I agree with Rui,
arts piped into jack is probably the best solution currently.
And when doing paranoid low latency audio work just kill artsd as Rui said.
I'm not a big user of consumer audio apps (eg mailer that emits
BOING.WAV) but
I guess due to certain apps being KDE centric and some GNOME
Hi,
I guess we are in need of some guys who help making JACK
ready for the desktop.
If you're on KDE 3.3+, try these Setup/Options on qjackctl:
[X] Execute script on Startup:
`artsshell -q terminate`
[X] Execute script after Startup:
`artsd -F 4 -S 1024 -a jack -m artsmessage -c
What's the current coding standard for consumer audio
apps that should work in both
KDE and GNOME enviroments ? Use ALSA directly, support both
artsd/esd etc ?
that's the problem. Currently there's no standard, but
creating one would simplify life a lot for developers of any
kind of audio
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 02:34:46AM +0200, Christoph Eckert wrote:
I think we should (and can) keep the desktop and 'pro'
worlds separate.
I do not agree :) . We're in the free software world, so
there's no need to tell the non-pro-audio-users use anything
else.
I think we can educate
Christoph Eckert wrote:
well, I have written a small login script which catches the
ALSA ID of my USB card and starts JACK on top of it each time
I login. This is because I use three USB devices and I didn't
manage to index them correctly to make them appear in the
same order each day.
If
Hallo,
Martin Habets hat gesagt: // Martin Habets wrote:
I think we can educate users to use a different login for pro-audio
work versus their normal desktop. The different logins can use a
different audio setup.
Actually I think, that having (at least) two soundcards will become a
standard:
I think we can educate users to use a different login for
pro-audio work versus their normal desktop. The different
logins can use a different audio setup.
I think we can not.
Personally I have a special runlevel to do audio work, but
that would probably be asking too much from your
At 2:34 +0200 18/6/05, Christoph Eckert wrote:
I think we should (and can) keep the desktop and 'pro'
worlds separate.
definitely not.
I do not agree :) . We're in the free software world, so
there's no need to tell the non-pro-audio-users use anything
else.
there should just be
I think we can educate users to use a different login for pro-audio
work versus their normal desktop. The different logins can use a
different audio setup.
what an absolutely horrid solution. i can't believe its even being considered.
Personally I have a special runlevel to do audio work,
there should just be 'working audio', whether your app is a
desktop app, a sound-synth, or a DAW. why should there be
a difference?
*sigh* :)
There are at least no technical reasons. Since I have some
knowledge about linux audio, I try to elicit what the future
audio subsystem for linux
Well I think that there is absolutly no border between Professional
Audio and Non-Professional Audio.
Just think about it, today you're using mainly xmms to play some
ogg-files, but suddenly you become a little creative, und you want to
do some drumming with hydrogen. I see no reason why somebody
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 04:38:52PM +0200, Richard Spindler wrote:
Well I think that there is absolutly no border between Professional
Audio and Non-Professional Audio.
See some previous posts.
Just think about it, today you're using mainly xmms to play some
ogg-files, but suddenly you
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 04:06:34PM +0200, Jay Vaughan wrote:
I think we can educate users to use a different login for pro-audio
work versus their normal desktop. The different logins can use a
different audio setup.
what an absolutely horrid solution. i can't believe its even being
[fons adriaensen]
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 04:04:11PM +0200, Jay Vaughan wrote:
there should just be 'working audio', whether your app is a desktop
app, a sound-synth, or a DAW. why should there be a difference?
Why are the terms 'consumer' and 'professional' used to denote two
different
Hallo,
Richard Spindler hat gesagt: // Richard Spindler wrote:
Well I think that there is absolutly no border between Professional
Audio and Non-Professional Audio.
Just think about it, today you're using mainly xmms to play some
ogg-files, but suddenly you become a little creative, und you
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 02:34:46AM +0200, Christoph Eckert wrote:
I think we should (and can) keep the desktop and 'pro'
worlds separate.
I do not agree :) . We're in the free software world, so
there's no need to tell the non-pro-audio-users use anything
else.
How OS X solves this
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 07:24:26PM +0200, Tim Goetze wrote:
Dividing computed audio into a 'professional' and an 'amateur' camp
only serves to defend obsolete categories and the arbitrary borders
inbetween.
