Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Another thought that stuck me. (and is probably more an OpenLayers question) is whether it can pull the graphical tiles from a 'file://' URI. They you could place rendered tiles on a local file store and not have to implement the webserver locally. Maybe with symlinking and browser resizing you can fake up some of the zoom levels to save disk space. Simon. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Hi, you could try using gosm (http://gosm.sf.net) you can mark an area and use the download-button in the 'Selection'-panel on the right. There you can select which zoom levels to download from this selection. When you configure nothing special, the tiles will be downloaded to /tmp/osm_mapnik or something and thereby deleted on reboot, but you can set another path as a cache dir in 'Options-Preferences'. This will allow you to make downloaded tiles permanantly available to the software. Is it possible for Marble to cache the data for offline viewing? On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 5:24 PM, Rory McCannr...@technomancy.org wrote: On 02/07/09 17:40, Mikel Maron wrote: - Offline map editing. ... It hadn't occured to me to have offline editing. It would be cool to have that, since lots of the areas that have low bandwidth aren't mapped very well. However trying to write all the custom code and syncronise all that up is not an easy task, so I'm going to leave that for the moment. :) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
On Friday 03 July 2009 12:47:42 maning sambale wrote: Is it possible for Marble to cache the data for offline viewing? Yes and no. Yes, in the sense that if you browse a certain area, the tiles that are downloaded are cached in the disk cache. No, in the sense that only the tiles that are actually visited will be cached. There is no way to say, for instance, download and cache all tiles in the current area for all zoomlevels and then have them downloaded automatically. In other words, yes it's possible but no, there is no really convenient way to do it. Patches are welcome, though . :-) Note also that the marble team is working on an OSM editing plugin that will allow the user to directly edit the OSM data. -Inge On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 5:24 PM, Rory McCannr...@technomancy.org wrote: On 02/07/09 17:40, Mikel Maron wrote: - Offline map editing. ... It hadn't occured to me to have offline editing. It would be cool to have that, since lots of the areas that have low bandwidth aren't mapped very well. However trying to write all the custom code and syncronise all that up is not an easy task, so I'm going to leave that for the moment. :) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Rory McCann rory at technomancy.org writes: Hi all, A team has formed amoung the Ubuntu community to help make Ubuntu work well for NGOs (Non-Govermental Organisations, aka charities) [1] [2]. I myself have done some volunteer work sending ubuntu computers to Africa with Camara [3]. One problem with many places in the developing world is non-existant or poor internet bandwidth. Many people have made an Offline Wikipedia, Camara has done and it has been very successful. It occured to me that having good free offline maps would also be very valuable, i.e. an offline OpenStreetMap. Has anyone done this with OSM? Hi, I would suggest you to make a fast test with OSM derived shapefiles and GIS program like QGis or OpenJUMP and see how close to your aim you could get by using those. They offer moderate styling capabilities whitch may not be extremely good for nice looking printed maps. On the other hand they are full featured GIS programs which can do nice things with the data. I mean things like search by any attribute, measuring distances and areas, finding features which are close to another feature or inside another feature, classification and colour theming by an attribute value, support for using local aerial images and so on. Don't be afraid of the tags which are missing from Cloudmade or Geofabric shapefile downloads, more tags can be added afterwards, or you can include local database to the offline package. Just have a look at the rendering and consider if the quality would be good enough for the potential users. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
On 02/07/09 19:43, Iván Sánchez Ortega wrote: IMHO, it'd be better to have the rendered tiles on the DVD. If you want to have a tweaked ubuntu liveDVD with postGIS, mapnik, mod_tile and the whole shebang, fine. But I guess that doing so will disrupt the workflow of the people using the computer. Definitly agree here. In my experience things should be as simple as possible. Having a whole pile of directories and images and one html file and one JS file is much better than running a complicated stack. Rory signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
