Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
[...] Now, if we had The ConTeXt Companion ... ... ConTeXt would probably stabilize, which IMHO is not a good thing. One thing I really love ConTeXt for is the speed new techniques are adopted (pdf features, luatex,...) One day we might have a ConTeXt MKII book for those who are afraid of swithing to pdftex2. Patrick -- ConTeXt wiki and more: http://contextgarden.net ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
[NTG-context] ConTeXt versioning model critique
Dear Patrtic, ... ConTeXt would probably stabilize, which IMHO is not a good thing. One thing I really love ConTeXt for is the speed new techniques are adopted (pdf features, luatex,...) One day we might have a ConTeXt MKII book for those who are afraid of swithing to pdftex2. ConTeXt should be eventually stabilized so that someone can make some use of it. But, there is a way for rapid adopting of new techniques too. My experience of using open-source products (I'm best familiar with Moodle) suggest that there should be overlapping cycles in development: 1. Allocate new version number and start implementing new features. Many things are broken at the moment and the version becomes unusable for production purposes. 2. Stabilize this version and make definite release (number x.x.). Now it can be used for production. 3. Continue resolve bugs in this version AND perform Step 1 IN PARALLEL. Moodle follows this model and I always wandered how smooth it was to migrate between releases. Everything is completely predictable. Please, look at http://download.moodle.org/ to get the idea of their versioning. I think ConTeXt needs similar versioning model badly. Now it has rather naive model (release dates) that doesn't help in deciding about stability at all. -- Best regards, Vyatcheslav Yatskovsky ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
[NTG-context] Some progress with XeTeX
Hello, I have some progress with XeTeX already (with the version included in TeXLive distribution). 1a) Including external graphics really requires ImageMagic to be installed. 1b) PDF pictures refuse to be inserted for unknown reason but PNGs are handled fine. 2) To use Windows encoding such as cp1251 (for Cyrrilc), two commands in preamble are needed: \enableregime[cp1251] \XeTeXinputencoding[cp1251] Question: what is a application to prepare custom vector graphics? Since pdfs are not included, it should be something more specific. My favourite one, Inkscape, allows export to .tex formatted for LaTex with PSTricks; obvously ConTeXt failes with it. -- Best regards, Vyatcheslav Yatskovsky ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] No way to use XeTeX
Hello Oliver,
Thank you very much. You encouraged me to do some more tests and finally I
discovered something useful.
The cow.pdf from context examples runs smoothly.
My .pdf was saved in Adobe Acrobat 8 Pro and this turns out the main cause.
Saving with older versions compatibility and adjusting other settings don't
help also. Anything created in this Acrobat fails in XeTeX.
And good news: pdf created in Inkscape seems to be valid input for XeTeX!
--
Best regards,
Vyatcheslav Yatskovsky
Well, first try inserting the sample PDF file cow.pdf supplied with
ConTeXt via
\placefigure{Test}{\externalfigure[cow]}
Contrary to including the familiar text snippets (like tufte, ward
etc.) you can't use cow.pdf directly from its original place in the
ConTeXt tree but you'll need to copy it into your working directory.
(You may have to download cont-img.zip from www.pragma-ade.com first
in order to find the sample images at all).
With ImageMagick installed (and write18 activated) XeTeX should now
generate an auxiliary file cow.pdf.rli when processing your TeX
source and include the figure flawlessly.
Let me know if this works.
Oliver
P.S. Dealing with your own PDF files would be the next step but I'm
currently trying to track down a nasty distortion issue and I haven't
quite figured out yet whether this is caused by a malformed PDF image
or by ConTeXt. However, the file cow.pdf appears to be harmless in
this respect, hence my advice to try this out first.
