The schtick about DMSO carrying everything thru' the skin into the
bloodstream is a good one for folks who don't know any better.
Fact is, DMSO does not transport anything over 1000 dalton molecular
weight. Look up an MSDS on whatever it is you fear will go to your
brain (if it's in the
Sandy.. If you mix DMSO and CS and apply it to your skin, the CS will be
carried right into the body along with the DMSO. When applying DMSO by
itself, the recommendations are to leave it on for about 15 - 30 minutes,
making sure that nothing comes in contact with the area during this time,
then
Why in the world would you want to use DMSO with isopropyl alcohol in it?
Or will DMSO not take it through the skin?...
Dan
On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 10:12 AM, Norton, Stevestephen.nor...@ngc.com wrote:
I use two versions. One is CS with DMSO and it will yellow. I also have a
version where I
.
- Steve N
- Original Message -
From: Dan Nave bhangcha...@gmail.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sat Aug 08 15:22:40 2009
Subject: Re: CSCS and DMSO
Why in the world would you want to use DMSO with isopropyl alcohol in it?
Or will DMSO not take it through
it goes a funny colour! dee
On 6 Aug 2009, at 23:52, Shirley Reed wrote:
Anyone know if CS and DMSO can be mixed in a spray bottle for a
few weeks (maybe) or so and not lose its strength?? tia pj
Shirley Reed wrote:
Anyone know if CS and DMSO can be mixed in a spray bottle for a
few weeks (maybe) or so and not lose its strength?? tia pj
They will mix fine, but my experience is that the mixture tends to
darken after a few days suggesting aggregation. I try to mix it fresh
when I
Testing
BUGS? Target them with the best in Pest Control. Click Here.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTGQSrvvWipbwWoKAORsxTrLpwhkc4QO4hyOWsdL3LgBtKOT1sa1VG/
--
The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing
: Fri Aug 07 10:00:08 2009
Subject: Re: CSCS and DMSO
Shirley Reed wrote:
Anyone know if CS and DMSO can be mixed in a spray bottle for a
few weeks (maybe) or so and not lose its strength?? tia pj
They will mix fine, but my experience is that the mixture tends to
darken after a few days
I do it for periods longer than a few weeks and have noticed no
degradation.
- Steve N
From: Shirley Reed [mailto:pj20fl...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2009 3:52 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: CSCS and DMSO
Anyone know if CS and DMSO can
We have stored such solutions of varying strengths for months at a time, at room temperature, with
absolutely no detectable variation in strength or principal properties. Others may have
experienced different results.
Sincerely, Brooks Braddley.
-[ Received Mail
Familymailto:clay...@skypoint.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.commailto:silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 12:10 AM
Subject: Re: CSCS-MSM-DMSO formula
I have made up some with just cs and msm for my pooch. I don't have the
dmso. She does not seem to mind. We are on day 2 or 3
Colloidal silver might be less toxic.
- Original Message -
From: Dianne France
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 5:29 AM
Subject: Re: CSCS-MSM-DMSO formula
I thought I read in the book on DMSO that they don't recommend it for dogs
eyes, humans were
Sorry wrong key.
- Original Message -
From: Dianne France
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 5:29 AM
Subject: Re: CSCS-MSM-DMSO formula
I thought I read in the book on DMSO that they don't recommend it for dogs
eyes, humans were okay. Seems it can
. Just check it out
before using DMSO on dogs.
Dianne
- Original Message -
From: Clayton Family
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 12:10 AM
Subject: Re: CSCS-MSM-DMSO formula
I have made up some with just cs and msm for my pooch. I don't have
the
dmso. She does
Thanks, and please let me know how this works. I was told I have a cataract
just starting.
