RE: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-29 Thread Davies, Daniel
-L:28685] Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery Michael Perelman wrote: The Wall Street Journal article does not say that the grinder represented particularly modern technology; nor was it a commercial product. I think most people would regarded as an example of appropriate technology. Don't you find

Re: RE: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-29 Thread Doug Henwood
Davies, Daniel wrote: No fair. The EF Schumacher crowd are pretty non-judgemental on this sort of issue. Appropriate technology basically just means technology that can be maintained and repaired without requiring an already existing industrial society; those wind-up radios certainly count.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-28 Thread Justin Schwartz
**Completely off the subject. Your answer to my question on legal briefs did not quite give the information I was looking for. Let me put it this way. Imagine I'm about to go to trial in a civil suit with a lot of money at stake. Taking your 15 hours a day for three weeks straight figure

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-28 Thread Justin Schwartz
I agree, but then who judges accountants like Andersens? Other accountants? Does any profession ever pass adverse verdict on the leading lights of that profession? Qui custodiet ipsos custodes? (Juvenal, Satires, if I recall). An old question. I haven't got an easy answer. We have this

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Justin Schwartz
How about nuclear engineers? Hospital surgeons and administrators? College professors? You think any of those groups currently want democratization of their expertise and accountability if it means a diminution of the scale and scope of their power? Just how much difference would there be

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread ravi
Justin Schwartz wrote: Why would be a such a great idea to have the demos tell college professors how to run their shop? In most of this country, that would result in the shut-down of biological departments, except for ag depts, the conversion of most philosophy depts into bastions of

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Ulhas Joglekar
Justin Schwartz wrote: In my typical, class-blinkered, petty bourgeois manner, I am a real fan of expertise. Democracy has its place, but not in micro-managing the use of real expertise by real experts. There are skills that require long study and constant application to master, and where

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Waistline2
In a message dated 7/27/02 6:07:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How about nuclear engineers? Hospital surgeons and administrators? College professors? You think any of those groups currently want democratization of their expertise and accountability if it means a

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Michael Perelman
Justin mentions that an ill-informed public might interfere with a rational university program. He is correct. One of the difficulty of substantial reforms is that their success often depends on a host of other reforms -- in this case, a reformed educational system, media Yesterday, NPR

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Gar Lipow
Justin Schwartz wrote: Why would be a such a great idea to have the demos tell college professors how to run their shop? In most of this country, that would result in the shut-down of biological departments, except for ag depts, the conversion of most philosophy depts into bastions of

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Doug Henwood
Justin Schwartz wrote: In my typical, class-blinkered, petty bourgeois manner, I am a real fan of expertise. Democracy has its place, but not in micro-managing the use of real expertise by real experts. There are skills that require long study and constant application to master, and where the

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Doug Henwood
Michael Perelman wrote: The Wall Street Journal article does not say that the grinder represented particularly modern technology; nor was it a commercial product. I think most people would regarded as an example of appropriate technology. Don't you find something a touch patronizing about the

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-27 Thread Michael Perelman
I don't find the term appropriate technology patronizing. Shiva was pretty accurate in what she said about the Green Revolution. Like the Monsanto Roundup-ready genetically modified seeds, it was intended to use more industrially produced fertilizers and pesticides. The grinder was appropriate

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-26 Thread Ian Murray
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 5:53 PM Subject: [PEN-L:28636] Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery In a message dated 7/26/02 5:03:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ian Murray wrote: The strongest objections

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Drudgery

2002-07-26 Thread Carrol Cox
Ian Murray wrote: -- Actually Feenberg, coming from a Marxian-Marcusian-Heideggerian standpoint pays a lot of attention to May 68 as well as address property relations. But you'd have to actually read his books to see that. I intended my comment to apply only to the specific sentence