I can assure you that from a POV of a paying customer, the difference
is neither
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 07:24:26PM +0200, Tim Goetze wrote:
Dividing computed audio into a 'professional' and an 'amateur' camp
only serves to defend obsolete categories and the arbitrary borders
inbetween.
Sorry Tim, but I'm with Fons :-)
These categories, even though they are not
If all distros adopted JACK and all audio apps were JACKified,
we're done and all struggling would have been past.
so what this really means, is a mass patch project to get all
offending audio apps (OSS) in line with the New Linux Audio Reality.
i don't see anything wrong with that.
--
;
I don't see the switch in that scenario. And if you are a 'pro'
you'd probably use an ogg player using the 'pro' setup from the
start.
you're missing the point: you're not a pro, you're someone who becomes a pro.
As was already pointed out, prosumer and professional users
will in all
what an absolutely horrid solution. i can't believe its even being
considered.
You will not have to educate a professional user to do this.
He will do it anayway because it makes sense, even ignoring
the reasons we are debating here.
it doesn't make -any- freakin' sense whatsoever!!
As
At 18:03 +0200 18/6/05, fons adriaensen wrote:
Denying that this difference exists is a postmodern trend, but is
misguided (IMHO).
well, i work in the pro audio world, it is my bread and butter, and i
can tell you that if Linux Audio goes in the direction of requiring
'two different configs'
These categories, even though they are not absolute, and overlap, do
indicate real differences in expectations and working methodology.
this is utterly, 100%, arbitrary.
'pro' does not mean 'totally different way of doing things', nor does
'consumer' mean the only lazy option.
--
;
Jay
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 08:57:51PM +0200, Jay Vaughan wrote:
These categories, even though they are not absolute, and overlap, do
indicate real differences in expectations and working methodology.
this is utterly, 100%, arbitrary.
'pro' does not mean 'totally different way of doing
On Sat, 2005-06-18 at 11:02 +0200, Benno Senoner wrote:
How does windows handle such stuff ? You simply write MME/WDM audio
apps
and
windows applies transparent software mixing to each API ?
No, on Windows pro apps use ASIO and consumer apps use MME/DirectX.
Lee
I didn't want to make that difference, but as every mainboard nowadays
has a decent audio chip onboard and as every more demanding user
(the professional) has a second card, too, why not just split
applications between those two?
right now, just to get the sounds out of all the apps running
[fons adriaensen]
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 07:24:26PM +0200, Tim Goetze wrote:
Dividing computed audio into a 'professional' and an 'amateur' camp
only serves to defend obsolete categories and the arbitrary borders
inbetween.
I can assure you that from a POV of a paying customer, the
On Sat, 2005-06-18 at 20:51 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
its already a nightmare beacuse gstreamer wants to use OSS emulation
on the same channel as mplayer32 (which i could get around by running
a second jackd in 32bit mode, connecting to mplayer32 and
communicating with the 64bit jackd
On Sat, 2005-06-18 at 16:38 +0200, Richard Spindler wrote:
Well I think that there is absolutly no border between Professional
Audio and Non-Professional Audio.
Just think about it, today you're using mainly xmms to play some
ogg-files, but suddenly you become a little creative, und you want
On Fri, 2005-06-17 at 18:09 +0200, Christoph Eckert wrote:
ALSA
direct access is no choice because it blocks the device. DMIX
is a choice, but what if I want to use JACK simultaneously
without using DMIX?
This question amounts to how do I block the device without blocking the
device. You
Actually I think, that having (at least) two soundcards
will become a standard: One (like the onboard chip) for mp3
listening etc, and a professional one for audio work.
I dislike this idea. I'm currently doing so:
* Running arts/ogg players on top of AC97
* Running my music stuff on top of
the 'cheap sound card' should work using the same tech as
the 'expensive' one.
Seconded :) .
Best regards
ce
Well I think that there is absolutly no border between
Professional Audio and Non-Professional Audio.
See some previous posts.
I also dislike the idea of dividing the users to pros and
amateurs. Am I a pro? Certainly not, I'm just a hobbyist. And
I'd be glad if some day I could install
I didn't want to make that difference, but as every
mainboard nowadays has a decent audio chip onboard and as
every more demanding user (the professional) has a second
card, too, why not just split applications between those
two?
I think that's not the point we're discussing.
Of course, if
This question amounts to how do I block the device without
blocking the device. You can't do this with any OS.
Sorry, this was caused by my bad english skills. I'll try
anew.
