Re: [Haskell-cafe] Question about the Monad instance for Iteratee (from the enumerator package)

2011-04-22 Thread John A. De Goes
You wouldn't be so confused if you had actually looked at Lato's implementation and compared it to Oleg's most recent version. Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Apr 21, 2011, at 6:27 PM, Jason Dagit wrote: On Thu, Apr 21, 2011 at 8

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Question about the Monad instance for Iteratee (from the enumerator package)

2011-04-21 Thread John A. De Goes
This is a much cleaner definition of Iteratee and I'm happy to see it. When are you going to move from your FTP site to Github, by the way? :) Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Apr 21, 2011, at 12:32 AM, o...@okmij.org wrote: Daniel

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Question about the Monad instance for Iteratee (from the enumerator package)

2011-04-20 Thread John A. De Goes
It's not OK and it's an artifact of the weak-typing and ill-defined semantics that pervade iteratee libraries. It's possible to do a lot of bad stuff, including binding with an iteratee yielding a remainder without consuming input. Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: enumerator 0.4.8

2011-03-28 Thread John A. De Goes
Now THATs what I'm talking about. Augment such a solution with interruptible resumable data producers, and I'd have everything I need. Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Mar 27, 2011, at 10:54 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: In an ideal

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: enumerator 0.4.8

2011-03-28 Thread John A. De Goes
This isn't quite what I'm after. I want to pull chunks on demand (i.e. have control over both the input and the output). Enumeratees don't allow me to do that. Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Mar 27, 2011, at 7:58 PM, John Millikin

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: enumerator 0.4.8

2011-03-27 Thread John A. De Goes
, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Mar 26, 2011, at 3:12 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: On 3/26/11 4:33 PM, John A. De Goes wrote: 4. Iteratees cannot incrementally produce output, it's all or nothing, which makes them terrible for many real world

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: enumerator 0.4.8

2011-03-27 Thread John A. De Goes
On Mar 26, 2011, at 4:24 PM, Mario Blažević wrote: On 11-03-26 04:33 PM, John A. De Goes wrote: Out of curiosity, have you looked at the monad-coroutine library? It's a more generic and IMO much cleaner model, though I wouldn't recommend it as a replacement because the enumerator

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: enumerator 0.4.8

2011-03-27 Thread John A. De Goes
. They provide excellent control of an input stream to the iteratee, but there is no structure permitting equivalent control of the output stream. Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Mar 27, 2011, at 3:22 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: On 3/27/11 11:38 AM

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: enumerator 0.4.8

2011-03-26 Thread John A. De Goes
experimenting with Mealy machines because I think they have more long-term promise to solve the problems of iteratees. Regards, John A. De Goes Twitter: @jdegoes LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/jdegoes On Mar 26, 2011, at 1:03 PM, John Millikin wrote: On Mar 26, 10:46 am, Michael Snoyman mich

Re: [Haskell-cafe] new focus for Happstack

2010-04-01 Thread John A. De Goes
Although you are joking, I've said it before and I'll say it again: server-side web development is dead. Everything that can be pushed to the client will be. Which leaves the server mainly for low-level persistence, data analysis, and anything requiring security. Static template-driven web

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Parsec-like parser combinator that handles left recursion?

2009-12-08 Thread John A. De Goes
X-Saiga. Regards, John On Dec 8, 2009, at 7:10 AM, Adam Cigánek wrote: Hello there, Is there some other parser library, with similar nice API than Parsec, but which somehow handles left-recursive grammars? Ideally if it has at least rudimentary documentation and/or tutorial :)

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Status of TypeDirectedNameResolution proposal?

2009-11-20 Thread John A. De Goes
GTDNR is what I really want anyway... whether or not it's possible. :-) At any given time, importing everything unqualified from every module used by a typical hs leads only to a handful of ambiguities. While the general case might be intractable, real-world cases might be trivial. Regards,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-11 Thread John A. De Goes
/rails_rumble_92_web_apps_created_in_48_hours.php [3] The difference in cost is strictly due to libraries. If you had some killer Haskell libraries at your disposal, I have no doubt you could do it for less than a Rails developer. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-11 Thread John A. De Goes
(JavaScript, CSS/HTML, Flash) or server-side developers (Java, PHP, Ruby, etc.). Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 10, 2009, at 12:11 PM, John Melesky wrote: On 2009-10-09, at 7:53 PM, John A. De Goes

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-11 Thread John A. De Goes
transition two companies over to Haskell, and likely more in the future. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http

[Haskell-cafe] Re: Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-08 Thread John A. De Goes
a long way towards leveling the playing field. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 7, 2009, at 5:41 PM, Curt Sampson wrote: On 2009-10-02 09:03 -0600 (Fri), John A. De Goes wrote: [Haskell] is missing

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Market Place for Haskell development teams?

