On Mon, Dec 28, 2020 at 4:26 PM Niels Bakker wrote:
> * mpet...@netflight.com (Matthew Petach) [Tue 29 Dec 2020, 01:08 CET]:
> >But as far as the physics goes, the conversion of biomatter into
> >petrochemicals in the ground is more "renewable" than the conversion
> >of hydrogen into helium in
On 12/29/20 02:06, Matthew Petach wrote:
Mark,
I think you may have misunderstood Keith's comment about
it being "all a matter of time-frame."
He's right--when the sun consumes all the hydrogen in
the hydrogen-to-helium fusion process and begins to
expand into a red dwarf, that's it;
* mpet...@netflight.com (Matthew Petach) [Tue 29 Dec 2020, 01:08 CET]:
But as far as the physics goes, the conversion of biomatter into
petrochemicals in the ground is more "renewable" than the conversion
of hydrogen into helium in the sun.
It's not. Where did Mr Metcalf think the energy
On 12/28/20 4:06 PM, Matthew Petach wrote:
I think you may have misunderstood Keith's comment about
it being "all a matter of time-frame."
He's right--when the sun consumes all the hydrogen in
the hydrogen-to-helium fusion process and begins to
expand into a red dwarf, that's it; there's no
On Sun, Dec 27, 2020 at 12:28 PM Mark Tinka wrote:
>
>
> On 12/27/20 21:56, Keith Medcalf wrote:
>
> > Me too. On top of that, diesel and gasoline are pretty reliable.
> Though some people may argue about "renewables" the fact is that it is all
> a matter of time-frame. Solar power, for
On 12/28/20 16:57, Mel Beckman wrote:
It’s not just the lithium load in the environment that is of concern.
As early as 2018 the US EPA had collected data on the incidence of
so-called “hot fires” caused by lithium batteries in the waste stream.
So far, nobody has been killed. But it’s
It’s not just the lithium load in the environment that is of concern. As early
as 2018 the US EPA had collected data on the incidence of so-called “hot fires”
caused by lithium batteries in the waste stream. So far, nobody has been
killed. But it’s only a matter of time before someone is, given
On 12/28/20 05:29, Brandon Martin wrote:
Interestingly, the Lithium content is the, in theory, valuable part of
it. There's not actually much Li in a typical Li-Ion rechargeable
battery (much less than a Li metal primary cell), but my understanding
is that it's enough to have people
On 12/27/20 5:26 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
I'm just not sure where all that Li-Ion will go after 15 - 20 years of
use, though...
One European manufacturer (the one whose battery I bought) says that as
of now, they can only recycle 20% of each battery they sell. To me, that
sounds like just the
On 12/27/20 21:56, Keith Medcalf wrote:
Me too. On top of that, diesel and gasoline are pretty reliable. Though some people may argue about
"renewables" the fact is that it is all a matter of time-frame. Solar power, for example, is not renewable.
Once it is all used up, it will not
On 12/27/20 21:51, Sabri Berisha wrote:
Netflix has a documentary on it, "Fire In Paradise". Gives me the chills
every time I watch it.
I'll have a sniff. Thanks!
Mark.
On 12/27/20 19:49, Michael Thomas wrote:
We can't get enough solar panels on the roof to charge a battery big
enough to handle a multi-day outage, and the battery as quoted is only
charged from the panels, not from the mains. It's easy enough to get a
transfer switch though for the battery
On: Sunday, 27 December, 2020 03:26, Mark Tinka wrote:
>In the end, and for various reasons, I settled on renewables.
Me too. On top of that, diesel and gasoline are pretty reliable. Though some
people may argue about "renewables" the fact is that it is all a matter of
time-frame. Solar
- On Dec 27, 2020, at 10:06 AM, Michael Thomas m...@mtcc.com wrote:
Hi,
> Right and here in California, it was precisely those lines that
> incinerated Paradise.
And for those lurkers outside of CA, or even the U.S., the small town
named "Paradise" was completely wiped off the map a few
On 12/27/20 10:26 AM, Baldur Norddahl wrote:
All of the 400V and 10 kV is buried. That means no wires along
streets, anywhere.
The long haul transmission network consists mostly of 150 kV and 400
kV lines. That has been partly buried, especially near and in cities.
There was a project to
søn. 27. dec. 2020 19.00 skrev Valdis Klētnieks :
> On Sun, 27 Dec 2020 17:57:17 +0100, Baldur Norddahl said:
>
> > Here in the civilised world we bury the wires ;-)
>
> Even the long-haul 765kv and up connections across the power grid?