Leslie
- Original Message -
From: sol sol...@sweetwaterhsa.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, August 10, 2008 3:50 PM
Subject: CSCS-MSM-DMSO formula
After reading everything sent on
I have made up some with just cs and msm for my pooch. I don't have the
dmso. She does not seem to mind. We are on day 2 or 3, 2x/day. Just the
flax oil seems to be helping her vision for some reason, unless the
msm/cs is doing it. I also thank all and sundry who gave the advice
and recipes.
Lignisul is china sourced msm. Opti-msm is made in the U.S. from U.S.
sourced ingredients. The difference is important to me, but may not be
to anyone else. I can afford the small price difference between Lignisul
and Opti-msm.
If I could afford the jacoblab DMSO I would use it in preference to
I got it here. Http://www.iherb.com/store/login.aspx
Dee
---Original Message---
From: Lee Nash
Date: 14/09/2007 21:40:33
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSCS MSM DMSO
Hey, I am now looking at a site where you can order DMSO but high shipping
Cost. Do you
I buy mine from http:///www.msmmsm.com The co. is in AZ so it is close to me,
they have two different sourses, Lingosol, and another, I buy Lingosol,
spelling may be wrong, but you can reconize it. (Ha)
Lee Nash leslie1...@windstream.net wrote:
Hey, I am now looking at a site where you can
There are some DMSO experts here, certainly, and one of them runs a DMSO
list, which would be sure to have a lot of fascinating information for you.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DimethylSulfoxide-DMSO/
There is also some great stuff on the net if you put in a search, and enter
DMSO Nature's
Ruth Bertella wrote:
Hell. anybody out there?!?! I did get a few nibbles
(and thanks to each of you), but was hoping I'd get some bites
y'all did ask for CS questions, so I thought I'd oblige! grin
I was kind of hoping for the some of the lively discussions like were
I have it in gel form and it is 70% DMSO and 30% distilled water. Dee
---Original Message---
From: Marshall Dudley
Date: 14/09/2007 15:33:49
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSCS MSM DMSO
DMSO is never in a gel form. Gel forms are made by adding a gelling
Wow - that ratio seems pretty strong to me. The DMSO I have at home is a
liquid. If I mixed 70% DMSO to 30% distilled water, I'd still have a
liquid. I'd think there has to be something else in it for yours to be a
gel. Did you make it yourself (and what did you use?) or did you purchase
it
---
From: Ruth Bertella
Date: 14/09/2007 20:20:29
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSCS MSM DMSO
Wow - that ratio seems pretty strong to me. The DMSO I have at home is a
Liquid. If I mixed 70% DMSO to 30% distilled water, I'd still have a
Liquid. I'd think there has
Hey, I am now looking at a site where you can order DMSO but high shipping
cost. Do you have ideas as to places to get it?
Leslie
- Original Message -
From: Dee d...@deetroy.org
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2007 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: CSCS MSM DMSO
It just
4:31 PM
Subject: Re: CSCS MSM DMSO
Hey, I am now looking at a site where you can order DMSO but high shipping
cost. Do you have ideas as to places to get it?
Leslie
- Original Message -
From: Dee d...@deetroy.orgmailto:d...@deetroy.org
To: silver-list
---
From: Smitty
Date: 12/09/2007 20:40:38
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSCS MSM DMSO
I don't have carpal tunnel, but was wondering if anyone has used
DMSO for the pain ?
Smitty
--
--
The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver
On Jun 4, 2007, at 8:46 AM, parj...@bellsouth.net wrote:
sorry
2 scoops or tsp
Jacques
From: sol sol...@sweetwaterhsa.com
Date: 2007/06/03 Sun PM 05:55:04 EST
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: DMSO gel, was Re: CSshingles
parj...@bellsouth.net wrote:
Richard Harris's recipe is 2oz
On Mar 18, 2007, at 2:05 PM, sol wrote:
Nope, all properties of DMSO are not shared by MSM. DMSO can transport
other substances into tissues, but MSM can't. Supposedly MSM can
penetrate tissues for a very short distance but it can't take anything
else with it. Therefore it will not take CS
Hell. anybody out there?!?! I did get a few nibbles (and
thanks to each of you), but was hoping I'd get some bites y'all did ask
for CS questions, so I thought I'd oblige! grin
I was kind of hoping for the some of the lively discussions like were going on
several days ago.
