Ka-Ping Yee wrote:
On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think Talin's got a point though. It seems hard to find one short English
word that captures the essence of the desired behavior. None of the words
in his list seem strongly suggestive of the meaning to me. I suspect that
Brett Cannon wrote:
Using a factory method callback, one could store the PyCodeObject in a C
proxy object that just acts as a complete delegate, forwarding all method
calls to the internally stored PyCodeObject. That would work.
For this initial implementation, though, I am not going to
Brett Cannon wrote:
http://www.klocwork.com/company/releases/06_26_06.asp
Looks like Klocowork is doing the same thing as Coverity and providing
free static analysis of source for open source projects. Doubt we want
this *and* Coverity, but figured wouldn't hurt to let people know about it.
Jeremy Hylton wrote:
To express this email in the positive form:
1. Reserved words should be real words.
2. The meaning of the word should be clear.
3. Put statements in positive form. (Strunk White)
4. The word should sound good.
agreed. a word should describe what a thing is, not what
Talin wrote:
I also think that it won't be a complete disaster if we do nothing at
all - there *are* existing ways to deal with this problem; there are
even some which aren't hackish and non-obvious. For example, its easy
enough to create an object which acts as an artificial scope:
Here's something to discuss:
First, let me say that I love easy_install. I absolutely just works
and does what I want, and makes it really simple to install whatever bit
of Python code I need.
At the same time, however, I get kind of scared when I hear people on
the list discussing the
I intend to fix bug #1223937: subprocess.py abuse of errno. I thought this was
going to to tricky, to maintain backwards compatibility, but then I realized
that check_call() and CalledProcessError() are not available in any released
version of Python, so I guess it's safe to change them.
Peter Åstrand wrote:
I intend to fix bug #1223937: subprocess.py abuse of errno. I thought
this was going to to tricky, to maintain backwards compatibility, but
then I realized that check_call() and CalledProcessError() are not
available in any released version of Python, so I guess it's
Talin wrote:
Ka-Ping Yee wrote:
On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think Talin's got a point though. It seems hard to find one short English
word that captures the essence of the desired behavior. None of the words
in his list seem strongly suggestive of the meaning to
A.M. Kuchling [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Mon, Jul 10, 2006 at 05:13:53PM +0200, Armin Rigo wrote:
didn't draw much applause. It certainly gave me the impression that
many changes in Python are advocated and welcomed by only a small
fraction of users.
The benefits of changes are usually
Fuzzyman wrote:
I've often found it a nuisance that you can't instantiate an 'object',
to use as a mutable 'namespace', but instead have to define an arbitrary
empty class.
What happened to the 'namespace' proposal ?
The code and the pre-PEP [1] are still out there, but Carlos, Steve and I
Phillip J. Eby wrote:
It would be nice if tracebacks in the footnote show the invoking context
Yep. Someone (Jim Fulton I think) had suggested that to me. I'll look
into it.
My other thought would be that having a patch that works against the 2.5
version of doctest would be good
My
Boris Borcic wrote:
I believe that in this case native linguistic intuition made the decision...
The reason has nothing to do with language. Guido didn't
want sum() to become an attractive nuisance by *appearing*
to be an obvious way of joining a list of strings, while
actually being a very
(Attention conservation notice: the following is concerned almost entirely
with exegesis of an old python-dev thread. Those interested in improving Python
and not in history and exegesis should probably ignore it.)
On Tuesday 2006-07-11 13:43, Boris Borcic wrote:
I believe that in this case
Gareth McCaughan wrote:
(Attention conservation notice: the following is concerned almost entirely
with exegesis of an old python-dev thread. Those interested in improving
Python
and not in history and exegesis should probably ignore it.)
On Tuesday 2006-07-11 13:43, Boris Borcic wrote:
I wish to apologize for mistakenly pushing the send button on an untouched
copy of Gereth McGaughan's reply, in the case my early cancel at gmane did not
stop the propagation.
I'll profit just to add (bringing this to a conclusion)
Gareth McCaughan wrote:
(...was not Guido's first
Hi,
urllib.quote fails on unicode strings and in an unhelpful way::
Python 2.4.3 (#69, Mar 29 2006, 17:35:34) [MSC v.1310 32 bit (Intel)]
on win32
Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information.
import urllib
urllib.quote('a\xf1a')
'a%F1a'
Fredrik Lundh wrote:
in what language the word sum an appropriate synonym for concatenate ?
any that admits a+b to mean ''.join([a,b]), I'd say.