>
> In the US, they're out on towers for a reason - you can
On 12/27/20 10:00 AM, Valdis Klētnieks wrote:
On Sun, 27 Dec 2020 17:57:17 +0100, Baldur Norddahl said:
Here in the civilised world we bury the wires ;-)
Even the long-haul 765kv and up connections across the power grid?
In the US, they're out on towers for a reason - you can fly along
On Sun, 27 Dec 2020 17:57:17 +0100, Baldur Norddahl said:
> Here in the civilised world we bury the wires ;-)
Even the long-haul 765kv and up connections across the power grid?
In the US, they're out on towers for a reason - you can fly along them
in a helicopter and easily spot parts of cable
On 12/27/20 9:38 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
On 12/27/20 18:14, Michael Thomas wrote:
We have both, and are going to get a battery. But the battery would
probably only be good for about a day which is not enough, especially
with these planned shutoffs because they have to inspect their wire
On 12/27/20 18:57, Baldur Norddahl wrote:
Here in the civilised world we bury the wires ;-)
I'm certain every country has a combination of both... one of those more
than the other in some places, but a combo nonetheless.
Ultimately, it's most unlikely that any utility company is going
On 12/27/20 18:14, Michael Thomas wrote:
We have both, and are going to get a battery. But the battery would
probably only be good for about a day which is not enough, especially
with these planned shutoffs because they have to inspect their wire
plant in daylight.
If you can add some
søn. 27. dec. 2020 17.14 skrev Michael Thomas :
>
>
> We have both, and are going to get a battery. But the battery would
> probably only be good for about a day which is not enough, especially
> with these planned shutoffs because they have to inspect their wire
> plant in daylight. There has to
On 12/27/20 2:26 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
On 12/26/20 23:57, Michael Thomas wrote:
Yeah, it burned somebody's house to a crisp here last year around
here. It certainly makes the case why leaving professionals in charge
of power issues is the better idea. although with pg it's a tough
On 12/26/20 23:57, Michael Thomas wrote:
Yeah, it burned somebody's house to a crisp here last year around
here. It certainly makes the case why leaving professionals in charge
of power issues is the better idea. although with pg it's a tough
call, my telco not so much.
I considered a
On 12/26/20 22:58, Michael Thomas wrote:
Here in California the new reality is that multi-day outages are now
common. The first few planned outages were 3-4 days, so that would be
on the edge, especially if it's for gabby granny on the phone for
hours.This all depends on the weather, and
ww.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> ----------
> *From: *"Mark Tinka"
> *To: *nanog@nanog.org
> *Sent: *Friday, December 25, 2020 11:44:00 PM
>
> *Subject: *Re: [External] Re: 10g residential CPE
>
>
>
> On 12/25/20 23:04,
Tinka"
To: nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Friday, December 25, 2020 11:44:00 PM
Subject: Re: [External] Re: 10g residential CPE
On 12/25/20 23:04, Michael Thomas wrote:
>
> I mean, i understand the arm's race, but now it seems to be an arms
> race for its own sake.
It is,
w.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp><https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
*From: *"Michael Thomas"
*To: *nanog@nanog.org
*Sent: *Friday, December 25, 2020 1:27:39 PM
*Subject: *Re: [External] Re: 10g
homas"
To: nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Friday, December 25, 2020 1:27:39 PM
Subject: Re: [External] Re: 10g residential CPE
On 12/25/20 11:04 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
On 12/25/20 20:10, Hunter Fuller via NANOG wrote:
It would meet some customers’ needs because multiple people co
homas"
To: nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Friday, December 25, 2020 1:27:39 PM
Subject: Re: [External] Re: 10g residential CPE
On 12/25/20 11:04 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
On 12/25/20 20:10, Hunter Fuller via NANOG wrote:
It would meet some customers’ needs because multiple people co
Ego.
Ignorance.
-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
- Original Message -
From: "Michael Thomas"
To: nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Friday, December 25, 2020 1:27:39 PM
Subject: Re: [External] Re: 10g resid
On 12/26/20 1:13 PM, Valdis Klētnieks wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2020 12:58:42 -0800, Michael Thomas said:
can go on for days. We have a generator because of this, but everybody
getting a generator in the middle of the Berkeley Hills would be
something of its own horror show, but it will probably
On Sat, 26 Dec 2020 12:58:42 -0800, Michael Thomas said:
> can go on for days. We have a generator because of this, but everybody
> getting a generator in the middle of the Berkeley Hills would be
> something of its own horror show, but it will probably come down to that.