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Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt versioning model critique
Vyatcheslav Yatskovsky schrieb: [...] My experience of using open-source products (I'm best familiar with Moodle) suggest that there should be overlapping cycles in development: 1. Allocate new version number and start implementing new features. Many things are broken at the moment and the version becomes unusable for production purposes. 2. Stabilize this version and make definite release (number x.x.). Now it can be used for production. 3. Continue resolve bugs in this version AND perform Step 1 IN PARALLEL. [...] I think ConTeXt needs similar versioning model badly. Now it has rather naive model (release dates) that doesn't help in deciding about stability at all. There is another reason for adopting a versioning model: legacy documents. I wonder how people (esp. at Pragma) currently deal with this. What happens if you have a ConTeXt doc from say 1997 that compiles into the resp. PDF with some ConTeXt version from that time but not today anymore? Which ConTeXt versions does one have to keep in order to be able to use such a document? (A good example for this kind of trouble seem to be the current issues with XeTeX, but I haven't followed this in detail -- but it kept me away from updating my ConTeXt installation since December...). Also remember that Knuth originally intended TeX to be an eternal formatting system (thus we have at least the option to expand all macros into plain TeX and keep that as the source file). This raises another question: is ConTeXt developed in an test driven way? I.e. are there test documents (including e.g. XML documents, bibligraphic references etc.) that have to pass comilation in order for changes to be published? If so, they would probably define a standard set of commands that could go into The ConTeXt Companion. Cheers Ulf ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
Patrick Gundlach schrieb: Now, if we had The ConTeXt Companion ... ... ConTeXt would probably stabilize, which IMHO is not a good thing. One thing I really love ConTeXt for is the speed new techniques are adopted (pdf features, luatex,...) One day we might have a ConTeXt MKII book for those who are afraid of swithing to pdftex2. I don't think that The ConTeXt Companion (TCC) would halt ConTeXt development. The LaTeX Companion (TLC) didn't do that for LaTeX. Now, TLC was in 1st edition from 1994 to 2004, meaning that it was quite outdated in the end (one reason for me, btw, to look around wether there are other options to do teXing, and discovering ConTeXt). But it kept the reference situation in a well defined three step state: (1) look into one of the small LaTeX guides; (2) look into TLC; (3) look into package docs, internet etc. (which is, of course messy). My experience is that one rarely needed to go past (2). With ConTeXt there is, of course, the excursion (equiv. to (1)) and the manual (2), but many important issues (the phantastic XML processing capabilities, bibliography stuff, typography, font management,...) are not quite complete or covered elsewhere (i.e. situation 3). Ulf ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
With ConTeXt there is, of course, the excursion (equiv. to (1)) and the manual (2), but many important issues (the phantastic XML processing capabilities, bibliography stuff, typography, font management,...) are not quite complete or covered elsewhere (i.e. situation 3). I totally agree. There are of course documents about the last topics you mention (not to talk about the mailing list, of course), but they seems to need a more general introduction, at least for me. I'd like to have a book covering all the aspects so that you a conceptual frame which unifies the whole stuff. Then, you can procede by yourself in a more organized way. By the way, a similar issue has been raised about SuperCollider, which in my esperience is similar for documentation to ConTeXt. Many deep documents, a huge work by the developers, some good intro/ tutorial, but no a complete book. The situation has now evolved in a project about a SC book which has been submitted to MIT Press. In any case, I cannot understand how people can go back to LaTeX, I mean from a user's perpsective. I'm a total ConTeXt ignorant but, just using setups, I've created A1 musical scores involving metapost and importing external files, A0 academic posters using layers so much better then powerpoint, an on-going book full of syntax colorized code...I just wouldn't started with LaTeX :-) Best -a- Ulf ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context -- Andrea Valle -- CIRMA - DAMS Università degli Studi di Torino -- http://www.cirma.unito.it/andrea/ -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- I did this interview where I just mentioned that I read Foucault. Who doesn't in university, right? I was in this strip club giving this guy a lap dance and all he wanted to do was to discuss Foucault with me. Well, I can stand naked and do my little dance, or I can discuss Foucault, but not at the same time; too much information. (Annabel Chong) ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 02:58:11 -0600, Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... ConTeXt would probably stabilize, which IMHO is not a good thing. One thing I really love ConTeXt for is the speed new techniques are adopted (pdf features, luatex,...) One day we might have a ConTeXt MKII book for those who are afraid of swithing to pdftex2. Hmm, we had this discussion in Epen... I think that enough of the high-level interface is stable enough that a thorough ConTeXt book will be useful, particularly after luaTeX/pdfTeX2. I recall a particular someone at Epen volunteering to set up a working committee on this, even to write the book himself if no one volunteers to help soon... :D :D :D As for MKII/pdfTeX1, it makes no sense making a book for a stalled branch; pdfTeX1 will go the way of the original TeX engine. Who today will write a book for those who only want to use the dvi format? Best Idris -- Professor Idris Samawi Hamid Department of Philosophy Colorado State University Fort Collins, CO 80523 -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
[NTG-context] Pagebreak only after stanzas
Hi, i am a fresh convert to Context from Latex and deeply impressed by it's ability to set multiple pages on one page, even doublesided ones. For setting a collection of poems I use \obeylines and \smallskip to arrange them on the page. Pagebreaks should only be possible between stanzas at the \smallskip-mark. Could somebody tell me, how to achieve this? Thanks in advance Chris ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
