[meteorite-list] Hal Povenmire has left us.
Everyone, We just got word that Hal Povenmire passed away last week atage 80. Hal was the undisputed authorityon Georgia tektites and author of many related books. He was discoverer of the Upsilon PegasidMeteor Shower. He is honored by thenaming of asteroids “(12753) Povenmire” and “(15146) HalPov”. But this is not meant to be an obituary;rather it is a message to his many, many friends that my good friend has leftus and we will be the poorer. His wifeKatie survives him at their home in Florida. Norm & Cookie Lehrman Tektitesource.com __ Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: New Atacamaite impact glass now on the Tektitesource website
All, I've finally acquired a small assortment of Atacamaites, probably the smallest splashform impact glass known. They are posted on our website together with the artwork that they inspired. Have a look. This is really interesting new material, and as far as I know, this is the first time it's been offered for sale. I have only 22 pieces, so act quickly if interested. I am considering getting the painting printed up on canvas. Let me know if you might be interested in purchasing a print. See the new material at http://www.tektitesource.com/ Cheers, Norm Lehrman __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] outrageous Muong Nong tektite layering
Phil, That is certainly an exceptional stunner. I can't recall ever seeing its equal. Nice! While on the topic of Muong Nongs, here's an interesting one: A distinctly flight-modified Muong Nong, something I have never seen nor heard of! http://tektitesource.com/A%20splashform%20Muong%20Nong!.htm Please do let me know if any of you are aware of anything like this. Cheers, Norm Lehrman TektiteSource.com From: Phil Morgan roxfromsp...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 8:58 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] outrageous Muong Nong tektite layering For those fellow tektite aficionados out there, I thought I'd share a couple of pictures of a muong nong specimen that I just received. It has some of the best layering and overall shape that I personally have ever seen (but I don't get to Tucson or Thailand). here is a link to the album http://s25.photobucket.com/user/pkmorgan/library/tektite%20-%20muong%20nong anyone have anything similar? observations welcome. Best Regards, Phil __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: Ivory Coast tektites and Locenice moldavites added to website
All, We scored seven of Alain Carion's Ivory Coast tektites. If you didn't make it to Tucson, here's your chance of a lifetime. We also picked up a fine selection of Locenice moldavites that rival Besednice for sheer beauty. Check out our new pages at www. tektitesource.com. Lots more good stuff to follow soon! Cheers, Norm Cookie __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] SHATTERCONES in TATAHOUINE
Paul, Jim, and All, Interesting how paths of interest converge from time to time I have had a long fascination with Tat horsetails. I mentioned this in a note to the list on the occasion of Tatahouine's 80th anniversary of arrival (Sun, Jun 26, 2011: Subject: [meteorite-list] 80th Anniversary of the arrival of a Green Alien from Space!). My fantasy has been that these are shattercones from the impact on Vesta---perhaps the only shattercones we have from someplace other than earth. Cheers, Norm www.tektitesource.com - Original Message From: James Tobin jamespa...@att.net To: Paul Gessler cetu...@shaw.ca Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, March 6, 2013 6:46:40 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] SHATTERCONES in TATAHOUINE Hi Paul and List, We were discussing this in Tucson with Norm Lehrman at the IMCA dinner. I have taken some pictures as well that will be in my Jim's Fragments article coming out in a couple days in Meteorite Times. The shattercones are visible in larger pieces with the naked eye and are a fascinating feature. You are correct also about the orientation of the cones it seems that they are arranged in several different and intermixed ways. I took some high resolution photographs and have included two in the article which we hope everyone will enjoy. We are pretty excited about this too. Hope to see more information about what this records of the powerful event which drove Tatahoine from its parent body. Jim Tobin - Original Message From: Paul Gessler cetu...@shaw.ca To: meteorite-list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wed, March 6, 2013 1:45:23 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] SHATTERCONES in TATAHOUINE I had a chance to cherry pick some larger sized Tatahouine nuggets from Alan Carion at the Tucson show and have noticed what appear to be shattercones on many of the facets? On every side that is fractured there are these chevron shaped interlaced lamellae/ flaring striationshowever they don't seem to have just one apex of orientation. On one surface I can see a cluster leading to the top as an apex point only to be met with one splitting the others going the opposite direction and also creating a small platform. It does make sense to me that Tathouine would exhibit this given its broken safety glass terminal deployment. I think the largest piece found was the size of a small grapefruit and if you tapped it with a hammer it would shatter into the smaller chunks we see more commonly. I guess what I am saying is that this mass in space must have been a heavily fractured structure and subject to multiple impact incidents followed by annealing then more impacts leaving over time heat and pressure multi directional percussion striation. In essence shattercones. Does anyone else see this? Any write ups on it that you are aware of? Got any examples in your collections that show what I am talking about? Let me here your thoughts please. I am stuck in an endless winter with plenty of time to ponder such things. I am aware that they may just be the natural clevage lines of the various minerals within.. but then why don't I see this anywhere near as dramatic in other meteorites? It would be neat to think of Tathouine as not just a unique Dioginite but also as some kind of relict impactite from the crust of another asteroid. ??? You can see some pictures here that I took through my microscope at 25x https://plus.google.com/photos/107261840007598315830/albums/5852125796528297633 Thanks- Paul Gessler __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: Lots of TektiteSource updates posted
All, We're still working through the Tucson backlog, but we've posted a bunch of inventory updates and new pages. Besednices, LDG, Henbury scoria, Zhamanshin glass, Philippinites, Arizonaites, and heaps more coming daily. We have some great new Sikhote and Taza bullets still to post, kilos of NWA individuals, some nicely oriented, and hundreds of new Australasian tektites in progress. Have a look and return often for the pick of the litter. The cream is skimmed early! www.tektitesource.com New changes are flagged near the top in the website news section. Thanks, Norm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Need help with a Tucson mystery rock
All, We're back from Tucson and busy going through the hoard. I found a couple of surprises in the 2 kgs of little NWA individuals we cherry-picked. Please have a look and see if my thumbprinted, glossy piece of basalt strikes you as something that fell from the sky--- or not. http://tektitesource.com/mystery%20rock%202013.htm There's also a very sweet little pebble with nice shock melt veins visible from the outside--- Cheers, Norm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market?
Shawn, why wait for Tucson? It's already on Fleabay, and remarkably cheap! http://www.ebay.com/itm/Black-Beauty-Martian-meteorite-very-rare-/130833898794?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item1e764edd2a This has become the dumping grounds for the absurd. How sad! Norm - Original Message From: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com To: abdelfattah gharrad life19ma...@yahoo.fr Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, January 18, 2013 7:38:25 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? Hello Abdelfattah This post got by me, do you think there will be any Black Beauty for sale at Tuscon? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html http://meteoritefalls.com/ - Original Message - From: abdelfattah gharrad life19ma...@yahoo.fr To: Michael Farmer m...@meteoriteguy.com; Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2013 8:01 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? cause of specific criteria Abdelfattah. De : Michael Farmer m...@meteoriteguy.com À : Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc : Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Envoyé le : Mardi 8 janvier 2013 3h59 Objet : Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? It is nice, but I don't see why it would be much more valuable than say Nakhla or Shergotty. Michael Farmer Sent from my iPad On Jan 7, 2013, at 7:53 PM, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello Listers I was wondering, will this meteorite ever be sold on the open market or has it be donated to science already because of its rarity? And if so, what would be the value? I mean in science terms, this find could have a few billion $ value or more cause that is how much it would cost to build a rover that could bring back a sample like black beauty from Mars Shawn Alan ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market?
Thomas, Mendy and all, If it was listed under coprolite or any variation of the same, I would be equally offended. It should be listed under rock (allthough I don't disagree with the sentiment behind the coprolite label. Guano would also work). There's also an Apollo lunar listed that should create quite a stir if you have $1.5 million to spare. I don't even want to talk about the tektite lies and absurdities that are there every day. Ebay is an absolute tsunami of misinformation. In one cynical way, it is good for the legitimate market. If enough people get burned (and realize it---), it should bring business to those that offer honesty and integrity along with their specimensl Sadly, most buyers don't have the background to know they are being ripped off. I would like to help, but what can one do? Occassionally a seller offers thanks for a correction, but most are quite content with their fraud Buyer beware! Norm www.tektitesource.com - Original Message From: Thomas Webb webb...@yahoo.com To: Mendy Ouzillou ouzil...@yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, January 18, 2013 9:00:43 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? How about 'coprolite' :) --- On Fri, 1/18/13, Mendy Ouzillou ouzil...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Mendy Ouzillou ouzil...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com, Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net Date: Friday, January 18, 2013, 11:51 PM That listing should have been put under croprolite. Mendy Ouzillou On Jan 18, 2013, at 8:16 PM, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Norm HAHAHAHAHAHA too fun, I wish It was that cheap to by some Black Beauty :) Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html http://meteoritefalls.com/ From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com; abdelfattah gharrad life19ma...@yahoo.fr Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, January 18, 2013 10:58 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? Shawn, why wait for Tucson? It's already on Fleabay, and remarkably cheap! http://www.ebay.com/itm/Black-Beauty-Martian-meteorite-very-rare-/130833898794?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item1e764edd2a a This has become the dumping grounds for the absurd. How sad! Norm - Original Message From: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com To: abdelfattah gharrad life19ma...@yahoo.fr Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, January 18, 2013 7:38:25 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? Hello Abdelfattah This post got by me, do you think there will be any Black Beauty for sale at Tuscon? Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html http://meteoritefalls.com/ - Original Message - From: abdelfattah gharrad life19ma...@yahoo.fr To: Michael Farmer m...@meteoriteguy.com; Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2013 8:01 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? cause of specific criteria Abdelfattah. De : Michael Farmer m...@meteoriteguy.com À : Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc : Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Envoyé le : Mardi 8 janvier 2013 3h59 Objet : Re: [meteorite-list] Black Beauty on the open market? It is nice, but I don't see why it would be much more valuable than say Nakhla or Shergotty. Michael Farmer Sent from my iPad On Jan 7, 2013, at 7:53 PM, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello Listers I was wondering, will this meteorite ever be sold on the open market or has it be donated to science already because of its rarity? And if so, what would be the value? I mean in science terms, this find could have a few billion $ value or more cause that is how much it would cost to build a rover that could bring back a sample like black beauty from Mars Shawn Alan ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Breaking news Meteor near Spokane WA!
List, Dozens of reports are coming in regarding an extremely loud bang, bright light, and visible fragmentation about 6:30 this morning. Observers say it passed over Spokane NW to SE and the thunder followed the fireball about 30 seconds later. My wife and dog were started by the sound at our location about 15 miles west of Spokane. It sounds like the prime ground is likely to be in Idaho south of Couer d'Alene. Things are pretty snowy here, but that is potentially in wheat country with lots of big fields--- Norm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Breaking news Meteor near Spokane WA!
Here's a link to local news: http://www.khq.com/story/20562952/what-was-that-bright-light-in-the-sky - Original Message From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, January 11, 2013 10:17:00 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Breaking news Meteor near Spokane WA! List, Dozens of reports are coming in regarding an extremely loud bang, bright light, and visible fragmentation about 6:30 this morning. Observers say it passed over Spokane NW to SE and the thunder followed the fireball about 30 seconds later. My wife and dog were started by the sound at our location about 15 miles west of Spokane. It sounds like the prime ground is likely to be in Idaho south of Couer d'Alene. Things are pretty snowy here, but that is potentially in wheat country with lots of big fields--- Norm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: Major update to TektiteSource Bediasite page
All, I have finally finished adding remarkable new Bediasites to our site, some of them truly world-class. Also be sure to check out the Javanite page. Cheers, Norm www.tektitesource.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Glass from the desert.
Aleksandr, I have spent time in Navoi, Uzbekistan, and have a specimen of that (or very similar) glass. Mine came from a site near Daugistau. There is an interesting story that goes with it. During the 1960s there was a rash of reported UFO sightings in that region. During that period, some children came to the leader of the Daugistau geological expedition and said they had seen a strange aircraft land in the desert. Beings got out, collected some rocks, then took off. The geologist accompanied the children to the site and found an elliptical patch of glass like yours about 50 or 60 meters in length. At one end, the glass was up to 15 cm thick and tapered to a ratty feather-edge at the other end. Beyond that were blobs and spatters of glass for some distance. The investigating scientists looked into the possibility of lightning strikes or military-related explanations, but were never satisfied with any firm conclusion. The material compares directly with Trinitite A-bomb glass (but the site is too small). Fixed rocket-engine tests have produced similar glass in US test facilities. It is also very similar to Ediowie glass from central Australia (where a very radical mirror-matter bolide impact with an annihilation-energy flash has been suggested, but not widely accepted). Is your glass from the Daugistau site? Cheers, Norm (www.tektitesource.com) - Original Message From: A.V.Leonenko alph...@rambler.ru To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, November 26, 2012 5:37:29 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Glass from the desert. Hi all! I found a glass rock in the desert of Uzbekistan. Similar to the volcanic pumice, but we have no volcanoes. I ask all who are interested to see and comment on the findings: http://www.meteoritics.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?t=733 Thank you in advance for your answers! (Paste this link into Google translator from Russian to English) Yours faithfully. Aleksandr. Navoi сity. Uzbekistan. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Sneak Peek to - The Black Phoenix...
Adam/Michael, For sure. Truly, remarkably black. Norm - Original Message From: Michael Blood mlbl...@cox.net To: John Lutzon j...@lutzon.com Cc: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, November 20, 2012 7:02:17 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sneak Peek to - The Black Phoenix... Yep, Still workssolid BLACK. Michael On 11/20/12 6:49 PM, John Lutzon j...@lutzon.com wrote: Try again Mike. - Original Message - From: Michael Blood mlbl...@cox.net To: Met. Greg Hupe gmh...@centurylink.net; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 9:39 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sneak Peek to - The Black Phoenix... Dude, All I get is a BLACK page...? Michael On 11/20/12 6:19 PM, Met. Greg Hupe gmh...@centurylink.net wrote: Hey All, I have been very busy lately and many folks have been asking what the heck I have been up to with, 'The Black Phoenix'. This is the only hint I can share at this moment! Hope you enjoy the 'Sneak Preview'... ;-) http://www.lunarrock.com/TheBlackPhoenix/TheBlackPhoenix.jpg Best Regards, Greg Greg Hupé The Hupé Collection gmh...@centurylink.net www.LunarRock.com NaturesVault (eBay Facebook) http://www.facebook.com/NaturesVault IMCA 3163 Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] missed opportunity (was, Re: NASA SETI Misappropriation of Tax Payer Funds)
Greg all, Whew! That is really bad news. I was beginning to think Jenniskens was a good guy. What would his Sutter's Mill database look like if we eliminated all but the academics? Rogue private meteorite hunters made it happen. So sad. Jenniskens, if you are reading this, let's hear your defense. We all understand misquotes. Is this one? I surely hope so. If not, your stock just went to zero. Cheers, Norm - Original Message From: Greg Hupé gmh...@centurylink.net To: Robert Verish bolidecha...@yahoo.com; Jodie Reynolds spacero...@spaceballoon.org Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, November 2, 2012 7:57:09 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] missed opportunity (was, Re: NASA SETI Misappropriation of Tax Payer Funds) Bob, I respect your 'protected' stance on this subject, however when you say this was a, missed opportunity [for outreach]..., was in fact part of Jennisken's grand plan as quoted in the article and stated by the 'private citizen' getting the 'free ride' on The Blimp. I will quote here for one's direct assessment... Jenniskens invited Rivera to join him and another scientist on the airship ride over Novato and parts of unincorporated Sonoma County, following the trajectory of the Oct. 17 fireball. Rivera said he took an oath not to tell what they saw for fear that rogue meteorite hunters — eager to sell galactic collectibles on eBay — might pounce on new potential meteorite locations and rob scientists' ability to research more rocks. I personally take issue with his entire paragraph! It insults the dedication from us, rogue [private] meteorite hunters, actual meteorite scientists and the average enthusiast at large! What a slap in the face from an media-hungry astrologer to make against us who have committed our lives to the world of real meteorite recovery, science and sharing through the expansion of actual knowledge to the entire world! We, as private citizens, have donated more to the study and knowledge of meteoritics than anyone really knows. Most contributions are made by private individuals who donate because they can and want to without the hype or the huge mug shot photo opp!! It scares me to think that an individual who is not even knowledgeable about the most simplistic aspects of a meteorite is out there representing our national treasure, NASA! What a let down if this rogue astrologer is allowed to continue his personal slime campaign against the private sector!! Shame, shame!! Best Regards, Greg Greg Hupé The Hupé Collection gmh...@centurylink.net www.LunarRock.com NaturesVault (eBay Facebook) http://www.facebook.com/NaturesVault IMCA 3163 Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault -Original Message- From: Robert Verish Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 6:41 PM To: Greg Hupé ; Jodie Reynolds Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: missed opportunity (was, Re: NASA SETI Misappropriation of Tax Payer Funds) Hello All, Given that it was a free ride, I think Petrus missed an obvious outreach opportunity. BEFORE the airship took off, he should have submitted articles to the Sonoma County newspapers soliciting the local residents to look for black space-rocks in their yards and driveways. Mention could have been made in advance that an airship would be incorporated in the search effort. Would make an interesting article for the local papers. The airship flying over Sonoma would have been free advertising for meteorite recovery. We've done a good job of saturating the media in Marin County, but nothing directed towards Sonoma residents. We need to stretch the strewn-field into Sonoma County and we're going to need a lot of cooperation from the residents. Bob V. --- On Fri, 11/2/12, Jodie Reynolds spacero...@spaceballoon.org wrote: From: Jodie Reynolds spacero...@spaceballoon.org Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NASA SETI Misappropriation of Tax Payer Funds To: Greg Hupé gmh...@centurylink.net Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Friday, November 2, 2012, 3:05 PM Hello Greg and List! It was my understanding that the airship rides were contributed. Is there reliable information that they're plunking down NASA-dollars for that? Because I agree - that'd be pretty criminal. Believe me, no one could possibly be any crankier about misappropriation of tax-payer dollars than I! I just want to make sure we string up the right ones. --- Jodie Friday, November 2, 2012, 1:10:15 PM, you wrote: To All Concerned US Tax Payers... I have been troubled by what is a clear misappropriation of US tax payer funds by NASA/SETI. At a time of this country's financial crisis, this is no time to squander our tax dollars!! We have all seen and read about 'The Blimp that was, as stated in the article link below, ... a NASA-hired airship. Not only are they using
Re: [meteorite-list] Off Topic - Novato California Strewn field / Meteorite Zombies
Sonny all, I've had some experience with trail cams. What you did is unethical. I see the signs of baiting in that guy's eyes. You sprinkled unclassified NWA dust in front of the camera. That ain't right. That poor bugger was caught by unfair chase. None-the-less, it's only right to sedate him. Go ahead with the tranquilizer darts. It's only right now that the damage is done. Nomr - Original Message From: wahlpe...@aol.com wahlpe...@aol.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, November 1, 2012 7:41:24 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Off Topic - Novato California Strewn field / Meteorite Zombies Hi List, I just returned from Novato, California where I had a chance to do an investigation on Meteorite Zombies. I was able to catch a few pictures on my hidden trail cams placed around the Novato area. Here is the Link. Sonny http://www.nevadameteorites.com/nevadameteorites/2.html __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?
permit, etc. etc. My permit doesn't exclude limitless others from trying their luck, even if I spend $thou$and$ for the right to hunt an area. If this is based on long-standing policies, why are there so many unanswered questions? These are some of the basic reasons it bothers me. There are others, but I've gone too long already. Best wishes to you and all readers, Mark From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net To: Jim Wooddell jimwoodd...@gmail.com; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, October 1, 2012 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? Jim all, Commercial users always had to have permits. Permits always took their time. This is not new Rockhounders were always prohibited from commercial endeavors. This is not new. Meteorite hunters were lumped in with rockhounders until now. The only real change that I can see is the change in poundage limits---a major change for sure, but how many of us have had years where the 10 pound limit would've been a problem? It can happen, but quite rarely. I have recovered hundreds of meteorite (fragments) in Nevada, but nowhere near 10 pounds per year. Probably the main point of all this is that we are now under scrutiny and attracting explicit personalized regulation where before we were pretty much under the radar. However, the new explicit meteorite regulations are mostly not new, but rather, a formal restatement of long-standing policies governing rockhounding on BLM-managed lands. Norm - Original Message From: Jim Wooddell jimwoodd...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, October 1, 2012 4:38:39 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? Hello Norm, I beleive that was 25 pounds a day, now 10 pounds a year. Science and Commerical users now require permits. Casual hunters not allowed to sell. Hmmm. Permit processes can take 185 days. I'd say that's significant. Jim On Sun, Sep 30, 2012 at 10:17 PM, Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net wrote: Sorry Norm. Your take on the BLM being some kind of begnign overseer who will look the other way couldn't be farther from the truth. Just wait till the next highly publicized fall amd someone admits to picking up something significant from public land. The BLM will be all over him/her like white on a golf ball. What! No permit? Didn't know this land was restricted? Gimme that! Here! Take this citation! Guido -Original Message- From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net Sent: Sep 30, 2012 8:17 PM To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? All, I have been following this thread with great confusion, and maybe there IS something I don't understand. Meteorite collecting has previously fallen under the general rules of rockhounding, and the new changes merely formalize a specific policy that is no great change from the past rules. I am quite sure I will be hugey chastised for my ignorance. Please correct me if I missed something. The previous rules said 25 pounds and/or one rock. Now it's 10 pounds and no provision for the big one with respect to meteorites. How often will that actually afect us? Almost never. The use of motorized vehicles off marked roads is also a general policy, not just for us. Metal detectors are explicitly allowed. Surely a magnet on a stick is also still fine. Commercial exploitation of BLM ground is subject to a long standing guideline. Find a monster? It is only fair that the land-owner (all Americans) should get some benefit. This is no change. If you want to harvest building stones or ornamental boulders, you pay a fee. We will too. No real change. I see no great disaster here. Just a formalization of a specific policy, thanks (?) to our own loud self-promotion in its various forms. Of course they had to get explicit. It is not much more than a clear, specific, restatement of the rules we were all subject to before now. Or did no one understand this? Yes, they may choose to make their point by prosecuting someone, but I will be amazed if this involves changes in the law. Just enforcement of those already extant. At worst with fairly minor changes. Have at it. I am waiting to be reprimanded for my folly. What am I missing? Best, Norm (http://www.tektitesource.com/) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Jim Wooddell
Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?