2009-10-08 Thread John A. De Goes
itself. Agile means more than getting software out the door quickly, a fact many businesses have yet to learn. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 7, 2009, at 5:49 PM, Curt Sampson wrote: On 2009-10-02

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-08 Thread John A. De Goes
Exactly, it's things like this that are so frustrating and which reduce efficiency. In a mature library, you don't need to handle details like this for yourself. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-08 Thread John A. De Goes
the work you and your company have done for Haskell. What has the Industrial Haskell group done so far? I haven't seen any announcements. The work I'd be most interested in helping co-sponsor is Haskell on JVM (biggest bang for the buck). Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Libraries for Commercial Users

2009-10-08 Thread John A. De Goes
of its methods. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 8, 2009, at 1:00 PM, Gregory Crosswhite wrote: Out of curiosity, why do you think that porting Haskell to the JVM would make such a large difference

Re: [Haskell-cafe] better way to do this?

2009-10-07 Thread John A. De Goes
system, network access, randomness, and so on. This could extend the safe spot to cover much more computational real estate, and effectively sandbox programs in various ways. Good idea in theory, in practice I suspect it would lead to unmanageable boilerplate. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain

Re: [Haskell-cafe] better way to do this?

2009-10-07 Thread John A. De Goes
It's a complex area not a lot of people are working in. Similar (actually worse than) dependent typing. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 7, 2009, at 3:32 AM, Eugene Kirpichov wrote: Or you can

Re: [Haskell-cafe] dsl and gui toolkit

2009-10-06 Thread John A. De Goes
This is the right approach to a GUI toolkit. Note that personally, I believe the details of the presentation should be separate from Haskell, stored in a separate file that is machine- friendly, so designers can work in concert and in parallel with developers. Regards, John A. De Goes N

Re: [Haskell-cafe] dsl and gui toolkit

2009-10-06 Thread John A. De Goes
CSS is a good start by it's beset by all the problems of a 1st generation presentation language, and is not particularly machine- friendly. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 6, 2009, at 10:44 AM

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Num instances for 2-dimensional types

2009-10-05 Thread John A. De Goes
That's not gonna happen until when/if Haskell supports name/operator overloading. There's a scarcity of good symbols/function names and everyone wants to use them. So naturally, type class abuse follows. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

Re: [Haskell-cafe] killer app sought

2009-10-04 Thread John A. De Goes
With few exceptions, no such thing as a killer server-side app. The Web 3.0 paradigm is simple: all work except sharing and persistence of data is done on the client. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Market Place for Haskell development teams?

2009-10-02 Thread John A. De Goes
On Oct 1, 2009, at 12:13 AM, Curt Sampson wrote: And as far as something like dealing with a changing language and libraries, the mainstream already has well-established and popular techniques for doing just: agile development. A project manager's worst nightmare: Sorry boss, but we're just

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Market Place for Haskell development teams?

2009-10-02 Thread John A. De Goes
that are of no interest whatsoever to commercial software developers (new numerical hierarchies, category theory libraries, etc.), and is missing many key libraries that would be of great commercial value. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Market Place for Haskell development teams?

2009-10-02 Thread John A. De Goes
for doing just: agile development. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Oct 2, 2009, at 9:03 AM, minh thu wrote: 2009/10/2 John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net: On Oct 1, 2009, at 12:13 AM, Curt Sampson wrote

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Market Place for Haskell development teams?