- BB
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Boris Borcic wrote:
in what language [is] the word sum an appropriate synonym for
concatenate ?
any that admits a+b to mean ''.join([a,b]), I'd say.
and what human language would that be ?
/F
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Stefan According to a message I found on quixote-users,
Stefan http://mail.mems-exchange.org/durusmail/quixote-users/5363/ it
Stefan might have worked prior to 2.4.2.
Confirmed with 2.3.5.
Stefanif isinstance(s, unicode):
Stefans = s.encode('utf-8')
Stefan
outbound x = 1
x = 2
evaluating using Jeremy Hilton's' list:
1. is a real word
2. For me - in python - it would mean: Is found in 'outer' scope and
is already bound.
And the literal meaning of 'outbound 'headed away' [1] is pretty
darn close to what I mean when I spell the usual mutables
Robin Bryce wrote:
outbound x = 1
FWINW, to me 'nonlocal' clearly and immediately tells you what you need
to know about the variable.
'outbound' has no programming associations for me (it makes me think of
'outward bound' and roaming the great outdoors). So negative or not I'm
+1 on nonlocal
At 03:36 AM 7/11/2006 -0700, Talin wrote:
I thought a little bit more about Guido's comment that you can hide
Python objects in a C wrapper class. However, as I was trying to sleep,
I realized that you don't even need C to do it.
The trick is to store the object reference as a closure variable.
On behalf of the Python development team and the Python
community, I'm happy to announce the second BETA release
of Python 2.5.
This is an *beta* release of Python 2.5. As such, it is not
suitable for a production environment. It is being released
to solicit feedback and hopefully discover bugs,
Fredrik Lundh wrote:
Boris Borcic wrote:
in what language [is] the word sum an appropriate synonym for
concatenate ?
any that admits a+b to mean ''.join([a,b]), I'd say.
and what human language would that be ?
Let's admit the answer is 'none' (and I apologize for accusing only
Please end this thread. Now. Really.
--
--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)
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beta2 is done, so trunk is unfrozen. Remember, we're still in feature
freeze, so new features need approval before being committed.
Thanks!
Anthony
--
Anthony Baxter [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It's never too late to have a happy childhood.
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There's an open PEP-356 issue for update the icons to the newer
shinier ones for Unix. As far as I can see, there's the 14x15 GIF
images used for Idle and the documentation. Note that for me at least,
idle comes up without an icon _anyway_.
Are there any others I missed?
Anthony
--
Anthony
Anthony Baxter wrote:
There's an open PEP-356 issue for update the icons to the newer
shinier ones for Unix. As far as I can see, there's the 14x15 GIF
images used for Idle and the documentation. Note that for me at least,
idle comes up without an icon _anyway_.
Are there any others I
Phillip J. Eby wrote:
A function's func_closure contains cell objects that hold the
variables. These are readable if you can set the func_closure of some
function of your own. If the overall plan includes the ability to restrict
func_closure setting (or reading) in a restricted
I'd like to have the get method available for lists and tuples. (I
figured this must have been discussed before but can't recall it and
didn't turn anything up on google).
It's obviously not a use-all-the-time method (or it'd already be there),
but I find myself wanting it often enough to
Anthony Baxter wrote:
There's an open PEP-356 issue for update the icons to the newer
shinier ones for Unix. As far as I can see, there's the 14x15 GIF
images used for Idle and the documentation. Note that for me at least,
idle comes up without an icon _anyway_.
A pyfav.(gif|png)
Benji York benji at zope.com writes:
Here's the idea: when a footnote is referenced in prose, execute the
code associated with the footnote at that point. For example:
Another natural place for the referenced code is the __test__ dictionary.
Using that has an advantage of not clobbering
Russell E. Owen wrote:
I'd like to have the get method available for lists and tuples. (I
figured this must have been discussed before but can't recall it and
didn't turn anything up on google).
It's obviously not a use-all-the-time method (or it'd already be there),
but I find myself
Fred L. Drake, Jr. wrote:
Anthony Baxter wrote:
There's an open PEP-356 issue for update the icons to the newer
shinier ones for Unix. As far as I can see, there's the 14x15 GIF
images used for Idle and the documentation. Note that for me at least,
idle comes up without an icon
On Wednesday 12 July 2006 03:39, Georg Brandl wrote:
Anyway, I'm just testing the waters. If it's not heresy then I'd
like to do what I can to make it happen.