Guido, Please read it again. All I said is that the new regs make minimal changes on past law. I don't doubt that the BLM will be looking for opportunities to make their point. But the policy states virtually nothing new other than the more restrictive poundage limitation. Everything else restates old policy. Norm - Original Message From: Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net To: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sun, September 30, 2012 10:17:23 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? Sorry Norm. Your take on the BLM being some kind of begnign overseer who will look the other way couldn't be farther from the truth. Just wait till the next highly publicized fall amd someone admits to picking up something significant from public land. The BLM will be all over him/her like white on a golf ball. What! No permit? Didn't know this land was restricted? Gimme that! Here! Take this citation! Guido -Original Message- From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net Sent: Sep 30, 2012 8:17 PM To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? All, I have been following this thread with great confusion, and maybe there IS something I don't understand. Meteorite collecting has previously fallen under the general rules of rockhounding, and the new changes merely formalize a specific policy that is no great change from the past rules. I am quite sure I will be hugey chastised for my ignorance. Please correct me if I missed something. The previous rules said 25 pounds and/or one rock. Now it's 10 pounds and no provision for the big one with respect to meteorites. How often will that actually afect us? Almost never. The use of motorized vehicles off marked roads is also a general policy, not just for us. Metal detectors are explicitly allowed. Surely a magnet on a stick is also still fine. Commercial exploitation of BLM ground is subject to a long standing guideline. Find a monster? It is only fair that the land-owner (all Americans) should get some benefit. This is no change. If you want to harvest building stones or ornamental boulders, you pay a fee. We will too. No real change. I see no great disaster here. Just a formalization of a specific policy, thanks (?) to our own loud self-promotion in its various forms. Of course they had to get explicit. It is not much more than a clear, specific, restatement of the rules we were all subject to before now. Or did no one understand this? Yes, they may choose to make their point by prosecuting someone, but I will be amazed if this involves changes in the law. Just enforcement of those already extant. At worst with fairly minor changes. Have at it. I am waiting to be reprimanded for my folly. What am I missing? Best, Norm (www.tektitesource.com) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?
Jim all, Commercial users always had to have permits. Permits always took their time. This is not new Rockhounders were always prohibited from commercial endeavors. This is not new. Meteorite hunters were lumped in with rockhounders until now. The only real change that I can see is the change in poundage limits---a major change for sure, but how many of us have had years where the 10 pound limit would've been a problem? It can happen, but quite rarely. I have recovered hundreds of meteorite (fragments) in Nevada, but nowhere near 10 pounds per year. Probably the main point of all this is that we are now under scrutiny and attracting explicit personalized regulation where before we were pretty much under the radar. However, the new explicit meteorite regulations are mostly not new, but rather, a formal restatement of long-standing policies governing rockhounding on BLM-managed lands. Norm - Original Message From: Jim Wooddell jimwoodd...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, October 1, 2012 4:38:39 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? Hello Norm, I beleive that was 25 pounds a day, now 10 pounds a year. Science and Commerical users now require permits. Casual hunters not allowed to sell. Hmmm. Permit processes can take 185 days. I'd say that's significant. Jim On Sun, Sep 30, 2012 at 10:17 PM, Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net wrote: Sorry Norm. Your take on the BLM being some kind of begnign overseer who will look the other way couldn't be farther from the truth. Just wait till the next highly publicized fall amd someone admits to picking up something significant from public land. The BLM will be all over him/her like white on a golf ball. What! No permit? Didn't know this land was restricted? Gimme that! Here! Take this citation! Guido -Original Message- From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net Sent: Sep 30, 2012 8:17 PM To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup? All, I have been following this thread with great confusion, and maybe there IS something I don't understand. Meteorite collecting has previously fallen under the general rules of rockhounding, and the new changes merely formalize a specific policy that is no great change from the past rules. I am quite sure I will be hugey chastised for my ignorance. Please correct me if I missed something. The previous rules said 25 pounds and/or one rock. Now it's 10 pounds and no provision for the big one with respect to meteorites. How often will that actually afect us? Almost never. The use of motorized vehicles off marked roads is also a general policy, not just for us. Metal detectors are explicitly allowed. Surely a magnet on a stick is also still fine. Commercial exploitation of BLM ground is subject to a long standing guideline. Find a monster? It is only fair that the land-owner (all Americans) should get some benefit. This is no change. If you want to harvest building stones or ornamental boulders, you pay a fee. We will too. No real change. I see no great disaster here. Just a formalization of a specific policy, thanks (?) to our own loud self-promotion in its various forms. Of course they had to get explicit. It is not much more than a clear, specific, restatement of the rules we were all subject to before now. Or did no one understand this? Yes, they may choose to make their point by prosecuting someone, but I will be amazed if this involves changes in the law. Just enforcement of those already extant. At worst with fairly minor changes. Have at it. I am waiting to be reprimanded for my folly. What am I missing? Best, Norm (www.tektitesource.com) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Jim Wooddell jimwoodd...@gmail.com 928-247-2675 __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?
All, I have been following this thread with great confusion, and maybe there IS something I don't understand. Meteorite collecting has previously fallen under the general rules of rockhounding, and the new changes merely formalize a specific policy that is no great change from the past rules. I am quite sure I will be hugey chastised for my ignorance. Please correct me if I missed something. The previous rules said 25 pounds and/or one rock. Now it's 10 pounds and no provision for the big one with respect to meteorites. How often will that actually afect us? Almost never. The use of motorized vehicles off marked roads is also a general policy, not just for us. Metal detectors are explicitly allowed. Surely a magnet on a stick is also still fine. Commercial exploitation of BLM ground is subject to a long standing guideline. Find a monster? It is only fair that the land-owner (all Americans) should get some benefit. This is no change. If you want to harvest building stones or ornamental boulders, you pay a fee. We will too. No real change. I see no great disaster here. Just a formalization of a specific policy, thanks (?) to our own loud self-promotion in its various forms. Of course they had to get explicit. It is not much more than a clear, specific, restatement of the rules we were all subject to before now. Or did no one understand this? Yes, they may choose to make their point by prosecuting someone, but I will be amazed if this involves changes in the law. Just enforcement of those already extant. At worst with fairly minor changes. Have at it. I am waiting to be reprimanded for my folly. What am I missing? Best, Norm (www.tektitesource.com) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Darryl Futrell (+) (also, question about Futrell Collection)
All, I just attempted to email the individual who acquired the Futrell estate tektite collection on behalf of a new museum, but the email I have no longer works. The museum is apparently still under development and doesn't seem to have a website as yet, but it will be located in the 34 mile-diameter Charlevoix, Quebec impact structure located about 105 km N of Quebec City. A summary inventory listing of the specimens in this collection is stll posted on our website. Futrell's tektite/meteorite library and files also went with the estate collection. While he was yet living, Futrell sold/donated a substantial collection of important pieces to the Corning Museum of Glass. Hardly any of the estate collection had the painted labels that Paul correctly tabulated below. Possibly this was due to a progression to almost total blindness in his final years. I have often imagined him holding and exploring his final remaining much-loved pieces by touch--- Cheers, Norm www.TektiteSource.com - Original Message From: Paul Harris p...@meteorite.com To: MikeG meteoritem...@gmail.com; meteorite-list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, August 13, 2012 5:32:13 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Darryl Futrell (+) (also, question about Futrell Collection) Hi Mike and List, Yes those are Futrell specimens. Darryl did not number all of his specimens. FA = Australite FB = Bediasites FC = Moldavites FD = Darwin Glass FG = Georgites FH = Hainan FJ = Javanites FIT = Thailand Splash Form FL = Laos FM = Malaysia FO = Cambodian FP = Phillippinite FR = Ivory Coast FT = Thailand Muong Nong FTT = Billitonites FU = Brunei FV = Vietnam FY = Libyan Desert Glass FZ = Zhamanshinite and Irghizite To learn a little more about Darryl please see the following page. http://www.meteorite.com/Darryl_Futrell/index.htm Thanks, Paul On 8/13/2012 2:52 PM, MikeG wrote: Hi Folks, I received a lot of replies regarding the tektites with painted labels. I think both are Futrell pieces. I uploaded some photos to Photobucket. Links are below. First specimen is a Philippinite and the second is a Muong Nong. Philippinite (27g) - http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/fp160.jpg Philippinite - http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/fp-160-2.jpg Muong Nong (161g) - http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/ft-649.jpg Muong Nong - http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/ft-649-2.jpg Muong Nong - http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/ft-649-3.jpg Best regards, MikeG __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: For the Geologists and Math Wizards!
Jim, This is square in the middle of my life as a gold exploration geo. There is no fancy creative math involved with this one. Carefully determined the volume of the rock. If the matrix is primarily quartz, multiply the volume in cc by 2.65 gm/cc to find what the rock should weigh without gold, giving you a baseline weight for the unmineralized rock. Any additional weight is an approximation of the gold (+silver) content. This obviously involves a couple of approximations. If there is anything other than quartz present in the matrix (calcite or clays or FeOx for example), the baseline specific gravity assumption will have to be adjusted. See the tektite specific gravity page on our website (tektitesource.com) for procedures for determination of S.G. Cheers, Norm - Original Message From: Jim Wooddell nf11...@npgcable.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sat, April 14, 2012 8:27:59 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT: For the Geologists and Math Wizards! Hi Doug and all! Thanks for the answers. My thought was, prior to posting the questions here, that you could not have a calculation that would result in a density less than the less dense material, if the formula was correct where you have known densities of two specific minerals. To add to that here, with melting or morphing or whatever, I contend you could not have a calculation that would result in a lower density than any of the known densities of any known minerals or mixtures there of. However, if there are unknowns, then I do see where is it very possible where it would totally hose the results. I stated that in another forum and then thought about it for a while and thought, Oh Shxx, I had better ask people way more knowledgeable than I. I put the OT in the subject line cause it may or may not relate to meteoritesI just knew some great minds are on this list. Specifically, I have a 65g rock with a lot of gold in it. While trying to determine the percentage of gold in it, this particular rock is breaking all the rules of engagement...to the point I am about ready to take a hammer to it and simply do it the old fashion way with mercuryexcept I don't have any mercury! That would be the part that is totally off topic for this list...except I found the gold when meteorite hunting! Using some of these wiz bang gold formulas (found on gold forums) I am coming up with negative numbers and one with minus 130% gold! I do not know how on earth I could be off by that amount using any of the areas known minerals or combinations of. Driving me nuts! It is such an awesome specimen, I hate to take a hammer to it...but two days of number crunching and testing is not panning out. Jim - Original Message - From: MexicoDoug mexicod...@aim.com To: c...@alumni.caltech.edu; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2012 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT: For the Geologists and Math Wizards! Jim, In a practical sense, this is quite possible since there are more possibilities, where your question could be taken as too ambiguous. Specifics - what are you really after? I'm thinking if this relates to meteorites you might have some concretions in mind as well, or perhaps melting and there are rarely just two minerals present in nature. When I mixed the concrete to fill the hole in the driveway, the hydration (a chemical modification) causes a structural change as well which contributes to a volume change, and it was certainly more slurry than the sum of the cement and sand, to adjust for the water. Some hydrations are reversible and others aren't. In nature for the organized mind, things usually go to hell in a handbasket since it is usually an open, complex system where everything and then some goes. If you like math, some engineers probably are very concerned about shrinkage or expansion of concretions for the times we drive over bridges, etc: maybe this gives further insight, I googled blindly: http://www.byg.dtu.dk/upload/institutter/byg/nyheder/trb-06-1571-as%20submitted%20final.pdf f If two minerals are melted together, it is quite possible they will form a new crystal or amorphous structure, perhaps not even a clear chemical modification, but rather just reordering on a molecular scale that don't result in voids, but do result in a new density without adding gases, etc. I guess it might be a new mineral, but I'm not sure I know the precise definition of a rock or mineral so I'd think of it this way. Kindest wishes Doug -Original Message- From: Chris Peterson c...@alumni.caltech.edu To: meteorite-list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sat, Apr 14, 2012 2:08 am Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT: For the Geologists and Math Wizards! If the two combine as some sort of conglomerate (like a breccia), and the combination doesn't result in voids, then the bulk density can't be
[meteorite-list] Ad: New Dakhleh Glass website page
All, In a continuing quest to get caught up with the Tektite Source website after our multiple-year absence, I have just completed a completely new Dakhleh Glass page with a decent write-up, references, and a nice selection of specimens. Please have a look. There's quite a fun story of a possible massive airburst with humans on hand for the event. Enjoy. Thanks, Norm www.TektiteSource.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] HupDes' find Chromites?
All, We shouldn't miss the really big picture here. Congratulatiuons to all involved for a truly positive article. Collectors/dealers have a symbiotic relationship with academics/scientists! We on this list understand that, but this may be the first journalist in history to get it right. Generally we are selfish blood-sucking leeches that deprive the scientific community of crucial research material while driving prices out of the reach of all legitimate institutions. Too often they ignore the fact that a specimen of every single classified meteorite is now, without charge, in the hands of the classifying institution for further research . My immediate reaction was to send the author an email expressing huge satisfaction in the accuracy and balanced perspective of the article (which I did). I can't recall seeing anything close to this. Way to go Adam and Greg! True ambassadors of our community. Norm www.tektitesource.com - Original Message From: Adam Hupe raremeteori...@yahoo.com To: Adam meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, March 19, 2012 7:09:59 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] HupDes' find Chromites? The misspelling doesn't bother me much. I only wish that Dr. Scott Kuehner had been mentioned because he is the Micro-probe operator and research scientist who always makes his laboratory and skills available to us at the University of Washington. He is an intricate part of the team! He is one of the very important, highly-skilled, background team players that makes things happen. Kind Regards, Adam HupDes' The HupDes' Collection From: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 6:30 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] HupDes' find Chromites? I feel bad for Adam and Greg. Wouldn't have been a bad article if the reporter had his spellings right. Mike http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2012/03/19/go-to-meteorite-guy-reveals-out-this-world-finds/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Ad: New Dakhleh Glass website page
List, Sorry for the repeat message, but a number of viewers had problems with my Dakhleh glass page wall-paper. It may have been Firefox engine users only. Whatever the case, I killed the wallpaper. If you couldn't read my general write up, please try again. It should work now--- Thanks, Norm www.TektiteSource.com - Original Message From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, March 19, 2012 4:49:20 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad: New Dakhleh Glass website page All, In a continuing quest to get caught up with the Tektite Source website after our multiple-year absence, I have just completed a completely new Dakhleh Glass page with a decent write-up, references, and a nice selection of specimens. Please have a look. There's quite a fun story of a possible massive airburst with humans on hand for the event. Enjoy. Thanks, Norm www.TektiteSource.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: TektiteSource website updated with lots more coming---
Listoids, At the beginning of the year I retired from my exploration geology job and came home from Africa. We've been reorganizing our inventory and working our way through a massive update of the Tektite Source website (www.TektiteSource.com) and have posted hundreds of new specimens---fabulous Besednice Moldavites, Bikolite soccerballs, top-shelf Libyan Desert Glass, and more--- I'll be at the catch-up job for weeks to come, but I wanted to give the list first shot at the new material. Check in and stop back often. The changes will continue on a near-daily basis. It's good to be home, but my new boss (me) is a bit of a slave-driver! I think we'll eventually come to terms if the bugger will show a bit of basic humanity. Good website traffic may help him to understand that I am doing something. I think both of us may be a bit schizoid to tell the truth---but that's hardly anything new for him (an opinion which I share as well!). Cheers, Norm Lehrman www.TektiteSource.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] fractal clusters of shallow rimless craters on lava plateaus -- result of ice comet fragment air and surface bursts? very common in Great Basin from Oregon to California: Rich Mur
Yes, these are very common in dry areas where ranchers must construct stock ponds. Regards, Norm - Original Message From: Rich Murray rmfor...@gmail.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; michael barron mhbar...@gmail.com; Rich Murray rmfor...@gmail.com; Rich Murray rmfor...@comcast.net; Dennis Cox dragon-hun...@live.com Sent: Mon, July 11, 2011 9:26:21 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] fractal clusters of shallow rimless craters on lava plateaus -- result of ice comet fragment air and surface bursts? very common in Great Basin from Oregon to California: Rich Murray 2011.07.10 fractal clusters of shallow rimless craters on lava plateaus -- result of ice comet fragment air and surface bursts? very common in Great Basin from Oregon to California: Rich Murray 2011.07.10 I readily found much more in 3 hours with Google Earth and Maps -- here are just two clusters -- may be evidence for fractal clusters of air and surface bursts of many ice comet fragments from typical gradual disruption of a parent comet in solar orbit. 41.661806 -119.086891 2.014 km el, a shallow rimless crater, .6X.4 km, 16 m lower than 2.030 km plateau to S -- seems to be a lava surface, with a number of similar craters. fractal field of impacts on lava plateau, one crater, about .6 km wide NW-SE 43.363764 -120.186009 1.443 km el low, 23 m lower than 1.666 km edge to NE, white and dark minerals on bottom, N and E inner rim is darker. The region is very interesting... __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] NASA sues Moonwalker Astronaut
List, This is getting totally out of hand. Did any of you catch this press release? “NASA officials are demanding the return of the mission shoulder patch that Bruce Willis sent back to Billy Bob Thornton in the 1998 film Armageddon. While acknowledging that this was just a film, NASA claims the shoulder patch is never-the-less a national treasure, and the actor that saved all mankind from certain destruction by an earth-smashing asteroid had no right to salvage and transfer ownership of the mission patch. “Although fictional, this mission is seen by many as a likely future event, and as such, all of the memorabilia from the film is being recovered and safeguarded for the day when they become sacred objects associated with the prophecy of NASA’s brightest moment” claimed inside sources who asked to keep their identities confidential. “Insofar as they used the NASA insignia, we have been advised to assert ownership now rather than after the portrayed event has taken place. (source publication not disclosed) What next? Norm - Original Message From: Martin Altmann altm...@meteorite-martin.de To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, July 4, 2011 4:17:37 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NASA sues Moonwalker Astronaut Indeed it is not so much a legal question, it is a question of decency. Seems that a new generation was bred by NASA. How disrespectful and ungrateful can you still be for that by all means truly heroic deeds the astronauts did for NASA and the nation, to molest them now at their old-age with such a petty and greedy idiocy! I think, it's a question of reason and saving the face of that governmental spaceflight organization to remove these shameless rugrats, who had that brilliant idea, immediately from their jobs. NASA was scrooge enough to them with their Moon rocks. Meteorite people are different... Look, here Mitchell receives a piece of Moon via Tim Heitz: http://www.meteorman.org/Ed-Mitchell.htm Best, Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von MexicoDoug Gesendet: Montag, 4. Juli 2011 09:31 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] NASA sues Moonwalker Astronaut http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/90053154?U.S.%20government%20sues%20former%20astronaut%20over%20lunar%20camera#ixzz1R7PMDp3p Dear list, This is a very relevant case to meteorites and should not be taken lightly. They're at it again ... rewriting history and after 40 years of NASA's permission to take mementos from the Apollo era - now suing the sixth man to walk on the moon, Edgar Mitchell of Apollo 11, for trying to sell the camera they allowed him to have ... the precedent, I suspect is the identical one to the dust on the tape, which didn't exist, but they are gunning for now. Again, we are faced with the erosion of sensible property rights, a violation of traditional English and Roman law regarding the importance of possession IMO, in an effort to legislation effort from the bench at its finest (sarcasm). The question at hand: Can we apply today's standards retroactively to say NASA was wrong to allow astronauts to have things that were of no use to NASA at the time and with the full knowledge of NASA allowed to be kept by those involved. After 40 years of knowledge that the astronaut possessed this camera and other sundry things, it becomes a precedent, and NASA is even painting an American hero with a scarlet letter of T for Thief From the article: During the Apollo mission era, Mitchell said he and other astronauts got permission to take mementos from the spacecrafts. We have dozens of pieces. All of us who flew to the moon, he said in a Palm Beach Post report. Mitchell’s lawyer, Donald Jacobson, said, Objects from the lunar trips to the moon were ultimately mounted and then presented to the astronauts as a gift after they had helped NASA on a mission. The government is asking the court to order Mitchell to hand over the camera, and declare that it has good, clean and exclusive title to the piece of space history. Best wishes Doug __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] XRF Test results UNWA First try
All, I work with a hand-held Niton XRF on a regular basis, and they are amazing machines if one recognizes their proper applications and limitations. The first limitation is that they can't measure anything lighter than sodium (or more realistically, sulfur) unless you buy a super expensive helium-purged unit. The light elements present their own set of problems even then. For example, a significant part of the signal return would be from the air, not the sample, unless you undertake the measurements in a vacuum. However, the inability to measure the light elements has a few benefits. You can measure directly through low molecular weight substances, so plastic bags or surface coatings are no problem. Detection limits vary from element to element and sample to sample depending on spectral interference from other elements present. One must always consider results in light of the detection limit, which is reported for every reading. It is common to see results like 5ppm +/- 150ppm (in which case the 5 ppm is utterly meaningless), so an analytical report that doesn't include the detection limits can be entirely misleading. (The unit allows one to configure the reporting format such that detection limits are included). Some elements, such as gold, can only be resolved from interfering wavelengths at high concentrations, so the machine becomes quite useless when dealing with more typical ppb concentrations of gold. So, some of the elemental ratios of the lighter rock-forming elements that are often cited in chondrite classifications are not going to be measured with a portable XRF. For the heavier elements like iron and nickel, it is pure magic. The machine can be set to automatically average multiple readings so that inhomogeneities in the sample are averaged. When working with flat slabs, you can even paint the sample window back and forth while the reading is in progress to get better representations of the average composition. The units come from the factory able to directly recognize a range of industrial metal alloys. You could quite certainly develop your own standards so that the read-out could actually be campo or sikhote rather than a list of elements! The bottom line is that, like every tool, one must understand what it can and cannot do. Then work with the strengths and avoid the weaknesses. The last unit my employers purchased a few months ago was priced at $29,900 plus another $2300 for a portable analytical chamber (in which you can get good readings on a medium-sand-sized particle). The operating costs are virtually nil, but the x-ray tube does have a finite life (around 10,000 measurements), after which the unit must be returned to the factory for a replacement tube (I haven't had to replace one yet, but I think the cost is in the $10,000 range). There are licensing requirements that vary from state to state and country to country. Cheers, Norm www.tektitesource.com - Original Message From: Jim Wooddell jimwoodd...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, July 1, 2011 2:00:36 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] XRF Test results UNWA First try Hello Count The one we are playing with now is a Niton XL3t. It's about $30k but don't quote me on that. Google Niton XRF and you'll find it. A few people have responded and we are going to see if we can add to the element list. Kind Regards, Jim Wooddell On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 3:47 PM, Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net wrote: Anyone on List like to smarten me up as to what one of these XRF guns cost and where one could be purchased? Count Deiro IMCA 3536 -Original Message- From: Jim Wooddell jimwoodd...@gmail.com Sent: Jun 30, 2011 2:01 PM To: cdtuc...@cox.net Cc: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] XRF Test results UNWA First try Hi! I am not trying to compare. All I need is a go - no go. Then it's off to a lab for classification. I had sent this lady a list for elements. She is going to see if she can do them when she get home. Her gun is one of the better higher end units. So I will add Cr Mn and Na, thank you. I had so far Ca Cr Si Ni Mg Ga Al Fe Mn Ti Na Thanks Jim On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 1:14 PM, cdtuc...@cox.net wrote: Jim, My posts are moderated so, they do not post in real time but , until Art releases them. Please excuse these delays. I don't know of any such links with XRF generated data. I only had my own data that I paid Blaine to produce from my own rocks. In order to compare data with that of known meteorites you have to have data for a few certain elements. Not the info you got from your XRF results. All of the published needed data that is used to plot these charts with are basically the same. the data you got for your UNWA is arbitrary in that nobody really uses much of what you were given for much of anything. The elements
[meteorite-list] 80th Anniversary of the arrival of a Green Alien from Space!
