[PEN-L] John Hogue's New Book: Nostradamus: The War with Iran

2008-01-11 Thread Ruy Lage
Hi All All the best for the year ahead (minus 11 days). Snow in Baghdad made me wonder if someone had already come up with something from Nostradamus proving it is prophecy! Looks like it hasn't reached the charlatan-mill yet. But I came across this book.

[PEN-L] Health care reform

2008-01-11 Thread Seth Sandronsky
Come health or high prices Critics say Núñez-Schwarzenegger health-care proposal does nothing to control costs By Seth Sandronsky There’s no question what’s ailing our festering health-care system. Soaring costs for insurance premiums have pushed health care beyond the reach of 47

[PEN-L] doug henwood on Kuttner

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
http://www.truthdig.com/arts_culture/page2/20080110_doug_henwood_on_robert_kuttners_the_squandering_of_america/ Nice job! -- Michael Perelman Economics Department California State University Chico, CA 95929 Tel. 530-898-5321 E-Mail michael at ecst.csuchico.edu michaelperelman.wordpress.com

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
Also, listservs are not well served by provocative remarks, especially when they have already been made. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 08:53:48AM -0800, Leigh Meyers wrote: It's EXACTLY what listservs are for... FWIW, I consider movie reviews on listservs bad form unless it is a movies-l,

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, The costs of empires is high. One asks why Britain came down? Projecting military power around the world is costly. Community based resistance which arms itself with current weapons can't be militarily defeated unless the empire adopts scorched earth techniques. Which are

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Louis Proyect
For you teachers out there, how do you pedagogically deal with this in the classroom? Any thoughts? Best, Brian McKenna Please, this is pen-l. It is considered bad form for teachers to give their thoughts on anything, unless it is Michael Perelman or Jim Devine. Teachers much prefer to deep

[PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Brian McKenna
In my classes these days I'm increasingly presented with an argument in support of all US aggression that seems compelling for many . It goes like this. All nations want protection and all are inherently for power.  If they can become an empire they will.  IF THE US DOES NOT STEP INTO THE VOID

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
Lou, most of the people on the list -- probably most lists -- prefer to lurk. From time to time, I used to set aside a period when the regulars were asked not to post anything to make way for lurkers, but that tactic never worked. Lurkers, let's hear from you. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, On Jan 11, 2008, at 8:35 AM, Louis Proyect wrote: Please, this is pen-l. It is considered bad form for teachers to give their thoughts on anything, unless it is Michael Perelman or Jim Devine. Teachers much prefer to deep lurk unless there is some non-teacher interloper

[PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, Scientific American online has this article here: http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan That suggests a plan for 480 billion (in increments from now to 2050) to completely go over to solar energy in the U.S. economy. Any thoughts from renewable economics

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Shane Mage
On Jan 11, 2008, at 1:37 PM, Gar Lipow wrote: On Jan 11, 2008 10:01 AM, Shane Mage [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 11, 2008, at 12:19 PM, Doyle Saylor wrote: Greetings Economists, Scientific American online has this article here: http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Charles Brown
Well, for one thing, the US is the current empire. So, there is no void of empire. They would have to be saying, if the US ends its empire, somebody might step into the void. It might be good to get them to realize that the US is an empire. 100 plus military bases around the world . No nation

Re: [PEN-L] What happened to Robert Reich?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
He was supposed to be the most leftist of the right wing bunch. This book was a big disappointment. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 12:15:36AM -0600, Matthijs Krul wrote: I am reviewing his Supercapitalism. It reads like something from the DLC. When did he move so far to the right? --

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Gar Lipow
On Jan 11, 2008 10:01 AM, Shane Mage [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 11, 2008, at 12:19 PM, Doyle Saylor wrote: Greetings Economists, Scientific American online has this article here: http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan That suggests a plan for 480 billion (in

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, On Jan 11, 2008, at 8:53 AM, Leigh Meyers wrote: It's EXACTLY what listservs are for... Doyle, I'm not sure what you mean by exactly here, but what a listserv doesn't do is provide an environment for working on a topic in the sense that wikis offer organized means of

[PEN-L] Benton Harbor , Michigan

2008-01-11 Thread Charles Brown
In a meeting on foreclosures, someone reported that 60% of the homes in Benton Harbor , Michigan are in tax foreclosure. Charles

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, On Jan 11, 2008, at 11:32 AM, Shane Mage wrote: A hydrogen-powered vehicle (car, bus, truck, dirigible, bike, ship or boat) is totally infrared-blocking-emission free when the hydrogen is produced by electrolysis driven by electricity from a wind farm. Both fuel cells

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, On Jan 11, 2008, at 10:01 AM, Shane Mage wrote: This, of course, requires a huge dose of government enterprise and economic planning. Doyle; I assume the pressure to move would come from people seeing global warming encroaches. I don't think this is especially useful as

