,
Bob Johnson
Fond du Lac, WI
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Steifel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 10:53 AM
To: dharban; rcse
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
Ok, I won't point and shoot. But the argument is weak about the pick up
or sun roof. Go rent
For all the late commers of this conversation who keep on pipinging in onwhy change the LSF program...No one wants to change anything !!! OK? The LSF Level 1 - 5 is what it is and always shall be! It's sacred. Your levelV want be belittled.Some people would ust likean additional
If its not about changing the LSF, then the title of the discussions should be New Soaring Program not LSF Discussion. I think that will bring focus to the discussion fia seperate class is what is truly desired.
JayOn 9/14/06, CapnCrunchie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
For all the late commers of this
...Seems like the people that can afford a quiver full of moldies don't want the wood workers to have anything to work for ...I want to check into something that I can complete with my wood airplane==I believe Cal Posthuma has achieved Level V TWICE with a hand-built wood airplane.
In a message dated 9/14/2006 4:24:45 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I believe Cal Posthuma has achieved Level V TWICE with a hand-built
wood airplane
He's probably 'one of one' that has done that ...
Too many people are forgetting the beginnings of this sport and
In a message dated 9/14/2006 5:03:03 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Yes, the first time I used a
Windrifter and Sagitta. The second time I used Sapphire and
Sailaire. I did use a Walt Good snffler on 10 k and two hour both
times. I am working on Level V for
Wrong Pepper, Don Harris has done it three times, and mostly with either wood or bagged ships. He is working on it again, that what happens when you retire.
Marc
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sep 14, 2006 3:29 PM To: Soaring@airage.com Subject: [RCSE] LSF
Hi All:
I've already started getting e-mails from folks out there in glider-land
...
PLEASE - I did not write anything about Cal or his accomplishments
...
Cal sent me his writeup and asked that I forward it to RCSE ...
I did ...
If any one has any comments, please direct them to Cal
Cal Posthuma
LSF VV
I know of no one else who can call himself an LSF X. (I wonder how many
there are)
Friends, this means something to me. Does it mean anything to you? Lets stop
arguing over LSF.
Bill Swingle
Janesville, CA
RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send
I think Don Harris may have done it three times... Way to go Don.. And
Cal Posthuma twice... Way to go Cal.
Now for those who complain the program is too hard, Cal has done it in a
wheel chair, with limited mobility.
Cal truly is one of the great Soaring Pilots, even without the program
his
: [RCSE] LSF Discussion update # CAL P. ##
I think Don Harris may have done it three times... Way to go Don.. And Cal
Posthuma twice... Way to go Cal.
Now for those who complain the program is too hard, Cal has done it in a
wheel chair, with limited mobility.
Cal truly is one of the great
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF Discussion update # CAL P. ##
For both of these Gentlemen, this is an accomplishment!!! Congrats!!!
RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and
unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please
The LSF page has all the Level V achievers and when they completed then.
http://www.silentflight.org/LSF_Base/achievers.htm
Bob Champine was the first to do Level V twice.
http://hometown.aol.com/GRC6431/myhomepage/
And Don Harris has three.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
In a message dated
: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 10:53 AM
To: dharban; rcse
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
Ok, I won't point and shoot. But the argument is weak about the pick up
or sun roof. Go rent a convertible. Others have done it.
The goal and return on a short course doesn't mimick the task. The air
Ryan, is it your intention to have me draft the program?
I'm sorry I won't do that. Smarter people than myself came up with the
original program.
I feel the current program is like the US Constitution. It is very good.
It holds up under time.
It isn't perfect, but what is? But on the other
In a message dated 9/13/2006 1:39:07 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Would
you perceive the following to be a set of tasks that is at least
asdifficult as LSF Level 1?
Whyinhell do weNEED a replacement for Level I?! - did you mean Level
II? If so, the short
I was thinking the same thing. The first LSF task is perfect. If you spend your time getting to know your plane, then doing LSF I should be a breeze. I also think the first task goes what it should do and that's intice people to participate. If it was an overtly difficult first task, I wouldn't
Guys,
I do not get something here. Why do people keep talking about the tasks being
difficult. They are all fun and yes maybe challenging but not difficult. Of
course the 8 hour slope flight might be considered difficult or at least boring
after a while. I consider things like having to
OK, I've read nearly all the comments on this topic in both forums and I'm
ready to toss my two cents worth in the pot.
If I were king, here's what I'd do to get my royal advisors started right
after I explained the KISS principle.
- Anyone wanting to become an LSF Sportsman MUST successfully
Damn I did it again. I'm sorry, I didn't realize that this was private.
I thought I hit reply instead of reply all, so I added RCSE back.
This IS a public apology for going public on something that should have
been private.
And for everyone out there Please put PRIVATE on the TOP line of your
of the current LSF Level 1 or any
other part of the current LSF program.