Listoids, June 27, 1931, 0130 hours, Foum Tatahouine, Tunisia June 26, 2030 hours, New York June 26, 1830 hours, Denver June 26, 1730 hours, Spokane In just a few hours it will be 1:30 AM, June 27 in Tunisia (but I am not going to stay up for it as that will be 3:30AM at my present location in East Africa). It’s a clear starry night at a balmy 24C/75F in Tunisia, much like the night in 1931. Eighty years ago today, after a very long voyage from a spaceport believed to be located in the south pole crater of asteroid 4 Vesta, a green alien shattered into tiny bits against the earth’s atmosphere. The fragments rained down about 2 ½ miles NE of Foum Tatahouine, Tunisia. On the same month and day, but differing numbers of years later, a couple of additional aliens survived re-entry and are quietly living amongst other earthlings to this day. Happy birthday, my diogenite brother Doug Dawn (aka MexicoDoug)! Happy earth-arrival anniversary Tatahouine! A great place to catch up on the story of Tatahouine is Doug’s website: (www.diogenite.com/tata1.htm) My favourite factoid regarding the green meteorite is the common presence of tiny shatter-cone horsetails decorating the coarse pyroxene crystals. A question for those more knowledgeable than I on impact cratering: could these shattercones have formed during the event that ejected the material from its source crater or are they artifacts of earlier impacts in the same location? Best regards, Norm Lehrman __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] 80th Anniversary of the arrival of a Green Alien from Space!
Listoids, Sorry if this is a double posting. I didn't receive the first try, so this is attempt 2--- June 27, 1931, 0130 hours, Foum Tatahouine, Tunisia June 26, 2030 hours, New York June 26, 1830 hours, Denver June 26, 1730 hours, Spokane In just a few hours it will be 1:30 AM, June 27 in Tunisia (but I am not going to stay up for it as that will be 3:30AM at my present location in East Africa). It’s a clear starry night at a balmy 24C/75F in Tunisia, much like the night in 1931. Eighty years ago today, after a very long voyage from a spaceport believed to be located in the south pole crater of asteroid 4 Vesta, a green alien shattered into tiny bits against the earth’s atmosphere. The fragments rained down about 2 ½ miles NE of Foum Tatahouine, Tunisia. On the same month and day, but differing numbers of years later, a couple of additional aliens survived re-entry and are quietly living amongst other earthlings to this day. Happy birthday, my diogenite brother Doug Dawn (aka MexicoDoug)! Happy earth-arrival anniversary Tatahouine! A great place to catch up on the story of Tatahouine is Doug’s website: (www.diogenite.com/tata1.htm) My favourite factoid regarding the green meteorite is the common presence of tiny shatter-cone horsetails decorating the coarse pyroxene crystals. A question for those more knowledgeable than I on impact cratering: could these shattercones have formed during the event that ejected the material from its source crater or are they artifacts of earlier impacts in the same location? Best regards, Norm Lehrman www.tektitesource.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits
All, I fear this thread may be counter-productive for any that are just getting started in the search for meteorites. The glacier angle is, in this case, thin ice. First, Antarctica is a very special case: in general glacial moraines are an absolutely horrible place to look. I'm with Mike. If you've got genuine meteorites, they probably have nothing at all to do with the moraine deposits. Second, I'm also with Anne: the starting place here is to confirm the ID. This is one of those stories with to good to be true overtones. But back to moraines. As a lifelong exploration geologist, I spent many years living on the terminal moraines and outwash gravels of the Cordilleran ice sheet (in NE WA). Moraines are vast accumulations of rock, precisely what a meteorite hunter doesn't want. Nininger's pioneering success in the recovery of meteorites was a direct result of going places where there shouldn't be any rocks. The sand seas of the Sahara, same thing. The dry lakebeds of the Great Basin continue that tradition. And so does Antarctica. The latter, of course, is where the confusion arises. Glaciers are part of the story for the Antarctic meteorites, but only part. Starting at the simple end, Antarctica is a vast expanse of white and blue where the nearest bedrock is often 3000 m straight down. Rocks are easy to spot, and most that are there fell from the sky. On a snowmobile you can cover a lot of ground fast and not miss much. The driest air on earth (much dryer than that of hot deserts) adds to the story by lengthening meteorite shelf-life. Then there are the glaciers. Mainly, the ice flows to the coast and the meteorites sail away in their ice rafts until they are dumped unceremoniously into the depths of the ocean. However, where the flowing ice encounters mountains, like the Transantarctic range, it stalls, to be slowly eaten away by katabatic winds descending from the high country. More ice flows in to replace that lost, and with time, all of the entrained rocks accumulate in a relatively compact stranding zone. The terminal moraines of the North American ice sheets were quite different. They flowed into warmer climes, melted, thinned and dumped their contents like dirty plowed snowpiles in the spring. They advanced and retreated. Meltwaters reworked the lot. The ice was both a bulldozer and upside-down conveyor belt. Certainly, meteorites fell onto the surface of the ice, as they do on all the world, but in this case the glaciers provided vast dilution, not concentration. Of course you could find a meteorite in glacial deposits, but the dilution effects make the search much more difficult. So advice to would-be searchers: by all means do search wherever you can, but if you want to increase your odds of success, don't head for the moraines of the great continental ice sheets. Further, you don't need to run out and buy a metal detector, expensive or otherwise. Life is too short to do that anywhere but a strewn field. You need to cover ground to up the odds. Go where there are no rocks and use your eyes, by far the best tool available for routine cold searches Cheers, Norm (still on the far side of the globe) www.tektitesource.com - Original Message From: Dave Myers whitefalcons...@yahoo.com To: meteoriteguy.com m...@meteoriteguy.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com; tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com Sent: Fri, June 10, 2011 5:07:57 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits Hi Mike you may be right. But the two chondrites are so different, I do not think there from the same fall. But they both could be from different falls?? And when you look at the glacier map I posted with all the iron finds in south west ohio, non of them are paired? just my thoughts. Thanks again Dave Myers - Original Message From: meteoriteguy.com m...@meteoriteguy.com To: Dave Myers whitefalcons...@yahoo.com Cc: tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, June 9, 2011 9:29:27 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits Guys, It is very unlikely that these Chondrites are related to the glaciation. Just appears to be a strewnfield like any other. Michael Farmer Sent from my iPhone On Jun 9, 2011, at 6:26 PM, Dave Myers whitefalcons...@yahoo.com wrote: Hi Tracy All the green areas on the map are high glaicer morians It does not show the smaller ones in Butler county and other countys. There is a farm on the Butler-Hamilton county line most of it in Hamilton county, Has a perfect out line u shaped of a morian on that farm. I want to hunt that really bad. Will ask next them next year. Dave Myers - Original Message From: tracy latimer daist...@hotmail.com To:
Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits
Count, Muonionalusta is actually a good illustration regarding the potential effects of glaciation: --- the Muonionalusta meteorites have endured thousands of years' worth of glaciations and melting periods. As a result, thawing ice sheets have migrated the meteorites miles from their original impact site, making Muonionalusta among the largest and most challenging strewn fields on the planet. (quoted from the Meteorite Men episode description). I don't have any personal knowledge of the Muonionalusta research, but the suggestion inherint in the last part of the quote is that glacial effects have dispersed, enlarged, and confused the inferred original distribution pattern. Which is my general point: more often than not, glacial phenomena work against the meteorite hunter. Without the slightest doubt, meteorites fell on the continental ice sheets, were variously transported, and were ultimately deposited. This, however, does not make glacial deposits any more prospective for meteorites than your back yard. In fact, if you find one in your back yard, you will be well on your way to finding more. But if you find one in glacial till, your chances of expanding that find into multiple finds is greatly reduced, not enhanced. Cheers, Norm www.tektitesource.com - Original Message From: Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net To: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net; Dave Myers whitefalcons...@yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, June 10, 2011 6:31:30 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits Hello Norm, List, Considering the exposition on Meteorite Men of the Muonionalusta strewn field and in particular the claims by the Swedish hunter that the meteorites were brought to the area by glaciers, could you comment? Best to all, Count Deiro IMCA 3536 -Original Message- From: Norm Lehrman nlehr...@nvbell.net Sent: Jun 10, 2011 6:08 AM To: Dave Myers whitefalcons...@yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits All, I fear this thread may be counter-productive for any that are just getting started in the search for meteorites. The glacier angle is, in this case, thin ice. First, Antarctica is a very special case: in general glacial moraines are an absolutely horrible place to look. I'm with Mike. If you've got genuine meteorites, they probably have nothing at all to do with the moraine deposits. Second, I'm also with Anne: the starting place here is to confirm the ID. This is one of those stories with to good to be true overtones. But back to moraines. As a lifelong exploration geologist, I spent many years living on the terminal moraines and outwash gravels of the Cordilleran ice sheet (in NE WA). Moraines are vast accumulations of rock, precisely what a meteorite hunter doesn't want. Nininger's pioneering success in the recovery of meteorites was a direct result of going places where there shouldn't be any rocks. The sand seas of the Sahara, same thing. The dry lakebeds of the Great Basin continue that tradition. And so does Antarctica. The latter, of course, is where the confusion arises. Glaciers are part of the story for the Antarctic meteorites, but only part. Starting at the simple end, Antarctica is a vast expanse of white and blue where the nearest bedrock is often 3000 m straight down. Rocks are easy to spot, and most that are there fell from the sky. On a snowmobile you can cover a lot of ground fast and not miss much. The driest air on earth (much dryer than that of hot deserts) adds to the story by lengthening meteorite shelf-life. Then there are the glaciers. Mainly, the ice flows to the coast and the meteorites sail away in their ice rafts until they are dumped unceremoniously into the depths of the ocean. However, where the flowing ice encounters mountains, like the Transantarctic range, it stalls, to be slowly eaten away by katabatic winds descending from the high country. More ice flows in to replace that lost, and with time, all of the entrained rocks accumulate in a relatively compact stranding zone. The terminal moraines of the North American ice sheets were quite different. They flowed into warmer climes, melted, thinned and dumped their contents like dirty plowed snowpiles in the spring. They advanced and retreated. Meltwaters reworked the lot. The ice was both a bulldozer and upside-down conveyor belt. Certainly, meteorites fell onto the surface of the ice, as they do on all the world, but in this case the glaciers provided vast dilution, not concentration. Of course you could find a meteorite in glacial deposits, but the dilution effects make the search much more difficult. So advice to would-be searchers: by all means do search wherever you can
Re: [meteorite-list] Question for dealers re: displaying sold items
All, This is an interesting question with important nuances. I am one that does leave many sold items pictured (but I do endeavor to marke them sold ASAP). Here's why I do it: The items we sell, each and every one of them, are unique. It is not like listing a particular stock item that was mass produced. We do have categories and types and sub-types, but in the end, a whole long list of individuals. As a consequence, every specimen has a unique value. One displays this feature supremely well, another presents other aspects well. One glorious piece has it all. I leave pictures of sold items on the website to help collectors to develop a sense of perspective. How can you recognize a truly superb Besednice moldavite if you don't have some frame of reference for the range of attributes possible? So that is my why. But there is another question that has not been mentioned thus far, and I would appreciate your thoughts on this. For a long time, when I was updating a sold item, I left the asking price visible. The thought, in line with the preceeding paragraph, was to help provide perspective as to what other willing buyers had accepted as a fair price for a piece of a particular quality. However, I also recognize that the day comes when a buyer may wish to resell, and at that point, the price they paid for the piece should be a private matter. In fact, some buyers may not want their significant others finding out the buying price for that great specimen they just bought instead of paying the rent! So, I increasingly do remove the purchase price when I mark something sold (but I hope that potential buyers may be able to infer from my long listing of sold items that many collectors have judged my pricing reasonable---). Do you want the purchase price deleted or do you find value in being able to see what was actually paid for a specimen? Periodically, I do go through our listings and weed out most of the sold items, leaving only a selection of some of the best of the best sold items still pictured. But for those of you who don't maintain your own websites, it is worth noting that this involves identifying the particular thumbnail photo that links to particular blow-up, then deleting those images and changing the associated page to delete references to those images, etc, etc. Frankly, there comes a point where it is easier to just leave it all there. Lazy is part of the answer to the original question--- Cheers, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) (back home for a month, then back to Africa---) - Original Message From: Michael Gilmer meteoritem...@gmail.com To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, April 12, 2011 7:59:52 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Question for dealers re: displaying sold items Hi List, Martin and Shawn raised a couple of good points. Old-school collectors bought specimens via snail mail and telephone calls, sometimes without seeing a photo of a specimen. Some dealers like Bob Haag had catalogues with photos and descriptions, but many had simple price lists with nothing more than a line or two describing the specimen. Today, we have instant gratification and can shop online for meteorites as if we are buying shoes or a hat. But, meteorites are unique and unusual, so they are ill-suited for a quickie drive through type of sales medium. Some of the newer dealers have very nice and flashy websites that are quite effective, but much of the meteorite world is still operating by it's own rules, so change comes slowly. Heck, I still buy the occasional specimen via snail mail and price-list. I've bought specimens from Blaine Reed, sight-unseen with just a brief text description and price. Not one time have I been disappointed, and it's exciting to open the package and see the specimen for the first time. It's a thrill one can't really get when you have already seen a dozen hi-res photos from every possible angle before receiving it in hand. As for the dealers who still have archives or pages full of sold specimens, I have no problem with it, if the specimens are marked as sold on the website, and the website is updated on a regular basis or semi-regular basis. When I can't tell which specimens are sold and which are not, that can be frustrating. Best regards, MikeG -- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 --- On 4/12/11, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: I would say Dealers leave sold items on the website because it shows the buyers what they have sold in the
Re: [meteorite-list] Darryl Futrell on flanged button prices (Was: Spectacular Tektite on eBay)
All, There are a couple of key issues regarding flanged aussie buttons. First, the big money has always been for Port Campbell Victoria specimens which somehow seem always bright, fresh, and pristine. All the others are in another league. For years I have offered specimens from anywhere else for $900 to $1300, but I haven't been able to restock for over 5 years at any wholesale price under $1500. They simply aren't on the market. --- On Mon, 8/9/10, bernd.pa...@paulinet.de bernd.pa...@paulinet.de wrote: From: bernd.pa...@paulinet.de bernd.pa...@paulinet.de Subject: [meteorite-list] Darryl Futrell on flanged button prices (Was: Spectacular Tektite on eBay) To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Monday, August 9, 2010, 9:05 AM Hello Brian and List, Brian wrote: On this beautiful tektite, I stand corrected. On December 3rd, 2000, I asked our late Darryl Futrell (+ Aug 13, 2001) what a reasonable price for a perfect Australian button would be and the next day he responded like this: A perfect flanged button goes for about $2000 or more. Maybe a sandblasted one might turn up for $1000 or so. Best wishes from someone who wishes he had one too Bernd __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Darryl Futrell on flanged button prices (Was: Spectacular Tektite on eBay)
Sorry, I was typing in the dark and hit a button that sent the message before I was done. The one on Ebay is significantly over-priced. For $1800, I think I can still source a flawless specimen. With the rim chips, I would not pay $1000, but times are certainly changing. They haven't made any more of these for a very long time and the supply is getting very lean. I think I told the story on our website, but I traded my youngest daughter's hand in marriage for one fine flanged button. We were living in West Aus and spent lots of time out searching. On the fateful day, Derek (our great current son in law) came out with us, his first tektite hunt. Cookie and I had over 1000 finds each to our credit (australites that is, not a single fully flanged button) and had a pretty good eye. We know how to tell them from kangaroo droppings (bite them!). We were walking a dry stream channel southeast of Kalgoorlie and finding nothing. My daughter is American Indian, and I had been kidding Derek that if he wanted to marry her he was going to have to come up with a fine bunch of horses and blankets for the father of the bride. It was hot and dry and swarming with flies and kangaroo droppings were about as exciting as it got. Then Derek shouted hey norm, about those horses and sheep and stuff---would this do??? He was holding up a perfect, flawless flanged button. I accepted on the spot. He has my daughter and a fine family, I have a fine flanged Australite and some great grandkids. What's more, we're both happy with the deal. People sometimes ask what my daughter thinks of being sold for a flanged button, and I assure them that she understands their rarity and is honored to command such a premium! Three years has passed since we moved to Africa and suspended the Tektite Source. Cookie has now moved back to the USA and is getting the inventory unpacked; I'm still wandering Africa at least until the end of the calendar year. But within a few months we should have things up and running again. Thanks for waiting. We have a long list of clients to contact when she finds everything. If you have items of interest from the website, let us know and we'll get to you when we can--- I need to visit our own website, but unfortunately I think we are completely out of good flanged buttons (that are for sale--there's for sure on that isn't!) Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- On Mon, 8/9/10, bernd.pa...@paulinet.de bernd.pa...@paulinet.de wrote: From: bernd.pa...@paulinet.de bernd.pa...@paulinet.de Subject: [meteorite-list] Darryl Futrell on flanged button prices (Was: Spectacular Tektite on eBay) To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Monday, August 9, 2010, 9:05 AM Hello Brian and List, Brian wrote: On this beautiful tektite, I stand corrected. On December 3rd, 2000, I asked our late Darryl Futrell (+ Aug 13, 2001) what a reasonable price for a perfect Australian button would be and the next day he responded like this: A perfect flanged button goes for about $2000 or more. Maybe a sandblasted one might turn up for $1000 or so. Best wishes from someone who wishes he had one too Bernd __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] I'm so happy! My 1st Post
Bill, Thanks. Your post warmed my heart, (even here in Africa 2 degrees south of the very hot humid meteorite-destroying equator!). Welcome! You are our kind of person. And to all of you that made Tucson and West, TX, thanks for your posts. They hurt very very bad/good. We missed both so much, and envied you all that made them! Cheers, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) --- On Sun, 3/15/09, Bill Hall meteorit...@gmail.com wrote: From: Bill Hall meteorit...@gmail.com Subject: [meteorite-list] I'm so happy! My 1st Post To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 8:18 AM Hello to all, I've tried to post on here over a year ago and couldn't get any thru. Thanks Steve Dunklee for the advice. My problem was different, but you inspired me to work on it again. gmail has a tab you must click to send messages as plain text. OK METEORITES. I probably got the bug the same way many of you did, watching a show with Robert Haag searching for the Tucson Meteorite. This was many years ago, and thanks a lot Robert if you read this. I hope your HAPPY! You've created a brand new Addiction all on your own! Soon after this I purchased O Richard Nortons book Rocks From Space. Great book, but guess what! I found out I lived only 5 miles from Richard and Dorthy Norton!. I found myself soon sitting at the kitchen table looking at thin sections with Richard, and learning all about chondrules, etc. What a treat!! He told me all about the field of meteoritics, and this pushed me over the edge. I have a serious problem when it comes to meteorites. I'm a bit of a freak I suppose,... I take meteorites with me wherever I go, I buy meteorites for less than their worth, more than their worth, give them to strangers, and pass them out at star parties to the children. I constantly think about all the different ways to include them in my life, process them, preserve them, make things from them, hunting for them, e-bay etc. Its a wonder I get anything done at all! Took a trip to Florida in 2003, went to Kennedy Space Center, and purchased my 1st meteorite. About 40 grams on Nantan crust for only $40!! How funny! I was ( and still am ) so happy to have my Nantan crust rust. ( No I don't want to buy any more @ $1 gram, but thanks ) I did go back in 2004 and buy another piece however. Oct, 2007 found me heading to Arizona, (I live in Bend Oregon) what a ride! I spent 4 month there hunting meteorites, and purchasing whenever possible. Made my 1st trip to meteor crater, UN believable experience! Met all the guys from Morocco, and purchased several kilo's NWA, a few kilos here a few kilos there. Spent most of my time in Quartzsite working (I have a mobile RV service business) and playing. In quartzsite I met a guy who many of you know I'm sure who brings us the Campo's. I spent nearly every spare moment working on, and discussing meteorite hunting, preservation, future searches for the Esquel Palllasite etc. and a BBQ almost every night. Ended up with Campo's running out my ears! Then my new friend had to go to Tucson,... how sad I had to stay and work. Well he called me several times from there, and made several nice purchases for me, some of these were purchased from list members. #1 I got the nice big Brenham slice, with the L.A. Times newspaper, thanks Steve Arnold, I love it! #2 I got a big 12 kilo complete oriented chondrite, I think it came from Mohammad, but not sure #3 I got a 1 kilo Seymchan, and small 40 gram slice from one of you guys. and several other smaller pieces, thanks everyone. I vowed to make it to Tucson in 2009. I kept that vow...WOW! Even before I went, I had the pleasure to meet Ruben in Quartzsite, and be in one of his videos. Oh yea! I forgot, I found a 40 plus gram chondrite in the Quartzsite area. My 1st find, I GPS the coordinates, and photo in situ, etc. My friend Mark and I had walked for a hundred miles before we found it. How cool it wasand Ruben videoed it with his new HD camera, and stuck it on You Tube. SO COOL, thanks Ruben! Then Tucson: Oh boy..the post is getting long, sorry so exited to post.be calm, breath...OK 1st stop, the Ramada, and got 8 kilo chondrites from a nice boy from Morocco for REALLY cheap! then to the Days Inn and found my Campo connection, visited a bit, then Steve Arnold walked up and I got to meet him! Almost peed my pants! Then got oriented, found a place to park for the day, and headed to Inn Suites. Here I met Marvin Kilgore, ( again nearly peed) what a nice guy! purchased his book, and talked meteorites for an hour or so, met his nice wife Kitty and got some pictures. thanks Marvin and Kitty. Then met Bruno Fectay and Corine Bidaut, SUPER nice people. Checked out their Mars rock Chassignite, nice..and took their picture! Thanks. Then found Mike
Re: [meteorite-list] West, Texas meteorite finds
Doug, Thanks for your story. And Mike F., you've been great. You can't know how envious we are, patiently waiting at our post for something to shatter on the atmosphere over east Africa. Just hearing your stories and knowing you guys and picturing the search in our minds makes us feel like we've touched greatness--- Thanks for sharing. (But as I have relayed to others privately, the Tucson pictures shared by listoids were a bit cruel. We've missed it for two years and it hurts bad---. But really, thanks for your pics. The tugs on our heartstrings hurt a bit, but they keep us going). We'll be back. Cheers (from Tanzania), Norm Cookie (http://tektitesource.com) --- On Sat, 2/21/09, mexicod...@aim.com mexicod...@aim.com wrote: From: mexicod...@aim.com mexicod...@aim.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] West, Texas meteorite finds To: meteor...@meteorobs.org, Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Saturday, February 21, 2009, 3:36 AM Hello from Sunny Texas, under clear and starry-eyed skies at the moment, A few stones were found right at the time of the fall, however, they were not definitively identified as meteorites - though that was the suspicion and they were saved. We (Doug Dawn, Dmitry Sadilenko, Sergey Petukov) drove across the country and estimated the location of the strewn field within 48 hours of the event. With a bit of tenacity, scarcely four hours after the second day, thanks to the help of some Texas-sized hospitality, we arrived in the strewn field and found our first couple of stones and I had the distinct pleasure of shaking the finders hand and removing any lingering doubts in his mind that he had meteorites fresh from Heaven's farm. After the initial success, my good friend and asteroidhunter, Rob Matson of Los Angeles, joined up with the team. We have found some stones, but more are being found by others, and we really expect larger masses to be found, though hard work in the field definitely gets you wondering if just because such a meteoritical spectacle drops one stone, should it drop the thousands we keep expecting to see? The TKW is rapidly evolving, but the area is being hit quite hard by hunters already. This doesn't seem to be a dense fall, and some areas are very easy to search, though bramble in other areas effectively keeps those off limits. All land is private and most families keep their gun collections well oiled. In our case, the big-hearts of the landowners have humbled easily as much as the witness reports of the bolide's fragmenting itself. This is at odds with some other reports, only because residents of the area treasure their privacy and were completely overwhelmed by the wave of treasure hunters that descended. We almost lost our permission to hunt when they believed that we were somehow responsible for several meteorite hunters showing up with a news crews. Besides being quite busy, I promised to respect the anonymity of our hosts as a condition of our search, and this evening we reaped the benefits of a delicious home-cooked dinner prepared by the caring hands of our hosts at their dinner table. There is a great Texas steakhouse on I-35 which adds to the flavor for anyone wanting to experience Texas culture, cowboys and pretty cowgirls from West, TX. It has been an incredible last few days, which started by being the first to walk in a virgin strewn field, though my mother had some problems (she seems better now) that have somewhat muted what will undoubtedly be some of the most memorable moments of my life. It is way past bedtime and I will post more tomorrow. The meteorite itself is moderately to highly shocked and has a very bright, light, interior and veins of troilite and nodules of metal, and the majority of stones found are fully fusion crusted. More on the classification on Saturday. We certainly were not in a mass-laden portion of the strewn field, other hunters please take note; more likely just a place where a minor fragmentation impacted. In any case, we are committed to getting the science done so everyone else can rest assured that we have already gladly provided the mass requirements necessary for this honor. All in all, a very humbling experience for many reasons. To pick up a piece of a falling star and I thought, detect a faint sulfurous odor. It seems a dog even caught the scent of a meteorite and laid it down on the owners porch! Best wishes and clear skies Doug -Original Message- From: Pat Branch pat_bra...@yahoo.com To: drtan...@yahoo.com; Global Meteor Observing Forum meteor...@meteorobs.org Sent: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 9:28 am Subject: Re: (meteorobs) West, Texas meteorite finds The University of North Texas Astronomers have found 4 so far. I saw a video clip of them. The biggest is about 3 times the others...just about palm sized. I think that is 4 for Farmer and 4 for UNT. I have not heard of other teams finding
Re: [meteorite-list] Bogus indochinites? Are they or aren't they?