2009-09-30 Thread John A. De Goes
, a manager really likes the ability to seamlessly move across platforms and architectures without recompilation. 32 - 64? No problem. Linux - BSD? Sure, why not? Yes, I'm sure even Amazon, Yahoo, and Google make these kinds of considerations. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-29 Thread John A. De Goes
for small applications that don't need specialized libraries (and apparently, for small segments of the financial industry). For other applications, it usually cannot compete economically with other, vastly technically inferior languages like Java. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-29 Thread John A. De Goes
adoption and mass adoption). Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 28, 2009, at 11:01 AM, Jason Dusek wrote: 2009/09/28 John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net: Libraries are _everything_... Not exactly

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-28 Thread John A. De Goes
open source libraries available for the Java platform. But I do agree on this: the JVM does indeed need a Haskell-like language. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 27, 2009, at 8:10 PM, Curt Sampson

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-28 Thread John A. De Goes
CAL is interesting, but unfortunately dead, and has no community. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 27, 2009, at 3:38 PM, Peter Verswyvelen wrote: That's not really true. Just use CAL from the Open

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Market Place for Haskell development teams?

2009-09-28 Thread John A. De Goes
written tiny to small Haskell apps); 4. How many shops are capable of handling Haskell development maintenance. These are the kinds of information one needs to make an informed decision about whether to introduce Haskell into the workplace. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-28 Thread John A. De Goes
worth of resources at your disposal. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 28, 2009, at 7:49 AM, Curt Sampson wrote: On 2009-09-28 07:01 -0600 (Mon), John A. De Goes wrote: And I stand by my statement

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-28 Thread John A. De Goes
, seamless, and easy Java interop, then it would be a success. Having neither, I'm not surprised it has no community and development has ceased. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 28, 2009, at 9:59 AM

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Comments requested: succ Java

2009-09-27 Thread John A. De Goes
interop with Java. Haskell is not in this category. It's stuck in a different world, wholly inaccessible to the masses. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 27, 2009, at 10:16 AM, Curt Sampson wrote

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANN: haskell-src-exts-1.1.4

2009-09-03 Thread John A. De Goes
Roundtrip is an important milestone for automated refactoring tools. Nice work! Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Sep 3, 2009, at 2:57 PM, Niklas Broberg wrote: Fellow Haskelleers, I'm pleased

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell?

2009-08-16 Thread John A. De Goes
constraints, high-level constructs, and a powerful effect system. Saying, I don't know exactly how it will look, is quite a bit different from saying It can't be done. I claim the former. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell?

2009-08-16 Thread John A. De Goes
, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Aug 16, 2009, at 2:46 AM, Marcin Kosiba wrote: Hi, IMHO, provided with a flexible effect system, the decision on how to do read/write operations on files is a matter of libraries

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-16 Thread John A. De Goes
On Aug 15, 2009, at 5:32 PM, Sebastian Sylvan wrote: On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 12:18 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: You must think I'm arguing for some kind of low-level analog of C, augmented with an effect system. I'm not. You can't do that. No, I don't. I think you're arguing

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-16 Thread John A. De Goes
In the presence of _uncontrolled concurrency_, you are correct, but uncontrolled concurrency is a failed paradigm littered with defective software. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Aug 16, 2009

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-15 Thread John A. De Goes
. It's only an illusion that such programs are safe, with or without transformation of sequential read operations. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 ___ Haskell

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-15 Thread John A. De Goes
On Aug 14, 2009, at 9:34 PM, Sebastian Sylvan wrote: On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 3:55 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: If you don't like the file system, consider mutable memory. An effect system will tell me I can safely update two pieces of non- overlapping, contiguous memory

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-15 Thread John A. De Goes
On Aug 15, 2009, at 6:36 AM, Jason Dusek wrote: 2009/08/14 John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net: Hmmm, my point (perhaps I wasn't clear), is that different effects have different commutability properties. In the case of a file system, you can commute two sequential reads from two different files

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-15 Thread John A. De Goes
many almost- impossible-to-debug crashes). I would not want functional languages to adopt something that's proven to be insanity-inducingly difficult to use. Please don't ever bring up C again. You can't do anything interesting in C. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-14 Thread John A. De Goes
and commute is quite complicated and needs to be baked into the effect system, rather than being the responsibility of a lowly developer. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Aug 13, 2009, at 12:24 PM, Sebastian

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-14 Thread John A. De Goes
, contiguous memory concurrently, even in different threads if the complexity so justifies it. The IO monad is a poor man's solution to the problem of effects. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cleaner networking API - network-fancy

2009-08-13 Thread John A. De Goes
Thank goodness for a cleaner networking API. I almost chose Haskell's socket API as an example of what _not_ to do in my series on Good API Design (http://jdegoes.squarespace.com/journal/2009/5/11/good-api-design-part-3.html ). Ended up going with Java though. :-) Regards, John A. De

