSEN wrote: I am not sure I follow you here, taxiway design have strict rules that you can find on the FAA site. I can assure you there are plenty of airfields out there that don't follow the rules. Many of the ones I've worked on have developed over the last 60+ years to become

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Jon Stockill
Durk Talsma wrote: - buildings placement This can be done through a combination of .stg and xml files, but this has to be done either by hand editing, or by using a dedicated scenery editor. I'm not sure if fgsd would be able to do this. This would be the only interactive application that

[Flightgear-devel] [PATCH] NewWaypoint() now accepts a nav ID; fix deg/rad code/comment mismatch in Navaids

2005-10-17 Thread Vassilii Khachaturov
The Add Waypoint dialog should now accept a nav name as well. To make it work, I used a (dead) code that seemed to be assuming degree-based geodesic points (whereupon the CVS SG docs claim that geodesic points are in radians). (I know that in this case it must be radians because if you pass

[Flightgear-devel] Re: [PATCH] NewWaypoint() now accepts a nav ID; fix deg/rad code/comment mismatch in Navaids

2005-10-17 Thread Vassilii Khachaturov
Please review my patch below in the light of the above caveats (it works, but I wonder if something needs to be re-written further to match some uniform usage of geodesic points). It won't hurt applying AFAIU because the Navaids code I'm touching doesn't seem to be called at all (according to

[Flightgear-devel] Re: [PATCH] NewWaypoint() now accepts a nav ID; fix deg/rad code/comment mismatch in Navaids

2005-10-17 Thread Vassilii Khachaturov
hmmm my doxygen didn't find a couple of the calls to findByFreq() that do assume radians throughout the code! please don't apply, i'll change the comments to say the arguments are in radians then, and move the conversion to radians over to the new caller, and post a new version soon Here it

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Ampere K. Hardraade
On October 17, 2005 02:28 am, Martin Spott wrote: I' pretty sure it easier to convert the PDF's into some common vector drawing format than adding editing capabilities to [X,K,G]PDF. Once you have a nice vector format you can easily load that into your favourite editor, and group the necessary

[Flightgear-devel] [PATCH] demote short-timer-driven msgs from info to debug

2005-10-17 Thread Vassilii Khachaturov
Included is a patch that I use here to get rid of trace spewn driven by short timers. It demotes the relevant sun solver and ground cache update messages from INFO to DEBUG. Index: src/FDM/groundcache.cxx === RCS file:

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread Ampere K. Hardraade
On October 17, 2005 02:23 pm, Durk Talsma wrote: - airport animations Just wondering what type of animations you were thinking of. We have support for moving aircraft now, but no ground vehicles yet, although this could be done using animation scripts. Bridges' movement, illumination, and so

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: A question regarding accurate taxiways

2005-10-17 Thread George Patterson
On Mon, 2005-10-17 at 21:57 -0400, Ampere K. Hardraade wrote: On October 17, 2005 02:23 pm, Durk Talsma wrote: - airport animations Just wondering what type of animations you were thinking of. We have support for moving aircraft now, but no ground vehicles yet, although this could be