Greetings Dirk, Mark, all, I have previously forwarded off-list comments to some on this matter, but just to round out the story for everyone, here are a few bits from our experience. We have purchased some very large lots of tektites from several sources. For many years we have had a consistent buyer of over 10,000 specimens per year. As these are used for educational purposes, we have handled and examined each and every one. Lots of odds and ends are included in every shipment, but I don't consider this intentionally fraudulent on the part of any of my suppliers. Bulk tektites are a bulk commodity and have a very low unit value to the finder. I am frankly amazed that the overall percentage of rejects is so low. The most common cull materials found in bulk shipments are: clinkers slag, coal, tourmaline, garnets, melted glass, fragments of plastic, and assorted common rocks. I don't think this is the result of deceit. It's just bulk materials being handled as quickly as possible. What does distress me is that I have seen this same cull material offered as individual specimens by dealers in Tucson who apparently think that just because it was found in a bag of tektites, it is therefor a tektite, ---in fact, an odd tektite deserving of its own box and individual piece sale. It should not need to be said, but I will say it anyway: if you buy bulk tektites, don't suspend critical judgement. Some of the black bits in there aren't tektites even if they are in a bag marked tektites. As for the fake moldavites, these also are quite often honest mistakes. Don't assume that every seller of the same is a crook. When I have contacted sellers on such matters, I would say that 80% of the time, they truly had no idea their material wasn't authentic and withdrew their auctions quickly and honorably. The ones you really need to watch out for are the new localities. These are the ones that show up periodically from Utah, or Arizona, or somewhere in Africa or a host of other places. Once someone has decided that what they have is a new type of tektite, there is seldom an objective bone left in their body. They can always find some teacher or professor or geologist who endorses their find. This is big-time buyer beware. I always give the new discoveries a fair hearing. We'd all love to find something new. But be careful. Honest people will be open about doubts and uncertainties. If they start to talk about conspiracies to supress their find, and quote all sorts of authorities who could not be in a position to be real authorities, throw out the red flag! As for the Indochinites, Dirk has told you like it is. It is virtually impossible to be sure of a source locality without self-collecting or getting it from someone you can trust impeccably who has self-collected(like Dirk). Even my most trusted suppliers, who may well be completely trustworthy, get their materials from other suppliers of completely unknown integrity. The front-line collectors have a vested interest in keeping their localities secret. Best regards to all, Norm Lehrman (tektitesource.com) --- On Fri, 2/13/09, drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com wrote: From: drtanuki drtan...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bogus indochinites? Are they or aren't they? To: Mark Ford mark.f...@ssl.gb.com, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Friday, February 13, 2009, 4:14 AM Dear Mark and List, You are correct that it is unlikely that tektites are faked, 99.99% BUT NOT 100%. Rare types such as buttons etc., rare types or rare localities perhaps would be the most likely target because of profit vs effort. I have seen ONE intentionally faked tektite in the Philippines in the Late Dr. Beyer`s collection from the 1930~40s (labeled as 'fake'- it was two real tektites that had been affixed together with asphalt to form a very unusual shape). Moldavite faked- see ebay and check especially China, Hong Kong sellers. Faked (mis-represented or mis-identified) Libyan glass...we saw it before from China. It is NOT uncommon to see slag substituted as Indochinite. In my opinion Indochinite is not a good name as it allows for such a large area and they may not all be from the same source impact crater or same impact event. We have yet to find a source crater or craters! I am also of the opinion that there were multiple impacts at the time of their formation and the term Indochinite is a term left for orphaned tektites that the find location is no longer known or the person obtaining them bought them from persons unwilling to give the find location for financial reasons OR the seller just did not know and assumed that the location was what the local seller said. For example, in Thailand, Vietnam, Hong Kong and especially China there are many tektites that are sold as being from China or Thailand when in fact they were imported from Thailand, Laos
Re: [meteorite-list] Tektite with metal?
All, The material pictured is just an iron oxy-hydroxide mixture (limonite works okay) that occurs naturally in lateritic soils. It is quite common on tektites from some localities. If you want to clean it, just soak the tektite in HCl for a week or two. It will then be easily picked or washed out--- If it is any consolation, when I first got started with tektites I hoarded pieces like that, also thinking they might be related to the famed Fe-Ni inclusions. No such luck. Cheers, Norm (http://tektitesource.com---still on hold in our absence from the USA) --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Eric Wichman e...@meteoritewatch.com wrote: From: Eric Wichman e...@meteoritewatch.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tektite with metal? To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 9:45 AM Phil, That's the closest thing I've seen. That might be it. Eric Phil Morgan wrote: Eric, I believe what your seeing is the same thing (maybe polished somehow) as what I've heard this referred to as Limonite. Here is an example. http://www.tektiteinc.com/104grams.html I have very similar examples and it is very hard stuff. Phil On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 9:42 AM, Eric Wichman e...@meteoritewatch.com mailto:e...@meteoritewatch.com wrote: Sean, Unsure of whether it is metal... it resembles metal, but is not magnetic. I've tried using a small pick to remove it and even a stainless steel wire brush and no luck. It's not soil of any kind. I'll try to get some 10X magnification photos... Eric T. Murray wrote: Eric - are you sure that is metal? I'm curious to know if a magnet sticks to it... Most of these that I have seen are compacted soil/minerals that are attached to the tektite. Kind of like caliche. I have a bunch of tektites with those kinds of inclusions - but they are all local material that has just gotten stuck in the weathered surface of the tektite. I usually leave them in as it is an indicator of the soil/material where the tektite was found. - Original Message - From: Eric Wichman e...@meteoritewatch.com mailto:e...@meteoritewatch.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com mailto:meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 10:40 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Tektite with metal? Hey all, On my recent adventure to the Tucson show I purchased many meteorites and about 6 kilos of tektites, in the batch of tektites I found an odd piece. Now I'm very familiar with chondrites but know little to nothing about tektites. Can someone please tell me what I'm looking at here. It's an odd piece. It appears to be metal embedded in the tektite in two places. This is the only piece I have that exhibits this inclusion. Is this a natural inclusion that formed after the tektite was formed or is it just something stuck in the tektite??? The piece is about 34 grams... http://www.meteoritesusa.com/tektites.htm This is bugging me because I can't find any info on it and I'd like to know if this is normal for a tektite or just some fluke oddity. Regards, Eric __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com http://www.meteoritecentral.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com mailto:Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA http://www.meteoritesusa.com http://www.meteoritesusa.com/ 904-236-5394 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com http://www.meteoritecentral.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com mailto:Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA http://www.meteoritesusa.com 904-236-5394 __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Argentine Campo Investigation
Eduardo, Several years ago I was told that the Campo strewn field overlaps the boundary into an adjacent province (Santiago del Estero?) which at that time had no laws regulating export. Hence, there was said to be a legal source outside of Chaco. Is this incorrect? Thanks, Norm --- On Fri, 11/21/08, Eduardo. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Eduardo. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Argentine Campo Investigation To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Friday, November 21, 2008, 3:46 AM Martin The problem is not just a reporter calling, is that there is a judicial process now. And the new law is not to be considered as it is about NEW FINDS AND FALLS only (December 2007). The problem here is that ALL meteorites from Chaco province (including Campo de Cielo) are protected by a provincial law since 1993. So only Campo del Cielo meteorites that left the Chaco province before 1993 can be legally sold. Eduardo -Original Message- From: Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:39:21 +0100 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Argentine Campo Investigation Don't worry Eric, ignore. When came the new law into force? In January? They and not you have to prove, whether there was an illicit export and whether it happened this year. Skol Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 20. November 2008 23:57 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Argentine Campo Investigation Hello Eric and List, She asked if I would come to Argentina to answer the charges...I certainly wouldn't show up for their inquisition No such experiences here but the best you can do as a citizen of a free country is to simply ignore such b.s., sorry, nonsense. Best, Bernd __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Question About Potassium-Argon (K/Ar) dates for North American and Australasian Tektites
Michael list, Greetings from Tanzania! Sorry to be so out of touch, but electricity and internet service are both pretty insecure here. Michael, K-Ar and Ar40/Ar39 techniques are not limited to volcanic rocks. Anything containing potassium (certainly including tektites) can work. There are always interpretative issues, but that's another subject. I spend a fair bit of my field time here working with geochronology where 2.8 billion years is young and an error bracket of +/- 40 million years is almost too sloppy to be of use! I'm learning some new stuff. No meteorites so far, and virtually no decent search environments. I found a killer little iron in the middle of a jungle trail a while back, but a quick zap with a Niton portable XRF unit showed no Ni. Just a nice chip off of an iron plow or sledge hammer---. The Niton ray gun is driving me crazy. At virtually no cost, I can pull the trigger and analyze for the entire periodic table heaver than Na in less than 1 minute. This machine should be able to let us non-destructively differentiate iron meteorites, and maybe tektites. Why am I going crazy? ALL my collection is in storage in the USA and I can't test the technology! The unit costs around $35,000 US. Here, now, I have unlimited access to one, and soon, several. Imagine being able to instantly (in relative terms), go though a collection of irons and verify their identity. I've got some in my collection that are potentially with the wrong tag, and I bet every museum in the world fits into that fellowship. What if we can easily zap tektites to confirm/differentiate Ivorites, Bediasites, and Australasians? Authenticate moldavites and reject etched glass? I THINK this tool is in our hands now. I'm coming to the US at Christmas time. Who can offer me a nice wide variety of approx. 1 cm sq slices of irons at a decent price? I could even return them afterwards (subject to the risk of confiscation in customs somewhere---). If this works as I think it could, I'd consider buying a Niton on my return to the USA, and offering verification services. If anyone is able to provide me with a dozen or so little iron chips (for a price of course), please let me know. This could be very cool. Regards to all, Norm http://tektitesource.com , 10/14/08, Michael L Blood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Michael L Blood [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Question About Potassium-Argon (K/Ar) dates for North American and Australasian Tektites To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Tuesday, October 14, 2008, 10:56 AM Hi Paul all, K-A dating is only applicable to volcanic material, therefore, It would not be applicable to tektites. Best wishes, Michael on 10/14/08 9:14 AM, Paul at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Friends, Can anyone recommend a publication that provides a comprehensive listing of Potassium-Argon (K/Ar) dates that have been published for the North American and Australasian tektites? Also, what the authorative reference(s) work for the bulk composition of tektites from each of these strewn fields? Any citations, which you can recommend would be greatly appreciated. Best Regards, Paul H. __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Totally Green by Twenty Eighteen! Info on Govnt. Spending (BEFORE current Bail Out): http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/GvntSpending.htm __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Atmospheric ablation marks on Tektites?
Sean all, This is whipping a dead horse, but I hate to see confusion perpetuated any more than it needs to be. You wrote The vast majority agrees they [tektites]are of cosmic origin-- Surely you mistakenly left out the NOT? Or maybe you use the word cosmic to include everything in the cosmos, which includes earth. Most commonly though, other people use cosmic to suggest something not of the earth. There is virtually no debate about LDG. Most listees know that we can now point to a specific source crater (Kebira) discovered a couple of years ago. You have and have seen splash-form LDG pieces??? Please don't say stuff like that in a public forum where it can only confuse those trying to learn. I am sure it would take about 5 minutes to find a buyer willing to pay over $1000 for even a small (but convincing) example, and I might well buy it myself. Maybe consider adding the term pseudo-splashform to your pseudo-regmaglypt theme. Tektite and impactite - different animals. Yes, the words mean different things, but they are not unrelated. Virtually all (living) students of the subject would accept that tektites are a subdivision of impactites. Tektites are impactites, but not all impactites are tektites. Deep enough, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Sean T. Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Michael, Yep - it's amazing that something so simple as a piece of glass has caused so much churning for over 100 years. The vast majority agrees they are of cosmic origin, most believe that they are from impacts on earth, but there are still those that believe the moon is directly involved. I've also read some other bizarre ideas - the coolest of them (to me) was the idea that the reason tektites are not always formed is that maybe they come from the impact of a huge ball of silica glass that slams into earth - A big meteorite just made of glass... how cool would that be. So far, everything I read simply states that tektites come from multiple sources. And don't worry about the noob stuff - I've only been diving into this for a few months, so I'll still say something way off base (as Doug points out with my still a lot of debate comment.) It's almost always wrong to make any general statement about tektites as a whole... the LDG debate is still ongoing as to how it was formed, but most people tie it to an impact event, and as an impactite. I've seen pictures (and have a few pieces) of LDG that show some of the splash-form types of characteristics of tektites, but nothing with a crust or a true regmaglypts. - Tektite and impactite - different animals. - LDG and Darwin glass - Terrestrial - it really helps that there are inclusions that are of the local material stuck in them. They also have a slightly higher concentration of water (in ppm) that make them different than a true tektite. The shaping that is seen in those glasses is not as nearly as convincing as the Australasian glasses. -Ventifacts is the more correct answer. But considering the company that tektites keeps with our other cosmic collectibles, I'm gonna stick with pseudo-regmaglypts until someone beats me up. - Yes - there are a lot of good documentation that spells out the composition of tektites. (Get Povenmire's book and McCall's book). The chemical composition of the tektites is the thing that really drives a lot of the controversy. The glass, in many cases, is very pure and free of water - it's hard to say how it was made since it breaks a few of the glass making rules and regulations :) They have found tektite like material on the moon (if it was found here on earth no one would have argued that it was not a tektite), but they are very small. It was thought that the first trips to the moon would have seen and brought back big, standard lots of tektites if that is where the originated - but they did not. many people changed their minds on the lunar origin after the moon landings. When they found microtektites on the moon, they ascribed them to impacts on the moon... after all, it is generally accepted that the moon and the earth are made from each other, so there will always be similarities. Another fun origin note: John O'Keefe was another of the proponents of the lunar origin of tektites. He died in 2000, and on his funeral program he had wanted the following phrase added: Tektitae De Luna Sunt! - tektites are from the moon! That's conviction. Sean. - Original Message - From: Michael Gilmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2008 11:07 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Atmospheric ablation marks on Tektites? Hi! Ok, now I figuring out this tektite issue. I want to thank everyone for their kind informative responses. First, I had no idea that tektites were so controversial!
Re: [meteorite-list] Atmospheric ablation marks on Tektites?
Mike, I'm not aware of any LDG that retains preserved external primary skin, so we don't even know what morphology or skin LDG may have once had. What you see now is mostly the result of desert sand-blasting by saltating sand grains. It can look oriented, and indeed it is, but with respect to prevailing surface winds, not atmospheric re-entry. Many pieces of LDG can properly be termed ventifacts. The australasians, and in particular, the australites certainly do have all sorts of thermal ablasian features, and when it comes to orientation, flanged buttons exceed the perfection of any meteorite. This is orientation exactly as we intend the word in meteoritics. With tektite discussions, one answer rarely fits all--- Cheers, Norm (of http://tektitesource.com , temporarily on hold while we are stationed in Tanzania for a few years). --- Michael Gilmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Group! While reading through another Meteorite-related message board on the WWW, I ran across a statement by an IMCA member that puzzles me somewhat. A discussion about Libyan Desert Glass was ongoing, and we were sharing photos of our LDG specimens. (and I showed off my new 9+ gram piece of dark-veined glass from Michael Farmer - thanks Mike!) So the guy says : This is one of my favorites and is fully oriented with regmaglypts (yes, tektite impactites can have atmospheric ablation patterns too). Ok, here is my confusion - I was under the impression that tektites were formed on impact - on Earth. So, doesn't this mean they cannot have atmospheric ablation patterns? Assuming the tektite never passed through the atmosphere, I don't see how this is possible. I have seen tektites with features that resemble regmaglypts and orientation, but this is just chance occurence, right? Or do I need to be schooled here? Thanks in advance! MikeG You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost. http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/text5.com __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] I am back!!!
