Re: [RDA-L] Illustration terms in 7.15.1.3

On 8/20/13, Bernhard Eversberg wrote: 20.08.2013 15:07, Mitchell, Michael: ... This is a rant against the folly of RDA,... I just don't understand how the profession can embrace such folly though. High time to figure this out indeed. When I have mentioned that it was necessary to make

[RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

I have seen many examples like the one below, in which there is both a publication date and a copyright date. 264 #1 $a London ; $a Toronto : $b Schott, $c [2011] 264 #4 $c (c)2011 But I cannot find a rule or example in which there is only a copyright date. How is that handled? Would it

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

264 fields use different second indicators to separate publication, distribution, manufacture statement, and copyright date. The second indicator 4 of 264 field means copyright notice date. That means it only records the copyright date. Copyright date is a core element only if neither date of

Re: [RDA-L] Extent -- some ideas

My initial thought is to separate carrier from content. Carrier types and extent of carrier should be defined irrelevant of content. A sheet is a sheet. A volume is a volume, no matter what content is on or in. They all are about physical objects in your hand. Pagination seems to be a part of some

Re: [RDA-L] Extent -- some ideas

That separation of content and carrier is what makes sense. In much the same way that the different concepts in the GMD were unpacked, the Extent element needs to go further than it has, and currently it looks compromised because of the need for backwards-compatibility for the compact displays

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

Amy, the 264 $4 contains ONLY the copyright date, with no other information. The example you showed seems to be a case where the publication date was inferred from the copyright date, thus the bracketed date in the first 264 field. Strictly according to RDA, the first 264 should contain

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

I would just add that the publication date element is core in RDA, and that my reading of the instruction indicates a preference to supply or approximate the date unless it cannot reasonably be determined. We also follow the LCPS. My own preference in such a case is to add the copyright date as

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

And how is the user supposed to make sense of this? How are thesis advisors supposed to make sense of this when checking bibliographical citations? How will it display On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 8:20 AM, Stewart, Richard rstew...@indiantrailslibrary.org wrote: I would just add that the

[RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

In RDA, how would the cited page number be given in the note? AACR2: 300 $a [4], 85 p. 500 $a Published to commemorate XYZ--P. [2]. * Walter F. Nickeson, Catalog Metadata Management Librarian Rush Rhees Library University of Rochester

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Library of Congress Policy: *do not use square brackets in notes except when they are used in quoted data* *Example:* 500* *Types of prayer wheels found in south central Tibet, by Mei Lin: pages 310-375. (Not pages [310]-[375]) On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 11:06 AM, Nickeson,

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Yes, but if the note says: 500 $a Published to commemorate XYZ-Page 2 you still don't know where it came from, as there are two page 2s in this volume, one with the number on it, the other without. * Walter F. Nickeson, Catalog Metadata

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Could the page perhaps be cited as page ii? Personally, I'm not sure that I fully agree with that specific provision in LC-PCC PS 1.7.1 that Joan reminded us of. At least, in cases where strictly following it results in misleading or confusing data. Kevin M. Randall Principal Serials

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

OK! Now I know what you are saying. Put a word to indicate that? like unnumbered page 2? On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Nickeson, Walter wnicke...@library.rochester.edu wrote: Yes, but if the note says: ** ** 500 $a Published to commemorate XYZ—Page 2 ** ** you still

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

page ii seems to make more sense :-) On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 12:04 PM, Joan Wang jw...@illinoisheartland.orgwrote: OK! Now I know what you are saying. Put a word to indicate that? like unnumbered page 2? On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 11:53 AM, Nickeson, Walter wnicke...@library.rochester.edu

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

I think the solution depends on what those initial unnumbered pages actually contain. If pages [2-4] are some sort of preface or foreword you could perhaps use that as the citation. 500 $a Published to commemorate XYZ--Preface. Failing that, some other suggestions: 500 $a Published to

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Unnumbered page 2 looks weird to me, personally. I am sorry about that :-) On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 12:11 PM, Benjamin A Abrahamse babra...@mit.eduwrote: I think the solution depends on what those initial unnumbered pages actually contain. If pages [2-4] are some sort of preface or

Re: [RDA-L] Extent -- some ideas

I am grateful for the feedback offered on the discussion paper (http://www.rda-jsc.org/docs/6JSC-ALA-Discussion-1.pdf) and am glad to hear that some of you think that implementing an Extent of Expression element (to disambiguate content and carrier) would be a step in the right direction. I