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-13 Thread John A. De Goes
with the file system or networking, etc.). Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Aug 13, 2009, at 2:42 AM, Sebastian Sylvan wrote: On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 4:56 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-13 Thread John A. De Goes
is interference from outside programs. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Aug 13, 2009, at 3:45 AM, Jason Dusek wrote: 2009/08/12 John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net: The next step is to distinguish between

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-13 Thread John A. De Goes
experiment in that direction. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-12 Thread John A. De Goes
the point is that a functional language with a built- in effect system that captures the nature of effects is pretty damn cool and eliminates a lot of boilerplate. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-12 Thread John A. De Goes
So what, because effect systems might not eliminate *all* boilerplate, you'd rather use boilerplate 100% of the time? :-) Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Aug 12, 2009, at 3:28 PM, Dan Doel wrote

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-12 Thread John A. De Goes
. Something that dumb monads can't provide. I haven't played with DDC, but I do believe some new FPL with a powerful effect system is going to take off in the next 5 years. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101

Re: DDC compiler and effects; better than Haskell? (was Re: [Haskell-cafe] unsafeDestructiveAssign?)

2009-08-12 Thread John A. De Goes
, memory, etc., then you'll be able to do some extremely powerful parallelization optimization. But for now providing course grained information on the class to which an effect belongs is pretty interesting in its own right. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Thinking about what's missing in our library coverage

2009-08-05 Thread John A. De Goes
Tom is exactly right here. GPL is the kiss of death in the commercial world. Haskell Platform exists in part to encourage industry use of Haskell -- and to encourage braindead use of blessed libraries. GPL libraries have no place in HP. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Proposal: TypeDirectedNameResolution

2009-07-27 Thread John A. De Goes
I've spoken in favor of this many times before. But there are many who think, Every function you write should have a unique name. Talk about needless clutter. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jul

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on JVM

2009-06-26 Thread John A. De Goes
JVM 7 has tail calls, and if you don't want to wait for that, goto works perfectly well for self-recursive functions. Other techniques can deal with mutual recursion, albeit at the cost of performance. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on JVM

2009-06-26 Thread John A. De Goes
I don't have a source, but I know tail calls have been implemented (in a patch) and tested, and at the JVM Summit everyone was saying this was definitely going to be released in JVM 7. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone

2009-06-24 Thread John A. De Goes
That sounds sufficient -- basically, just tell the sponsored developer where to look to get started, give him a rough idea of what needs to be done, and let him sort out the rest. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone

2009-06-23 Thread John A. De Goes
I have strong interest in Haskell on the JVM. Not for Android, however. Seems like every time this topic comes up, the consensus is that it's not easy to support new targets with GHC, but that work is underway to make such developments easier. Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell on the iPhone

2009-06-23 Thread John A. De Goes
? Regards, John A. De Goes N-Brain, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Jun 23, 2009, at 8:16 AM, Simon Peyton-Jones wrote: Good news about the iPhone port! There seems to be quite a bit more interest now in supporting platforms other than

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Darcs as undo/redo system?

2009-05-09 Thread John A. De Goes
Una Merge does real-time merging and has per user undo. And it can do lots of stuff that seems darcs-like, though I don't know enough about darcs to say for sure (e.g. moving a user's own edits after other edits). http://www.n-brain.net/una_merge.html Regards, John A. De Goes N

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell/JS -- better through typeclasses?

2009-04-26 Thread John A. De Goes
in this area is clearly the best available). What I'd really like is something like SMLtoJS (possibly without the reactive library), but for Haskell. And that does not exist. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell/JS -- better through typeclasses?

2009-04-26 Thread John A. De Goes
infinite is not as easy, but it might be sufficient to use lazy evaluation whenever there is a possibility that a structure might be infinite. Any function exported to JavaScript must return a finite list. Annotations would be another way of handling this. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell/JS -- better through typeclasses?