Billy, That remark just dropped you below your point of reference. How absurd! Norm --- Bill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Whoopdeedo. Thought it was steve for a second there. Bill -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 18:23:58 EDT To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [meteorite-list] I am back!!! Hello everybody!! I am back from Ensisheim and vacation. After a very long day yesterday, made even longer by the hours spent in the Dallas Airport watching the rain and hoping that my flight would be allowed to take off, I got home very late and very tired. Now I am cleaning up my in-box. After deleting all spams, dubious offers and requests for help, I still have 497 emails to read. If yours is in that pile, please be patient, I'll get to it as soon as possible. Talk to you again very soon. Anne M. Black www.IMPACTIKA.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] President, I.M.C.A. Inc. www.IMCA.cc ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list FREE ONLINE PHOTOSHARING - Share your photos online with your friends and family! Visit http://www.inbox.com/photosharing to find out more! __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] More on London Clay Microtektites
Sterling all, You are excessively kind with your reasoned comments. When someone says But the people that found difficulty with such a composition, in my view, simply had an inability in grasp that some things in heaven and earth are literally beyond the powers of human understanding. Aubrey, I am embarrassed for you. How could you endorse (by mere repetition) such mindless drivel? Your stock just went way down. Good grief! Norm --- Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Addresing not Aubrey, but his informant... Why is this so familiar? Is there a Mystery Object Protocol that demands that things be presented obliquely, incompletely, and confusingly? The tektites have a high Ca content and this factor through [THROWS?] those who expect them to show substantial silica in their make up. But the people that found difficulty with such a composition, in my view, simply had an inability in grasp that some things in heaven and earth are literally beyond the powers of human understanding. So, they have been analysed for bulk composition, then? Calcium is high. How high? Provide percentages, please. They don't show substantial silica? How much silica? NUMBERS, please. In fact, how about the entire bulk composition results? What is their chief constituent? If they're glass as claimed, they must contain a more than measurable amount of silicon dioxide. That's what glass is. If they're tektites, it is inconceivable that they would be silica-free. The only thing that's beyond my powers of human understanding is what he thinks he's doing with this idiotic babble about dataless compositions and vague mysticism. Does he have data or not? Sounds like a complete flake. I suppose another source can be added to the list of possible origins: a night in the lab with bunsen and pipette and some nice glass stock. Shame. If they were real and from the beginning of the Eocene (55 mya) instead of the end of the Eocene (35 mya), they might be evidence from an enigmatic event: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleocene-Eocene_Thermal_Maximum Aubrey, why don't you ask him if he actually has any real data, how he got it (who did the tests), and such like questions, as, would he show it to you or let you put it on your website? And, finally, despite the visual resemblance to microtektites, there is one other substance which these objects could be: Amber. Amber was formed largely 50+ mya, is often found in early Eocene deposits, is suitably durable, is extensively transported by water, assumes fluid forms, and so forth. Amber can absorb considerable calcium (buried with bird bones you said). If the chief element of its composition is Carbon, you might have amber... Sterling K. Webb --- - Original Message - From: Aubrey Whymark To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 4:51 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] More on London Clay Microtektites Hi Michael Daniels, who discovered the London Clay tektites has recently emailed me a little more information, which I'd like to pass on: When it comes to your correspondent's doubts, which they are fully entitled to submit, particularly suspicions raised about the possibility of contaminates, origins connected with fly-ash and power stations, volcanics, yes, they are all familiar observations con- cerning the particles. And, as before, I just make the suggestion that for those more doubtful, they come down here and I will gladly conduct them to the Naze when I shall be more than appreciative to hear their explanations as to where I may have, in my enthusiasm, become a little adventurous in my concept and having unquestioning belief in the antiquity of the little glassy objects. That might be for me an acid test, but actually I think when they have better appreciation of the conditions prevailing at this lower London Clay locality, I think I can win over a few potential critics. Just to deal with a couple of questions raised by those who have written. I have today once more checked the particles and none show any magnetic properties. Some do have voids and there is a little evidence of impurities, but if that is confirmed then just might be tiny specs of dirt or plant debris. As for their pristine state, no sign of them suffering any ablation. Many of the fossil bird bones that I have collected from the Walton site are in such a remarkable condition that I have had to be careful when comparing them with modern avian elements, so perfect are they that confusion over which is which could arise. This is because once the relics came to rest on the sea bed and were fast covered with sediment, there they remained
Re: [meteorite-list] The Biggest Tektite?
Michael, This may be heresy, but the broad rounded grooves and tiny pits look Muong-Nongy to me. 3 kilos is a MONSTERous departure from any splashform known. Give it a close look. Not all Muong Nongs are conspicuously layered--- I betting Muong Nong. Cheers, Norm http://Tektitesource.com --- Michael L Blood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As per requests I have put up some photos of my 3,255.6g Indochinite Tektite. Those interested can have a look see at: http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/GiantTektite.html I believe it is only one of the largest 5 in the world - but I think it may be the one in best (flawless) condition of those 5. Best wishes, Michael __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] To Africa? what do you do?
List, Sorry if this is a bit off-topic, but I've had a bunch of (mostly) off-list questions about what I do that gets us transferred to places like Africa. I'm an exploration geologist, now working mainly with gold, employed by a big gold company. I've got 39+ years in the field and have worked every continent except Antarctica. On the side, I spent about 10 years teaching part-time at college level. A general lust for every facet of natural history magnified the whole thing, ultimately into the most exotic pursuit of all, METEORITES! and their problematic progeny TEKTITES! All of you reading this have the bug to some degree, and I hope you all comprehend that you're part of one of the most extreme focus groups in science: rocks that fall from the sky. Samples of asteroids. Samples from other planets. Samples of galactic star dust. Where do you go from this? My new assignment is based in Tanzania and involves creating the best team of explorers in Africa (and maybe the world!). You would be right to bet that nobody has escaped my training camp without knowing about meteorites, what to look for, and how where to look. I will keep our website going while we're gone, and will keep it updated with travel-log pics and narratives. I won't have access to our inventory for 2-3 years, so selling will be largely on hold. I'll still buy when opportunity presents, so do keep in touch. I'll remain on the list. This is not a good-bye (unless the crocs or tsetse flies or mosquitoes win--). Our address and phone and email will change, and will be posted to our website. But if you want to buy anything, ask soon--- Very soon. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] the biggest tektite ?
Anne, Sterling, Zelimir all, Hal Povenmire has a nice tabulation in his book Tektites: a Cosmic Enigma (2003). Here are a few additions from that list: Bohemian moldavites: 500 gms (Sorry Anne; not a contender) Moravian moldavites: 265.5 gms Java: 750 gms Georgia: 70.5 gms Bediasites: 200.8 gms Thailand: 456 gms in all cases not including Muong Nong types. The biggest remaining Rizalite in Futrell's collection 991.7 gms. I have a bunch of Povenmire's 2003 revision at $20 each if anyone is interested in acquiring one. Cheers, Norm http://Tektitesource.com --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 5/24/2007 3:40:24 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hi, Zelimir, List Just from searching the internet, I compiled this list of the Biggest Tektite (excluding layered tektites) from: Australia.437 g. Czechoslovakia..258.5 g. Ivory Coast 79 g. Malaysia.464 g. Philippines1069 g. I couldn't find any mention of the largest Vietnamite, but here's a site with a study of 203 Vietnamese tektites: _http://www.edamgaard.dk/Copy%20of%20VietnamTektites%20edj.htm_ (http://www.edamgaard.dk/Copy%20of%20VietnamTektites%20edj.htm) Sterling K. Webb --- Very interesting, Sterling. And what is the largest Moldavite known? I just acquired a big one, a nice tear-drop shape, 6.5 cm long, 39 grams exactly. Am I in the running? Anne M. Black www.IMPACTIKA.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] President, I.M.C.A. Inc. www.IMCA.cc ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: Moving to Africa---Taking final orders
List, I'm being transferred to Tanzania for a few years and our inventory will mostly or all be in storage. If there's anything you want, I can cover you for about a month, then I'm not sure--- Mention the met list or IMCA when you order and take off 15%. It sounds pretty cool. My main area of responsibility will extend from Lake Victoria around the Serengeti to Kilimanjaro with coaching functions for the rest of the continent. Hopefully there'll be some opportunities to push the meteorite envelope a bit--- Cheers, Norm Lehrman http://Tektitesource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Looking for hunting success story
Michael all, Here's a quick successful hunt story for you. I was headed home from a project in rural Nevada about a week ago and had a few hours to spare, so I dropped in on a dry lake near the road home. In two hours I had about 20 small fragments but huge dust devils were circling me like a pack of wolves. Several times I started to run for the truck for cover when the storm just dissolved away. At one point I looked up to check the threatening dust and to my surprise, a pickup was emerging from the cloud. One can go a week out here without seeing another soul (except for the Navy boys streaking by overhead), so it's always startling to meet someone like this. It turned out to be Robert Verish and his wife, Beth. Like me, they hadn't set out to hunt meteorites but were passing by and couldn't resist. It turned out to be a good day for all of us. All up, I covered 4.9 kilometers on foot in a little over five hours and recovered 58 stones, including one with very fresh heavy fusion crust, certainly a distinct fall from the others which were all visually similar. Despite the fairly short day, this was a new personal record for me. (Actually, I stopped at 60, but two of them flunked closer inspection at home---). Beth Verish found a very nice crusted nearly complete individual about an inch in diameter and another fairly big 20-30 gm piece (as well as a nice bunch of smaller pieces). When I left, the Verishes were still going strong and had a nice collection. I individually photograph each piece in situ, take a GPS fix, and bag each one with coordinates, date and time. Taking the time required for this process into account, I was finding a new specimen after every three or four minutes of search time! Not a bad day! Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Michael Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, I'm not looking for details such as location, type, or any of that but, I need a meteorite hunting success story fix. Anyone have a recent one they would at least acknowledge on list? Coming up empty-handed so far this year... Michael Murray __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] [meteorite_sale] Iron Meteorite for sale
All, The same guy tried to sell me an achondrite earlier today: Hi, I'm Bob Frankline an American resident presently on a volunteer mission at the Shisong Catholic Hospital(NW) of Cameroon,and an ardent lover of meteorites.I have a NWA achondrite(ahow), weighs 735g for sale.It was found in 2005 in the North West African Desert and i happened to have bought it while i was in Mauritania.It is very nice looking.I'm offering it at a reasonable price of $1700.If you're interested please do get incontact with me. Thanks Frankline Be careful out there! Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Jason Utas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Bob, Lists, Beware of a seller calling himself Bob Frankline, who is attempting to pass off a Chinga (currently on the Labenne webside, weight 499g) as a Mauritanian/NWA iron of any weight (he stated that it weighed 1091g). I did some sleuthing; the picture that was sent to me sure looked like a Chinga, so I searched for Chinga meteorites on google and the third hit was, well, it showed me the very same picture that I'd been sent of his 1091g Mauritanian meteorite. See here for the picture that he sent to me: http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f306/JUtas/wals.jpg and here for the Labennes' site and the identical image: http://www.meteorites.tv/index.html?lang=en-ustarget=d428.html The seller stated that it had been analysed in polytechnique de Vincent Bordeaux,in France when [he] was on transit to Cameroon from Mauritania. I tend to be trusting with such things, but this was an odd story, so I asked for more pictures/information, etc. He said that he would prefer to leave it uncut, but that it had aready been analysed with the following results: Chemically it contains 26.7%Ni,76%martensite and 24%taesite,0.072ppm Ge 0.177ppm Ga and finally it is 11.7ppm Ir. Load of crap, as you can see, both the data and the fact that it was analysed without being cut. So...beware of a 'Bob Frankline' or old material being passed off as a 'new NWA iron.' If the story's suspicious, or the irons doesn't look like a desert iron, just me mindful... Regards, Jason On 5/2/07, frankline bob [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Janson, I would not want to temper with this whole fragment. I want to sell it in it's natural form. This meteorite was analysed in polytechnique de Vincent Bordeaux,in France when i was on transit to Cameroon from Mauritania. Thanks. Frankline. On 5/1/07, Jason Utas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Again Bob, Could you please send a picture of the cut surface? Doesn't have to show the micro-etch - I know that would be hard to capture, but just something to give a rough idea. Also, could you please send a little more on the history - such as where you had it analysed, etc? Thanks, Jason On 5/1/07, frankline bob [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Janson, See picture attached. Structurally it's microsrstucture is plessite-like,It lacks the troilite crystals and very smooth. It is highly attracted to a magnet also. Chemically it contains 26.7%Ni,76%martensite and 24%taesite,0.072ppm Ge 0.177ppm Ga and finally it is 11.7ppm Ir. Thanks. On 4/30/07, Jason Utas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Bob, Pictures would be much appreciated - do you have any more information on it as well? Thanks, Jason On 4/24/07, bob_frank2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I'm Bob Frankline an American resident presently on a volunteer mission at the Shisong Catholic Hospital(NW) of Cameroon.I have an iron (ataxite) meteorite,very rich in Nikel(Ni) and weighs 1091gms.It was found in 1997 in Mauritania and i happened to have bought it while i was in that Country.It is very nice looking.I'm offering it at a reasonable price of $800.If you're interested please do get contact with me.contact me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] for photo. Thanks Frankline __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Database | Calendar From list manager: Ebay auctions may be advertised only if offering within the posting a discount of at least 5% of total. This list is not for regular dealer postings, therefore dealer postings may be subject to moderation which will delayed them. Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Recent Activity 1 New MembersVisit Your Group SPONSORED LINKS Posting Meteorite Job postings Load posting
Re: [meteorite-list] Tektite Surface Question- Please Zap if I'm out of place
Mike list, If I take your machined and polished like flat wording literally, I don't think I've ever seen anything (natural) where I would use such words. Maybe yours are machined and polished. Feel free to send me some photos of what you are talking about. The elongate hollows are likely the interiors of bubbles. Perhaps your flats are the same, but it would be very uncommon for them to approach truly flat, as in planar. If we ignore the idea of planar and just focus on ornamentation contrasts, one commonly sees bald spots on splatforms, which seem quite clearly to be thin patches of brittle skin that have popped off of variably plastic interiors on impact. Also, particularly with the onion type of splatted tear, there is usually a marked contrast between an unpitted, stretched upper surface and a deeply pitted base. The latter resembles the texture of molten metal poured onto a very wet surface, where the resulting steam pockets pit the base. I've often wondered if this is a clue that tektites fell during a very widespread rainy (monsoon) season when most of southeast Asia was wet. This might also help to explain why we never see anything embedded in the impact surface of a plastic tektite. Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Mike Groetz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good Morning- I understand this is a meteorite group- but may I please ask a tektite question to get some opinions? Many of the tektites I own seem to have almost machined and polished like flat surfaces on them. Some have elongated hollow areas- again smooth inside. It is almost like the molten glass set up on smooth flat or elongated surfaces. The balance of the same tektites' surfaces are worn and pitted from reentry, weathering, etc.. In other words- these areas look totally out of place to me but seem to be common in some of mine and in photos that I have seen. Understanding that tektites are of questionable origin and formation to begin with- would any of you please offer suggestions as to what you think may cause these out of place surfaces? Thank You Mike Groetz __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] National Geographic Re-Airing Ancient Astroid, the origins of Libyan Desert Glass
Jerry list, I didn't see the program (nor will I since we kicked out the TV over 30 years ago---), so I'm not completely qualified to respond. But quite often, I see solved mysteries kept alive and milked well beyond their expiration date. With the discovery of the Kebir crater in exactly the predicted target rocks a couple of years ago, I accepted that we had a conclusion for the long-missing source of Libyan Desert Glass. If this new program presents something contradicting this, I would be glad to hear of it. Otherwise, it's old news for most interested people, which might well explain a lack of response to your post. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Gerald Flaherty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi List, In response to Anne Black's picture of LDG in Michael Johnson's Rocks From Space a few days ago I posted news of a TV program concerned with one theory of the origins of Libyan Desert Glass. I didn't get much of a response from the List. I'm not sure why unless this subject is not of interest to anyone or everyone is comfortable with their personal understanding of the origins of LDG. Yet if anyone is so inclined, that show, Ancient Astroid, will be aired again on Tuesday April 3, at 12:00 noon Eastern Daylight Time on The National Geographic Channel. And Oh, you're welcome in advance to anyone to whom this notice might apply. Have a good evening. Jerry Flaherty __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] more gao please
Steve, What a superb collection! The list may give you a bad time, but no one can doubt your enthusiasm. Congrats on a magnificent effort. Credit where it is due! Regards, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- steve arnold [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good evening list.I see the list is running slow again.Well not for me.They say you can never get enuff of a good thing.Well I just updated my website with 11 new GAO specimens on a new gao webpage.I also moved around a few with another name change.I am coming up to 5 kilo's of really truly beautiful stones.Thanks to mike farmer for these 11 beauty's.Let me know what you think.View at your liesure. Steve R.Arnold,chicago,Ill,Usa!! Collecting Meteorites since 06/19/1999!! www.chicagometeorites.net Ebay I.D. Illinoismeteorites No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] CALIFORNIA-REGISTERED PROFESSIONAL GEOLOGIST FINDS HOBBY WITH EBAY
Ken and all, How embarassing for geologists everywhere and another general downer for serious meteorite people. This stuff is frustrating and sad. I hate seeing people ripped off. My bristles go up everytime someone says: I know it's real 'cause I had a geologist look at it--- As a career practicing geologist with over 10-years college-level teaching on the side, I can assure you that most geology curricula do not include ANY significant training or information regarding meteorites, much less, their identification. It is true that we geologists see a lot of earth rocks and are in a generally advantageous position to recognize something out of the ordinary when we see it, but I have described to this list before that in well-intentioned nievete, I used to pass around some fine SLAG pieces as examples of meteorites. Everyone, please be advised that, in general, professional geologists and geological academicians know less about meteorites than list members! Anyone reading this has been exposed to more meteorite information on this list than any geologist gets in multi-degree training unless they are involved in a course of study specifically involving meteorites! Cheers, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) --- ken newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Check out this professional geologist's 'Ureilite meteorite with diamonds.' http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=300094532355 (see question at bottom also, the 'professional geologist' info is found on his 'me' page) Does the cut face of this 'non magnetic meteorite' look like ordinary hematite to anyone else? As far as the obvious entry FUSION coating, remember this? http://home.earthlink.net/~wrongs/auctions/2255992757.htm Follow-up: http://home.earthlink.net/~meteorwrong/auctions/2260392588.htm Continuously amazed, Ken Newton http://home.earthlink.net/~magellon/updates.html __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] CALIFORNIA-REGISTERED PROFESSIONAL GEOLOGIST FINDS HOBBY WITH EBAY
Ken and list, This image: http://i7.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/94/59/e4ce_3.JPG looks highly silicous, which could explain the lack of streak. Am I imagining it, or can you detect some concentric banding, convex towards the upper left (opposite the saw marks)? If that's real, this may well be petrified wood! Surely the seller would've recognized that--- Norm http://tektitesource.com --- ken newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Norm and others, Thanks for your reply. The photos do not show up well in the little ebay viewer so here are three urls. http://i7.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/94/59/e4ce_3.JPG http://i2.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/94/59/e233_3.JPG http://i1.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/94/6b/a18e_3.JPG I asked about a streak test, Mr. Rank replied: No, I did not do a streak test, but I did one just now per your request. The finding is negative for any color whatsoever--no blacks, rust, hematitic, ochre, or yellows present. Thank you for the interest. Very curious reply (in my opinion) when looking at the red interior of the photos. Best, Ken Norm Lehrman wrote: Ken and all, How embarassing for geologists everywhere and another general downer for serious meteorite people. This stuff is frustrating and sad. I hate seeing people ripped off. My bristles go up everytime someone says: I know it's real 'cause I had a geologist look at it--- As a career practicing geologist with over 10-years college-level teaching on the side, I can assure you that most geology curricula do not include ANY significant training or information regarding meteorites, much less, their identification. It is true that we geologists see a lot of earth rocks and are in a generally advantageous position to recognize something out of the ordinary when we see it, but I have described to this list before that in well-intentioned nievete, I used to pass around some fine SLAG pieces as examples of meteorites. Everyone, please be advised that, in general, professional geologists and geological academicians know less about meteorites than list members! Anyone reading this has been exposed to more meteorite information on this list than any geologist gets in multi-degree training unless they are involved in a course of study specifically involving meteorites! Cheers, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) --- ken newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Check out this professional geologist's 'Ureilite meteorite with diamonds.' http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=300094532355 (see question at bottom also, the 'professional geologist' info is found on his 'me' page) Does the cut face of this 'non magnetic meteorite' look like ordinary hematite to anyone else? As far as the obvious entry FUSION coating, remember this? http://home.earthlink.net/~wrongs/auctions/2255992757.htm Follow-up: http://home.earthlink.net/~meteorwrong/auctions/2260392588.htm Continuously amazed, Ken Newton http://home.earthlink.net/~magellon/updates.html __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] CALIFORNIA-REGISTERED PROFESSIONAL GEOLOGIST - Final
Ken, Congrats to you for pursuing this to a conclusion. They aren't always this receptive to dissenting opinions. Once in a while, it works, and helps to restore a bit of our confidence. Thanks, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- ken newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Norm and others, I asked Mr. Rant to examine the specimen for growth rings. He replied: Due to the interest by others and the quandary it presents (experts are puzzled!) I have removed the item from eBay until a qualified expert evaluates the stone. It never occurred to me that a local petrified wood expert lives four houses down from me. I called him up and asked if he would give me his professional opinion to a problem stone in my possession. I just returned from a visit with him. He not only instantly recognized this specimen as petrified wood but was able to give a close approximation of the type of hardwood it was. He believes my specimen is from American Chestnut or Giant Chinkapin. He described the cell structures as the reasons why he believes that is what it is. I asked him if there was any doubt whatsoever in his opinion, even one or two percent doubt. Zero doubt--it is petrified wood with 100 percent certainty! The only doubt is the type of tree; could certainly be wrong in that area of his opinion. So, you were persistent and hung in there. Thank you so much for helping me with this auction. I will relay similar information to those others who were also puzzled. I was totally fooled on this one, which will make me more aware next time. I will stick to selling what I am more comfortable with from now on--you know, stuff with a label on it. :-) Best regards, Kenneth Rank Norm, Thanks for solving this and restoring the credibility of geologist worldwide (or until the next non-List geologist deems an obvious 'wrong' to be a genuine meteorite :) Best, ken Norm Lehrman wrote: Ken and list, This image: http://i7.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/94/59/e4ce_3.JPG looks highly silicous, which could explain the lack of streak. Am I imagining it, or can you detect some concentric banding, convex towards the upper left (opposite the saw marks)? If that's real, this may well be petrified wood! Surely the seller would've recognized that--- Norm http://tektitesource.com --- ken newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Norm and others, Thanks for your reply. The photos do not show up well in the little ebay viewer so here are three urls. http://i7.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/94/59/e4ce_3.JPG http://i2.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/94/59/e233_3.JPG http://i1.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/94/6b/a18e_3.JPG I asked about a streak test, Mr. Rank replied: No, I did not do a streak test, but I did one just now per your request. The finding is negative for any color whatsoever--no blacks, rust, hematitic, ochre, or yellows present. Thank you for the interest. Very curious reply (in my opinion) when looking at the red interior of the photos. Best, Ken Norm Lehrman wrote: Ken and all, How embarassing for geologists everywhere and another general downer for serious meteorite people. This stuff is frustrating and sad. I hate seeing people ripped off. My bristles go up everytime someone says: I know it's real 'cause I had a geologist look at it--- As a career practicing geologist with over 10-years college-level teaching on the side, I can assure you that most geology curricula do not include ANY significant training or information regarding meteorites, much less, their identification. It is true that we geologists see a lot of earth rocks and are in a generally advantageous position to recognize something out of the ordinary when we see it, but I have described to this list before that in well-intentioned nievete, I used to pass around some fine SLAG pieces as examples of meteorites. Everyone, please be advised that, in general, professional geologists and geological academicians know less about meteorites than list members! Anyone reading this has been exposed to more meteorite information on this list than any geologist gets in multi-degree training unless they are involved in a course of study specifically involving meteorites! Cheers, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) --- ken newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Check out this professional geologist's 'Ureilite meteorite with diamonds.' === message truncated === __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Delay and porphyritic
Armando , Bernd, all, Porphyritic is a textural term. In terrestrial igneous rocks it results from multiple-stage cooling, but I see no reason why you can't run it backwards with incomplete melting. If olivine is the common phenocryst phase, this would make sense in that it has an extremely high melting point. The glass would reflect the lower melting point silicates, while the olivine and magnetite remain, yielding a porphyritic texture. Cheers, Norm (http://TektiteSource.com) --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What can be the reason for this messages to appear with a delay of 32h? AA porphyritic? Are you sure? The meteorites cool down in a single stage, I believe Hi Armando and List, No idea why there is such a delay! Furthermore, I do not know for sure about the porphyritic thing. This was not my personal comment but I only quoted from the article by Genge and Monica Grady. But Dr. Monica Grady is a List member, so, time permitting, Dr. Grady might perhaps find some spare moments to answer your question much more competently than I ever would be able to! Best wishes, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Not and Idea for list to think about - Thanks for the feedback!
