Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

And, of course, it's entirely the EPA's fault that an abandoned mine had been festering for almost a hundred years, leaking "toxic water at a rate of 50 to 250 gallons a minute" even before the EPA sent a contractor's crew to investigate remediating the existing leakage. On 10/25/2015 4:49 PM,

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Thanks, Steve. I did wonder if anyone looked at the photos. On 10/25/15 5:35 PM, pdml-requ...@pdml.net wrote: Message: 12 Date: Sun, 25 Oct 2015 16:34:27 -0600 From: steve harley<p...@paper-ape.com> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List<pdml@pdml.net> Subject: Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Can I have an "Amen" On 10/26/15 9:12 AM, pdml-requ...@pdml.net wrote: Message: 7 Date: Sun, 25 Oct 2015 22:58:11 -0400 From: "Daniel J. Matyola"<danmaty...@gmail.com> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List<pdml@pdml.net> Subject: Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills Message-ID:

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Yes, it's the EPA's fault, they were told, by industry experts, not to fuck with it. That the cofferdam was unstable, and could be easily breached. Yet, the EPA persisted in fucking with it, until it was breached. Thus changing the problem from one of local contamination to one of regional

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Only just looked at this picture. The horse looks like My Little Pony. Revolting. B > On 25 Oct 2015, at 22:35, steve harley wrote: > >> On 2015-10-24 10:03 , Donald Guthrie wrote: >> On the subject of statues carved out of the hillside this one is among the >>

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Does that make Crazy Horse a Brony? Cheers, frank On October 25, 2015 8:55:22 PM EDT, Bob W-PDML wrote: >Only just looked at this picture. The horse looks like My Little Pony. >Revolting. > >B > >> On 25 Oct 2015, at 22:35, steve harley wrote: >> >>>

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On Sun, Oct 25, 2015 at 4:30 PM, knarf wrote: > There are some places that it's best tourists ~not~ go to. Well, It's goo that we of the unwashed masses have men of taste and virtue to tell us where we should and should not go. Dan Matyola

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I'm merely expressing an opinion, Dan. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do. I've never claimed to have taste and believe me, I'm hardly virtuous. LOL! Cheers, frank On October 25, 2015 10:58:11 PM EDT, "Daniel J. Matyola" wrote: >On Sun, Oct 25, 2015 at

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On 2015-10-24 10:03 , Donald Guthrie wrote: On the subject of statues carved out of the hillside this one is among the controversial set. Is it the hopeless dream that will be never completed, another hideous artwork, or a great tribute to Native Americans who have blessed the project. It is

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Yeah, aesthetically it leaves a lot to be desired. Paul via phone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 8:55 PM, Bob W-PDML wrote: > > Only just looked at this picture. The horse looks like My Little Pony. > Revolting. > > B > >>> On 25 Oct 2015, at 22:35, steve harley

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

So far anyway > On 25 Oct 2015, at 20:15, knarf wrote: > > Nature always "wins". One way or the other... > > Cheers, > > frank > >> On October 25, 2015 2:47:17 PM EDT, Jack Davis wrote: >> Time will eventually replace it all. >> >> J >> >>

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On 2015-10-25 14:49 , P.J. Alling wrote: Based on the track records, Governments are a poor choice to make such decisions. I think the Navaho would say the Government should go to Hell based on recent events on their reservation. A mining company would never have made such a stupid mistake and

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Technically that may be true, in reality this is what happens. On 10/25/2015 4:58 PM, knarf wrote: That's not a government decision or policy gone awry, it's an error made by a government employee or agent in the implementation of an action. That horrendous situation says nothing to whether

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On 2015-10-25 14:44 , knarf wrote: So-called ecotourism is having an impact on pristine areas of rain forests and other sensitive areas, all so rich Western folk can get up close and personal with orangutans (to use one example). ecotourism is meant to be an alternative to more destructive

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

By extension one could argue that the cave paintings of early humans desecrated nature. Mankind leaves it's mark and writes a history for better or worse. It's the way of the world. Paul via phone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 11:59 AM, John wrote: > > According to Wikipedia,

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

That's EXACTLY what I said, Paul. It's either "tourism everywhere" or "tourism nowhere". https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma Cheers, frank On October 25, 2015 1:45:14 PM EDT, Paul Stenquist wrote: >Are tourists desirable anywhere? We could all stay in our

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Are tourists desirable anywhere? We could all stay in our rooms with shades drawn. Paul via phone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 12:38 PM, knarf wrote: > > Is bringing tourists out there desirable? > > Cheers, > > frank > >> On October 24, 2015 5:40:43 PM EDT, Bob

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Slippery slope argument Paul. Won't work. Of course, every human activity, indeed every activity of every thing, has an ecological impact. We need to assess each activity individually and decide if the impact is desirable or not, irrespective of what other impacts have occurred at other

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Nature always "wins". One way or the other... Cheers, frank On October 25, 2015 2:47:17 PM EDT, Jack Davis wrote: >Time will eventually replace it all. > >J > >Sent from my iPhone > >> On Oct 25, 2015, at 10:43 AM, Paul Stenquist > wrote: >> >>

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I'm not a "let the government do everything" type of guy (despite a general perception to the contrary). I am against a pervasive government interfering in our day-to-day lives. But who better than the government to decide on environmental and land use issues like this? And if not the

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I was being ironic. I neither meant nor said it. There are some places that it's best tourists ~not~ go to. I'm not sure but the Black Hills may be one such place. I was initially reacting to Bob's post, merely pointing out that tourism isn't always a good thing. Tourism ~in and of itself~ is

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I have to admit I've never understood why anyone would want to desecrate a natural formation like Mt Rushmore in that way. But, I'm Australian so what would I know... When we were in the USA in 2013 we were about three hours drive of Mt Rushmore but none of us had any interest or desire to visit.

