Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread Nikola Smolenski
Nathan wrote: My sense was that Nikola was using tl:dr to respond not to George's e-mail, but to the process he described for creating a new page. I could be wrong, though. I wanted to say that due to the length of the text, new users' response would likely be tl;dr. I haven't realized it

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread Nikola Smolenski
Nikola Smolenski wrote: Nathan wrote: My sense was that Nikola was using tl:dr to respond not to George's e-mail, but to the process he described for creating a new page. I could be wrong, though. I wanted to say that due to the length of the text, new users' response would likely be

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread George Herbert
On Fri, Dec 5, 2008 at 7:26 AM, Nikola Smolenski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nikola Smolenski wrote: Nathan wrote: My sense was that Nikola was using tl:dr to respond not to George's e-mail, but to the process he described for creating a new page. I could be wrong, though. I wanted to say that

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread David Gerard
2008/12/5 George Herbert [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I think these are valid concerns about my idea. I would respond with But you can always create pages the existing way 8-) But some new users won't want that much framework either. I don't know how many different methods/paths we can set up for

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread Nathan
This [1] is the sort of thing I'm thinking about. David, has this been proposed, discussed, modeled and rejected in the past? (It seems like it must have, for something that is pretty common around the web). [1]: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Add_an_article_-_basic.JPG Nathan

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread David Gerard
2008/12/5 Nathan [EMAIL PROTECTED]: This [1] is the sort of thing I'm thinking about. David, has this been proposed, discussed, modeled and rejected in the past? (It seems like it must have, for something that is pretty common around the web). [1]:

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-05 Thread George Herbert
We could just build the thing and then ask permission to put in the link on the default UI.. Forgiveness easier than permission, etc etc. On Fri, Dec 5, 2008 at 8:25 AM, David Gerard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 2008/12/5 Nathan [EMAIL PROTECTED]: This [1] is the sort of thing I'm thinking

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-04 Thread George Herbert
On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 5:28 PM, David Gerard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 2008/12/3 David Goodman [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Nothing personal, but when tl;dr is given as a response, it indicates that there is something certainly substantial and probably interesting to be seen and understood--and possibly

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-03 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi, So if the question to any of these questions is not positive a person should not contribute ? I would strongly argue that when a valid subject is identified and a plain text of one or two paragraphs has been written we already have a winner. You still want wikification, you still want

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-03 Thread George Herbert
On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 2:56 AM, Gerard Meijssen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hoi, So if the question to any of these questions is not positive a person should not contribute ? I would strongly argue that when a valid subject is identified and a plain text of one or two paragraphs has been

Re: [Foundation-l] Handholding for new articles (Was: Re: 80% of our projects are failing)

2008-12-03 Thread Ziko van Dijk
The major weakness may be the attitude of some Wikipedians, who treat newbies rudely as if we would have an infinite reservoir of them. Our ideal of openess (everyone can edit) has as an implication that new people come in and make things we experienced Wikipedians consider as wrong. Pacience and