Regards,
Bob Johnson
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, September 13,
2006 1:56 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED];
[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; soaring@airage.com
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF
The thread ran its course to its logical enddisclaimers by posters that
they aren't evil, hadn't said anything negative and for the most part are
enthusiastic promoter/supporters of all things good and fun.
As expected the originator of the thread did not (once a bevy of
enlightened
analogy was that if you want to be a champion bass fisherman,
you'd better have a boat, preferably a fast one.
Dan
- Original Message -
From: Jim Deck [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: RCSE soaring@airage.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 1:06 PM
Subject: [RCSE] LSF discussion - some
I have been following this discussion with
interest and some good ideas have been advanced,
however I have seen no discussion of the two most
important items. Who will do the work and how
will it be financed. I have been a member of LSF
since 1972 and joined the old East Coast Soaring
I may be wrong (probably am), but perhaps some of the unease in the world could
be mitigated by one little change in the LSF rules, without changing any tasks
at all.
The rules say: requirements for the subsequent Levels may be achieved any time
after the previous Level form has been
Wow, no end in sight here. The SSA (Soaring Society of
America) Achievement Program for full size soaring has stood the test of time
(60+ years I believe). Why not the LSF Program? For those Level IIs
or IIIs needing contest points one week at the Nats will give you all
the points you need
Sorry, I only sent this to Tony and it should have gone to all.-- Forwarded message --From: Jack Iafret
[EMAIL PROTECTED]Date: Sep 13, 2006 8:07 PMSubject: Re: [RCSE] LSF discussion - some thoughtsTo: tony estep [EMAIL PROTECTED]OK, my one comment.
Read my post of the History
:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, September 13,
2006 4:56 PM
To: Soaring@airage.com
Subject: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
...was just that.
The thread ran its course to its logical
enddisclaimers by posters that they aren't evil, hadn't said anything
negative and for the most part
From: Jeff Steifel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Ryan, is it your intention to have me draft the program?
No, I just thought you might throw out a few ideas of tasks that you think
could be worthy. Other folks have done the same (like Don Stackhouse's
suggestion of a dawn till dusk thermal
PROTECTED]
To: Ryan Woebkenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: soaring@airage.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 4:47 PM
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
Damn I did it again. I'm sorry, I didn't realize that this was private. I
thought I hit reply instead of reply all, so I added RCSE back
The ICON? ;-)
At 04:55 PM 9/13/2006, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Oh well, life ain' t Perfect, but there is one plane out there now that's
pretty close :-)
Jim
Downers Grove, IL
Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR
AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at www.jimbacus.net
Of course that was the point of the movie, it was all about the
journey... just like the current LSF program.
At 04:39 PM 9/13/2006, Tom Broeski wrote:
I watched a neat movie on the World's fastest Indian (Burt Munro a NZ
motorcyclist who had to travel to Bonneville to have a place to set
: Bob Johnson
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; 'rcse'
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 4:52 PM
Subject: RE: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
At no point in my post did I suggest or imply that the current LSF Level 1
be replaced; I merely asked if the list of tasks posted was perceived to be
as difficult
I'm in support of ANYTHING that furthers or promotes the sport. I will
still finish my LSF in the old way, new way, anyway - doesn't matter. I
will participate in any new task format LSF or not. I will not discourage
anyone from trying new ideas. I will not attack them for trying to present
I don't know whether the people on this RCSE thread are reading the
corresponding thread or not so I am reposting a message I have on that
thread in this forum. Before everyone loads up to shoot, please
understand that these thoughts are offered not as definitive but more
as illustrative of what
In Boy Scouts you have to earn various merit badges to advance to the
different levels of achievement.
How ever in each of the merit badge books you have a list of
requirements you must completed to earn that merit badge.
Usually about 7 or 8 steps. 3 or 4 of the steps are required but their
What is the point of entering a contest if you do not want or try to
win. The fun develops from that desire and ambition. If we end up
losing and can only have fun if we won, then we do not know the true
meaning of competition.
Chad
I think that's what is wrong with so many current
Well put Jim, my sentiments exactly.
At 11:13 PM 9/7/2006, Jim Porter wrote:
Pat McCleave wrote:
Once again you are missing the point, it is not so much about changing the
current system as it is about adding a separate system to the fold for
those pilots who do not choose or
do not have
:54 PM
To: S Meyer
Cc: RCSE
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
Here is my comment on this subject.
Not everybody can be a Level V, otherwise there would be no reason to
attain it. No reason to change rules so more can reach the
apogee. Next they will want a handicap system for world competition
I started traveling to Ohio, Indiana, and Kentucky to attend
contests. First it was because that was where the HL contests were
at. Now mainly TD contests. It was not just for the LSF points, I
met some great guys along the way, learned a lot from all the
different people, and had a lot of
Pat McCleave wrote:
Once again you are missing the point, it is not so much about changing the
current system as it is about adding a separate system to the fold for
those pilots who do not choose or
do not have the means to travel to the big contests in order to complete
the list of tasks.
