Re: collecting negative reviews

2005-12-12 Thread Murray Cumming
On Mon, 2005-09-12 at 02:28 -0300, Santiago Roza wrote: It's done: I've read [almost] every single comment from the 2.12 release articles (including Slashdot and OSNews, which Travis was going to cover... sorry Travis, I got carried away), and here's the compiled list of

Re: real marketing or just catchy slogans?

2005-12-12 Thread Murray Cumming
On Fri, 2005-12-09 at 16:36 -0300, Santiago Roza wrote: You are absolutely right. That's what i am always saying. We need GNOME out there. Either we should make out own distribution or ... for the love of god, no :) creating and maintaining and supporting a distro is an enourmous task,

RE: GNOME's Target Markets

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
With the LiveCDs (and soon the VMPlayer images) it is almost that easy. Check. In about 90 seconds I am going to give a copy of Ubuntu to one of my colleagues. Forgive my desparate amateurism. Save us. It's all good! There is no such thing as an amatuer in marketing. We are all consumers!

Re: slogan poll

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 10:01 +0100, Murray Cumming wrote: I'll put a poll on gnomdesktop about the slogan suggestions. It's not the best way of choosing something, but it's better than nothing, and it might force marketing experts to have an opinion. Good on you, Murray, for prodding the experts

Re: real marketing or just catchy slogans?

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 11:37 +0100, Dave Neary wrote: We have lots of data. Every GNOME release, we get data. So far, we've simply had no way to analyse, synthesis and transmit that data to the people who need to get it. Oooh! Oooh! Pick me! Pick me! Can you be more specific please Dave?

Real Marketing

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
Hi all I have attempted to summarise the Real Marketing thread here: http://live.gnome.org/RealMarketing I think this could become the basis for something good, but I'm not sure what, yet. -- marketing-list mailing list marketing-list@gnome.org

Re: GNOME's Target Markets

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
On Thu, 2005-12-01 at 13:15 +0100, Murray Cumming wrote: Time to revive this thread again. Cool! On Sun, 2005-07-10 at 18:50 +1200, John Williams wrote: On Sat, 2005-07-09 at 22:25 +0200, Murray Cumming wrote: Try to explain the issues to us, and suggest definite actions. There are many

Please sit down before reading this, and take a deep breath.

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
On Thu, 2005-12-01 at 18:03 +0530, Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay wrote: Without straying too far from the topic - What is GNOME ? Or as someone recently asked me in one session for college kids (WTF is guh-nome) With respect to the recent discussion on slogans and general discussion of about Real

Don't encourage people to switch to GNOME

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
I have, for some time, been uncomfortable with the use of the phrase switch to GNOME in our private and public communications. However after looking at http://live.gnome.org/GnomeWeb I think it is time to bring my reservations about this out into the open. Switch to implies giving up what you

Re: Don't encourage people to switch to GNOME

2005-12-12 Thread Murray Cumming
[snip] Switch to implies giving up what you are already using. This is a big step psychologically for some (most?) people. [snip] This makes a lot of sense to me. We shouldn't start out by scaring people. However, actually switching does have a lot of benefits and it's what many home users

Re: Please sit down before reading this, and take a deep breath.

2005-12-12 Thread Murray Cumming
On Thu, 2005-12-01 at 18:03 +0530, Sankarshan Mukhopadhyay wrote: Without straying too far from the topic - What is GNOME ? Or as someone recently asked me in one session for college kids (WTF is guh-nome) With respect to the recent discussion on slogans and general discussion of about

Re: Don't encourage people to switch to GNOME

2005-12-12 Thread Claus Schwarm
On Sun, 11 Dec 2005 19:59:41 +1300 John Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have, for some time, been uncomfortable with the use of the phrase switch to GNOME in our private and public communications. However after looking at http://live.gnome.org/GnomeWeb I think it is time to bring my

Re: real marketing or just catchy slogans?

2005-12-12 Thread David Neary
Hi, John Williams wrote: On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 11:37 +0100, Dave Neary wrote: We have lots of data. Every GNOME release, we get data. So far, we've simply had no way to analyse, synthesis and transmit that data to the people who need to get it. Can you be more specific please Dave? What

Re: Please sit down before reading this, and take a deep breath.

2005-12-12 Thread John Williams
On Mon, 2005-12-12 at 16:47 +0100, Murray Cumming wrote: What is GNOME? We seem to fond of asking that question these days. The answer is simple: it is the GNU Network Object Model Environment. That is never ever the answer, and hasn't been for a long time. If it's anywhere on our web

Re: Please sit down before reading this, and take a deep breath.

2005-12-12 Thread Santiago Roza
Oh! Then why do we capitalise it? Is it still an acronym? If so, what do the letters stand for? who cares about that? several brands are usually spelled in uppercase, and that doesn't seem to undermine their popularity or acceptance... -- Santiago Roza Departamento I+D - Thymbra [EMAIL

Re: real marketing or just catchy slogans?

2005-12-12 Thread Santiago Roza
Perhaps we are getting too obsessed about this idea that people need to test something before getting it. well, people like to test things that could f*ck up their computers beyond all recognition... and wether we like it or not, that's what could happen when you install a new operating system.

Re: real marketing or just catchy slogans?

2005-12-12 Thread Jeff Waugh
quote who=Santiago Roza i think we're pretty much obsessed with the real gnome, but we need to accept that the real gnome is the one real people receive with real distros... In large part, we do, as we're very pragmatic about our relationship with distributions and other major projects. They

Re: collecting negative reviews

2005-12-12 Thread Santiago Roza
I don't think this is of much value to the developers. They do tend to read web site comments when we do major releases, so reiterating the comments doesn't help them much. i don't know which developers do read this stuff and which ones don't, so this list was supposed to be a summary of all

Re: Please sit down before reading this, and take a deep breath.

2005-12-12 Thread Santiago Roza
But GNOME also means gnome, i.e. a small, dumpy, cutesy-stupid type fellow. Following Murray's repeated points about brand association, is that the type of image we want? well maybe it's not the type of image we want, but imho it's way too late to change that name: it's been 8 years since the