Jeff Prickett wrote:
Scott Sanders wrote:
Calendar is much more apropos in JAMES IMHO. I think that JAMES could
become an Exchange killer :)
Good point, I would accept that place as a home for the back end
objects. Possibly split
iCalendar between JAMES and Jetspeed or make it its own module
I think the best thing to do would be to have a standalone calendar
backend, communicating with James as transport,
As a James commiter I can see this as being a sensible route, James exposes
the Mailet API which would provide hooks into the mail system for icalendar,
or indeed any other
On 1/29/02 3:31 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
How is it possible that such a small, little, tiny project happens to be
at the top level of Jakarta?
Ahh.. Jon Stevens.. There we have it.
WHY are there so many small, little tiny projects at the top of Jakarta?
Ever heard of
29.01.2002 09:31:16, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
How is it possible that such a small, little, tiny project happens to be
at the top level of Jakarta?
Ahh.. Jon Stevens.. There we have it.
WHY are there so many small, little tiny projects at the top of Jakarta?
Ever heard of
On 1/29/02 6:32 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
A bit to flame-baitish, yes yes..
But there are two things in that mail:
1) Why not do some grouping of the projects in Jakarta?
( 1b) Maybe not all projects in Jakarta are of the identical importance?
Well, not sure if
On 1/29/02 7:02 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| What's the point?
|
| They will still always be separate communities in separate CVS repositories.
|
| Let me put it another way : what problem are we trying to solve?
Me coming to the front page and trying to understand
You soon got me cornered here now..!
| | 2) If a guy that's already within Jakarta decides that he'll make a nice,
| | thight, _small_ little library, it seems like getting it into Jakarta just
| | takes a cvs commit. Even top level.
| |
| | No way. I'm a guy in Jakarta. I have commit
I'm not sure what to make of this discussion, except this, why would anyone
expect a loose OS project like jakarta to be well organised, methodical and
fair?
Life's not fair, and bearing in mind that everyone involved has to do
something else to earn a crust and spare time when they can for
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On 1/29/02 7:02 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| What's the point?
|
| They will still always be separate communities in separate CVS repositories.
|
| Let me put it another way : what problem are we trying to solve?
Me coming to the
On 1/22/02 9:02 AM, Jeff Prickett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
As we speak I am trying to restart the calendar effort. I think that I
have a point to
make here in this forum. First a lot of these sub-projects are spun off
from other projects iCalendar originally started in Jetspeed. The same
Ceki Gülcü wrote:
In your opinion, what are the key factors in nurturing a developer
community?
To paraphrase Stefano Mazzocchi (only because I can't locate the exact
words via Google at the moment) - a wonderful idea with a lousy
implementation. Any other permutations of those two don't
on 1/29/02 4:42 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| Example? Stefano pushed to get POI in, and there was *huge* pushback.
At least heavy from Jon, as I remember it.
I wasn't about to accept a half assed proposal. Is there anything wrong with
that?
The POI team took our feedback,
on 1/29/02 8:52 AM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Sometimes the reasons an implementation is lousy (or at least, not
appropriate for the task at hand) are non-technical. Freemarker was a
wonderful idea with a GPL implementation. Hence velocity was born.
Just to be clear...
On Tue, 29 Jan 2002, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
| Endre, you clearly have a personal bias against me. If you would like to
| continue to express it, you are free to do so. However, your complete lack
| of contributions around here, other than expressing your bias against me, is
| making you look
Ceki Gulcu wrote:
In your opinion, what are the key factors in nurturing a developer
community?
I know what does not nuture a development environment.
1. Working in a vacuum and hoping someone magically finds out.
2. Mispresenting (Intentionally or Unintentionally) the status of the
Comments inline...
-Original Message-
From: Endre Stølsvik [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 4:02 AM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
| What's the point?
|
| They will still always be separate communities
Just my two cents worth. .. don't freeze your vision. Have one (we
have a very general one for POI plus some very specific ones for each
release), but you have to allow people to come in and say I want this
by 2.0 even if its a 4.0 for you.
For example we landed a very talented developer for
Calendar is much more apropos in JAMES IMHO. I think that JAMES could
become an Exchange killer :)
-Original Message-
From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 7:26 AM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project
+1
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:07, Scott Sanders wrote:
Comments inline...
-Original Message-
From: Endre Stølsvik [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 4:02 AM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta
]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 7:26 AM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
On 1/22/02 9:02 AM, Jeff Prickett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
As we speak I am trying to restart the calendar effort. I
think that I
have a point to make here
thing (BIFF4 back in 1992!), I respect what you have done!
Scott
-Original Message-
From: Andrew C. Oliver [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 11:16 AM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: RE: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
h yummy. I've GOT
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:22, Scott Sanders wrote:
Yes. I have been thinking that Exchange needs an OSS competitor.
Yes yes yes yes yes.