2009-04-25 Thread John A. De Goes
4.3.5. Haskell doesn't have anything close! Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Apr 25, 2009, at 11:53 AM, Jason Dusek wrote: I'd like to be able to translate Haskell to JavaScript. Many Haskell/JS bridges

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: ANNOUNCE: Utrecht Haskell Compiler (UHC) -- first release

2009-04-23 Thread John A. De Goes
. Is there a simple way to download everything from Hackage? One would need to write a script to do this. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: ANNOUNCE: Utrecht Haskell Compiler (UHC) -- first release

2009-04-23 Thread John A. De Goes
for Haskell 98. :-) Do you think that's fair? Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Apr 23, 2009, at 3:18 AM, Jon Fairbairn wrote: John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net writes: That's absurd. You have no way

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: ANNOUNCE: Utrecht Haskell Compiler (UHC) -- first release

2009-04-22 Thread John A. De Goes
if no one (that we know) uses them. Moreover, the odds that everyone who is using n + k patterns are doing so only in private is an untestable hypothesis (i.e. unscientific) and extremely unlikely to be true. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Is 78 characters still a good option? Was: breaking too long lines

2009-04-22 Thread John A. De Goes
Another reason for the 80 character limit: some developers have very poor eyesight, which can be overcome with large monitors and large fonts. This won't work if you have to scroll the code. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net

Re: [Haskell-cafe] General function to count list elements?

2009-04-18 Thread John A. De Goes
function equality, you could use it to prove or disprove arbitrary theorems in mathematics. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Apr 18, 2009, at 9:39 AM, Eugene Kirpichov wrote: Could you then provide

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hugs on iPhone

2009-03-24 Thread John A. De Goes
possible to sell GPL code, only that it's not commercially viable. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Mar 24, 2009, at 1:27 AM, Jules Bean wrote: Rick R wrote: The agreement doesn't specifically prohibit

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hugs on iPhone

2009-03-24 Thread John A. De Goes
companies selling the labors of others. Joe Schmoe who contributed patch #2345235 to fix a critical bug never sees a cent from RedHat. So your examples don't support your case as much as you seem to think. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hugs on iPhone

2009-03-24 Thread John A. De Goes
complicated enough and you know your way around it, then you can sell support maintenance. However, those conditions doesn't apply to consumer software, because consumers don't want complicated software. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net

Re: [Haskell-cafe] least fixed points above something

2009-03-19 Thread John A. De Goes
A JIT compiler can easily know. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Mar 19, 2009, at 10:29 AM, Neil Mitchell wrote: CSE is tricky and a potential space leak in general. I'd love it if the compiler could

Re: [Haskell-cafe] DSLs with {in,}equalities

2009-03-03 Thread John A. De Goes
Workarounds for the lack of linguistic overloading. :-) Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Mar 3, 2009, at 12:52 AM, Lennart Augustsson wrote: I often hide the Prelude and import my own Prelude which

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Left fold enumerator - a real pearl overlooked?

2009-03-03 Thread John A. De Goes
understand your question, Why have laziness in Haskell at all? Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Mar 2, 2009, at 6:03 PM, Henning Thielemann wrote: On Mon, 2 Mar 2009, John Lato wrote: Hello, I am

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: base-4 + gtk2hs-0.10.0 licensing

2009-02-26 Thread John A. De Goes
, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 26, 2009, at 1:17 AM, Ketil Malde wrote: Peter Hercek pher...@gmail.com writes: Relinking against newer Gtk2Hs versions might not work. You have the option of recompiling

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket

2009-02-26 Thread John A. De Goes
On Feb 25, 2009, at 7:49 PM, Achim Schneider wrote: John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: The problem is that PL research is probably not going to stop evolving in our lifetimes. Yes, that research needs a venue, but why should it be Haskell? Haskell is a good language and it's time to start

Re: [Haskell-cafe] statep haskell-lang [was: Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket]

2009-02-26 Thread John A. De Goes
into newer source code. Add binary compatibility, and then the only real disadvantage in language evolution becomes retraining and tools. Which are both significant costs, to be sure, but not as significant as the former. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: statep haskell-lang [was: Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket]

2009-02-26 Thread John A. De Goes
compatibility. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 26, 2009, at 1:08 PM, Achim Schneider wrote: John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: What do you mean by progress? I noted before

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: statep haskell-lang [was: Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket]

2009-02-26 Thread John A. De Goes
No, I hate C and will never use it again in my entire life unless forced to at the point of a gun. You're point? :-P Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 26, 2009, at 1:17 PM, Jonathan Cast wrote

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: statep haskell-lang [was: Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket]