IMO there's almost no chance this can go into 2.5.
almost?
I'll go you one better. No way at all will it be in 2.5. And I'd be a
Alexander Belopolsky wrote:
Benji York benji at zope.com writes:
Here's the idea: when a footnote is referenced in prose, execute the
code associated with the footnote at that point. For example:
Another natural place for the referenced code is the __test__ dictionary.
Using that has an
On 7/10/06, Talin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Brett Cannon wrote: Using a factory method callback, one could store the PyCodeObject in a C proxy object that just acts as a complete delegate, forwarding all method calls to the internally stored PyCodeObject.That would work.
For this initial
At 01:30 PM 7/11/2006 -0400, Scott Dial wrote:
Phillip J. Eby wrote:
A function's func_closure contains cell objects that hold the
variables. These are readable if you can set the func_closure of some
function of your own. If the overall plan includes the ability to
restrict
Scott Dial wrote:
Phillip J. Eby wrote:
A function's func_closure contains cell objects that hold the
variables. These are readable if you can set the func_closure of some
function of your own. If the overall plan includes the ability to restrict
func_closure setting (or reading) in a
On 7/11/06, Benji York [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
I'm not quite sure what you're suggesting. A guess: put the code that
isn't to be seen in the __test__ dict with a string key being the name
of the footnote?
That's right.
I don't think a ReST processor would like that much.
It would
On Tuesday 11 July 2006 14:12, Alexander Belopolsky wrote:
Also __new__ and __init__ method docstrings is the natural place to
put set-up code.
Maybe, if all the tests required the same setup code. That's often not the
case.
-Fred
--
Fred L. Drake, Jr. fred at zope.com
Zope
Anthony Baxter wrote:
On Wednesday 12 July 2006 03:39, Georg Brandl wrote:
Anyway, I'm just testing the waters. If it's not heresy then I'd
like to do what I can to make it happen.
IMO there's almost no chance this can go into 2.5.
almost?
I'll go you one better. No way at all will it
Russell E. Owen wrote:
I'd like to have the get method available for lists and tuples. (I
figured this must have been discussed before but can't recall it and
didn't turn anything up on google).
It's obviously not a use-all-the-time method (or it'd already be there),
but I find myself wanting
At 02:12 PM 7/11/2006 -0400, Alexander Belopolsky wrote:
On 7/11/06, Benji York [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
I'm not quite sure what you're suggesting. A guess: put the code that
isn't to be seen in the __test__ dict with a string key being the name
of the footnote?
That's right.
I
On 7/11/06, Phillip J. Eby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
At 10:56 AM 7/11/2006 -0700, Brett Cannon wrote:On 7/10/06, Talin mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:(Although, I've often wished for Python to have a variant of __call__
that could be used to override individual methods,
On 7/11/06, Fred Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tuesday 11 July 2006 14:12, Alexander Belopolsky wrote:
Also __new__ and __init__ method docstrings is the natural place to
put set-up code.
Maybe, if all the tests required the same setup code. That's often not the
case.
That's true,
On Tue, 11 Jul 2006, Stefan Rank wrote:
urllib.quote fails on unicode strings and in an unhelpful way::
[...]
urllib.quote(u'a\xf1a')
Traceback (most recent call last):
File stdin, line 1, in ?
File C:\Python24\lib\urllib.py, line 1117, in quote
res =
On Tuesday 11 July 2006 14:37, Alexander Belopolsky wrote:
That's true, but you cannot test an object method without creating the
object first.
True. How the object is created can vary; if the creation affects the
expected behavior in any way, you'll need be careful about how the
At 11:35 AM 7/11/2006 -0700, Brett Cannon wrote:
On 7/11/06, Phillip J. Eby
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
At 10:56 AM 7/11/2006 -0700, Brett Cannon wrote:
On 7/10/06, Talin
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
(Although, I've often
python.org/sf/1515343 fixes a regression against 2.4, which masks
exceptions, and should therefore go in before release. The tracker
has a patch to the test cases, and two alternative fixes. (One
minimal, the other less ugly.)