Well Ruth, I'm not exactly a 'great mind' but I'll try to answer a few of
your questions. I have used a mix of CS at 10ppm and DMSO gel (70%) to cure
things like abscess, sebaceous cysts etc., also as in a recent post, it
seemed to help sciatica. The DMSO on its own definitely helps pains in
Well Ruth, I'm not exactly a 'great mind' but I'll try to answer a few of
your questions. I have used a mix of CS at 10ppm and DMSO gel (70%) to cure
things like abscess, sebaceous cysts etc., also as in a recent post, it
seemed to help sciatica. The DMSO on its own definitely helps pains
---
From: Smitty
Date: 07/06/2007 22:51:26
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSCS and DMSO - Amazing Discoveries!
Have you considered the FDA people ?
Good luck in your endeavor.
Smitty
On 6/7/07, Scott scottie592...@yahoo.com wrote:
Hey, Members!
I just wanted to take
Have you considered the FDA people ?
Good luck in your endeavor.
Smitty
On 6/7/07, Scott scottie592...@yahoo.com wrote:
Hey, Members!
I just wanted to take the opportunity to share with you all, that I have,
through some trial and error, created a natural healing lotion using CS,
DMSO and
I mix several applications worth at once, keep in a small glass
container. Mixing a large amount ahead, I found it does turn brown over
time, which could mean some of the silver drops out, which I do not want.
sol
Sharlene Miyamura wrote:
Don't know much about DMSO, but when combining it
I do.
sol
Pat wrote:
Can you mix the CS and DMSO and keep it so you don't have to mix it
each time?
Pat
--
The Silver
, 56 yr FL Pharmacist
-Original Message-
From: Ode Coyote [mailto:coyote...@earthlink.net]
Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 9:24 AM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSCS and DMSO; OT: need Scars/Adhesions help
Be sure to check and see if they will deliver to Canada.
Ode
At 11:14 AM
Be sure to check and see if they will deliver to Canada.
Ode
At 11:14 AM 10/16/2003 -0700, you wrote:
silversurfer1952 . 10/15/03 8:51 PM Wrote:
I'd like to get some DMSO but have no idea where to look for it. I'm a
city
slicker and don't know of any farm supply stores near where I
silversurfer1952 . 10/15/03 8:51 PM Wrote:
I'd like to get some DMSO but have no idea where to look for it. I'm a city
slicker and don't know of any farm supply stores near where I live, which is
in Montreal. Can anyone suggest where I might buy this stuff?
***
Check
If these adhesions are pure scar tissue? Then there are ways to disolve
them... I'l try to look up the info I came accross :)
Regards,
Al
- Original Message -
From: silversurfer1952 . silversurfer1...@hotmail.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2003 11:51 PM
Elle,
Ijust got 1 gal. of DMSO for $38.75 + $7.50 shipping, I don't think
this can be beat. The first sime I bought it I paid $9.15 for 4oz. They
also sell it in pints for $6.95. Their address is DMSO.com. Bob Smith
- Original Message -
From: silversurfer1952 .
I got mine at a health food store.
DL
silversurfer1952 . wrote:
Hi everyone,
I'd like to get some DMSO but have no idea where to look for it. I'm a city
slicker and don't know of any farm supply stores near where I live, which is
in Montreal. Can anyone suggest where I might buy this
Elle,
Enzymes are reported (anecdotally) to help tremendously with adhesions and
internal scar tissue. Vitalzyme is one of the best.
Jannette
From: silversurfer1952 . silversurfer1...@hotmail.com
Subject: OT: need Scars/Adhesions help
OT: Also, hoping this isn't the wrong place to ask... I
I bought my DMSO at the local health food store but it
was a bit pricey. Next time I will definitely be
buying it online.