Egads.
Especially if a
On 12/26/20 12:44 PM, John Levine wrote:
In the 25 years since I've lived here the power has never been out as
long as a day so I think a four day battery will give me pretty good
reliability. I know my fiber is a straight shot to the CO since I'm
only four blocks away but as far as I can
In article <653758700.2275.1608968920711.javamail.zim...@baylink.com>,
Jay R. Ashworth wrote:
>- Original Message -
>> From: "John Levine"
>
>> They sure seem ready to take down the oopper. The installer was sad
>> when I told him to leave my six-pair copper cable alone even though
>>
>If the operator wants to keep bufferbloat low you will not be able to
>utilise your 1 Gbps to that speed when downloading from distant servers.
>But with the same bufferbloat measured in milliseconds you will still
>have a 10x bigger buffer and thus 10x bigger bandwidth delay product.
>That
On 12/26/20 13:41, Nuno Vieira wrote:
Once upon a time a wise main said “Who in their right mind would ever
need more than 640k of ram?”
While everyone will take a chance at using this line at some point in a
computing career, it's somewhat disingenuous to compare (or equate) the
640KB
On 12/26/20 13:41, Nuno Vieira wrote:
Once upon a time a wise main said “Who in their right mind would ever need more
than 640k of ram?”
While everyone will take a chance at using this line at some point in a
computing career, it's somewhat disingenuous to compare (or equate) the
640KB
On Fri, 25 Dec 2020, Chris Adams wrote:
Queueing doesn't get me my next game in time to play it tonight. I've
always seen general queueing as a work-around for "not enough bandwidth
and can't add more"... but when more is available, why not just use
more?
I de-bloat my 1000/1000 with
On 12/26/20 09:44, Jay R. Ashworth wrote:
By which you mean that they can safely afford to bandwidth-surf again because
the average usage is so much lower than the peak?
Unless you are providing some kind of service from your home, yes.
Mark.
- Original Message -
> From: "John Levine"
> They sure seem ready to take down the oopper. The installer was sad
> when I told him to leave my six-pair copper cable alone even though
> nothing is using it now.
Sure; ILECs would *love* to deprovision their copper end networks.
But
- Original Message -
> From: "Mark Tinka"
> On 12/25/20 22:49, Michael Thomas wrote:
>> But using the right queuing disciplines it a lot cheaper than the
>> brute force and ignorance of just upping the bandwidth, right?
>
> Consumer ISP's have realized that they can make money selling
On 12/26/20 00:32, John Levine wrote:
I agree it is odd to make 100/100 the top speed. The fiber service I
have from my local non-Bell telco offers 100/100, 500/500, and
1000/1000. FiOS where you can get it goes to 940/880.
The obvious guess is that their upstream bandwidth is
On 12/25/20 23:04, Michael Thomas wrote:
I mean, i understand the arm's race, but now it seems to be an arms
race for its own sake.
It is, because it is hard to be different when all you know is to sell
bandwidth.
The next level of differentiation is being a fibre provider, and
On 12/25/20 22:49, Michael Thomas wrote:
But using the right queuing disciplines it a lot cheaper than the
brute force and ignorance of just upping the bandwidth, right?
Consumer ISP's have realized that they can make money selling Gigabit
services, because the ones who really know how
On 12/25/20 22:40, Chris Adams wrote:
Bandwidth is like disk space - you think "I'll never use all of this",
and then the availability changes behavior. Having ability to do more
means your behavior changes to utilize more. We don't NEED high speed
Internet to download games - we could
In article <5f11bc55-e3d1-006d-c4c4-0703ff63c...@mtcc.com> you write:
>> The obvious guess is that their upstream bandwidth is
>> underprovisioned, or maybe they figure 100/100 is all they need to
>> compete in that particular market.
>
>What's weirder is that it's most likely not going to allow
On 12/25/20 2:32 PM, John Levine wrote:
In article <3b0bc95b-c741-7561-1692-75fac74d5...@mtcc.com> you write:
I'd definitely appreciate symmetric, or at least better in upstream.
Obviously zoom and all of that has made a lie of us not needing
upstream. It would make cloud based "filesystems"
In article <3b0bc95b-c741-7561-1692-75fac74d5...@mtcc.com> you write:
>I'd definitely appreciate symmetric, or at least better in upstream.
>Obviously zoom and all of that has made a lie of us not needing
>upstream. It would make cloud based "filesystems" more feasible too.