At 11:13 PM 9/7/2006, you wrote:
snip
These DO NOT have to be a blood and guts type of contest, merely an
opportunity to fly together, thereby learning from each other and improving
the overall skill level. When the other local flyers see how much fun is
being had they will join in, even if
Steve makes some really good points here.
We were already traveling on weekends 100's of miles just to go fly with
others, the LSF tasks didn't start us off on that.
We didn't get our contest task points at home because we have a big club,
we had to go on the road for those points because
It just occurred to me that a good explanation of why some want a
New achievement program may be the same reason that involvement by
new blood is diminishing. Nobody has any time to enjoy
themselves. The 40 hour work week is gone and if you get more than 2
weeks vacation consider yourself
Steve,
If we had that kind of achievement program we would have to have Level X for
Gordy.
See Ya,
Pat
S Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
It just occurred to me that a good explanation of why some want a
New achievement program may be the same reason that involvement by
new blood
replacing competition requirement with non-competition tasks that provide a
comparable level of challenge and skill development
To re-create a comparable level to a competition there would have to
be a task that required you to launch on a specific day, at a specific
time, regardless of
Steven,
Once again you are missing the point, it is not so much about changing the
current system as it is about adding a separate system to the fold for those
pilots who do not choose or do not have the means to travel to the big contests
in order to complete the list of tasks. Funny thing
Testing the waters for a different type of LSF
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=554577
It's a long one...
Jim Deck wrote:
OK, probably most members of RCSE are aware of it but, for those who
aren't, a good discussion concerning the LSF is taking place in
Sailplane Talk on
I have stayed out of this foray but will offer only one clarification. When you talk about the planes of yor, we all flew those. Today we all fly what is out there today so the competition is just as meaningful as it was 20 years ago.
It is not moldies against woodies but the playing field is
Here is my comment on this subject.
Not everybody can be a Level V, otherwise there would be no reason to
attain it. No reason to change rules so more can reach the
apogee. Next they will want a handicap system for world competition.
The few the proud...
I aspire to be a level V.
Steven
]; 'James V. Bacus'
[EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'RCSE' soaring@airage.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 9:45 AM
Subject: RE: [RCSE] LSF discussion
I would disagree. Jim may have not caught every post and didn't catch the
disclaimers. It wasn't the originators intent to bash LSF. And I didn't
Actually, having read through a majority of the thread, I don't see him
as attacking the LSF. He says again and again that he respects the LSF
system, but is looking for something that isn't so dependent upon
contests. It's something that even I've heard repeatedly, and I've only
been
That is about the Best Summation I have ever read.
Great Job Jim.
chip
-Original Message-
From: James V. Bacus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 8:56 AM
To: RCSE
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF discussion
I've read it all before...
A guy looks at the LSF task set
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF discussion
I've read it all before...
A guy looks at the LSF task set and they seem daunting so he figures he
will redesign them.
Instead of actually joining LSF and figuring what its all about its much
easier to attack it from the computer on the forums, e-lists, or where
Hello Chuck!!!AMEN!!!cheersJim
Ya,
Pat McCleave
Wichita, KS
- Original Message -
From:
Jack Iafret
To: Pat McCleave
Cc: RCSE
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 7:16
PM
Subject: Re: [RCSE] LSF Discussion
I have stayed out of this foray but will offer only one
clarification. When you talk
Hi Guys,
Here is my 2 cents worth on the topic. First off, I am currently a Level III
Pilot needing only my Goal and Return to complete Level IV. I plan to continue
under the current guidlines to strive to reach Level V. I am going to do so
because I have always felt like and still do feel
At 11:08 PM 9/5/2006, you wrote:
OK, probably most members of RCSE are aware of it but, for those who
aren't, a good discussion concerning the LSF is taking place in
Sailplane Talk on RCGroups. Both members non-members of the LSF
may find it interesting.
Here we go again with the same old
On Wed, 6 Sep 2006, Ben Wilson wrote:
mean new people, but also some new ideas - and I'll give an ear to just
about anyone who has an idea that might help me put more people in my club
and more planes in the air.
(Young) people are unaware that such thing as R/C soaring exists. It might
I've read it all before...
A guy looks at the LSF task set and they seem daunting so he figures he
will redesign them.
Instead of actually joining LSF and figuring what its all about its much
easier to attack it from the computer on the forums, e-lists, or where ever
it may get attention.
OK, probably most members of RCSE are aware of it but, for those who aren't,
a good discussion concerning the LSF is taking place in Sailplane Talk on
RCGroups. Both members non-members of the LSF may find it interesting.
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