2009-02-26 Thread John A. De Goes
On Feb 26, 2009, at 1:36 PM, Jonathan Cast wrote: On Thu, 2009-02-26 at 13:25 -0700, John A. De Goes wrote: No, I hate C and will never use it again in my entire life unless forced to at the point of a gun. Why? Its libraries are far better, its editors are far better [1], its compilers

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket

2009-02-25 Thread John A. De Goes
. The more people using Haskell, the more libraries that will be written, the more bugs that will be fixed, the more creativity that will be poured into development of libraries and the language itself. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket

2009-02-25 Thread John A. De Goes
will find or invent a new target to keep themselves occupied. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 25, 2009, at 5:52 PM, Jonathan Cast wrote: On Wed, 2009-02-25 at 17:54 -0700, John A. De Goes wrote: It's

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Hoogle and Network.Socket

2009-02-25 Thread John A. De Goes
. Haskell is already behind state-of-the art in PL research and it seems unlikely to catch up (witness the slow evolution of Haskell' and the non-existent progress on Haskell2). Of course, I could be wrong. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n

[Haskell-cafe] jhc speed

2009-02-22 Thread John A. De Goes
, and if successful, it would allow you to better focus on the really important stuff. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 20, 2009, at 4:14 PM, John Meacham wrote: On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:52:27PM +0100

Re: [Haskell-cafe] jhc speed

2009-02-22 Thread John A. De Goes
can you provide if we get enough people interested in this? Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 22, 2009, at 7:45 AM, John Meacham wrote: On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 07:25:26AM -0700, John A. De Goes wrote

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Hoogle and Network.Socket

2009-02-21 Thread John A. De Goes
systems. Not showing platform-specific packages by default *might* make package writers more likely to develop cross-platform packages. We've heard many times someone say, I don't know if it works on Windows, never really thought of that. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc

Re: Re[5]: [Haskell-cafe] Re: speed: ghc vs gcc

2009-02-21 Thread John A. De Goes
It's not practical at all. It's monstrously more complicated than C. It would be much simpler to do it in C and use FFI. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 21, 2009, at 4:55 PM, Sebastian Sylvan

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Hoogle and Network.Socket

2009-02-21 Thread John A. De Goes
Maybe because one Haskeller generally tries to help another one. That's what what it means to be a community, no? Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 21, 2009, at 6:47 PM, Jonathan Cast wrote

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell.org GSoC

2009-02-19 Thread John A. De Goes
Unfortunately the proofs in dependently typed languages are extremely long and tedious to write. Some kind of compiler proofing tool could ease the pain, but I do not think it has low enough complexity for a GSoC project. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Haskell.org GSoC

2009-02-19 Thread John A. De Goes
in this area already. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 19, 2009, at 3:35 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: 2009/2/19 Wolfgang Jeltsch g9ks1...@acme.softbase.org Am Donnerstag, 19. Februar 2009 02:22

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Overloading functions based on arguments?

2009-02-19 Thread John A. De Goes
and function of programs to suggest our intentions to others. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Overloading functions based on arguments?

2009-02-19 Thread John A. De Goes
On Feb 14, 2009, at 11:28 PM, wren ng thornton wrote: John A. De Goes wrote: On Feb 13, 2009, at 2:11 PM, Jonathan Cast wrote: The compiler should fail when you tell it two mutually contradictory things, and only when you tell it two mutually contradictory things. By definition, it's

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Overloading functions based on arguments?

2009-02-19 Thread John A. De Goes
structure and associated properties. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 19, 2009, at 7:33 AM, Luke Palmer wrote: On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 7:09 AM, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: On Feb 14

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Overloading functions based on arguments?

2009-02-14 Thread John A. De Goes
On Feb 13, 2009, at 6:31 PM, Krzysztof Skrzętnicki wrote: On Fri, Feb 13, 2009 at 22:37, John A. De Goes j...@n-brain.net wrote: On Feb 13, 2009, at 2:11 PM, Jonathan Cast wrote: The compiler should fail when you tell it two mutually contradictory things, and only when you tell it two

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: Overloading functions based on arguments?

2009-02-14 Thread John A. De Goes
to assist with typing. Regards, John A. De Goes N-BRAIN, Inc. The Evolution of Collaboration http://www.n-brain.net|877-376-2724 x 101 On Feb 13, 2009, at 6:31 PM, Robert Greayer wrote: -- John A. De Goes wrote: Adding information cannot remove a contradiction from the information

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