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

Gene Fieg asked, regarding the inclusion of copyright date and inferred publication date in an RDA record: And how is the user supposed to make sense of this? How are thesis advisors supposed to make sense of this when checking bibliographical citations? How will it display I don't see

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

Sorry, the copyright symbol in my reply got automatically changed to (c). That's what I get for replying in text format. :( Steve McDonald steve.mcdon...@tufts.edu -Original Message- From: Resource

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Wakter Nickeson posted: AACR2: 300 $a [4], 85 p. 500 $a Published to commemorate XYZ--P. [2]. I suggested: 300 $a[iv], 85 pages 500 $aPublished to commemorate XYZ--Page [ii] But I suspect RDA would have: 300 $a4 unumbered pages, 85 pages 500 $aPublished to commemorate XYZ--Unnumbered

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

Amy Mercer posted: 264 #4 $a London; $a Toronto : $b Schott, $c (c)2011 No. Field 264 4 has only $c date. The publisher may or may not be the copright holder. You do not record a copyright date in 264 1; in the absence of an imprint date, you record an inferred imprint date in brackets,

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Perhaps: 300 $a4 unnumbered pages, 85 pages 500 $aPublished to commemorate XYZ--Page 2 (first count). ~~ Will Evans Chief Rare Materials Catalog Librarian Library of the Boston Athenaeum 10 1/2 Beacon Street Boston, MA   02108 Tel:  617-227-0270 ext. 224

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

300 $a4 unumbered pages, 85 pages 500 $aPublished to commemorate XYZ--Unnumbered page 2. My initial idea. Anyway, more than one person hates it :-) On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 1:18 PM, J. McRee Elrod m...@slc.bc.ca wrote: Wakter Nickeson posted: AACR2: 300 $a [4], 85 p. 500 $a Published

Re: [RDA-L] Citing an unnumbered page

Under AACR2, the practice was to qualify the number with (first sequence), (second sequence), etc., when a given page number could belong to more than one sequence of pages. I think it could still work under RDA, e.g.: 300 $a 4 unnumbered pages, 85 pages 500 $a Published to commemorate

[RDA-L] Recording text and symbol in copyright dates

Hi all, Here's yet another question about the copyright date! I know that you would include the copyright symbol with the copyright date in a 264 if the symbol appears on the resource. Would you include any accompanying text in the 264 as well? For example... On source: Copyright (c) 2009

Re: [RDA-L] Recording text and symbol in copyright dates

This is the rule: Precede the date by the copyright symbol (©) or the phonogram copyright symbol (℗). If the appropriate symbol cannot be reproduced, precede the date by copyright or phonogram copyright. Joan Wang Illinois Heartland Library System On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 2:45 PM, Crum, Cathy

Re: [RDA-L] Recording text and symbol in copyright dates

Cathy Crum asked: I know that you would include the copyright symbol with the copyright date = in a 264 if the symbol appears on the resource. Would you include any acco= mpanying text in the 264 as well? You include the symbol, whether or not it apears on the item. Copyright qouls would be

Re: [RDA-L] 264 with only a copyright date

I wasn't talking about the copyright of theses. In terms of theses: author cites New York : Harper, c1961 Catalog record reads 264 New York : Harper, [1961] 264 c1961 Thesis advisor checks citation and notes the [1961]. Calls in author. Our catalog says it was published in 1961, are you sure

[RDA-L] Unknown begin and end dates for multipart monograph

I'm assuming that this instruction in 2.8.6.5 (recording dates for multipartmonographs, serials, and integrating resources): If the date or dates cannot be approximated for a multipart monograph, serial, or integrating resource, do not record a date of publication. means do not include $c at

Re: [RDA-L] Unknown begin and end dates for multipart monograph

Michael Chopey posted: DtSt: n Dates: , I would code q, with guessed dates (even if the last one or two digits are u). Yes, totally unknown dates would be recorded as in 008. Date 2 would be if the resource is still being published. Continuing resources are the only

Re: [RDA-L] Unknown begin and end dates for multipart monograph

Hi Mike, On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 4:40 PM, Michael Chopey cho...@hawaii.edu wrote: I'm assuming that this instruction in 2.8.6.5 (recording dates for multipart monographs, serials, and integrating resources): If the date or dates cannot be approximated for a multipart monograph, serial, or