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

The most obvious answer regarding Paris, London and Rome is that they're huge urban areas with an infrastructure in place to handle tourists. No doubt they're a net benefit to those cities. The Pyramids have been a tourist destination for long enough that whatever ecological damage that's

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Based on the track records, Governments are a poor choice to make such decisions. I think the Navaho would say the Government should go to Hell based on recent events on their reservation. A mining company would never have made such a stupid mistake and if they had they could be sued.

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

That's not a government decision or policy gone awry, it's an error made by a government employee or agent in the implementation of an action. That horrendous situation says nothing to whether the government is the best organ to protect the environment or to make decisions regarding it.

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

According to Wikipedia, encouraging tourism was the original reason for creating it. On 10/24/2015 5:40 PM, Bob Sullivan wrote: Ann, You need to get over it. The sculpture has brought thousands (millions) out to look at the Black Hills. Otherwise, folks would never go there. Regards, Bob S.

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Is bringing tourists out there desirable? Cheers, frank On October 24, 2015 5:40:43 PM EDT, Bob Sullivan wrote: >Ann, >You need to get over it. >The sculpture has brought thousands (millions) out to look at the Black >Hills. >Otherwise, folks would never go there.

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

No, you asked if we wanted tourists in the Dakotas. Although I confess to not having read the entire thread. Busy doing laundry. Paul via phone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 2:08 PM, knarf wrote: > > That's EXACTLY what I said, Paul. It's either "tourism everywhere" or >

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I would think the Gov. has long since made it's decision in support of continuing with the project "as long as it's financially feasible." J Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 11:25 AM, knarf wrote: > > The Government should decide. > > Cheers, > >

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Time will eventually replace it all. J Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 10:43 AM, Paul Stenquist wrote: > > By extension one could argue that the cave paintings of early humans > desecrated nature. Mankind leaves it's mark and writes a history for better >

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On 10/25/2015 12:25 PM, knarf wrote: The Government should decide. Ouch. I hope not. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Tourists go to Paris for the Eiffel Tower; London for Big Ben; Rome for the Colosseum. They go to Egypt for the pyramids & the Spinx. Tourism provides a significant revenue in each of those places. Why should the Dakotas be denied? On 10/25/2015 12:38 PM, knarf wrote: Is bringing tourists out

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Who should make the assessment? Evidently both Rushmore and Crazy Horse were judged worthy. Paul via phone > On Oct 25, 2015, at 1:57 PM, knarf wrote: > > Slippery slope argument Paul. Won't work. > > Of course, every human activity, indeed every activity of every

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

The Government should decide. Cheers, frank On October 25, 2015 2:20:11 PM EDT, Paul Stenquist wrote: >Who should make the assessment? Evidently both Rushmore and Crazy Horse >were judged worthy. > >Paul via phone > >> On Oct 25, 2015, at 1:57 PM, knarf

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Don't lump me in with those who consider it a desecration of nature. Bob pointed out that it had "brought thousands (millions) out to look at the Black Hills" and I noted encouraging tourism was the original purpose for which it was intended, and that seems to have worked. I would like to see

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Might have been what you meant, but it's *NOT* what you wrote. On 10/25/2015 2:08 PM, knarf wrote: That's EXACTLY what I said, Paul. It's either "tourism everywhere" or "tourism nowhere". https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma Cheers, frank On October 25, 2015 1:45:14 PM EDT, Paul

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I'll go with hopeless dream of a great tribute that's not likely to be completed in my lifetime. On 10/24/2015 12:03 PM, Donald Guthrie wrote: On the subject of statues carved out of the hillside this one is among the controversial set. Is it the hopeless dream that will be never completed,

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I wouldn't say it's hideous artwork but it's certainly a desecration of a beautiful natural formation. If they stopped now I'd be pretty pleased. Cheers, frank On October 24, 2015 12:03:12 PM EDT, Donald Guthrie wrote: >On the subject of statues carved out of the

Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On the subject of statues carved out of the hillside this one is among the controversial set. Is it the hopeless dream that will be never completed, another hideous artwork, or a great tribute to Native Americans who have blessed the project. It is being done entirely with private funding &

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

I imagine the thought of just tweeting the viewing area and being done with it is prevalent in the teams quiet mutterings. J Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 24, 2015, at 10:28 AM, knarf wrote: > > I wouldn't say it's hideous artwork but it's certainly a desecration of

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On 10/24/2015 12:48 PM, P.J. Alling wrote: On 10/24/2015 12:03 PM, Donald Guthrie wrote: On the subject of statues carved out of the hillside this one is among the controversial set. Is it the hopeless dream that will be never completed, another hideous artwork, or a great tribute to Native

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

On 10/24/2015 12:03 PM, Donald Guthrie wrote: On the subject of statues carved out of the hillside this one is among the controversial set. Is it the hopeless dream that will be never completed, another hideous artwork, or a great tribute to Native Americans who have blessed the project. It is

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

Ann, You need to get over it. The sculpture has brought thousands (millions) out to look at the Black Hills. Otherwise, folks would never go there. Regards, Bob S. On Sat, Oct 24, 2015 at 4:34 PM, ann sanfedele wrote: > In answer to Mt. RUshmore? > > Ithink they areboth

Re: Geso Crazy Horse in the Black Hills

In answer to Mt. RUshmore? Ithink they areboth desecrating nature , but asa reply to Rushmore bothers me less - Nice shots, Don - On 10/24/2015 2:25 PM, Jack Davis wrote: I imagine the thought of just tweeting the viewing area and being done with it is prevalent in the teams quiet