Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

Tom Lane wrote: > Melvin Davidson writes: > > However, Customer Feedback ( > > https://postgresql.uservoice.com/forums/21853-general > > ) does seem to > > indicate it and give positive results. > > I had never heard

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Sat, Apr 23, 2016 at 1:03 AM, Shulgin, Oleksandr < oleksandr.shul...@zalando.de> wrote: > On Apr 22, 2016 19:46, "Melvin Davidson" wrote: > > > > > > First, tahnk you for your feedback Alex. > > > > "IMO, every time it was conclusively demonstrated that when you consider

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Apr 22, 2016 19:46, "Melvin Davidson" wrote: > > > First, tahnk you for your feedback Alex. > > "IMO, every time it was conclusively demonstrated that when you consider dump/restore semantics, this feature can have exactly zero value if implemented *inside pg_catalog*.

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:49 PM, Shulgin, Oleksandr < oleksandr.shul...@zalando.de> wrote: > On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 6:55 PM, Melvin Davidson > wrote: > >> And so far, NO ONE has shown any proof that this enhancement could >> possibly cause ANY negative result. >> > >

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 6:55 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > And so far, NO ONE has shown any proof that this enhancement could > possibly cause ANY negative result. > Searching through the list archives[1] I can see that you've asked this question a number of times already.

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 9:55 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > Please, just ONE LOGICAL VALID argument, not speculation. Otherwise, stop > with the nay saying. I think you should look seriously at the suggestion offered of using an event trigger to get what you desire here. I

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thursday, April 21, 2016 12:55:00 PM EDT Melvin Davidson wrote: > WHY am I being vilified for making a simple request? How is it that > developers proceed with other enhancements, yet so much negative attention > is being given to my request because of unjustified fear that something bad > will

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 11:59 AM, David G. Johnston < david.g.johns...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 8:18 AM, Melvin Davidson > wrote: > >> On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 11:08 AM, Adrian Klaver < >> adrian.kla...@aklaver.com> wrote: >> >>> On 04/21/2016 07:53 AM,

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 8:18 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 11:08 AM, Adrian Klaver > wrote: > >> On 04/21/2016 07:53 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: >> >> >>> "Whether that is worthy or not is the point of your request and

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 11:08 AM, Adrian Klaver wrote: > On 04/21/2016 07:53 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > > >> "Whether that is worthy or not is the point of your request and really >> depends on more input." >> Correct. And that is what I am looking for. Stating

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On 04/21/2016 07:53 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: "Whether that is worthy or not is the point of your request and really depends on more input." Correct. And that is what I am looking for. Stating obscure corner cases does not rule out the need for an enhancement. If it did, there would be no

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 10:44 AM, Adrian Klaver wrote: > On 04/21/2016 07:30 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > >> >> >> > >> >> "Just one example of why that assertion does not hold:" >> >> I fail to see your point >> >> "That is easy. Compare dumps of the current schema

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On 04/21/2016 07:30 AM, Melvin Davidson wrote: "Just one example of why that assertion does not hold:" I fail to see your point "That is easy. Compare dumps of the current schema against the official schema." So your solution is to do a dump and then grep for anomalies? How is that

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 10:08 AM, Karsten Hilbert wrote: > On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 09:40:18AM -0400, Melvin Davidson wrote: > > > "and what about user objects added to a database which is > > then used as a template for creating another DB ?" > > > > This existence of

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 09:40:18AM -0400, Melvin Davidson wrote: > "and what about user objects added to a database which is > then used as a template for creating another DB ?" > > This existence of objects that are part of the default schema is NOT a > problem. Developers and users should

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

"and what about user objects added to a database which is then used as a template for creating another DB ?" This existence of objects that are part of the default schema is NOT a problem. Developers and users should never have access to a template. The point is to be able to track down rogue

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

"Speaking blindly here but given that we now have event triggers I'm even more inclined to simply tell people to setup user-space tables and event triggers to do whatever they want. Is there any reason that combination cannot solve the problems being brought up? I get the desirability of having

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 3:11 AM, Karsten Hilbert wrote: > On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 07:09:24PM -0400, Melvin Davidson wrote: > > > There is also the situation of tables with limitited use. EG: > > history_mm, in which case it would facilitate dropping of tables that >

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 07:09:24PM -0400, Melvin Davidson wrote: > There is also the situation of tables with limitited use. EG: > history_mm, in which case it would facilitate dropping of tables that > are no longer needed after x amount of time. select * from pg_class where

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 05:17:20PM -0500, Kevin Grittner wrote: > if someone had been allowed to run ad hoc > reports or data cleanup on a database it was a quick way to look > for stray tables they may have generated to keep intermediate > results or exceptions, so we could follow up on

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 03:02:52PM -0700, Adrian Klaver wrote: > No one is arguing that slapping a new column on pg_class is not easy, just > that the implications of doing so requires a good deal of thought. The first > thing that comes to my mind(also in threads on --hackers) is what is the >

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 5:30 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 8:01 PM, Adrian Klaver > wrote: > "I just cannot see that in the following: > pg_upgrade 9.4 --> 9.5" > The 9.5 database is the same as the 9.4 one." > > You are

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 8:01 PM, Adrian Klaver wrote: > On 04/20/2016 04:33 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > >> >> >> > >> >> "Not until pg_upgrade is done or replication is started, in either case >> a new cluster is started probably at a different time from the original

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On 04/20/2016 04:33 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: "Not until pg_upgrade is done or replication is started, in either case a new cluster is started probably at a different time from the original cluster." Not true, whether an upgrade or rep[lication, the relcreatedat time will not/cannot

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 7:22 PM, Adrian Klaver wrote: > On 04/20/2016 04:09 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > >> >> On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 6:17 PM, Kevin Grittner > > wrote: >> >> On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 4:40 PM, Melvin

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On 04/20/2016 04:09 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 6:17 PM, Kevin Grittner > wrote: On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 4:40 PM, Melvin Davidson > wrote: > As for what I want

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 4:40 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: > As for what I want from the community, I would like other users > and dba's to weigh in on this request and it's usefulness. When I was a DBA on a team responsible for hundreds of geographically distributed

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On 04/20/2016 02:40 PM, Melvin Davidson wrote: On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 5:14 PM, David G. Johnston Really, it's that hard to add another column to an existing system catalog and document it? Hmm, let's try ALTER TABLE pg_catalog.pg_class ADD COLUMN relcreatedat timestamp default now();

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 5:14 PM, David G. Johnston < david.g.johns...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 1:50 PM, melvin6925 wrote: > >> On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 12:59 PM, Melvin Davidson >> wrote: >> >>> To Tom: >>> "it *sounds* trivial,

Fwd: Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT 4G LTE smartphone Original message From: "David G. Johnston" Date: 4/20/2016 16:13 (GMT-05:00) To: Melvin Davidson Subject: Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

Melvin Davidson writes: > *I am a bit confused. If this is the correct list for enhancement requests, > then why is that not explicitly stated in the list description? In general, any of the major PG lists are suitable places for discussing enhancements; either here or

Re: [GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

On Wednesday, April 20, 2016, Melvin Davidson wrote: > > > > > > > > *I am a bit confused. If this is the correct list for enhancement > requests, then why is that not explicitly stated in the list description? > Then again, none of the list descriptions mention they are

[GENERAL] Add relcreated (timestamp) column to pg_class catalog to record the time an object was created

*I am a bit confused. If this is the correct list for enhancement requests, then why is that not explicitly stated in the list description? Then again, none of the list descriptions mention they are are the correct ones for enhancement requests. However, Customer Feedback (