Idris Samawi Hamid wrote: On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 02:58:11 -0600, Patrick Gundlach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... ConTeXt would probably stabilize, which IMHO is not a good thing. One thing I really love ConTeXt for is the speed new techniques are adopted (pdf features, luatex,...) One day we might have a ConTeXt MKII book for those who are afraid of swithing to pdftex2. Hmm, we had this discussion in Epen... I think that enough of the high-level interface is stable enough that a thorough ConTeXt book will be useful, particularly after luaTeX/pdfTeX2. I recall a particular someone at Epen volunteering to set up a working committee on this, even to write the book himself if no one volunteers to help soon... :D :D :D As for MKII/pdfTeX1, it makes no sense making a book for a stalled branch; pdfTeX1 will go the way of the original TeX engine. Who today will write a book for those who only want to use the dvi format? hey, it's not that bad ... functionality will not change but mkiv - will have less to no input encoding and font encoding mess to be explained - font installation wil be easier due to lack of encodings - some functionality will be more robust due to node postprocessing (hidden for user) - some new stuff (for idris -) So ... apart from some chapters, much mkii/mkiv descriptions are the same Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
Ulf Martin wrote: With ConTeXt there is, of course, the excursion (equiv. to (1)) and the manual (2), but many important issues (the phantastic XML processing capabilities, bibliography stuff, typography, font management,...) are not quite complete or covered elsewhere (i.e. situation 3). concerning xml ... i will update that manual once we have mkiv in place; currently xml processing has some dark corners when tex and xml are used mixed but this will go away; i also have some experimental xml manipulation code laying around (filtering, replacing, etc). In this respect mkiv will be quite powerfull for xml Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt versioning model critique
Ulf Martin wrote: I wonder how people (esp. at Pragma) currently deal with this. What happens if you have a ConTeXt doc from say 1997 that compiles into the resp. PDF with some ConTeXt version from that time but not today anymore? Which ConTeXt versions does one have to keep in order to be able to use such a document? (A good example for this kind of trouble seem to be the current issues with XeTeX, but I haven't followed this in detail -- but it kept me away from updating my ConTeXt installation since December...). for projects where we use relatively new features (which evolve) we use frozen trees; actually some of this code is not even documented (simply no time; take synchronized graphics) with regards to commands and such ... context is just (supposed to be) downward compatible; even kind of obsolete is still there; with regards to different solutions to problems, we often provide control usign low level mode indicators concerning xetex ... keep in mind that there xetex is the moving target (changes/extensions in interface) and to some extend this was true for pdftex as well, but there we could silently adapt Also remember that Knuth originally intended TeX to be an eternal formatting system (thus we have at least the option to expand all macros into plain TeX and keep that as the source file). plain tex is just a format and unsuitable as expanded format well, i have some experimental code that dumps the expanded token list into a file; nu fun ... a 50 page moderately complex doc becomes some 25 meg -) but then, if the sole reason is to reprocess the doc ... just save the pdf file -) This raises another question: is ConTeXt developed in an test driven way? I.e. are there test documents (including e.g. XML documents, bibligraphic references etc.) that have to pass comilation in order for changes to be published? If so, they would probably define a standard set of commands that could go into The ConTeXt Companion. Sanjoy has set up an advanced test system ... so anything that you contribute can go in there Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] The ConTeXt Companion
book for those who only want to use the dvi format? hey, it's not that bad ... After all it's DeVice Independent. Maybe today it sounds better if we say 'output format independant' ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] ConTeXt versioning model critique
On 4/14/07, Hans Hagen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ulf Martin wrote: I wonder how people (esp. at Pragma) currently deal with this. for projects where we use relatively new features (which evolve) we use frozen trees; Confirm One tree of 2002 (still-crazy-after-all-these-years). Another of 2004. Switch to last pdftex/context sometimes second quarter of this year; switch to luatex at the end of next year. Why switch ? Last versions. are better (speed and features); pdf spec. change . with regards to commands and such ... context is just (supposed to be) downward compatible; even kind of obsolete is still there; with regards to different solutions to problems, we often provide control usign low level mode indicators On average, my macros are not completly portable from one tree to another, but I'm sure that this depend from my poor coding tecnique for 95% . 5% is made by spaces and fonts . concerning xetex ... keep in mind that there xetex is the moving target (changes/extensions in interface) and to some extend this was true for pdftex as well, but there we could silently adapt Also remember that Knuth originally intended TeX to be an eternal formatting system (thus we have at least the option to expand all macros into plain TeX and keep that as the source file). plain tex is just a format and unsuitable as expanded format well, i have some experimental code that dumps the expanded token list into a file; nu fun ... a 50 page moderately complex doc becomes some 25 meg -) pdf has some sort of compression . Do \pdfcompresslevel=0 \pdfobjcompresslevel=0 make some differences in your 50page document? Sanjoy has set up an advanced test system ... so anything that you contribute can go in there I will install on my machine. luigi ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Pagebreak only after stanzas
On 4/14/07, Bert Trüger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, i am a fresh convert to Context from Latex and deeply impressed by it's ability to set multiple pages on one page, even doublesided ones. For setting a collection of poems I use \obeylines and \smallskip to arrange them on the page. Pagebreaks should only be possible between stanzas at the \smallskip-mark. Could somebody tell me, how to achieve this? Can you post a small example ? ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Pagebreak only after stanzas
On Sat, 14 Apr 2007, Bert Trüger wrote:
Hi,
i am a fresh convert to Context from Latex and deeply impressed by
it's ability to set multiple pages on one page, even doublesided
ones.
