Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Vladimyr, You thank Stephen Guerin [st...@redfish.com] and Owen Densmore [o...@redfish.com] who got it started more than 12 years ago, and you thank Frank Wimberly (Frank Wimberly [wimber...@gmail.com] , who arrives faithfully ever Friday at 9am, come rain,

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

Glen☣ Yours is a characteristically adroit yet confrontational argument and I don't know that it is my place (or ability) address it completely, but would like to try to add some context that I hope will help: A) Are /Truth/ and /Social Justice/ in any way different? I think they are

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Frank - I don't know the answers to your questions. I can say that an anti-Trump theme has been prominent. I don't think there was much optimism for Sanders's chances nor for those of the 3rd party candidates. There was a moment when one attendee was lamenting the poor choices available.

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Steve writes: <> I thought the democrats had two decent candidates, at least on technical grounds. I was rooting for Bernie during the primaries, although I don't really buy that the donor class and super pacs are so terrible. Jeb Bush had a big donor base and so did Clinton. It didn't

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Nick Take a deep Breath and slowly listen to your Prophetic words. Your metaphor has enormous potential and may seem to some overly generous . Yet it may be what saves us from ourselves. Accepting the far flung into the commonality is exactly how the Greeks defied more brutal regimes.

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Steve, I don't know the answers to your questions. I can say that an anti-Trump theme has been prominent. I don't think there was much optimism for Sanders's chances nor for those of the 3rd party candidates. There was a moment when one attendee was lamenting the poor choices available. I

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Frank - I was not admonishing you, but DO admit that I assumed you were speaking to the "congregation at large" not merely the attendees at "the Mother Church"... As you know I DO occasionally attend High Mass at the Fri(day)AM with ritual consumption of the blood of Complexity Yak (aka

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

I was amused to hear a heckler yelling about false dichotomy toward the end of the video. Haidt wanted a clean vote between christian university, truth university, and social justice university, so he didn't open the ballot to poll for none of the above. And it's also amusing to consider that

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

I'd like to challenge the core assertion: that conflict will necessarily happen. Then, even if we can adequately show it will necessarily happen, I'd like to challenge the children: • that it has happened and • that it will/has happenened so much that it's caused a problem. My challenge

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

Glen, Certainly one can follow more than one telos, and given fairly compatible choices one can typically do so for long periods without encountering conflict. But eventually they will conflict, if pursued long enough, and when that happens, there are various courses of action, and various

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

BTW: This was the NYTimes explanation on why this is of the same type as brexit: Ostensibly the vote was about arcane changes to Italy’s Constitution that would have streamlined government. But opposition to the proposals came from the same anti-establishment sentiment — spiked with skepticism

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

​Italy seems to be regressing as well, although this was not an EU vote, but pundits felt its defeat would indicate an anti-EU sentiment. Anyone have an explanation of the ramifications of the defeat? -- Owen ROME — Italy plunged into political and economic uncertainty

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

Glen, ‘n all, I thought Haidt's point was not universal, but that we had passed some point of no return in the current situation. I have to reread it. Somebody once wrote a very profound essay on this subject 45 years ago. Oh, Wait a Minute! It was ME!

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

I'd be cautious of denying anyone who feels physically unsafe access to security and I am suspicious of reverse discrimination claims. I think professors should do what they can to support anyone that might feel or be perceived as vulnerable when they thoughtfully defend minority (either

Re: [FRIAM] Divided America

Sorry, Vladimyr, My Bad. “the mother church” and “the diaspora” is a running gag of mine that nobody gets and I should stop it. I mean by “mother church” the group of people who meet here in Santa Fe each Friday and by “the diaspora” those of you on the list who are too far away to

Re: [FRIAM] Truth vs. Social Justice on college campuses

Is there anything in the study of telos that demands it be unitary? Even assuming "truth" and "social justice" are fundamentally disjoint, why must a university choose one over the other when they "collide"? The epithet "linear thinker" comes to mind. Haidt's parenthetical is important: "But