--- silversurfer1952 .
silversurfer1952-at-hotmail.com |SilverList|
v4lvhmu07...@sneakemail.com wrote:
Hi everyone,
I'd like to get some DMSO but have no idea where to
You might try asking some horse people, someone at a near by race track
or training facility. I do not know where to buy it in your country but
in the US it is sold by most horse supply companies in a liquid and a
gel form. The gel is handy for topical application. It should give you a
slight
Harris, 56 yr FL Pharmacist
-Original Message-
From: Erik Duley [mailto:e...@systemcontrols.co.nz]
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 10:06 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso for eyes
Hi
I understand that DMSO and MSM can be bought at Veterinary supliers.
I have rung
Erik Duley 9/25/03 7:05 PM Wrote:
I understand that DMSO and MSM can be bought at Veterinary supliers.
I have rung a lot of places here in Auckland, NZ with no luck
**
I buy each from the internet:
http://www.dmso.com
Shirley Reed 9/23/03 5:27 PM Wrote:
I think maybe it goes bad because after a while (say 24 hours) it feels
different when I put it in my eyes. pj
*
Sorry, I haven't a clue.
Although I do put CS in my eyes
on occasion, I have never used
a DMSO / CS mix.
Jack
Be
I have never heard of any CS going bad !! I have seen some CS where the
silver particles have dropout of suspwnsion, but the Ionic portion of
properly made CS does not change.
Ole Bob
--
The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.
Instructions for unsubscribing
Hi Jack and all,
Since there has been discussion on CS+DMS in the eyes I just tried the
nebulizer mix,
50% CS+ 50% DMSO that is saturated with MSM.
No problems !! So forget that chestnut !!
Ole Bob
J
--
The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.
Instructions
Hi
I understand that DMSO and MSM can be bought at Veterinary supliers.
I have rung a lot of places here in Auckland, NZ with no luck
Does anyone have any contacts?
Regards, Erik
Robert Berger wrote:
Hi Jack and all,
Since there has been discussion on CS+DMS in the eyes I just tried the
: Thursday, September 25, 2003 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso for eyes
Hi
I understand that DMSO and MSM can be bought at Veterinary supliers.
I have rung a lot of places here in Auckland, NZ with no luck
Does anyone have any contacts?
Regards, Erik
Robert Berger wrote:
Hi Jack and all,
Since
Hi Erik, if your still stuck for DMSO MSM you might like to contact me off
the list as I have a source for both.
Cheers, Roger
Rotorua, New Zealand.
on 26/9/2003 2:05 PM, Erik Duley at e...@systemcontrols.co.nz wrote:
Hi
I understand that DMSO and MSM can be bought at Veterinary
Hi Roger
I just ordered some from the USA, but if you have a closer supply I am
all ears :-)
Cheers, Erik
Mt Albert
P.S. I used to live in Rotorua
Roger Barker wrote:
Hi Erik, if your still stuck for DMSO MSM you might like to contact me off
the list as I have a source for both.
Hi Erik, I order my DSMO from a friendly vet but it cost around $90.0 per
500mil - rather expensive but quickly available. You may be able to source
it cheaper from the States if you don't mind the wait.
As for MSM - I always like to keep some available and do sell a very small
amount to friends
Shirley Reed 9/21/03 3:06 PM Wrote:
Anybody know for sure how long cs mixed with DMSO will retain its strength and
not 'go bad'?
***
Define go bad .
What makes you think so.
Jack
Be Nice
--
The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal
Sounds like a case of blastomycosis to me. If so the doctor totally messed
up with the treatment, that has to be treated as a fungus like
histoplasmosis (which is another possibility), and from what I have read the
treatment is slow, expensive, and often unsuccessful.
Marshall
Owen Jones wrote:
Thanks. It is possible that you are the only group that has done any
experiments to determine this at all.