Since this only affects string exceptions with a value, it might be
Stefan Rank wrote:
I suggest to add (after 2.5 I assume) one of the following to the
beginning of urllib.quote to either fail early and consistently on
unicode arguments and improve the error message::
if isinstance(s, unicode):
raise TypeError(quote needs a byte string
I know the .desktop files have become fairly standard, but are these our
responsibility or does that rest with the distributions/integrators? (I'm
not objecting, but I'm not sure what the right thing really is since Python
is an interpreter, not a desktop application.)
The same anal argument
Martin v. Löwis wrote:
Georg Brandl wrote:
In case we add a Python .desktop file (as proposed in patch #1353344),
we'll need some PNGs in /usr/share/icons. A patch for Makefile.pre.in
is attached.
Independent of whether this should be done at all, I have a comment on
the patch. Instead of
On 7/5/06, Neal Norwitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 7/4/06, Guido van Rossum [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
From actual users of
the language I get more complaints about the breakneck speed of
Python's evolution than about the brokenness of the current language.
Guido,
I'm really
John,
I see what you are doing with the algorithm now, and I can easily re-factor
it. What I am having issues with is how structured it is. 5 minute
windows? Then running hours will always be recorded in 1/12th time steps.
Would it not be more accurate to record engine time where the breaker
Michael Well here's one I stumbled across the other day. I don't know
Michael if it's legit, but it's still bad PR:
Michael http://www.gbch.net/gjb/blog/software/discuss/python-sucks.html
Michael For the impatient, he's not at all bothered about the lack of
Michael obscure
On 7/11/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Michael Well here's one I stumbled across the other day. I don't knowMichael if it's legit, but it's still bad PR:Michael
http://www.gbch.net/gjb/blog/software/discuss/python-sucks.htmlMichael For the impatient, he's not at all bothered about
Brett That whole entry is a little overblown.
Well, sure. Think of it as a bug report with attitude. ;-)
Brett That was done to fix buffer overflow issues when libc
Brett implementations didn't do bound checks on the arguments to
Brett strftime() and would index too far...
On Wednesday 12 July 2006 07:16, Martin v. Löwis wrote:
Stefan Rank wrote:
I suggest to add (after 2.5 I assume) one of the following to the
beginning of urllib.quote to either fail early and consistently
on unicode arguments and improve the error message::
if isinstance(s, unicode):
On 7/11/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Brett That whole entry is a little overblown.Well, sure.Think of it as a bug report with attitude. ;-)Brett That was done to fix buffer overflow issues when libcBrett implementations didn't do bound checks on the arguments to
Brett strftime()
Matthew Barnes wrote:
its
meaning in C/C++ (i.e. the symbol is defined outside of the current
scope).
It means more than that -- it means defined outside
the current *file*. That's much too drastic for
what we want.
--
Greg
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Fredrik Lundh wrote:
Boris Borcic wrote:
in what language [is] the word sum an appropriate synonym for
concatenate ?
any that admits a+b to mean ''.join([a,b]), I'd say.
and what human language would that be ?
Python :)
Sure-computers-can-speak-it-but-so-can-humans'ly yours,
Nick.
--
Boris Borcic wrote:
sum() *is* exactly an attractive nuisance by *appearing* to be an obvious way
of
chaining strings in a list (without actually being one).
But at least it fails immediately, prompting you to
look in another direction.
I admit that there is a step of arguable
Gareth McCaughan wrote:
(I agree that Greg's interpretation is also not well supported
by that thread;
I was perhaps a bit excessive in claiming that language
had nothing to do with it. What I meant was that it
wasn't the *only* consideration. If there hadn't been
any disadvantages, quite
Boris Borcic wrote:
Fredrik Lundh wrote:
in what language the word sum an appropriate synonym for concatenate ?
any that admits a+b to mean ''.join([a,b]), I'd say.
Not the same thing. a + b is usually pronounced
a plus b. Now, plus has a somewhat wider meaning
than sum. It sounds quite in
Anthony Baxter wrote:
The right thing to do is IRIs.
For 2.5, should we at least detect that it's unicode and raise a
useful error?
That can certainly be done, sure.
Martin
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Making strftime accept 0s is fine to be checked in, since it's a
regression (an understandable one, but what the hell). Making it
accept less than 9 items and have useful defaults should wait for 2.6
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