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On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:54, Endre Stølsvik wrote:
| As a complement to this: how is the deprecating system of
| Jakarta? If a project dies, that nobody seems to update it,
| the list dies or something like this, does it die away from
| Jakarta too?
|
| What would you like to see
on 1/29/02 11:54 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| What would you like to see happen? Should we wipe the site with
| something that has no activity? Should Jserv die because the last
| release was forever ago? I think not. Jserv is a production server
| that lives in many
Scott Sanders wrote:
Calendar is much more apropos in JAMES IMHO. I think that JAMES could
become an Exchange killer :)
Good point, I would accept that place as a home for the back end
objects. Possibly split
iCalendar between JAMES and Jetspeed or make it its own module that
plugs in to
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 12:08 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
on 1/29/02 11:54 AM, lloyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:22, Scott Sanders wrote:
Yes. I have been thinking that Exchange
So then start the base code in the commons, and create impls in Jetspeed
and James that use the base.
Scott
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Prickett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2002 11:10 AM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 15:08, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
on 1/29/02 11:54 AM, lloyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:22, Scott Sanders wrote:
Yes. I have been thinking that Exchange needs an OSS competitor.
Yes yes yes yes yes.
Why would anyone want to create an OSS
On Tue, 29 Jan 2002, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
| on 1/29/02 11:54 AM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
|
| | What would you like to see happen? Should we wipe the site with
| | something that has no activity? Should Jserv die because the last
| | release was forever ago? I think not.
PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 15:08, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
on 1/29/02 11:54 AM, lloyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:22, Scott Sanders wrote:
Yes. I have been thinking that Exchange needs an OSS
]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 12:08 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
on 1/29/02 11:54 AM, lloyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:22, Scott Sanders wrote:
Yes. I have been thinking that Exchange needs an OSS
-Original Message-
From: Andrew C. Oliver [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 12:14 PM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: RE: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 15:13, Scott Sanders wrote:
The user *must* still be able to use
Scott Sanders wrote:
Again, why don't you send a patch with the pages that you would
like to see, and then we could discuss that? What we are saying
is that we do not really know how a jakarta user wants to see it.
You do. So post some HTML and lets talk about it.,
+1. It doesn't even
freaking email virus in the world less like 3 was written for...
;-)
Scott
-Original Message-
From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 12:08 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
on 1
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 15:26, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
on 1/29/02 12:07 PM, Scott Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Innovation is necessary. But duplication is also necessary for the
purpose of adoption. The only way to beat Exchange is to look like
Exchange. The innovation will then
know that the change happened. Then
things like Evolution and other clients can plug into an OSS impl.
Scott
-Original Message-
From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 12:26 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 15:27, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
on 1/29/02 12:06 PM, Andrew C. Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My issue is the places I
typically work if I could sell a drop in replacement for Exchange...heck
yeah cause then I wouldn't be forced to use that spamming virus ridden
, January 29, 2002 12:27 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
on 1/29/02 12:06 PM, Andrew C. Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My issue is the places I
typically work if I could sell a drop in replacement for
Exchange...heck yeah cause then I wouldn't
:26 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
on 1/29/02 12:07 PM, Scott Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Innovation is necessary. But duplication is also necessary for the
purpose of adoption. The only way to beat Exchange is to look like
on 1/29/02 12:18 PM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Why not view me as an outsider, trying to use your cool stuff, not finding
my way around, wading through small and big projects alike..
My point is that there is no such thing as an 'outsider'. You can become
just as involved as I
on 1/29/02 12:29 PM, Scott Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My goal is NOT to target other developers. My goal is to target users
that *HAVE* to have exchange because they:
1) *HAVE* to use Outlook.
2) *HAVE* to have real groupware capabilities (calendaring, etc.)
3) Refuse to give up
On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 15:44, Jon Scott Stevens wrote:
on 1/29/02 12:29 PM, Scott Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My goal is NOT to target other developers. My goal is to target users
that *HAVE* to have exchange because they:
1) *HAVE* to use Outlook.
2) *HAVE* to have real groupware
]
Subject: Re: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
on 1/29/02 12:29 PM, Scott Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My goal is NOT to target other developers. My goal is to
target users
that *HAVE* to have exchange because they:
1) *HAVE* to use Outlook.
2) *HAVE* to have
: Andrew C. Oliver [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 12:43 PM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: RE: ECS?? _TOP_ level project of Jakarta??
Oh and don't forget Lotus notes. Notes seems to be somewhat
of a deprecation, but had some app development features
On 29 Jan 2002, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:
| I'll subscribe.
|
| (Hey you Endre ...see what just happened)
Yes! And it's all my fault! ;-]
heh-heh! ,)
Endre
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On Tue, 2002-01-29 at 14:22, Scott Sanders wrote:
Yes. I have been thinking that Exchange needs an OSS competitor.
Yes yes yes yes yes.
Why would anyone want to create an OSS competitor of a piece of sh*t?
Let's innovate, not duplicate.
A competitor doesn't have to be a clone -
If your goal is to target other developers, then why use Exchange at all
when there are better solutions out there?
Such as...?
With calendaring support?
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