For setting a collection of poems I use \obeylines and \smallskip
to arrange them on the page. Pagebreaks should only be possible
between stanzas at the \smallskip-mark. Could somebody tell me, how
to achieve this?
Probably, the easiest way to do that will be to add a bit of a markup.
Something like (untested)
\setuplines[after={\blank[small]}] %or after=\smallskip
\defineframedtext[stanza][width=\textwidth,before=\startlines,after=\stoplines]
\startstanza
\stopstanza
Since framedtext is a box, it will not break across pages.
Aditya
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[NTG-context] Hanging punctuation is impressive
Hello, I've just read a about hanging punctuation in Hans' Typographic Programming manual. It is very impressive; now I understand one more cause why Word documents look so ugly. :) Unfortunatelly, I cannot try those examples by myself, since I run TeXLive2007 that don't have Palatino font preinstalled and I'm confident only with MiKTeX in font installing issues. Is it possible to use this feature with XeTeX? Or should I impatiently wait for LuaTeX? -- Best regards, Vyatcheslav Yatskovsky ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] Hanging punctuation is impressive
On Sun, 15 Apr 2007, Vyatcheslav Yatskovsky wrote: Hello, I've just read a about hanging punctuation in Hans' Typographic Programming manual. It is very impressive; now I understand one more cause why Word documents look so ugly. :) Unfortunatelly, I cannot try those examples by myself, since I run TeXLive2007 that don't have Palatino font preinstalled and I'm confident only with MiKTeX in font installing issues. You do not need Palatino to use hanging puntuation. Hanging punctuation can be used with any font. The wiki has instructions on how to use hanging punctuation with other fonts. Is it possible to use this feature with XeTeX? Or should I impatiently wait for LuaTeX? From what I understand, character expansion can not be used with XeTeX. I am not sure about character protrusion. Since LuaTeX is supposed to pdftex2, I am sure that it will support all the features of pdftex, so hanging punctuation will be supported. Aditya ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
[NTG-context] texexec+mpost cmr10 vs CMR10 trouble using dvips backend
A font-embedding issue puzzles me. First I make a metapost figure that uses plain tex for the label, so it uses cmr10. Then I include it in a context document to get a .ps file. The problem is that the label shows up in Courier (which ghostscript uses when it cannot find the font, I think). Here is the test.tex \starttext \externalfigure[fig.1] \stoptext and this fig.mp beginfig(1) label(btex hello etex, origin); endfig; end The commands are: mpost fig texexec --ps test gv test.ps The resulting fig.1 has these lines: %*Font: cmr10 9.96265 9.96265 65:912 ... (hello) cmr10 9.96265 fshow and test.ps has %%DocumentFonts: LMRoman12-Regular CMR10 But there's no cmr10 (lowercase) embedded in test.ps. If I generate test.pdf directly (with texexec test), then all is well. Is there a magic option or map file line that I need? [ConTeXt ver: 2007.03.19 11:20 MKII fmt: 2007.4.12] Thanks for any suggestions! The reason I'm using dvi and ps is that arxiv.org cannot handle ConTeXt submissions directly. A workaround recommended by the arxiv.org maintainers is to submit document.ps with all the source files in a separate directory (but it won't let you submit document.pdf with all the source files, a behavior that the admins say is a bug or 'oddity' but not one that they'll fix soon). -Sanjoy `Intellectual property is intellectual theft.' ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Re: [NTG-context] texexec+mpost cmr10 vs CMR10 trouble using dvips backend
On Sun, 15 Apr 2007, Sanjoy Mahajan wrote: A font-embedding issue puzzles me. First I make a metapost figure that uses plain tex for the label, so it uses cmr10. Then I include it in a context document to get a .ps file. The problem is that the label shows up in Courier (which ghostscript uses when it cannot find the font, I think). I get this all the time when I try to preview my mp figures in ghostview. I thought that this was because my system was misconfigured and never really bothered to go into the details. Thanks for any suggestions! The reason I'm using dvi and ps is that arxiv.org cannot handle ConTeXt submissions directly. A workaround recommended by the arxiv.org maintainers is to submit document.ps with all the source files in a separate directory (but it won't let you submit document.pdf with all the source files, a behavior that the admins say is a bug or 'oddity' but not one that they'll fix soon). Since they are not going to process the source, how about generating a pdf and then converting the pdf into ps. Aditya ___ ntg-context mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