Gary, I've been on the road and am a little late, but I'll add another vote: You are Wy off base. Just relax, get to know everybody, and listen more than you talk. This time, you're not a scapegoat. You're just getting very well earned strong reactions--- Paul and Jim were offering other's sales on [their] site free of charge before you touched your first meteorite if I'm not mistaken. Cheers, Norm --- Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Apparently nobody has noticed my attempts to offer other's sales on my site - free of charge. So, am I the scapegpoat of the week? Looks like... So much for offering opinions that were asked for. See ya! Gary So that would be a no then!! Lol And no, I don't think it's attempt to make more $$ either - I also find it really annoying having to spend hours on ebay trawling through hundreds of 1g campos, rusty fake nantans, meteorite dog statues, meteorite caravans, meteorite deep impact movie DVD's meteorite lamps, meteorite jewelry etc etc, I think if everyone on this list (most of whom don't sell things like the meteorite caravans or cosmetics etc!) put a * or a standard letter code somewhere in their auction it would allow people to cut down on the 'dross' when an ebay search is done... And of course people can always still search for 'meteorite' if they want a full search! Best Mark Ford -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 15 March 2007 16:04 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Not and Idea for list to think about - Thanks for the feedback! Hi Gary, Paul and Jim are the best! These guys spend a lot of time helping the meteorite community. Without their dedication and time, this list and meteorite community would not be where it is today. Sonny -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 6:04 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Not and Idea for list to think about - Thanks for the feedback! Does this strike anyone else as an attempt to help a commercial site make more $$$ by streamlining their output at your expense? Gary If all the meteorite-lists Sellers added the same code (example ML1947) in the title of all their auctions then all of the Buyers could search using that code and eliminate the junk. On our page visitors would have a choice of All ebay Sellers or Meteorite-List Sellers and would not have to remember any code. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Question: Just How ...?
Robert and all, My story is a little twisted and includes some good educational insights. As a field geologist, I saw everyone's curiosity rocks. I skipped work to go visit meteorite (wannabe) craters that suddenly appeared in fields. My first quality meteorwrong was a big hunk of the infamous Montana elk hunter find, reputedly miles from nowhere, packed out on horseback, and ultimately given to me. It turned out to be cohenite, an iron carbide, that had actually been reported in meteorites but not known to occur naturally on earth. For years, I was pretty sure it was a winner. Bit by bit, my suspicions grew ( in sync with slowly growing meteorite knowledge--). Skipping to the conclusion, I am now sure it is industrial slag. The next very good meteorwrong came at a gold show. A gold dredger had found a bunch of metal fragments in the Clackamas river in Oregon and was selling them by the piece. He assured me that the main mass had been given to the Smithsonian. I was teaching at the community college level at the time, and wanted some pieces to pass around. I sorted through the pile and picked out a couple with nice rounded shoulders with molten spatters down the sides. They still look really good! And lots of people still remember them as the first piece of deep space/deep time that they have ever held in their hands. I'm now sure that they are also slag. Don't assume your professor knows meteorites from bat guano! Finally, I had gotten going on tektites and hit the big Tucson show. I knew Eric Olsen from emails, and got to meet him. I asked him to recommend a good stony meteorite to help me calibrate my eye, and he sold me a fine little fully crusted Gao, which I still have, my first meteorRight! I bought a bunch more NWAs on that trip, and on the strength of those calibration tools, I finally found my first for sure, no doubt about it meteorite. Thanks for the memories, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) --- Robert Woolard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello List, There was a lot of interest and positive comments on the thread concerning whether or not members still had their first meteorite. I'd like to ask a related question that I think might be interesting. The question is: How did you find out that it was possible to actually BUY a meteorite!? I will list the most likely ways that come to my mind (doubtless there will be others) in no particular order: 1.Magazine AD (such as Astronomy or Sky Telescope) 2.Magazine ARTICLE about collecting meteorites 3.Catalog offering meteorites for sale 4.Internet browsing and accidentally came across 5.TV program, featuring Haag, Farmer, etc. 6.Friend was a collector and got you hooked, too 7.You are a mineral collector, led to meteorites 9.You are a fossil collector, led to meteorites 10.Auction listed meteorites up for bid 11.Other OK, that's about all the ways I can think of right off hand. I hope that the question is of interest. And by the way, MY answer would be #5 above, as I saw a VERY young Robert Haag on the David Letterman show WAY back in 1986. I was thrilled to see that here was a guy who was actually making it possible for me to buy my very own meteorite! I called directory assistance the very next day, got Robert's telephone number, called him, ordered 10 specimens, and what a ride it has been since!! Best wishes, Robert Woolard 8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] HELP ! and, Who's still got their first meteorite?
Jerry, A superb and exemplary contribution to the list! A great story, informative, and exactly on-topic. The links were a great touch. Thanks and well done. I still have my first (central Nevada) find, and will be keeping it till my last rock moves on. It likely will be the last rock to go. (No small thing for a career exploration geologist with thousands of specimens!). Most of you have seen it, but for any that haven't, the story, with photos, is on our website at http://tektitesource.com/First%20Meteorite.html I may be slow. It took over 30 years in the field with a reasonably trained eye for the unusual before I plucked number one from the ground with trembling hands. Now, my best single day stands at 49 pieces (I stopped at 50, but one flunked closer inspection-). Regards, Norm --- Jerry A. Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Kevin, List, That brings to mind a fond memory. It was in the late winter of '57 and the sun was barely beginning its work day in West Texas by starting to illuminate the landscape through the cold, gray, dismal, misty, low overcast morning. I was with my mineralogical mentor on yet another trip to raid the agate beds at Marfa, Texas. I was in the seventh grade at that time, so I was probably still about 13, and an eager learner about anything mineralogical. My good friend, Mr. V. C. Wiggins (a former mayor of Odessa in the '30's) had promised me for several months that he would take me to the Odessa meteorite crater some day, and this was the day. Mr. Wiggins at that time had the one and only rock shop in Odessa and it was conveniently located only a half block from the Junior High School I attended. Needless to say, most of my brown bag lunches were eaten in his shop. Then, too, he had to push me out the door in the evenings so he could close and go home. He was a fine gentleman that I will always miss. We bounced down the narrow fence line dirt road for miles in Mr. Wiggins old '51 Buick until we finally arrived at what appeared to be a large muddy hump in the otherwise flat landscape. He parked with his headlights aimed at the geological anomaly and proudly exclaimed, That's it! I'm not sure what I was expecting, but I do recall being sorely disappointed in the sight. That's just another example of reality rarely meeting expectations. But what the heck, I was thrilled to be there. I took off at a dead run up the muddy slope, promptly slipped and found myself rolling back down the muddy slope. I'm sure Mr. Wiggins was both amused and somewhat wary at the thought of me getting back into his Buick as a mud blob. We worked that out later with old newspapers from his trunk. Once inside the floor of the crater, I was advised about more of the crater's history and given a mental picture of what I should be looking for. In the excitement of finally being there, I had forgotten to bring my rock pick or flashlight from the car. So I took off across the crater floor kicking at muddy lumps. All but one of those lumps turned out to be caliche. This one piece that wasn't caliche I took over to Mr.Wiggins for identification. It was about seven inches long by three inches wide with tapered ends. Turns out that it was indeed a part of the meteorite. A very rusty, crumbly part of the old meteorite, but it was mine. I then moved to the southern side of the crater and began clawing away at it with a broken branch of old mesquite. After sifting through the muck with my cold fingers I found a small black piece of something that obviously wasn't the prevalent caliche. Another fast run over to the expert and I got the good news that this was a keeper. I turned to resume my muckraking for more keepers but was cut short by the order to return to the Buick so we could get on with the business of the day which was to extract as much of that fine Marfa agate as humanly possible and still get back to Odessa without the expense of spending the night on the road somewhere. As was typical of our agate hunting trips, despite our best intentions of leaving the hunting area earlier so as to get home earlier, we left well after dark for the three hour trip back to Odessa. We bounced along with a trunk and rear floorboard full of the prized agate, and my two pieces of the Odessa meteorite. As usual, the headlights of the Buick were pointlessly pointed towards the stars. That always made our trips more exciting by only having a faint glow of light on the highway. So, to keep this short (HA), yes, I still have my first pieces of the fabulous Odessa meteorite. Wouldn't trade them for Mr. Arnold's new Brenham. Well, maybe the shale piece. The solid piece that I recovered weighed in at 2.1g. Never weighed the rust. I surely had one of the prized specimens that Prof. Ninninger and the earlier hunters missed. The crater is
Re: [meteorite-list] the price per gram of tatahouine
Mark list, Tatahouine is an exception to the bigger costs less per gram pattern. Due to the large crystal size in this material and the well-developed cleavages of pyroxene, Tatahouine shattered when it hit the atmosphere. Small bits dominate, biggerr pieces are rare. As a consequence, there is a sliding price scale for Tatahouine, with a premium for over 5 gms, more of a premium over 8 grams, more yet over 10, etc. The curve rises quickly! Cheers, Norm --- mark ford [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Steve, I think you'll find it usually works the other way a lower$/g for larger pieces and Higher $/g for smaller (Otherwise there would be no reason for anyone to cut rocks into smaller pieces, and that would make a main mass worth less than the total cost of the cut pieces!). Mark. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of steve arnold Sent: 27 February 2007 00:54 To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] the price per gram of tatahouine Good evening list.I was wondering what is the going price of tatahouine?I heard from one dealer who said it was going for between $10 to $15 per gram.I think that would be for the pieces under 10 grams.Then I have heard as high up as $55 per gram.Of course that would be for the larger ones.I would like to know. steve Steve R.Arnold,chicago,Ill,Usa!! Collecting Meteorites since 06/19/1999!! www.chicagometeorites.net Ebay I.D. Illinoismeteorites TV dinner still cooling? Check out Tonight's Picks on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Eastern Oregon Meteorite on Ebay
Mike all, That did look like a winner, but too bad about the crumby documentation. The seller didn't seem very interested in providing anything but platitudes. The caliche crusts were right for eastern Oregon. Cheers, Norm --- Mike Fowler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi List, Did any of you see this meteorite on ebay? 23 oz sold for $1026 to peterutas. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=200077988565 I bid, but not that much. Mike Fowler Chicago ebay--starsandrocks __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Eastern Oregon Meteorite on Ebay
Martin, For an extra thousand dollars, rocks in Arizona could crawl to Oregon! Maybe this is the beginning of a migration! Regards, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Martin Altmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But how did that Canyon Diablo found its way to Oregon?? Buckleboo! -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Norm Lehrman Gesendet: Samstag, 17. Februar 2007 23:11 An: Mike Fowler; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Cc: Mike Fowler Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Eastern Oregon Meteorite on Ebay Mike all, That did look like a winner, but too bad about the crumby documentation. The seller didn't seem very interested in providing anything but platitudes. The caliche crusts were right for eastern Oregon. Cheers, Norm --- Mike Fowler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi List, Did any of you see this meteorite on ebay? 23 oz sold for $1026 to peterutas. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=200077988565 I bid, but not that much. Mike Fowler Chicago ebay--starsandrocks __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] you really never know what you have, till you really look at it
Gang, It'll be fun to see who can type fastest when it is posted with a $0.01 Buy-it-now!! Regarding the fusion crust, I have been shopping for a nice Tatahouine, and I have been surprised at how many little fragments actually do have tiny patches of fusion crust. It's mostly at a hand-lens scale, but more often than not, there is a bit present. Cheers (and fast typing!) Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Howard Steffic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Steve Great Specimen. Be sure and give us all a heads up when you put it on ebay. Thanks dude.. Howard Steffic From: steve arnold [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] you really never know what you have,till you really look at it Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:28:00 -0800 (PST) Good evening list.After finally taking time to really look at my new 62 gram tatahouine,I see it is covered with 50% black fusion crust.It is simply amazing.I have seen many sizes of tatahouine in the last 5 years,but NEVER have I seen a beaut with this much fusion crust.I think I got a GREAT DEAL and somehow this one just got away.I wish my camera could take real close up's of this beauty,but the one on my website will have to do for now.This piece is just amazing.Oh and please ignore the last post.That one got away from me. steve arnold Steve R.Arnold,chicago,Ill,Usa!! Collecting Meteorites since 06/19/1999!! www.chicagometeorites.net Ebay I.D. Illinoismeteorites Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list _ Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Sharing a positive
List, Just a brief note to temper recent topics. I made a deal a while back to trade for a tektite from a deep jungle location. My contact had never attempted an international shipment before, so I agreed to send my part of the trade first. Both of us were nervous whether it would make it through the mail. Finally, it did. Today I received the following: Im very happy right now because the meteorite and meteoritic glasses have been arrived this saturday. I will send the tektite and some unknown material that chapadmalal-like material. Im in hurry to send the items to you this day.. Thanks 'cause made me happy! (name) This note made me happy too, so I thought I'd pass it along. Newbies might wonder about some of the negative emotions visible on the list from time to time, but there's some heart-warming good stuff that more than makes up for it. Along that line, part of the fun of Tucson is shaking hands with people we know from the list but are meeting face to face for the first time. This is a very unique community! Thanks to all! Cheers, Norm (http://TektiteSource.com) __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Hunting with a magnet; suspect stones; meteorwrongs; and ramblings.
Rockbiter list, I enjoyed your write-up. I've always viewed the magnet as a tool to test things seen by the eye rather than a collecting tool, but you've made your point well. Recently en route to Tucson, I spent a day in the Arizona desert. There are rainwater collection and dispensing systems out there for wildlife (guzzlers), and these include large concrete aprons to collect the rain. In one of these I noted a few gallons of particulates collected in a sediment trap at the bottom, so I ran a magnet through this material. In this magnetic fraction were dozens of tiny metallic to glassy spheres. It seemed to good to be true. While it WAS what I was hoping to see, it was just too easy. There had been some welding in the area building tanks and fences, so I'm concerned that some or all of these sphereoids might be particulates from the welding. Have you found such things away from civilization? Secondly, you said: How about a rock that looks like chrome when you grind off a small spot and polish it a little but it is totally not magnetic. You can't make it leave a streak, it never rusts and is very hard. I have not found but one piece of whatever it is and am glad to have that one to study even though it is not a meteorite. Believe me, I have researched this one and although I have my suspicions about it being Hematite, I still am not positive about it. For sure it is not hematite. Hematite has the most distinctive streak in the mineral kingdom (rusty vermillion red even when the hematite is bright and metallic as a silver mirror). I am confused how you collected it with a magnet if it is absolutely not attracted to a magnet. Whatever the case, there are lots of hard, silver minerals not attracted to a magnet, A good bet would be ilmenite. Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Michael Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been hunting meteorites with supermagnets for a little over four years now. As I am sure everyone knows, when you drag a magnet you pick up all sorts of stuff including a lot of magnetite, at least here where I hunt you do. If you're interested in this type of hunting, here is how I deal with all the metal junk, the magnetite and the small stones. I clean the magnet off into a gold pan. I then screen it all through a very fine screen to remove the magnetite particles. I dump the stuff left in the screen back into the pan and I add water with a drop of dish soap and wash. I use a swirl and dump motion to get rid of the dirt and trash only. I usually repeat this process with clean water at least a couple time until the water remains fairly clean. I pass a magnet (not a supermagnet) over the stones at about 1/2 to 3/4 above and pull out all the bits of metal and examine them somewhat closely before getting rid of those pieces. Don't want to inadvertently pick up a suspect stone and through it out with the scrap.Now to have a look at all the little stones left. I will leave just a small amount of water in the pan with the material so that I can still swirl the contents if I want. Then I take it outside in the sunlight and take my first look. If I don't see anything right away that gets my attention, I'll drain all the water off and let the contents of the pan dry completely. Usually I just leave it sit for a day or so. So when it is dry, I take the pan in and put it under my mscope and go through the contents with close scrutiny. Sometimes, I have even done this when the contents were still wet. Anyway, if I see something that sticks out as unusual and interesting, I pick it out and take a closer look. One quick way to separate the magnetic stones is to place a strong magnet on the underside of the pan then swirl the rocks for a bit over the area where the magnet is located. All the strongly magnetic rocks will collect in one spot. Then just take the magnet over them from above and lift them out. This lets you get down to taking a look at the magnetic rocks in a hurry if you so wish. I realize none of this is very scientific. It's a hobby for me and gives me something relaxing to do in my spare time and I get exercise from the walks. The thrill in it all comes when I actually have something of extraterrestrial origin to look at and hold in my hand. Then I also get a lot more enjoyment out of studying the suspect rock to find out what it could be. After you have been through about a five gallon bucket full of these pea-size rocks you have a real good feel for what is a suspect meteorite or is actually a terrestrial stone (I guess you could call some of these meteorwrongs). I have studied the many, many, many little meteorwrongs to a fairthywell. To have a good meteorwrong to study can be a good learning tool. I have a collection of small rocks that I keep
Re: [meteorite-list] On Stretch Tektites
Ma Lan List, Stretch tektites are specimens that partly broke and bent after the skin had become brittle, but while the interior was still semi-molten and taffy-like. As commonly used, the term does not include starburst-ray skin splits even though their interpretation and significance is essentially identical. To fit common usage, a stretch tektite involves a triangular skin split associated with an equivalent angular bend in the long axis of the specimen. The material exposed within the split shows a plastic, stretched character, like pulled taffy. Nininger was first to publish on this subject, describing two bent teardrops from Vietnam. They are of special interest with respect to the debate on the origins of skin pitting in Indochinites. Nininger argued that the fact that the brittle part of the skin shows pitting, but the stretched plastic part does not (or very,very little), implies that the pitting predated the skin split. Since the skin split happened while the specimen was still mostly molten, the ornamentation disrupted by the split must have developed in the first few minutes of the tektite's journey. Conversely, the stretched part has experienced a few minutes less exposure to soil acids than the brittle skin. Say the brittle part is 780,000 years old. That's about 409,968,000,000 minutes. The stretched part is only about 409,967,999,995 minutes old. Could that difference in length of exposure to soil acids account for the observed difference in ornamentation? I would guess the total number in collections as a few dozen, but it is clear that they are more abundant than that would suggest. Cookie and I have found four good ones in the process of handling a few hundred thousand tektites, so the abundance is on the order of 1 in 100,000. I can't be sure about your specimen. In the photos I don't see a bend in the overall specimen matching the skin gaps. The gaps or saw cuts in some deeply ornamented specimens are due to ablation or terrestrial corrosion and do not involve plastic skin-splits. Unless there is an angulation in the specimen matching a triangular skin split, it is not a stretch tektite per common usage of the term. The most commonly confused tektite feature is what I call the starburst ray skin split that results from point impact while the specimen is still plastic inside. The difference is purely semantic. But ultimately, common usage dictates the definition of a word, and by this, starburst rays are not stretch tektites. There is a page on our website that discusses and illustrates stretch tektites. Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Email from Chinaren76 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi listees, On tektites, especially unusual tektites, for example, stretch tektites, i have several questions. 1. what's the definition of stretch tektites from the points of science? 2. How were the stretch tektites created? 3. How many are there the known stretch tektites found by meteorite/tektite collectors nowdays? In addition, i found one piece of tektite, with characteristics very similar to that of stretch-types, but i'm not sure. Please view photos from the link below: http://www.esnips.com/web/TektitefromChina 4. Is this piece a stretch one? Any tips will be deeply appreciated. Regards Miss Ma Lan Beijng, China The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Tucson Finds
Gang, I just posted a page on our website with pics of some of our Tucson acquisitions that will be of interest to some of you. Its biased towards tektites, but includes some NWAs and a Sikhote. Be sure to check out the little shatter cone we found in a box of NWAs. http://tektitesource.com/Tucson2007.htm There's a bit of verbiage regarding the supply-side status and pricing included. There are some very noticeable changes this year. Libyan Desert glass and Besednice moldavites were in short supply and mostly inferior quality. I saw two Aussie flanged buttons at an asking price of $2300 or $2500 each. No Billitons, Malaysians, Borneos, Ivory Coasts, Javans, Tibetans, Georgians, or Bediasites that I saw. Only a handful of Rizalites. One dealer had a couple of little Wabars and Irghizites. I saw one small lot each of Aouelloul, Darwin, and Monturaqui. Still good supplies of Indochinites. With the Moroccans, unclassified NWA stoneys were in greatly diminished abundance and general quality. I turned down one lot at $25/kg, and if they had been free I would've picked out one or two bits and left the rest! There was still some good stuff though(see pictures). One guy had three big stoneys over 25 kilos each. There were about half as many Sikhotes as last year, and bullets are now individually specimen priced. Last year I bought them by weight. I'll leave commentary regarding the fancier meteorites for those who know them better. Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] First Cold find for 2007
Sonny, Waaay to go!!! Regards, Norm (http://TektiteSource.com --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, After spending about two hours of hunting I found a 34 gram fragment from an old weathered chondrite. The magnet jumped to it like a piece of steel. I spent about an hour walking around looking for the rest of the meteorite. From the looks of the fragment and surface that I was hunting it could not be too far. I decided to try the metal detector on the fragment, it was a real loud signal. Within minutes I found 4 more pieces 34,17,135 grams. All of the fragments were buried a couple inches deep. I had a loud signal about 6' from the first target. I started digging, the first 10 was hard dirt with fist sized rocks. The signal got louder and I thought it must have been a hot rock in the hole. Four more inches down under some more rocks was a 2.65lb chunk of meteorite. None of the smaller pieces fit onto the large meteorite. The chunk looks like a third of the meteorite.The fragments all look the same, my guess it is all from the same meteorite. I will have to bring a shovel and dig the hole deeper. The meteorite looks like it is a OC . The total weight so far is 3.16 lbs. The meteorite is from a new area with no previous finds in Nevada. I will post some pictures next week. Sonny Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite List- Polite Request
Gary Foote, Just in case you don't get it, this is about you. You are spamming the list. Real questions? Great. Informative answers? Even better. Chit-chat? Fine, OFF list. There are over 600 of us. What if everyone posts something without content to every post? We do appreciate your enthusiasm. Don't destroy that. Mike and Mike, you are gentle souls and have been kind. Sometimes it has to be more direct. Thanks, Norm --- Mike Bandli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been thinking the same thing Mike, but have been hesitant to post anything with the fear of starting another flame war. It seems that some posts should not be 'Reply to all.' Not pointing fingers... just a little constructive criticism to free up the delete button. Kind regards, Mike Bandli -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Groetz Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:08 PM To: Meteorite List Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite List- Polite Request Hi Everyone- I don't know how the rest of you feel about it- but may I politely ask that when some of you have maybe 10 word personal responses to emails- please do not copy the entire meteorite list. I am still on dial up (can't get DSL, etc.. in my area yet) which I know is MY problem. But I wait for messages to open responding to an interesting meteorite subject only to find it is a few words between a couple list members that are irrelevent to others in the entire meteorite list. OK- I'll be quiet. I hope all of you had a good weekend and a good week coming up. Thanks for hearing me out. Take care Mike Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Close-up New Jersey Object
Thanks for the better picture Adam. From the random abrasions and percussion pits, it looks like a fragment from some heavy equipment part that self destructed, then got run over for a few months on a hard surface. How it came to fall out of the sky is a mystery though. Maybe it got stuck in the tire tread of an airplane--- Cheers/Happy new orbit to all Norm --- Adam Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here is a close-up of the New Jersey object: http://themeteoritesite.com/Jersey.jpg Best Regards, Adam __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] tips on transporting meteorites.
