[Haskell-cafe] Case studies, step two

2013-10-09 Thread Mike Meyer
I want to thank everyone who provided pointers for the last question about this. They were a big help. We're now trying to narrow things down a bit. If you have either converted part of a business project from a language like ruby or python to Haskell, or have a business project that integrates

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Any precedent or plan for guaranteed-safe Eq and Ord instances?

2013-10-02 Thread Mike Meyer
On Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 5:18 AM, Tom Ellis tom-lists-haskell-cafe-2...@jaguarpaw.co.uk wrote: Are there examples where application programmers would like there so be some f, a and b such that a == b but f a /= f b (efficiency concerns aside)? I can't think of any obvious ones. Yes, and we

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Looking for numbers to support using haskell

2013-09-26 Thread Mike Meyer
11:31 AM, MigMit wrote: The classical reference is, I think, the paper “Haskell vs. Ada vs. C++ vs. Awk vs. ... An Experiment in Software Prototyping Productivity” On Sep 23, 2013, at 9:20 PM, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote: Hi all, I'm looking for articles that provide some technical

[Haskell-cafe] FP Complete competition clarification

2013-09-26 Thread Mike Meyer
I got some clarification on what unpublished means for FP Complete competition entries. Basically, you can enter code that you've already published, providing it has an appropriate license (or can be republished with such a license). The tutorial/description/documentation that shows how to use it

[Haskell-cafe] Looking for numbers to support using haskell

2013-09-23 Thread Mike Meyer
Hi all, I'm looking for articles that provide some technical support for why Haskell rocks. Not just cheerleading, but something with a bit of real information in it - a comparison of code snippets in multiple languages, or the results of a study on programmer productivity (given all the noise

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Mystery of an Eq instance

2013-09-21 Thread Mike Meyer
On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 2:21 AM, Bardur Arantsson s...@scientician.net wrote: On 2013-09-21 06:16, Mike Meyer wrote: The single biggest gotcha is that two calculations we expect to be equal often aren't. As a result of this, we warn people not to do equality comparison on floats. The Eq

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Mystery of an Eq instance

2013-09-21 Thread Mike Meyer
On Sep 21, 2013 9:17 AM, Bob Hutchison hutch-li...@recursive.ca wrote: On 2013-09-21, at 4:46 AM, Stijn van Drongelen rhym...@gmail.com wrote: I do have to agree with Damodar Kulkarni that different laws imply different classes. However, this will break **a lot** of existing software. You could

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Mystery of an Eq instance

2013-09-21 Thread Mike Meyer
On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 5:28 PM, Bardur Arantsson s...@scientician.net wrote: On 2013-09-21 23:08, Mike Meyer wrote: Exactly. The Eq and Ord instances aren't what's broken, at least when you're dealing with numbers (NaNs are another story). That there are pairs According to Haskell NaN

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Mystery of an Eq instance

2013-09-20 Thread Mike Meyer
On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 11:17 AM, damodar kulkarni kdamodar2...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, let's say it is the effect of truncation. But then how do you explain this? Oh, it's a trunaction error all right. Prelude sqrt 10.0 == 3.1622776601683795 True Prelude sqrt 10.0 == 3.1622776601683796 True

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Mystery of an Eq instance

2013-09-20 Thread Mike Meyer
On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 7:35 PM, damodar kulkarni kdamodar2...@gmail.com wrote: This seems a good step forward, removing the Eq instance altogether on floating point types would be much better; (unless as pointed out by Brandon, you have a very clever representation that can store (floats) in

Re: [Haskell-cafe] World's First Commercial Haskell IDE and Deployment Platform, FP Haskell Center Launches Today

2013-09-03 Thread Mike Meyer
On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 2:25 PM, Tommy Thorn tt1...@yahoo.com wrote: This is interesting and I wish them luck, but it seems surprising that the below link doesn't have as much as a screenshot (for an IDE, you kind of expect to see what it looks like). If you follow the link that says Product

[Haskell-cafe] Embedded haskell?