Re: [PEN-L] Negroponte believes Brazil has money + $75 laptop

2008-01-11 Thread raghu
While I agree the whole one laptop for every child concept is a bit wacky, Negroponte runs a non-profit not a business and there is no reason to doubt that it is a well-intentioned project. Also $13B may be a lot of money when it comes to Brazilian school children but I believe it is less than the

Re: [PEN-L] query: Marx quote

2008-01-11 Thread raghu
On Jan 10, 2008 8:32 AM, Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: did Marx ever say anything like Societal deviations in terms of the distribution of wealth for example, must be minimized? (supposedly he said this in CAPITAL, according to Nassim Nicholas Taleb, THE BLACK SWAN, p. 242.) It seems

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Jim Devine
Brian McKenna wrote: In my classes these days I'm increasingly presented with an argument in support of all US aggression that seems compelling for many . It goes like this. All nations want protection and all are inherently for power. If they can become an empire they will. IF THE US DOES

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread ravi
On Jan 11, 2008, at 11:35 AM, Louis Proyect wrote: Teachers much prefer to deep lurk unless there is some non-teacher interloper that disturbs their peace in which case Michael Perelman is forced to act on their behalf. I am not sure the above holds. I am one of the more prolific posters on

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
Our enemies do better: Japan, Germany, Vietnam. Not the powerful Grenada, however. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 05:39:24PM -0500, ravi wrote: Charles already pointed out that we are the empire -- there is no void. The other option is to take Chomsky's argument: look at the data on the places we

Re: [PEN-L] query: Marx quote

2008-01-11 Thread Charles Brown
Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] 01/11/2008 5:32 PM raghu wrote: In particular, the emergence of Statistics led Adolph Quetelet and others to formulate a generalized notion of the normal as an imperative(Davis 11). Through his construct of l'homme moyen physique and l'homme moyen morale, a

Re: [PEN-L] query: Marx quote

2008-01-11 Thread Jim Devine
raghu wrote: In particular, the emergence of Statistics led Adolph Quetelet and others to formulate a generalized notion of the normal as an imperative(Davis 11). Through his construct of l'homme moyen physique and l'homme moyen morale, a physical and moral average man, Quetelet creates a

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Jim Devine
Michael Perelman wrote: Our enemies do better: Japan, Germany, Vietnam. I don't think that Vietnam is doing that well, except in terms of market criteria. Even then, it's part of the race (or crawl) to the bottom. It will be out-competed by another country with even lower wages, laxer

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
But the US hasn't really tried to coerce it into any policies. It mostly bullies friends. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 02:50:43PM -0800, Jim Devine wrote: Michael Perelman wrote: Our enemies do better: Japan, Germany, Vietnam. I don't think that Vietnam is doing that well, except in terms of

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Peter Hollings
What if the British Empire ran the whole world? What alternatives then would the American colonists seeking religious freedom, better opportunities, economic emancipation, etc., have had? I might take this further and argue that cultural diversity is valuable and we should value it just as we do

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Doug Henwood
On Jan 11, 2008, at 6:20 PM, Peter Hollings wrote: Globalization and empire are forces that favor monoculture Do they really? What music does MTV China play? I see a lot of hybridization going on, which makes cultural purists of left and right nervous. Doug

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread raghu
On Jan 11, 2008 2:25 PM, Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: that's a new one! one possible response: power corrupts. Look at what happened to the Roman Republic when it became an Empire. It may have started out pretty good, but it became totally corrupt and disgusting. That may not be totally

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread ravi
On Jan 11, 2008, at 6:32 PM, Doug Henwood wrote: On Jan 11, 2008, at 6:20 PM, Peter Hollings wrote: Globalization and empire are forces that favor monoculture Do they really? What music does MTV China play? I see a lot of hybridization going on, which makes cultural purists of left and right

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Leigh Meyers
On Jan 11, 2008 3:16 PM, Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But the US hasn't really tried to coerce it into any policies. It mostly bullies friends. Destruction of Vietnam's social infrastructure, their economy, and massive numbers of people in a war for their natural resources in

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Gar Lipow
On Jan 11, 2008 11:32 AM, Shane Mage [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A hydrogen-powered vehicle (car, bus, truck, dirigible, bike, ship or boat) is totally infrared-blocking-emission free when the hydrogen is produced by electrolysis driven by electricity from a wind farm. Both fuel cells and

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread raghu
On Jan 11, 2008 3:32 PM, Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 11, 2008, at 6:20 PM, Peter Hollings wrote: Globalization and empire are forces that favor monoculture Do they really? What music does MTV China play? I see a lot of hybridization going on, which makes cultural purists

[PEN-L] A little too much reality

2008-01-11 Thread Gar Lipow
A little too much reality: http://images.teamsugar.com/files/users/1/13254/46_2007/joy.jpg

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
I meant former enemies. Sorry if I was not clear. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 03:47:29PM -0800, Leigh Meyers wrote: On Jan 11, 2008 3:16 PM, Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But the US hasn't really tried to coerce it into any policies. It mostly bullies friends. Destruction of