Graham, With heightened airport security, you may have trouble with carry-ons. I tried bringing a couple of good sized Campo del Cielo irons in that way. No problems in Argentina or Chile, but when I hit the USA they caused great consternation. The security screeners couldn't find anything about meteorites in their reference manuals, but they finally decided that big lumps of iron were dangerous weapons, and forced me to check them (which became my third piece of checked luggage and cost an additional $80!). Good luck! Norm http://tektitesource.com --- ensoramanda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everyone, We have now booked our flights to go to the Tucson show..so will be definately there. So now for a question to all you well travelled hunters and dealers. Now supposing I buy up several amazing specimens at the show :-) ...does anyone have any tips about transporting them back to the UK. Would it be best to ship themor it seems more sensible to bring them back on the plane...but what are the snags of carrying meteorites in luggage across the atlantic or within the USA...eg in stowed or hand luggage? What are the regulations? Any tips most welcomeand thanks already to all those who have helped me so far with planning my visit. Graham Ensor Near Barwell UK __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] More California Meteorite Finds!
Ruben, Congratulations on a truly amazing couple of weeks!! Most collectors dream of finding ONE in their lifetime. It is inspiring to see what can happen when you get out there with enough knowledge to recognize a keeper when you see it. Make no mistake, it's not easy, but when preparation and circumstance meet, the face of the earth is a compound strewn field! Cheers, Norm --- Ruben Garcia [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, Here's some recent California Meteorite Finds. http://www.mr-meteorite.com/californiafindspart2.htm The prior weeks finds: http://www.mr-meteorite.com/californiafindspart1.htm Ruben Garcia Ruben Garcia Phoenix, Arizona http://www.mr-meteorite.com Want to start your own business? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/r-index __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites????
Michael, Nothing in your photos looks remotely suspicious. Most look to be stream-rounded quartzite pebbles. Disseminated magnetite is the likely culprit. Some of today's magnets are just too good. I've put away my big hard-drive monster that will pull nails out of fences and opted for a small telescoping neodymium magnet. Still very strong, but it produces a better contrast between meteorites and wannabes. Like Chris said in another reply to your post, with a monster magnet it is not uncommon to find areas where nearly everything gives a response. I've seen places in Arizona with nuggets of pure magnetite. One thing that will usually help is to check the streak color (rub the specimen against unglazed porcelain or give it a stroke on your diamond hone). Most of the winners will give a rust red-brown powder (and so will some losers), while magnetite will give a black streak and a lot of the common wannabes will give slate gray. Good luck, Norm (http://TektiteSource.com) --- Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm new to hunting for meteorites. I found a magnetic rock and from what I understand this could be a meteorite but I would like some input from y'all. Go to http://www.ladyofgreys.org/meteorites.htm and please let me know if there is another explanation for a rock being magnetic and so on Help is greytly appreciated. Michael The Krachen http://www.ladyofgreys.org - Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Ebay is ripping everybody off at least once! (OT)
Johnny, Moody Blues, circa 1969: First Man: I think, I think I am, therefore I am, I think. Establishment: Of course you are my bright little star, I've miles And miles Of files Pretty files of your forefather's fruit and now to suit our great computer, You're magnetic ink. First Man: I'm more than that, I know I am, at least, I think I must be. (End quote) I always find it exhilirating when I realize that the cosmos is fiddling with the whole fabric of reality just to get at me. There's a real sense of significance in all that. And for Ebay to mess with their whole search engine just for you? What can I say? You are truly honored. Regards, Norm --- Johnny Rieben [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Darren, I just sent an email a while ago stating why ebay would do this. 1. they are protecting the limited server space for bigger sales 2. they raised store and listing fees saying it 'was costing them more in hosting than it was worth'.(a clue) 3. they are a monopoly and do not care about the little guys. Everyone thinks eBay would never turn down money but I say they wouldin exchange for BIGGER money! P.S. I do sing it...I also shout it and scream it! Regards, Johnny - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Johnny Rieben [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 5:21 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ebay is ripping everybody off at least once! (OT) On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 17:14:33 -0600, you wrote: guys because of 'server issues'. They arent trying to get rich off of this they are trying to protect the server space of higher paying customers! But the way to become a higher paying customer is to have more people see and bid on your auctions. Intentionally making people get low closing costs doesn't make sense in that context. amounts of money than mine. I say RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE!!! But do you sing it? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qqb-D8fcFw __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Seeking Knowledge and Dealing with Meteorwrong Owners was Classification Q
Elton and all, Well said. I too have been holding back on this subject, but I agree strongly that to send a certain meteor-wrong in to be examined by our small and over-taxed group of classifiers is unconscionable. The vision rock is a nice rock and has value as a landscape boulder. Most of the typical cost for such boulders is associated with their transport costs. I agree with Elton: why in the world would anyone assume that this rock has any value beyond that? Gary, please rethink the idea of wasting the time of any reputable lab. You are being a nice guy and are very charitable towards a scam artist. They all seem sincere. That's how their business works. It is wrong to represent such a rock as a meteorite, let alone a Martian. These guys hurt the credibility of the entire meteorite community. Deep enough, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- E J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Gary, Pete, List I've held back discussing this again as I am not the one on the vision quest. However, you've raised the issue of getting this classified aka lab tested--at a meteorite lab amongst other things. You think he can sell this for a sum and rebuild his failing ministry. He'll make more in bake sales. For Pete's sake...and mine , please tell us why you remain convinced that this is valuable specimen beyond a that of landscaping boulder? Interesting doesn't equate to rare and valuable. If it were, my collection would be worth millions. I also want to say I loathe going out on a limb especially working with photographs--there will always be someone near by with pruning shears and they have a long memory for when you made a bad call. Old Man's ambush of the whipper snapper: There are 3 straight up reasons not requiring lab work that show this can't be a Martian meteorite-- name one? How to Beef Up your Knowledge Base: In a nut shell, a way to improve your identification knowledge is to get out and see all the rocks you can, So when one does come up that you haven't seen before, you'll have a better basis to judge if it is rare or if it is just interesting. Additionally: read, read, read. Google is your friend. Get Norton's Cambridge Encyclopedia of Meteorites and McSween's Meteorites and their Parent Bodies Read them three times. Study your own collection, practice describing each specimen to your self. Advice from the Good Ole Boy Girl Network: As far as seeking classification(?) Trust me on this , your credibility is on the line every time you refer a specimen for meteorite identification and that credibility slips down the toilet when you send in an obvious meteorwrong. The way I see it is, you owe a duty to the astro-geologist you contact to not waste his/her time. If you do a field accessment and are unable to eliminate/ exclude an object as a meteorite, only then do you start considering recommending it to a meteorite lab and that only after you've floated it to your other colleagues for their input. If you hold yourself out as a meteorite expert then you better be able to back it up with several the reasons it is not likely a meteorite or these meteorwrong owners will eat your lunch and send you packing with your tail twixed your legs--Because you did not confirm their rock as a meteorite--They obviously know more than you do!. I re-learn the following lesson each day: You should not interfere with another's right to remain ignorant. No matter how much wishing, hoping, or praying it isn't going to turn this water into wine. No matter how sincere you believe this pastor is--his hidden agenda is to keep this dream alive until he can explain it away and face the reality that this was not a God send. I assure you it has nothing to do with mineralogy. Some churches die on the vine for good reasons! Check out Luke's Gospel?--it has been a while since I did any church preaching. I feel for you but your Dutch Uncle would likely advise you to get away from this situation as soon as you can extract yourself honoring whatever commitments you've made. Read what Randy Korotev has to say after dealing with 1000's of meteorwrong owners http://epsc.wustl.edu/admin/resources/meteorites/what_to_do.html The Quest New Hampshire isn't a large state(nor is Vermont ) and seems you would have scoured the state by now if not in person via google. Google the Chlorite mineral group (esp. Clinochlore) and the rock types greenschist , blueschist, and syenite. (See the links way below) I only have state for location, cursory description and photos(needing a reference object--coin, ruler, etc.) which you've taken down to go on. The new photo makes me go back to Actenolite-Tremolite as I can see large crystals and to me this looks like other occurrences I have seen. The flaky granules point to Clinochlore or any of several Chlorite group minerals. I think this rock is not
Re: [meteorite-list] RE: Self-Proclaimed Pairing Issues
Thomas, Take heart. Almost a year? Try never. The last piece I sent to UCLA they claim to never have received even though people visiting the lab asked about it and were told probable preliminary classifications. Now they want a second piece? Can anyone help me get the kick me sticker off my back? I don't know where the problem might be. US mail? UCLA mailroom? Met lab? I suspect the mail room. Packages going to this department might have valuable rocks. But that doesn't explain the verbal communications suggesting the material was in process. Lesson: if you can find a way, have your material hand carried into the hands of a respected scientist by someone who can vouch that it was delivered. I am very disheartened by the whole experience. Maybe you get what you pay for. It appears I did. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Thomas Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: List Members, There are a few people who seemingly are able to get meteorites classified in a matter of weeks. I have been waiting for almost a year now and don't even have a number much less a classification. Is this due to the volume supplied by some and the consequent revenue to the institution or what is the reason for the inequity? I would appreciate some answers to the list on this matter. Thank you, Thomas H. Webb __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: Nevada Meteorite as found IN MATRIX
List, Here's a heads up on something kind of neat. A few days ago I stopped at my favorite central Nevada dry lake and collected several specimens complete with the dessicated lake bed surface in which they were embedded. I just posted the first one to ebay. See it at: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=6624425370 This makes a really interesting display piece and comes with exact find coordinates. If anyone would like a bigger version of this---say a square foot or so of lake surface complete with a meteorite, let me know and I'll try to collect one for you on my next trip out. I'm still experimenting with approaches to stabilizing the material, but water-diluted Elmer's glue seems to work well without any obvious changes in appearance. This could make a really cool framed wall mount! Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] meteorite magnetic polarization?
List, I just received several nice big 0.5 - 1 kg stony NWAs (unclassified). One of them shows distinct magnetic polarity. One face repells the magnet. Is that common? Any particular significance? regards, Norm http://tektitesource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: MetTimes Tektite of the Month specimens posted
List, I've built a new page offering some specimens of the controversial bubble blisters or impact welded tektites featured by Paul Harris in the current Meteorite Times Tektite of the Month column. Be sure to check the MetTimes archive for an earlier column in the March 2003 issue. I have included examples that I think are definitive. Have a look. http://tektitesource.com/Tektite%20Bubble%20blisters.htm Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Meteorite Times tektite of the month
Paul, I tried to send this off list, but the email link doesn't work. With all due respect, you are selling an idea as fact. Ideas are fun and should be unconstrained. But don't present them as done deals. I have dozens of specimens of this sort. They are so uniform that they cannot be the random melding of two tektites. I don't claim to know what they are for sure (and I don't even deny that you could be right, but I don't think so). I have one that is developed on a bubble shard and the convex exterior feature corresponds with a concave interior feature, suggesting it was a bubble about to erupt. This is quite fatal to your interpretation. Tektites are particularly fun because there are still questions like this that even us kids have a shot at solving. But don't foist a simple idea, as fine as it may be, on the believing public as fact. It is a fine idea. And almost surely wrong. Sorry. But if you want to buy a whole bunch of these, let me know! Norm http://tektitesource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks From Space Picture of the Day - April 3, 2006
Susan et al, I agree. And you've gotta give that baby a little credit too! Just kidding, Norm (http://tektitesource.com) --- batkol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i don't think i've ever seen a cuter meteorite on this page . . . . take care susan - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2006 9:01 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks From Space Picture of the Day - April 3, 2006 http://www.spacerocksinc.com/April_3.html __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Any interesting (?) Chinese tektite
Mark list, About five years ago, as Cookie and I were helping our main Chinese supplier unpack at Tucson we found a couple of dozen like you have pictured. The coloration is a surface patina like Carnival Glass. We never determined how it formed, but I have seen similar patinas developed on ghost town glass that has been through a fire. I always suspected that the tektites might have been through a warehouse fire. Others suggested that an overly aggressive acid treatment was used in cleaning, but I've tried a variety of acids over the years and have never seen anything like this happen. Ironically, we were just commenting between us this year that it is strange that we have never seen the phenomena again. Not a single piece. This convinces me we are talking about some non-natural feature. To find 20 or 30 in one crate, then no more in something on the order of 50,000 to 75,000 pieces that we have subsequently sorted certainly provides a clue. I looked into the commercial production of carnival glass, but I don't remember the whole story. Something about sublimation of a metal film on hot glass. If you want to pursue the subject, look into that manufacturing process for more clues. As I recall, I sold all our pieces to a single collector in Texas. We openly expressed our concerns that this was probably not a natural phenomenon. Regards, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- MARK BOSTICK [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello list, Hope everyone is doing well. This may or may not be interesting, as it may or may not be that unusual. However, I have sorted through and sold a lot of tektites over the years and this is the only tektite like it I have seen. A nice average sized dumbell tektite http://www.meteoritearticles.com/coltektitechin76g.html Photographs were taken under white photograph lights in a room with white walls. The color is more obvious in person and was hard to reproduce digitally. On the ends and in the surface dimples, you can see a very striking blue color. The ends also show a little purple color, but more of the blue. Not sure what has caused this colorling. Any thoughts? Clear Skies, Mark Bostick Wichita, Kansas www.meteoritearticles.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] An interesting (?) Chinese tektite
Dirk, As I wrote earlier, I have seen this patina on old ghost town bottles that have been through a fire. There IS some connection. Perhaps the common ground between our comments is that wood ash is strongly alkaline. I remember my grandma leaching ashes to get lye to make soap. Perhaps the accelerated chemical reactions produced by heat combined with the alkaline ash is the key--- Whatever the case, there is an empirical connection with fire. Norm http://tektitesource.com --- drtanuki [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark, Save your time. As I stated earlier this is due to a chemical reaction by perhaps a natural process (alkaline salts) or a man caused chemical process. The devitrification process (a weathering process) is similar that you see on old glass bottles that have been buried or in alkaline salt environments and nothing to do with heat. Please do a google search for more details. Best, Dirk --- MARK BOSTICK [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for your comments Dirk, Kevin and Norm, Norms comments: The coloration is a surface patina like Carnival Glass. is better then mine previous. I imagine it is a man influenced feature. Perhaps I will burn a couple tektites to see what results that creates and try other ways to create the patinawith some of my lower grade tektites of course. Clear Skies, Mark www.meteoritearticles.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Ignored or List Not Working?
Gary, That's just a thin translucent septum. What you are seeing is the normal transmitted light color of most australasians. You can only see it along thin edges or where there's a shallow internal bubble. Regards, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Dirk, This is the best shot of the green ridge I could get. My camera kept wanting to focus on the body of the tektite or on the background. The green ridge is centered longititudinally along the specimen's axis in the middle of a smooth, shiny spot that looks like it may have remained melted for a time after the major portions of the piece solidified. Pic is here; http://www.meteorite-dealers.com/images/green-tektite.jpg Thanks, Gary On 10 Mar 2006 at 8:56, drtanuki wrote: Gary, If you have images of your green edged Indochinte I will gladly give it a look. Depending on the thickness of the glass some appears yellow-green to a blackish-green. Oxides of iron in indochines and other tekties usually produce greens, yellows, yellow greens, brown greens. The missing color for iron oxides in glass are reds and blues. Darryl Futrell once emailed me that he had a sample of a blue impact glass, later we lost contact so the exact location is unknown except Argentina (Patagonia). He claimed that there were 100+ pound masses of it. Messages are coming through but have been busy without sleep for more than 3 days at this moment. Dirk...Tokyo --- Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are my emails coming thru to the list? I seem to be getting ignored. Gary __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cool Fresh Chondrites and Slick-n-Slide
Greg all, Nice specimens. Just a minor side point: the term is slickensides for the striated, movement-polished surface itself, or slickensided for a rock showing slickensides. Your version is a common, but erroneous, transliteration. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Greg Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear List Members, I have been going through the material I brought back from my Morocco trip last week. Here are some photos of some very nice fresh chondrites, an unusual thing these days coming out of Morocco. There are two pictures of some very good examples of Slick-n-Slide also. I have not seen chondrites this nice for a long time out of the Sahara. 4170 gram Large and Fresh Thumb Printed chondrite - VERY COOL !! http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc1.jpg 140 gram Individual - Neat Shape http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc00013.jpg 122.7 gram Slick-n-Slide (Best Example I have Seen for a Long Time) http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc00023.jpg 25.6 gram Slick-n-Slide (Unfortunately broke during airplane ride home) http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc00025.jpg Hope you enjoy the pictures. Best regards, Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) [EMAIL PROTECTED] IMCA 3163 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cool Fresh Chondrites and Slick-n-Slide
Pete list, There are meteorites with slickenside?! It would have to be Martian, then, right? Yes, slickensided meteorites have been discussed several times on the list. But no, they don't have to be planetary. I would only be speculating on the actual limiting conditions, but the parent body just needs to be sufficiently large and cohesive to break and move in frictional contact with the opposing surface a few inches or less. I'm guessing that even in small bodies without enough gravity to hold breaks in frictional contact, the pressures of a hard impact could do the job. I've never really thought about it before, but I can't see any reason why the striated surfaces on Sikhote shrapnel wouldn't be appropriately termed slickensides. The Glossary of Geology gives this definition: A polished and smoothly striated surface that results from friction along a fault plane (a fault is a surface along which movement has occured). Hence, you take even a baseball-sized lump of iron and impact it so hard that it breaks and slips a little under the compression of impact, and you could expect surface features that would meet the definition of slickensides. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Pete Pete [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Norm all, There are meteorites with slickenside?! It would have to be Martian, then, right? Cheers, Pete From: Norm Lehrman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Greg Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED],meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cool Fresh Chondrites and Slick-n-Slide Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2006 13:18:31 -0800 (PST) Greg all, Nice specimens. Just a minor side point: the term is slickensides for the striated, movement-polished surface itself, or slickensided for a rock showing slickensides. Your version is a common, but erroneous, transliteration. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Greg Hupe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear List Members, I have been going through the material I brought back from my Morocco trip last week. Here are some photos of some very nice fresh chondrites, an unusual thing these days coming out of Morocco. There are two pictures of some very good examples of Slick-n-Slide also. I have not seen chondrites this nice for a long time out of the Sahara. 4170 gram Large and Fresh Thumb Printed chondrite - VERY COOL !! http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc1.jpg 140 gram Individual - Neat Shape http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc00013.jpg 122.7 gram Slick-n-Slide (Best Example I have Seen for a Long Time) http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc00023.jpg 25.6 gram Slick-n-Slide (Unfortunately broke during airplane ride home) http://www.lunarrock.com/3-9/dsc00025.jpg Hope you enjoy the pictures. Best regards, Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) [EMAIL PROTECTED] IMCA 3163 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad A Stretch Moldavite---the first ever???