Waht I really meant was:
* We all agree that we don't want JACK to use on top of DMIX,
we want JACK to run directly
First, why in the hell are you using gstreamer with OSS
emulation? It has an ALSA backend.
I do not use it but I read that it also has a JACK sink.
Best regards
ce
Hallo,
Jay Vaughan hat gesagt: // Jay Vaughan wrote:
why not, no matter whether the chipset is on-board, or in an external
firewire case, present the -same- configuration of the audio-system,
no matter what!
*this* would be a pro approach. saying that its okay to have two
different
Forgive me the harsh word, but this is all useless BS.
:)
I
have to admit I don't care if Linux audio is used by many
or none, pro or ama; I don't care for world domination
either.
That's exactly the point. You do not care (and that's
absolutely OK)...
I have the tools I want, now is
so what this really means, is a mass patch project to get
all offending audio apps (OSS) in line with the New Linux
Audio Reality.
i don't see anything wrong with that.
What's wrong with that is that we do not all agree in the LA*
community.
And as long as we do not agree we cannto
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 08:12:54PM +0200, Tim Orford wrote:
As well as the difference between Pro/Amateur there is the
Consumer/Producer divide. To anyone who isnt involved in any kind of
production, Jackd is inappropriate.
Probably not if it's so solid that it can become 'invisible' to the
On my laptop, all my audio software I use on stage is
configured to use an external soundcard (hw:1) because it's
much better quality,
Frank, are you really talking about our beloved Terratec
Aureon?!?
Just kidding :) .
whereas all my desktop audio
software (alsaplayer etc.) is
Actually I think, that having (at least) two soundcards
will become a standard: One (like the onboard chip) for mp3
listening etc, and a professional one for audio work.
Disagreed.
Einspruch, euer hren ;-)
Best regards
ce
On Sun, Jun 19, 2005 at 12:29:50AM +0200, Frank Barknecht wrote:
On my laptop, all my audio software I use on stage is configured to
use an external soundcard (hw:1) because it's much better quality,
whereas all my desktop audio software (alsaplayer etc.) is
configured to use the internal
Well I think that there is absolutly no border between
Professional Audio and Non-Professional Audio.
Disagreed ;-) . But there's no border in tech terms.
I often see that amateurs use better equipment than
professionals. Therefore: Agreed at 100%.
I remember my keyboard teacher who earns
I'm basically doing the same thing. On my 'studio' system,
all 'entertainment' stuff goes to the onboard chip and that
drives the speakers built into the monitor. Meanwhile jackd
runs on the Terratec hooked up to an external mixer. The
onboard output also goes to that mixer but is rarely
On Sat, 2005-06-18 at 17:33 -0400, Lee Revell wrote:
First, why in the hell are you using gstreamer with OSS emulation? It
has an ALSA backend.
It also has JACK plugin.
I've long wanted to add samplerate conversion to jack, but haven't made
my mind on how it should be implemented.
I would
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 11:57:16PM +0200, Christoph Eckert wrote:
I also dislike the idea of dividing the users to pros and
amateurs. Am I a pro? Certainly not, I'm just a hobbyist. And
I'd be glad if some day I could install any distro, plug in
my guitar, fire up jack-rack and start
On Sun, Jun 19, 2005 at 01:23:10AM +0200, Christoph Eckert wrote:
Thanks Paul for Ardour!
Thanks++
--
FA
On Sat, Jun 18, 2005 at 08:49:16PM +0200, Jay Vaughan wrote:
So even elementary security provides more than enough reason to keep
the two well separated.
eh? sorry, but you've gone stupid on this issue.
Maybe I am stupid, and maybe you are a professional. In that case
let me make two
windows applies transparent software mixing to each API ?
No, on Windows pro apps use ASIO and consumer apps use MME/DirectX.
Lee
Not entirely true, Sonar achieves very nice solid latencies with WDM and MME
drivers (both of which are used for consumer purposes as well).
Best wishes,
Ico
I think that the core question is do Windows and OS X users have to know
anything about sound servers to get multiple applications to talk to the
soundcard? The answer is obviously no.
The second question is do Windows and OS X users have to know a bit more
about audio in order to use it for
3. 'amateur' users vs. 'professionals'.
Since a took a clear stand on this matter, let me define what
I mean by a 'professional' in this context: someone who makes
a living by providing a service to customers who pay for it.
I still maintain that someone in this position will not mind
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