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
The United States also had regional cultures, which have now degenerated into a boring sameness. Raghu and Ravi suggest that this is also happening in India. I assume that Hollywood will also blend in a little Bollywood into our domestic culture here. -- Michael Perelman Economics Department

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Doyle Saylor
Greetings Economists, On Jan 11, 2008, at 3:48 PM, Gar Lipow wrote: It is a very hopeful thing, but not something you can put an ETA on. Doyle; They demonstrated it could be fabricated using chip techniques. That aside, what I see is not so much lab work might happen as that it could develop

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Jim Devine
I wrote: that's a new one! one possible response: power corrupts. Look at what happened to the Roman Republic when it became an Empire. It may have started out pretty good, but it became totally corrupt and disgusting. That may not be totally accurate history-wise, but it may have some

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread David B. Shemano
Regarding cultural homogenization, assuming for purposes of discussion that it is occurring, is it a result of capitalism or modern communications? In other words, assuming the existence of modern communications, why would there be less cultural homogenization if there was global socialism?

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread raghu
On Jan 11, 2008 5:03 PM, David B. Shemano [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Regarding cultural homogenization, assuming for purposes of discussion that it is occurring, is it a result of capitalism or modern communications? In other words, assuming the existence of modern communications, why would

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Doug Henwood
On Jan 11, 2008, at 8:46 PM, Michael Perelman wrote: When I was young, I could hear the different speech patterns between New Castle and Butler, about 20 miles about. Why is that worth preserving? Doug

Re: [PEN-L] Solar grand plan?

2008-01-11 Thread Gar Lipow
On Jan 11, 2008 4:24 PM, Doyle Saylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greetings Economists, On Jan 11, 2008, at 3:48 PM, Gar Lipow wrote: It is a very hopeful thing, but not something you can put an ETA on. Doyle; They demonstrated it could be fabricated using chip techniques. Yeah, but what

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
The differences were not useful in themselves. It was just indicative of the effect of the media to reduce local culture, not all of which was worth saving. But some regional cultures are of value. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 09:04:31PM -0500, Doug Henwood wrote: On Jan 11, 2008, at 8:46 PM,

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread Doug Henwood
On Jan 11, 2008, at 9:19 PM, Michael Perelman wrote: But some regional cultures are of value. The U.S. is different from India. In the U.S., Vermont is different from Georgia. Manhattan is different from Queens. The East Village is different from Harlem; Maspeth is different from Flushing.

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread raghu
On Jan 11, 2008 6:50 PM, Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The U.S. is different from India. In the U.S., Vermont is different from Georgia. Manhattan is different from Queens. The East Village is different from Harlem; Maspeth is different from Flushing. Really, where is this

[PEN-L] Paul Samuelson: Balancing Market Freedoms

2008-01-11 Thread Julio Huato
http://www.iht.com/bin/printfriendly.php?id=8390223

Re: [PEN-L] Paul Samuelson: Balancing Market Freedoms

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
At the meetings Dean Baker remarked nostalgically that URPE grew out of an opposition to people like Samuelson Solow guiding the American Economic Association. Samuelson must be a real optimist, speculating in the article about writing 10 years from now. He is well into his 90s?? -- Michael

[PEN-L] Paul Samuelson: Balancing Market Freedoms

2008-01-11 Thread Julio Huato
P Samuelson wrote: Since we live ever in the short run... Before that he wrote: When I come to write a newspaper article like this 10 years from now, I believe America may still be leading the pack in per-capita affluence. He was born in 1915.

[PEN-L] Query on Recessions

2008-01-11 Thread Carrol Cox
Is it not correct that fairly frequent recessions are a necessity of the capitalist system? And certainly, in practice, they have been happening every five to ten years for a couple of centuries. But both on this list and in the financial columns of the media everyone is fussing about whether or

Re: [PEN-L] US EMpire Better than Alternative - Huh?

2008-01-11 Thread ravi
On Jan 11, 2008, at 9:50 PM, Doug Henwood wrote: On Jan 11, 2008, at 9:19 PM, Michael Perelman wrote: But some regional cultures are of value. The U.S. is different from India. ... Really, where is this homogenization going on? Answered in upcoming messages (one by me, and the other by

Re: [PEN-L] Paul Samuelson: Balancing Market Freedoms

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
He has a unique interpretation of the short run. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 10:36:09PM -0500, Julio Huato wrote: P Samuelson wrote: Since we live ever in the short run... Before that he wrote: When I come to write a newspaper article like this 10 years from now, I believe America may still

Re: [PEN-L] Query on Recessions

2008-01-11 Thread Michael Perelman
I believe that your first question is correct. According to Marx, recession/depressions shock the system, generally making it stronger, but when then contradictions become too extreme, then even a small shock can be fatal. On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 09:37:34PM -0600, Carrol Cox wrote: Is it not