Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-06 23:31, John Smith wrote: On 7 July 2011 07:25, Andreas Perstingerandreas.perstin...@gmx.net wrote: No, I just wanted to show you that you can't really tell if someone retraces a removed way by looking at an aerial imagery, by looking at the current OSM map or by just moving

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread John Smith
On 7 July 2011 16:16, Andreas Perstinger andreas.perstin...@gmx.net wrote: That's why I prefer PD because I believe there is no protection and so why bother about licenses at all? Wouldn't it be great if we could all wish away inconvenient laws like that, however morality often drives laws and

[OSM-legal-talk] OT: artists and copyright (was Re: license change effect on un-tagged nodes)

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
Probably OT: On 2011-07-07 02:25, John Smith wrote: How many painters die poor? What about famous composers? Economics became an issue much later. So artists have a human right to be rich? There are many reasons why painters or composers die poor (people don't like their work and don't

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-07 08:24, John Smith wrote: On 7 July 2011 16:16, Andreas Perstingerandreas.perstin...@gmx.net wrote: That's why I prefer PD because I believe there is no protection and so why bother about licenses at all? Wouldn't it be great if we could all wish away inconvenient laws like

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] OT: artists and copyright (was Re: license change effect on un-tagged nodes)

2011-07-07 Thread John Smith
On 7 July 2011 16:40, Andreas Perstinger andreas.perstin...@gmx.net wrote: So artists have a human right to be rich? Glad you took my point so far out of context, someone claimed that copyright existed for economic reasons. ___ legal-talk mailing list

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Frederik Ramm
Simon, Andreas, all, when discussing these things with the person who goes by the pseudonym of John Smith, keep in mind that he is spending a lot of time building/supporting an OpenStreetMap fork. The forkers, as I like to call them, are driven by all kinds of motivations, the most

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread John Smith
On 7 July 2011 16:58, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: While they started out wishing OSM to suffer the least possible damage, their ego now forces them to demand the most rigid - even absurd - data deletion policies for the license change lest they look like idiots for starting a fork

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Simon Poole
Frederik, I'm fully aware of JS motives and tactics and normally avoid getting sucked in to his endless threads. But it was 2 am and I was just finishing tax returns and associated book keeping. John Smith is a tiny bit more entertaining than that and I needed a short break :-) Simon Am

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread 80n
On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 7:58 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Simon, Andreas, all, when discussing these things with the person who goes by the pseudonym of John Smith, keep in mind that he is spending a lot of time building/supporting an OpenStreetMap fork. The forkers, as

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen
+1 Frederik has not shown much respect for any argument nor to anyone that disagrees with the future commercialisation of OSM. (with that I means making OSM optimally fit for commercial use; disregarding the open principles that OSM started with: leaving out the Share Alike principle)

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-07 08:58, Frederik Ramm wrote: when discussing these things with the person who goes by the pseudonym of John Smith, keep in mind that he is spending a lot of time building/supporting an OpenStreetMap fork. I know who John Smith and his fellows are and I even read their

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-07 08:39, Anthony wrote: On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:16 AM, Andreas Perstinger No (see above). But I think it's more a question of morality and adhering to community guidelines. Legally I don't see any problems using informations from any map (or aerial imagery). But using

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-07 09:35, 80n wrote: Data loss is your problem not ours. I see people doing thought experiments about how they can get around the wishes of contributors who have, in good faith, provided their content under the CC license. Those people who have not agreed to the CT have not

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-07 08:48, Anthony wrote: On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:45 AM, Andreas Perstinger andreas.perstin...@gmx.net wrote: On 2011-07-07 08:24, John Smith wrote: Wouldn't it be great if we could all wish away inconvenient laws like that, however morality often drives laws and they tend seem

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Fwd: [OSM-dev] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Dave F.
On 07/07/2011 07:41, Anthony wrote: Thanks Toby. I'm forwarding this to Dave Fox, who is the one who actually asked the question. It follows pretty naturally out of the database schema. Anything that modifies the ways, way_tags or way_nodes tables creates a new version of the way. Things

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Andreas Perstinger
On 2011-07-07 19:55, John Smith wrote: On 7 July 2011 21:49, Andreas Perstingerandreas.perstin...@gmx.net wrote: But that doesn't mean that their content won't show up in a future ODBL map. I've noticed that John Smith doesn't want to answer my question, but perhaps you would: How far away

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen
+1 Gert -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: John Smith [mailto:deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com] Verzonden: donderdag 7 juli 2011 19:55 Aan: Licensing and other legal discussions. Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes On 7 July 2011 21:49, Andreas Perstinger

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] license change effect on un-tagged nodes

2011-07-07 Thread Rob Myers
On 07/07/11 20:14, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: +1 /2 ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] data derived from UK Ordnace Survey

2011-07-07 Thread James Livingston
On 16 June 2011 21:08, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: On 06/16/11 12:31, Dermot McNally wrote: Not quite, based on what Richard is saying. It would allow future relicensing but only if the new licence remained compatible with the terms seen to be required by the OS (currently