2013-02-20 Thread Mike Meyer
I've been working with open source rc aircraft transmitter software, and in looking at the shortcomings of one of them, started thinking about embedding a language. There are a number of options that can work here, like FORTH or a basic. But then I realized that Haskell - or similar functional

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Embedded haskell?

2013-02-20 Thread Mike Meyer
On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:01 PM, Jeremy Shaw jer...@n-heptane.com wrote: Another option would be to use Atom. I have successfully used it to target the arduino platform before. Running the entire OS on the embedded system seems dubious. Assuming you are using something the 9x family of

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Object Oriented programming for Functional Programmers

2013-01-02 Thread Mike Meyer
On Wed, 2 Jan 2013 13:48:07 +0400 MigMit miguelim...@yandex.ru wrote: On Jan 2, 2013, at 10:52 AM, Mike Meyer m...@mired.org wrote: MigMit miguelim...@yandex.ru wrote: But really, Design by Contract — a theory? It certainly is a useful approach, but it doesn't seem to be a theory, not until

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Object Oriented programming for Functional Programmers

2013-01-01 Thread Mike Meyer
MigMit miguelim...@yandex.ru wrote: On Jan 1, 2013, at 10:23 PM, Никитин Лев leon.v.niki...@pravmail.ru wrote: Eiffel, for my opinion, is a best OOP language. Meyer use a theoretical approach as it is possible in OOP. Really? Because when I studied it I had a very different impression: that

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Object Oriented programming for Functional Programmers

2013-01-01 Thread Mike Meyer
[Context destroyed by top posting.] MigMit miguelim...@yandex.ru wrote: But really, Design by Contract — a theory? It certainly is a useful approach, but it doesn't seem to be a theory, not until we can actually prove something about it, and Eiffel doesn't seem to offer anything in this

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Object Oriented programming for Functional Programmers

2012-12-31 Thread Mike Meyer
On Mon, Dec 31, 2012 at 7:46 AM, Strake strake...@gmail.com wrote: Disclaimer: My own experience with OO is limited. Mine isn't quite so much... On 30/12/2012, Daniel Díaz Casanueva dhelta.d...@gmail.com wrote: My programming life (which has started about 3-4 years ago) has always been in

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-17 Thread Mike Meyer
On 12/17/12, Ketil Malde ke...@malde.org wrote: I would use copying to mean verbatim cut-and-pasting, which is something else. I feel I should point out that, while that's currently a common definition of copying, it's not the legal definition. Copyright law predates the ability to

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-17 Thread Mike Meyer
Ketil Malde ke...@malde.org wrote: Mike Meyer m...@mired.org writes: Niklas Larsson metanik...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/12/15 Mike Meyer m...@mired.org: Only if Tanenbaum documented the internal behavior of Linux before it was written. Tannenbaum wrote Minix, the operating system that Linus used

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-17 Thread Mike Meyer
Ketil Malde ke...@malde.org wrote: In particular when copyright is concerned, I believe that verbatim copying in many cases will require a license to the original work, but merly examining the original work to make use of algorithms, tricks, and structures from it will not. If you don't actually

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-15 Thread Mike Meyer
Ketil Malde ke...@malde.org wrote: Clark Gaebel cgae...@uwaterloo.ca writes: I just did a quick derivation from http://graphics.stanford.edu/~seander/bithacks.html#RoundUpPowerOf2 A copyrighted work, you say? The work is copyrighted, the snippets are placed in the placed in the public domain.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-15 Thread Mike Meyer
Niklas Larsson metanik...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/12/15 Mike Meyer m...@mired.org: Only if Tanenbaum documented the internal behavior of Linux before it was written. Tannenbaum wrote Minix, the operating system that Linus used (and hacked on) before he did Linux. Minix contained lots of features