Marshall
Brooks Bradley wrote:
Dear List Membership,
During the immediately past nine years of
investigating/researching the
Chelation, with DMSO in the mix???
- Original Message -
From: Jonathan B. Britten jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 10:47 PM
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso
Other relevant speculation is this: how does the BBB normally work in
reverse
I believe it's been said over and over that silver nitrate is REALLY dangerous
stuff.
Chuck
UFO's are real--the Air Force is swamp gas!
On Sun, 16 Mar 2003 01:48:27 -0800, C Creel ccr...@eagle1st.com wrote:
namely 0.03 mg/l silver ions as
Dear List Membership,
During the immediately past nine years of
investigating/researching the uses/applications of
(uncontaminated/uncompounded) electrically-generated Colloidal
Silver..we have not discoverednor have we examined credible
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 12:07 AM
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso
Denise if you worry about odor then I say just forget about your health
and
worry about your love life.
Denise Every writes:
Have you had any problems with the garlic odor that I understand
Charles,
I have a book by Dr. David G. Williams DMSO The Complete Up-to-Date Guidebook,
and he mentions many uses for DMSO but does not talk about nebulizing it.
For me I use Brooks Bradley's Resaerch Foundation's methode for lung problums.
Taste like h-ll, but works very well.
Personally I
Catherine,
Did you pick-up the words silver nitrate !!! There still in no work
reported on electro-silver generated ions!!!
When it comesto using CS +DMSO for the new arrival of deadly pneumonia or
anthrax or other lung problem, then the brain Barrier be dammed. I do use it
and will
lol...well, geez, almost the best offer I've had all week!
Denise
- Original Message -
From: hdka h...@myecom.net
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 4:02 PM
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso
Denise I don't have a love life either. I can't smell because I smoke, And
I
am
Dear Bob,
You said:
Did you pick-up the words silver nitrate !!! There still in no work
reported on electro-silver generated ions!!!
** Yes, I did se that. I believe the question posed to which I responded
was aking about silver in general.
You said:
When it comesto using CS
Other relevant speculation is this: how does the BBB normally work in
reverse? IAW, how does stuff that gets in get out? Omura's work
suggests that it normally does not, but can be induced to. IAW, one can
clear out heavy metals and pathogens from the brain. Given that so few
MDs know
-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 12:07 AM
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso
Denise if you worry about odor then I say just forget about your health
and
worry about your love life.
Denise Every writes:
Have you had any problems with the garlic odor that I understand
accompanies the use
PJ,
What sort of tooth and gum problems did you have that were improved by the CS
DMSO?
Denise
- Original Message -
From: Shirley Reed
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 2:45 PM
Subject: CScs and dmso
List, the cs and DMSO combination as
The DMSO odor would be dose dependent. I doubt using a few drops would elicit a
noticable reaction. YMMV...
If you need to feel secure, take chlorophyll liquid or capsules as a internal
deodorant supplement.
Works for ketone breath too, for those following Atkins' induction diet.
cells, and dmso will
carry it to the brain.
- Original Message -
From: Denise Every deni...@citlink.net
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: CScs and dmso
I'm not worried about anything I don't have a health issue (actually
don't have
Hi Charles,
I just did a quick search of the archives and couldn't find a reference to CS
causing brain damage when used with or without DMSO. Could you please direct
me to the posts you are referring to? Thanks.
Andy
From: Charles Sutton
As we have learned on this list CS can damage brain
On Sat, 15 Mar 2003 22:59:02 -0500, Charles Sutton
cds...@earthlink.net wrote:
As we have learned on this list CS can damage brain cells, and dmso will
carry it to the brain.
What is this
I've been on this (and other) silver lists for some time and have
never seen even an implication
Hi Charles,
I did some more searching and all I could find was an obscure quote from good
old Dr Robert Becker, M.D., author of 'The Body Electric.'
He said the following, but so far, I can't find anything to substanciate it.
Silver can be toxic to nerve cells in the brain and spinal cord, but
Thanks for the post Catherine,
So this would indicate that CS can cause brain damage? At least in rats...