>
>But the larger
fre. 25. dec. 2020 21.49 skrev Michael Thomas :
>
> On 12/25/20 12:40 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
> >
> > The other aspect of it is that we're doing these downloads while
> > continuing to play other games and chat (both things sensitive to
> > latency). Some have family/roommates in the home, so
On 12/25/20 1:25 PM, John Levine wrote:
In article you write:
I'm fine with "free stuff". But it seems we've hit saturation on a
number of front like camera and screen pixels, ghz of cpu, TB's of disk,
Gb's of netio for residential stuff.
My provider on the other (Volcano Internet) doesn't
In article you write:
>I'm fine with "free stuff". But it seems we've hit saturation on a
>number of front like camera and screen pixels, ghz of cpu, TB's of disk,
>Gb's of netio for residential stuff.
>
>My provider on the other (Volcano Internet) doesn't seem to have got
>this memo though.
On 12/25/20 12:53 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
Once upon a time, Michael Thomas said:
On 12/25/20 12:40 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
The other aspect of it is that we're doing these downloads while
continuing to play other games and chat (both things sensitive to
latency). Some have family/roommates
Once upon a time, Michael Thomas said:
> On 12/25/20 12:40 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
> >The other aspect of it is that we're doing these downloads while
> >continuing to play other games and chat (both things sensitive to
> >latency). Some have family/roommates in the home, so they may be
>
On 12/25/20 12:40 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
The other aspect of it is that we're doing these downloads while
continuing to play other games and chat (both things sensitive to
latency). Some have family/roommates in the home, so they may be
streaming audio and/or video at the same time. Do we
Once upon a time, Michael Thomas said:
> On 12/25/20 11:39 AM, Cory Sell wrote:
> >I saturate my 1G connection most during game downloads, file
> >downloads/uploads, full backup uploads, etc.
> >
> >I also self-host a lot of services for personal use and having
> >that peak speed is really nice
On 12/25/20 21:45, Michael Thomas wrote:
Obviously for downloads it's nice, but how often is that happening? A
time or two a month max? It seems sort of strange the providers would
build out infrastructure for such a niche activity.
Haha, that's the trick; they don't.
Because the logic
On 12/25/20 21:39, Cory Sell via NANOG wrote:
I saturate my 1G connection most during game downloads, file
downloads/uploads, full backup uploads, etc.
Same here, but how often does this happen?
I upload my videos to Youtube once a week, if not less, at the most. The
kids, more
in the house is a sweet spot, it is
easily/cheaply retrofitted into any workstation with a free USB3 port and run’s
on any existing cat5.
From: NANOG On Behalf Of Michael
Thomas
Sent: Saturday, 26 December 2020 8:28 am
To: nanog@nanog.org
Subject: Re: [External] Re: 10g residential CPE
On 12/25/20 11:39 AM, Cory Sell wrote:
I saturate my 1G connection most during game downloads, file
downloads/uploads, full backup uploads, etc.
I also self-host a lot of services for personal use and having that
peak speed is really nice when you need it. It also had no traffic
limit per
I saturate my 1G connection most during game downloads, file downloads/uploads,
full backup uploads, etc.
I also self-host a lot of services for personal use and having that peak speed
is really nice when you need it. It also had no traffic limit per month which
is my biggest complaint about
On 12/25/20 11:04 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
On 12/25/20 20:10, Hunter Fuller via NANOG wrote:
It would meet some customers’ needs because multiple people could use
1G of service at a time. I think it is interesting to distinguish
“>1G CPE” from “true 10G CPE” and I suspect many / most
On 12/25/20 20:10, Hunter Fuller via NANOG wrote:
It would meet some customers’ needs because multiple people could use
1G of service at a time. I think it is interesting to distinguish “>1G
CPE” from “true 10G CPE” and I suspect many / most customers are
looking for the former.
Large
On Fri, Dec 25, 2020 at 12:07 Cory Sell via NANOG wrote:
> Just because nobody is mentioning it - you can always build a
> pfSense/VyOS/Vyatta box in whatever form factor you’d prefer. Even can run
> within a VM if you really want to.
>
For a CPE, openwrt would also work well. It runs well on a
On Fri, Dec 25, 2020 at 11:46 Bryan Fields wrote:
> On 12/25/20 4:52 AM, Mark Tinka wrote:
> > For the home, if you're looking at shipping 10Gbps-based CPE's for under
> > US$200, I can't think of anything other than the Tik:
> >
> > https://mikrotik.com/product/rb4011igs_rm
>
> That has 1
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