List, Czech out http://tektitesource.com/taffy_cored_tektites.html This is a gorgeous new stretch tektite from Chlum. I've never heard of any others. There is a chance that it is the first and only example of its kind! If any of you know of any other stretch Moldavites, please let me know. Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Hunting hours vs recovery rate
Sonny list, My stats are not going to be what people want to hear. I have been collecting rocks, fossils, and artifacts since I could walk. I have been a continuously active exploration geologist for 35 years. I have been looking at the ground in front of me with something of a trained eye for something like 50 years. Unusual rocks came home with me without fail. When I joined Homestake Mining Company about 25 years ago, they had to pay to move something like 10 tons of rock. When I sheepishly apologized to my new boss, he said I guess if we hire a geologist who doesn't like rocks, we made a poor choice! This is the long way of saying: none of those were meteorites. When I became interested in the current subject, I spent (as for most of my life) on the order of 150 days in the field per year in my normal work routine. Always looking, but with very limited knowledge (none the less, a well trained eye for the unusual). Nothing. No memories at all of something I wish I could go back and view again. As the obsession grew, I gradually acquired a small collection of meteorites via purchase specifically to train my eye. I started looking where there were few or no rocks (thanks to Nininger's Find a Falling Star that had been given to me). I can't guess how long it took after that--- I'd say weeks of quality time before the big moment for #1 (described on our website and IMCA). Speaking only of dedicated meteorite-search time, I spent another three or four man-days in Nevada, then say 5 man-days in virgin country in the high Andes in Chile, then another 3 days in Nevada before my next tiny find at Majuba (also on the website). Learning from experience, my next effort was where meteorites had been found before, and I found 21 fragments in 2 days. The next page will be written soon, but I suspect no armchair quarterback has any idea what kind of patience and perserverance it takes to beat the odds on one of the longest shot endeavors on earth! I serve as living proof that you can go nuts before it happens. Cheers, Norm http://TektiteSource.com (where you can read the longer versions of #s 1 2) --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, Have you ever wondered how many hours you must spend before your first cold find ? Or how many hours after you find a new area with a new meteorite before your next find? I would like to say that you will find a meteorite every 40- 50 hours of searching for cold finds not counting driving or prep time. The only problem is once you find one you will spend 4-5 days or longer searching the area looking for the rest of the meteorite or the continuation of the strewn field. In my own experience in a know strewnfield ( Gold Basin) I spent 16 hours of hunting plus 6 hours driving time for my first meteorite. I might have recovered one faster if it was not for the 10 pounds of meterwrongs I was carrying in my pockets before I found one. On some of the new areas I have spent as little as 4 hours before a new find in a new location. I have also spent weeks before a new find at 8 to 10 hour days. In a strewnfield that I have been working there are times were you may not find one for a week and then find one or two. In one area a friend I spent 3 days hunting before the frist find. We spent 2 more days looking for the next find paired to the first find. We have done 3 more trips to the location for a few more pieces. Average hunting day 8 hours plus 4-8 hours driving time to get to location one way. I would like to say the average time to find a meteorite in a known is location 2-20 hours. For a new cold find from a area with no finds may take 50 plus hours of hunting not counting driving or prep time. I am interested in hearing input from other hunters especially from the Southwest. I have been asked by some new meteorite hunters what they can expect before they find their first meteorite. Thanks, Sonny __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
Bernd list, This is indeed exciting, and may finally justify LDG being recognized as a true tektite rather than a simple impactite. Although the article doesn't give us much for location beyond at the northern tip of the Gilf Kebir region, that's close enough, as the LDG strewn field is immediately north of the Gilf Kebir. The 28.5 ma date for LDG should be a good number (fission track). The 100 million year sandstone mentioned as the crater target rock is perfect. For years it has been argued that the Nubia group sandstones are the geochemically perfect precursor for LDG. Interestingly, this raised a problem for researchers looking for a local LDG source crater as there are good geological arguments that the Nubia sandstones were covered by younger formations in the LDG strewn field at 28.5 ma and would not have been available as target rocks. With the revelation that this newly recognized crater did indeed impact the sandstones, we're almost there. Now, all we have to do is eject the LDG a hundred km or so northwards and the picture works fine. (The long axis of the strewn field is roughly N-S). Where is the dividing line between impactite and tektite? I'd like to hear what others may understand, but my impression is that it fundamentally hinges on distance the glassy material is ejected from the crater. Material found only in and immediately around the source crater is impactite. Stuff blasted tens to hundreds of km or more crosses the definitional boundary into tektites. If this is the criterion, LDG was already home free in my book insofar as the known strewn field has a long axis of at least 150 km, so even if there was a now-erosionally removed crater at one end of the strewn field proper, some of the glass would've already required over 100 km ejection distance. Now, I'm guessing we may be talking a couple hundred km, maybe more. Is that sufficiently far to legitimize LDG as a true tektite? (From Ries-Norlingen to the Czech moldavite fields is about 300 km). Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Ron and List, Like so many others, I was eagerly flying over the lines in search of a hint to LDG (Libyan Desert Glass),and, there it is (of course ;-): since its shape points to an origin of extraterrestrial impact, it will likely prove to be the event responsible for the extensive field of 'Desert Glass'-yellow-green silica glass fragments found on the desert surface between the giant dunes of the Great Sand Sea in southwestern Egypt. But: may have been formed by a meteorite impact tens of millions of years ago. How many *tens* of millions of years ago ??? If current age estimates are correct, LDG has an age of ~28 Ma. Any thoughts out there, ... Norm? Cheers, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
Doug, Good points all, but if you want to raise the water/purity issue, you can't dodge the Muong Nong issue. (The best answer is that they shouldn't be called tektites, BUT, they ARE so called by all authorities). With LDG, it can be reasonably argued that flight-related morphology has been erased by ventifaction. In the area where this stuff is found, it is literally reasonable that ALL of the material has seen the wind and its entrained sand. LDG is pretty fine, clean glass, albeit with a higher water content. (So, here again, people have dodged the issue by calling them Muong Nongs---) As for inclusion of impactor material in LDG, you've got to remember that iron spherules are found in Australasian tektites. Good chance that's impactor condensate. I truly have no argument with the water content criterion. That's probably the best definitional parameter we have. But it makes me a bit nervous to turn the whole matter over to such a narrow definition. Are we positive, given all that we don't know about tektites, that there can't be any wet ones? Should we now start calling Pyrex another variety of tektite? Clearly, we are including some process-related factors (even if just inferred) in our definition. It is very much like the planet issue. I keep thinking that there have been a lot of grade-school kids that got marked down on tests for answering the question: How many planets are in our solar system? wrong according to the erroneous wisdom of a given time. How many tektite-producing impacts have there been? I get weary of qualifying my answers with, Well, depending on whether or not you count LDG Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Norm L. writes: Where is the dividing line between impactite and tektite? I'd like to hear what others may understand, but my impression is that it fundamentally hinges on distance the glassy material is ejected from the crater. Material found only in and immediately around the source crater is impactite. Stuff blasted tens to hundreds of km or more crosses the definitional boundary into tektites. If this is the criterion, LDG was already home free Hola Norm, yet again here's another one of those awkward definitions that when overyly analyzed starts falling apart. I think the distance criterion is not THE criterion, but rather a tektite differs from an impact glass in that the tektite has actually been exposed to general conditions of enough kinetic and thermal energy to create a greater melt uniformity where the original impactor has transmitted that energy cleanly, and in such a great quantity that the energy is also enough to propel tektites into the upper atmosphere and have them re-enter ablating like meteorites. These are a bunch of hand-waving concepts, but as we know, it seems the one factor that really distinguishes tektites is the low water content. LDG's have at least 5 times the typical water content of the cleaner tektites, and they contain inclusions including those of the impactor, and aerodynamic shapes are not really known I believe. In fact the water content of LDG's at the low end of 5 times the amount of the cleaner tektites actually goes practically as high as obsidian. They don't usually look very aerodynamic and they have meteorites inside them. They deserve some distinction, they are dirty glass. Now all of this about water content might be just an academic distinction, except for one exception. One of the greatest mysteries of tektites is derived from the mystery of exactly what physical laws were twisted to get that low water content and this more than anything else is the criterion as much as the mystery. Plus they are generally clean (OK, they have smalled fused cuartz. etc., but there there tends to be a bimodal distribution between clean tektites and impact glasses as far as inclusions = so far you have clean ones and dirty ones) Please don't bring up layered tektites I don't want the definition system to fail even more... But practically speaking, you would have to be right that there is a continuum, just like in the definition of a planet, etc., the world tends towards complexity just when you get it all figured out...and soon we will come to know of the impektite that bridges tektites, water and all, with LDGs and other impact glasses. Better yet how about just saying they are all impact glasses - which they are no matter who starts talking about flying - and that tektites just had a higher energy/diffusion/flux melt event which is witnessed in the record by water content...If cats could only talk they could tell us how long we have erred on visible light as they see into the near UV, don't they? What's the use of going at it with a cat over the definition of visible light?:) My 2 centavos...Doug
Re: [meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
Doug, I do enjoy your contributions. Always stimulating. I have no fundamental disagreements. Just a few hair-splitting points. Re: the partial pressures in Australasian bubbles. It has been argued that our numbers are bogus. As atmospheric water is absorbed into the hydrating tektite selvage lining a bubble, internal pressures can be considerably reduced, giving the false appearance of high altitudes. I have never seen anything about partial pressures in LDG glass. I'm not sure anything has ever been found sufficiently large to measure. Lacking such data, this argument is conceptual, not real. However it is a great research suggestion. With modern micro-techniques LDG bubbles should be revisited! As for a real strewnfield defined for LDGs as we find with other conceptually true to form tektites, yes, the finding area is quite sharply delimited at about 150 km X 50 km. If anything, the LDG area is atypically WELL defined relative to other tektites (I don't know much about Ivory Coast distribution. It may be comparable or smaller). I must admit, I have never seen anything even remotely resembling an erosionally-modified aerodynamically- shaped Libyan Desert Glass form. If you started with the typical morphologies of Australasians and sand-blasted them within an inch of their existence, we would still recognize some traces of original morphology. I must decline any hope of the Harvey Award on this matter. You are totally correct. LDG shows absolutely no hint of aerodynamic ablation modification. Deep enough, Norm http://tektitesource.com (a great place to view a huge selection of prime Libyan Desert Glass!) --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hola Norm, so it seems we actually agree on most of the points, including the most important one: the subjectivity of the definition. You are just wanting to be more liberal...and me more stoodgy...I wasn't dodging the layered tektite issue when I said not to bring it up (which you unfortunately did:)). Clearly layered tektites are closer to impact glasses in the continuum and I was just trying to cleanly conceptualize. The definition of 'tektite' is a human classification which like most, depends on a clear understanding of a concept, not a recipe. The Muong Nong glasses (vs. tektites) as many experts also call them deserve a category by themselves so if you want to point to experts calling them tektites as support for calling the LDG's also tektites, all I can say is we are pushing the concept even further. You do mention the meteoritic content of Indochinites (=Australasian tektites). Yes a small component of iron has been detected, but this is very rare, and no where near the content in LDG which can approach a 0.5%. You didn't mention that the partial pressure of the air in the bubbles of the Indochinites corresponds to the upper atmosphere, and that in LDG I am assuming it corresponds to the surface. This shouldn't be a surprise as the water should not be linearly independent - thus they ought to track similarly. Good point on the desert weathering, but is there a real strewn field defined for LDG's, as we find with other conceptually true-to-form tektites (pun:))? If any evidence could be found, your argument would be more solid, as a of evidence isn't any proof of anything. Try checking nobel gas ratios and I bet the tektite concept will be even further away... Where I must really agree with you and put all grammatical gymnastics and opinions aside, is where you make the best point of the whole discussion, imho. That maybe our definition of tektites whatever that concept may be is based on faulty ideas. With liberty taken, that maybe it will change as we learn more. Yes, I buy that, I believe that is a distinct possibility. Things were so much simpler when we all agreed they were blasted from the Moon and the aerodynamic shapes and low water content actually meant something more to the experts of that time. Gor the time being, I be conservative on the definitions for the distinctions mentioned. Show me one aerodynamically shaped LDG besides one sculpted by a Neanderthal, and I'll recommend you for a Harvey award which would be quite fitting:), and definitely a nobel prize in the meteoritical community...for the moment we think there is a crater now, well, we already called them impact glasses, and now we have all these years of human transport mucking it up for these highly prized special glasses. Perhaps little Norm and little Doug in the 100th century will follow in our footsteps. Norm will say, Doug, look at all the chondrites in the USA, and there are none in the Sahara. Looks like the major strewn field is into North America and then a minor one into Europe. And Doug will say, I don't know, they weren't witnessed falls Jokes aside, the concepts are pretty clear --- high energy, less
Re: [meteorite-list] Experiment Update #1
Göran all, I don't understand the chemistry involved, but I have personally used a concentrated sodium hydroxide bath to remove rust from very rusty Campos. It took weeks, but scales of rust just kept detaching untill the bottom of the pail was a centimeter deep in rust flakes. I did do a final treatment with a wire brush, but ended with a beautiful metallic specimen. This treatment wasn't just a rust stopper. It removed rust in large quantities. The solution didn't discolor as if iron was being dissolved. Flakes just popped off and fell to the bottom. Cheers, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Göran Axelsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is not a rust cleaner treatment, it is a rust stopper treatment. To remove the rust you have to use more traditional methods, like polishing. Acidic solutions with a low Ph makes it easier to dissolv the iron hydroxides in rust but at the same time the iron will be unprotected against oxidation. Basic solutions with a high Ph stops the iron hydroxides to dissolv but protects the iron against oxidation by passivation, it becomes chemically inert. The idea behind the hydroxide solution is to protect the iron while chloride ions are leached out of the meteorite. I would recommend small volumes in the bath, maybe twice the volume of the meteorite but at least covering it, combined with numerous replacement of the solution. In the beginning it should be closer between the changes of the solution as it faster gets contaminated. When the chlorine levels in the meteorite and the solution is in balance it doesn't help to let it lie longer. Archeologists sometimes uses ordinary tapwater in the initial bath but at the end they use deionised or distilled water. And whatever you do, don't use chlorinated water, that could make it rust even faster. /Göran tracy latimer wrote: About 10 days ago I dunked my poor Fredericksburg in what I hoped would be a rust removal bath of half Liquid Drano and half anhydrous alcohol. Since then, I have swirled it about at least once a day, and some of the rust has come off, but not all. The bath is lightly tinged with brown and there is a fine peppering of rust flakes on the bottom of the glass jar. I will give it another week or so, but if there is not a significant change in the quantity of rust in suspension rather than on my meteorite, Freddy will be taken out of the bath and more old fashioned methods of getting rid of rust will be regretfully employed. Watch this space for more fast-breaking news! Tracy Latimer __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fight extreme lunar spam
List, If you, like me, are one of the chosen, you'll be receiving another edition of Göran Lindfors' extreme lunar fakes spam about now. Please forward several copies of his message back to him. As I recall, we shut down his mailbox for a few days the last time. He seems to be a slow learner. Regards, Norm http://TektiteSource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] THEORIES OF THE ORIGIN OF TEKTITES, Part Two
Sterling, Thanks for posting this series! One question though: Item #5: It would also appear that no one tried breaking a specimen of each, as the fracture morphology of each differs. In what way? I've never tried breaking specimens, but I've seen plently of broken ones and have never noticed a difference. As amorphous glass, both obsidian and tektites have a nice conchoidal fracture. However, now that you bring it to my attention, I can imagine a theoretical difference: since most obsidian does have tiny crystallites, and tektites have absolutely none, tektites should have a smoother fracture surface, relatively free of stair-steps. I'll have to go check as soon as I get this written. As an interesting aside, various obsidians were esteemed for varied uses in the stone age. Varieties packed with incipient crystals flaked more crudely than more pure glasses, but because the tiny crystals obstructed the growth of fractures, tools made of such impure material were tougher. Better coarse, heavy duty implements could be made of this. More pure glasses made for perfectly flaked extra sharp arrowheads, but they were essentially one-use items as they broke very easily (there being no crystallites to interfere with fracture growth). Is this the sort of difference in fracture morphology to which you refer? Thanks, Norm http://tektitesource.com --- Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Part Two of THEORIES OF THE ORIGIN OF TEKTITES Passing through the Colossally Silly Entrance Hall, we next enter the extensive and colorful Volcanic Tektite Exhibition. 5. The Terrestrial Volcanic Origin of Tektites: Mayer, in 1788, published the first scientific tektite theory; he called moldavites glassy lavas. Charles Darwin, in 1844 (The Voyage of the H.M.S. Beagle), first described australite buttons and identified them as obsidian. He wondered a great deal about their unique shape, but became distracted by some issue or other in biology, so the world lost a great tektite theorist. The volcanic theory became as predominant in the 19th Century as the Impact Theory is today. It was endorsed by Wickman, 1893; van Dijk, 1879; W. D. Campbell, 1906; La Conte, 1902; and Moore, 1916 (who said tektites were identical to Pele's Tears); Simpson , 1902, proposed Australite tektites came from Krakatoa. Dunn, 1908 and 1912, proposed a complicated formation of tektites inside of gas bubbles in fresh lava, a suggestion further developed and complicated by Buddhue in 1940, while Dunn then later (1935) suggested tektites were formed by rain and snow falling on molten lava. The volcanic theories all died when geochemical analysis advances in the 20th Century, as tektites have a composition that is quite different from any terrestrial volcanic rock, and tektites are easily distinguishable from obsidian. It should be pointed out, in defense of Darwin and all the early geologists, that just from the standpoint of holding a tektite and obsidian in your hand and looking at them, they appear to be materially identical. Chemical and physical analysis is required to distinguish them. It would also appear that no one tried breaking a specimen of each, as the fracture morphology of each differs. However, the last Terrestrial Volcanic Theory was proposed in 1976! It is: 6. The Cryptovolcanic Origin of Tektites: McCall, 1976: To understand this at all, we need to dig into the strange tribal relationships of science. British geologists (we invented geology, you know) were firmly wedded (possibly even welded) to the volcanic origin of craters, all craters, of all kinds, on all worlds. An immense amount of energy and thought had been invested in lunar volcanic theory in particular, up through the 1950's. Those who learned their geology at British institutions (Australians, New Zedders, and so forth) were trained in this tradition. The notion of that some craters on the Earth or elsewhere might have been formed by heavy objects falling out of the sky was regarded as a crackpot theory put forward entirely by brash and uninformed colonials of the American variety who were well-known to be fond of whizz-bangs (child-like, you know), and the impact theory was resolutely resisted as errant nonsense up until the moment of the Moon landings, when it all unraveled in a snap. A volcanic explanation was handy; there had always been craters from which volcanic characteristics were absent. They were called by these geologists cryptovolcanic, meaning that their volcanic origins were hidden. This was a theory built on the absence of evidence as a proof of the theory, always a dangerous logical method. Cryptovolcanic craters were postulated to be the result of direct venting of very deep, very hot, high pressure gassy magma to the surface of the planet in a manner analogous to kimberlite pipes.
Re: [meteorite-list] Why are Esquel slices Transparent Blue?
Gary, No one has bothered to explain it because it doesn't happen. What do you smoke just before you see this phenomenon? Regards, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Gary K. Foote [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't seem to fnid an explanation online anywhere. Gary http://www.meteorite-dealers.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: page of great Sikhote BULLETS just posted to our website
List, With all the talk about oriented stones, I thought I'd get some great new strongly flight-oriented Sikhote Alin bullets posted. Check out the Sikhote Alin page at http://TektiteSource.com I'll be posting these to ebay over the next few months, but they are available from the website untill then. Thanks, Norm http://TektiteSource.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Meteorite-list Digest, Vol 26, Issue 30
Sterling, I too got drawn into tektites by the mystery. They often tell their individual stories plainly, but we still can't get the big picture out of them! One comment on your comments though. Tektites (australites) ARE very often emu gizzard stones. In the dry lakes where they are most abundant there are typically only two rock types surviving. Sharply angular little bits of quartz shattered by halite growth and the relatively smooth and conspicuous little australites. The latter are selectively picked by the emus. The aboriginees always check the gizzards of emus taken hunting for australites---and I always checked emus killed on the roadways! That theory is not a theory. Best regards, Norm http://TektiteSource.com --- Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Steve, List, It's why I love tektites, as a puzzle. Every theory explains some features; no theory explains all the features of those little devils. I regard them as still a wide open mystery, the only scientific mystery still going strong after more than 200 years of hypothesis. (The first tektite theory was published in 1788, long before the first scientific theory of meteorites, which had not even been accepted as real yet.) I keep a table of all the theories of tektites, ancient and modern, and I have 39 listed, including the one that assays that they are the gizzard stones of emus! There are several lunar theories. Nininger (at one time) believed them to be Lunaites, or ejecta from lunar meteoroid impact. Chapman suggested that they were the material that makes up the bright rays that a few young lunar craters display, ejected all the way to the Earth, thinking this would account for their terrestrial distribution pattern (it doesn't). Lunar vulcanism of the ordinary volcanic variety has been suggested several times, the last time by John O'Keefe, who refined it to a suggestion of deep hydrogen volcanoes with hypersonic hot gas plumes, before moving on to another theory. I am not, BTW, denigrating O'Keefe for changing theories in mid-stream. O'Keefe put forward FIVE theories by my count, which gives him more theories than any one else on my list. He spent his not inconsiderable talents on the problem, but all the theory buckets have holes in them and leak like crazy, not just his, but all of them. Today, we have the impact consensus theory, which is actually not a consensus at all, because every impact theorist of note has a tektite impact origin theory of his own which is not compatible with any other impact theorist's tektite theory! But it's called a consensus because the real consensus is that there is no point in wasting any more time on tektites. We've done them to death, performed every test; it's time to move on and just accept the least whacky answer by (unspoken) default. Don't get me started; I wrote that post chewing over the impact theories a long time ago... I even have a pet theory of my own (I call him Bruno and feed him regularly) that manages to explain a lot of tektite puzzles that the other 39 theories don't, but --- guess what? My pet theory has different but glaringly obvious flaws all its own, so it's DOA, just like all the other tektite theories. They're a paradox. They're a problem. They're like the jigsaw that seems to going so well until somebody holds up a piece you'd forgotten about and innocently says, Where's this go? Sterling K. Webb -- - Original Message - From: Steve Schoner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2006 2:41 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Re: Meteorite-list Digest, Vol 26, Issue 30 As Sterling Webb wrote, if the reasoning he posited follows then there is no way that tectites came from the moon. The distribution on the earth, the ablation shapes, stretch forms, and lack of cosmic ray exposure pretty much eliminate the moon as the source. Steve Schoner IMCA #4470 Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2006 03:00:46 -0600 From: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Orbital debris watching radar To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Hi, Darren, I gather from the phrase about having their orbits decay, that by Earth orbit, you mean in orbit about the Earth. Orbits around the Earth only decay because the orbit touches the uppermost atmosphere enough to cause drag which, however minute, reduces orbital velocity. It may seem logical that materials kicked off the Moon would easily and immediately end up in an orbit around the Earth, or at least some of them would. But the truth is that it is nearly impossible to get from the Moon to the Earth, and that lunar