Andy
From: C Creel
An experimental study on silver in the nervous system and on aspects of its
general cellular toxicity.
Rungby J
Dan Med Bull 1990 Oct 37:442-9
An experimental study on silver in the nervous system and on aspects of its
general cellular toxicity.
Rungby J
Dan Med Bull 1990 Oct 37:442-9
Abstract
Exposure of foetal and adult rats to silver results in a long-lasting
deposition of the metal in many structures of the nervous system. A brief
Dear Andy,
You said:
Thanks for the post Catherine,
So this would indicate that CS can cause brain damage? At least in rats...
** I think it will be impossible to find literature on humans and this
topic primarily because silver itself will not cross the BBB.
If I had to speculate,
I use a mixture of 60% CS to 40% DMSO for cuts, bruises and muscle
pulls, and scrapes (and it killed my wifes plantars wart in about 6 weeks).
We apply it with a cotton ball and despence it from an old eye dropper
bottle. You want to cut back on the DMSO to 10-20% if you use a spray
bottle,
The degree of suffering one is undergoing is a factor in determining
what one is willing to impose on others.
Shirley Reed, 2003
Quite profound!
Using this mixture out of the eyedropper bottle lets you get right to
where you need it so you use less. We
Denise if you worry about odor then I say just forget about your health and
worry about your love life.
Denise Every writes:
Have you had any problems with the garlic odor that I understand accompanies the use of DMSO?
Denise
Now MyECom FreeMail gives you what you've been asking for.
Internal DMSO uses are multifarious and documented; e.g., in The Miracle of
MSM-The Natural Solution for Pain, by Stanely Jacob,MD, Ronald Lawrence, MD,
PHD., and Martin Zucker, copyright 1999.
I've seen a doctor's website that mentioned internal DMSO by itself is as an
anti-cancer modality.
On
In a message dated 11/5/02 12:16:07 AM Central Standard Time,
ba...@netease.net writes:
Also want to read about CS and DMSO from the standpoint of theirs who have
used it. I used DMSO with CS to get the CS where it need to go (my lower
leg and foot).
Can you explain how you did this? Did
Health food store chlorophyll capsules or liquid is remarkable as a deodorizer
(taken internally).
Chuck
Gestate: what you say when offered liver and onions when visiting.
On Mon, 04 Nov 2002 19:45:33 -0500, Robb Allen
On Tue, 05 Nov 2002 11:07:50 -0500 (EST), samma...@aol.com wrote:
I worry that I will allow something not good to get into my
system, like traces of soap left on my skin or something.
Normal hygienic practices should suffice. Wash, rinse, dry first.
My ONLY reaction to DMSO was when I used
Hi..I know for a fact that it can be taken internally because I've done
it.and it has been used many times for RA via IV. It tastes nasty
...and even worse..it makes you smell even worse..It takes 3
days for the smell to go away after you discontinue use. Robb
-
on 5/11/2002 1:45 PM, Robb Allen at rube2...@hotmail.com wrote:
Hi..I know for a fact that it can be taken internally because I've done
it.and it has been used many times for RA via IV. It tastes nasty
...and even worse..it makes you smell even worse..It takes 3
days for
I live in Russia for 20 years and never heard of DMSO for arthritis or
anything else. Yes, it was first discovered in Russia but it was never a main
treatment protocol.
Greeting Robb and Wayne,
Also want to read about CS and DMSO from the standpoint of theirs who have
used it. I used DMSO with CS to get the CS where it need to go (my lower
leg and foot).
I t worked. The only drawback was that it did definitely change my body
odor. My husband said it was not
Re: CSCs and DMSO Human UsageDoes the oral DMSO lead to any GI SYMPTOMS?
- Original Message -
From: Roger Barker
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: CSCs and DMSO Human Usage
on 5/11/2002 1:45 PM, Robb Allen at rube2
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