Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Eelco Hoogendoorn
Note that I am not opposed to extra operators in python, and only mildly opposed to a matrix multiplication operator in numpy; but let me lay out the case against, for your consideration. First of all, the use of matrix semantics relative to arrays semantics is extremely rare; even in linear

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Anthony Scopatz
This is awesome! Congrats! On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Eelco Hoogendoorn hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote: Note that I am not opposed to extra operators in python, and only mildly opposed to a matrix multiplication operator in numpy; but let me lay out the case against, for your

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Nathaniel Smith
On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 2:39 PM, Eelco Hoogendoorn hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote: Note that I am not opposed to extra operators in python, and only mildly opposed to a matrix multiplication operator in numpy; but let me lay out the case against, for your consideration. First of all, the

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread josef . pktd
On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 10:54 AM, Nathaniel Smith n...@pobox.com wrote: On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 2:39 PM, Eelco Hoogendoorn hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote: Note that I am not opposed to extra operators in python, and only mildly opposed to a matrix multiplication operator in numpy; but

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Eric Moore
On Sunday, March 16, 2014, josef.p...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 10:54 AM, Nathaniel Smith n...@pobox.comjavascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','n...@pobox.com'); wrote: On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 2:39 PM, Eelco Hoogendoorn

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Eelco Hoogendoorn
Different people work on different code and have different experiences here -- yours may or may be typical yours. Pauli did some quick checks on scikit-learn nipy scipy, and found that in their test suites, uses of np.dot and uses of elementwise-multiplication are ~equally common:

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Nathaniel Smith
On Sun, Mar 16, 2014 at 4:33 PM, Eelco Hoogendoorn hoogendoorn.ee...@gmail.com wrote: Different people work on different code and have different experiences here -- yours may or may be typical yours. Pauli did some quick checks on scikit-learn nipy scipy, and found that in their test suites,

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Eelco Hoogendoorn
An important distinction between calling dot or @ is that matrix multiplication is a domain where enormous effort has already been spent on algorithms and building fast, scalable libraries. Yes einsum can call these for some subset of calls but it's also trivial to set up a case where it can't.

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-16 Thread Joseph Martinot-Lagarde
Le 16/03/2014 15:39, Eelco Hoogendoorn a écrit : Note that I am not opposed to extra operators in python, and only mildly opposed to a matrix multiplication operator in numpy; but let me lay out the case against, for your consideration. First of all, the use of matrix semantics relative to

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-15 Thread Charles R Harris
On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 6:51 PM, Nathaniel Smith n...@pobox.com wrote: Well, that was fast. Guido says he'll accept the addition of '@' as an infix operator for matrix multiplication, once some details are ironed out: https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-ideas/2014-March/027109.html

[Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Nathaniel Smith
Well, that was fast. Guido says he'll accept the addition of '@' as an infix operator for matrix multiplication, once some details are ironed out: https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-ideas/2014-March/027109.html http://legacy.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0465/ Specifically, we need to figure

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Aron Ahmadia
That's the best news I've had all week. Thanks for all your work on this Nathan. -A On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 8:51 PM, Nathaniel Smith n...@pobox.com wrote: Well, that was fast. Guido says he'll accept the addition of '@' as an infix operator for matrix multiplication, once some details are

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Frédéric Bastien
This is great news. Excellent work Nathaniel and all others! Frédéric On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 8:57 PM, Aron Ahmadia a...@ahmadia.net wrote: That's the best news I've had all week. Thanks for all your work on this Nathan. -A On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 8:51 PM, Nathaniel Smith n...@pobox.com

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Christophe Bal
This id good for Numpyists but this will be another operator that good also help in another contexts. As a math user, I was first very skeptical but finally this is a good news for non Numpyists too. Christophe BAL Le 15 mars 2014 02:01, Frédéric Bastien no...@nouiz.org a écrit : This is great

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Chris Laumann
That’s great.  Does this mean that, in the not-so-distant future, the matrix class will go the way of the dodos? I have had more subtle to fix bugs sneak into code b/c something returns a matrix instead of an array than almost any other single source I can think of. Having two almost

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Nathaniel Smith
On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 3:18 AM, Chris Laumann chris.laum...@gmail.com wrote: That’s great. Does this mean that, in the not-so-distant future, the matrix class will go the way of the dodos? I have had more subtle to fix bugs sneak into code b/c something returns a matrix instead of an

Re: [Numpy-discussion] It looks like Py 3.5 will include a dedicated infix matrix multiply operator

2014-03-14 Thread Travis Oliphant
Congratulations Nathaniel! This is great news! Well done on starting the process and taking things forward. Travis On Mar 14, 2014 7:51 PM, Nathaniel Smith n...@pobox.com wrote: Well, that was fast. Guido says he'll accept the addition of '@' as an infix operator for matrix multiplication,