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-13 Thread Mike Meyer
in the company code base is that it opens them up to the possibility of a lawsuit. That the original author said it was derived from GPL'ed code was sufficient to cause at least one lawyer to believe that a case existed. mike -- Mike Meyer m...@mired.org http://www.mired.org

Re: [Haskell-cafe] LGPL and Haskell (Was: Re: ANNOUNCE: tie-knot library)

2012-12-13 Thread Mike Meyer
software that is covered by such a license. You can find a list of these licenses at: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html#GPLIncompatibleLicenses and following, which lists licenses used for open source but aren't considered free licenses by the GNU folks. mike -- Mike Meyer m

Re: [Haskell-cafe] containers license issue

2012-12-12 Thread Mike Meyer
Niklas Larsson metanik...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/12/12 Niklas Larsson metanik...@gmail.com: There is no copied code from FXT (which can be said with certainty as FXT is a C library), hence the there can be copyright issue. Gah, I should proofread! NO copyright issue, of course. Um, no.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] ANNOUNCE: tie-knot library

2012-12-11 Thread Mike Meyer
David Thomas davidleotho...@gmail.com wrote: ... and OS X and iOS are clearly a win for the FLOSS community? Yes. The parts of it that are willing to use BSD-licensed software, anyway. Apple does release sources to some of their toys. They released all of OS X below the GUI level, for

Re: [Haskell-cafe] education or experience?

2012-12-09 Thread Mike Meyer
Heinrich Apfelmus apfel...@quantentunnel.de wrote: Christopher Howard wrote: Concerning a university education, there are two approaches 1. I want to learn as much as possible 2. I want to learn just enough to get a high-paying job There's actually a third approach ( and probably more): 3. I

[Haskell-cafe] Real-time code in Haskell (Was: Can a GC delay TCP connection formation?)

2012-11-27 Thread Mike Meyer
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 3:45 AM, Gregory Collins g...@gregorycollins.net wrote: If you have a hard real-time requirement then a garbage-collected language may not be appropriate for you. This is a common meme, but frankly, it isn't true. When writing real-time code, you just need to make sure

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Compilers: Why do we need a core language?

2012-11-23 Thread Mike Meyer
Jacques Carette care...@mcmaster.ca wrote: On 22/11/2012 11:52 AM, Brandon Allbery wrote: On Thu, Nov 22, 2012 at 7:56 AM, Jacques Carette care...@mcmaster.ca mailto:care...@mcmaster.ca wrote: On 20/11/2012 6:08 PM, Richard O'Keefe wrote: On 21/11/2012, at 4:49 AM,

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Cabal failures...

2012-11-21 Thread Mike Meyer
On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 7:34 PM, Albert Y. C. Lai tre...@vex.net wrote: On 12-11-20 08:20 PM, Johan Tibell wrote: This logic is flawed. More than 90% of computers having Windows doesn't imply that 90% of all computers in a given household runs Windows. What's the probability that your

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Optimal line length for haskell

2012-10-30 Thread Mike Meyer
Evan Laforge qdun...@gmail.com wrote: I wonder if people who like one giant window maybe don't use the REPL? I keep 3 windows open: one with the editor, one with ghci, and one with a shell. [...] I've tried with 3 terminals but I can never figure out what to do with the extra ones. Besides

Re: [Haskell-cafe] Optimal line length for haskell

2012-10-29 Thread Mike Meyer
Colin Adams colinpaulad...@gmail.com wrote: I'm not viewing on a narrow device, and I see the wrapped (and the whole post confined to the centre of the screen). I certainly don't use an 80-column limit any more. I use the rule: A function must be completely visible in my editor on my screen.

Re: [Haskell-cafe] forkProcess, forkIO, and multithreaded runtime

2012-10-16 Thread Mike Meyer
locks, and locks on files that are closed on exec will unexpectedly close them in the parent. mike -- Mike Meyer m...@mired.org http://www.mired.org/ Independent Software developer/SCM consultant, email for more information. O ascii ribbon campaign - stop html mail