On 02/07/09 17:40, Mikel Maron wrote: - Offline map editing. ... It hadn't occured to me to have offline editing. It would be cool to have that, since lots of the areas that have low bandwidth aren't mapped very well. However trying to write all the custom code and syncronise all that up is not an easy task, so I'm going to leave that for the moment. :) signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Is it possible for Marble to cache the data for offline viewing? On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 5:24 PM, Rory McCannr...@technomancy.org wrote: On 02/07/09 17:40, Mikel Maron wrote: - Offline map editing. ... It hadn't occured to me to have offline editing. It would be cool to have that, since lots of the areas that have low bandwidth aren't mapped very well. However trying to write all the custom code and syncronise all that up is not an easy task, so I'm going to leave that for the moment. :) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Hi all, A team has formed amoung the Ubuntu community to help make Ubuntu work well for NGOs (Non-Govermental Organisations, aka charities) [1] [2]. I myself have done some volunteer work sending ubuntu computers to Africa with Camara [3]. One problem with many places in the developing world is non-existant or poor internet bandwidth. Many people have made an Offline Wikipedia, Camara has done and it has been very successful. It occured to me that having good free offline maps would also be very valuable, i.e. an offline OpenStreetMap. Has anyone done this with OSM? Hi Rory, I guess it depends on the precise requirements. Are you asking whether sections of geodata can be rendered into 'picture files' for view later? Of course this is basically what is happening all the time. If you want a 'slippy map' displayed in a local webbrowser this can also be achieved by having a local webserver or tile cache on the same machine that the web browser is on. Richard wrote up how to build/run a tileserver on Ubuntu: http://weait.com/content/build-your-own-openstreetmap-server If not, it should be easy enough to generate and create a CD, which leads me to my next question. Approximatly how big are all the map tiles? I doubt you'd fit the whole planet on a DVD. There might be ways to make it simplified, less zoom levels, black white vs colour, restricted area, etc. Leads me to ask an OpenLayers question can it support a fall back on the tile server. So one machine has priority covering a specific area, and when that area is left another machine takes over? Cheers, Mungewell. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
I wonder if Portable GIS would help? http://www.archaeogeek.com/blog/portable-gis/ Cheers, Joseph 2009/7/2 si...@mungewell.org: Hi all, A team has formed amoung the Ubuntu community to help make Ubuntu work well for NGOs (Non-Govermental Organisations, aka charities) [1] [2]. I myself have done some volunteer work sending ubuntu computers to Africa with Camara [3]. One problem with many places in the developing world is non-existant or poor internet bandwidth. Many people have made an Offline Wikipedia, Camara has done and it has been very successful. It occured to me that having good free offline maps would also be very valuable, i.e. an offline OpenStreetMap. Has anyone done this with OSM? Hi Rory, I guess it depends on the precise requirements. Are you asking whether sections of geodata can be rendered into 'picture files' for view later? Of course this is basically what is happening all the time. If you want a 'slippy map' displayed in a local webbrowser this can also be achieved by having a local webserver or tile cache on the same machine that the web browser is on. Richard wrote up how to build/run a tileserver on Ubuntu: http://weait.com/content/build-your-own-openstreetmap-server If not, it should be easy enough to generate and create a CD, which leads me to my next question. Approximatly how big are all the map tiles? I doubt you'd fit the whole planet on a DVD. There might be ways to make it simplified, less zoom levels, black white vs colour, restricted area, etc. Leads me to ask an OpenLayers question can it support a fall back on the tile server. So one machine has priority covering a specific area, and when that area is left another machine takes over? Cheers, Mungewell. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
On 02/07/09 16:39, si...@mungewell.org wrote: If you want a 'slippy map' displayed in a local webbrowser this can also be achieved by having a local webserver or tile cache on the same machine that the web browser is on. Yeah that's pretty much what I want to. I'm curious if it'd be better to pre-generate all the images before, and then you're just serving static files, or if it'd be better to have some sort of web server / database / the whole tile rendering shebang on there. Leads me to ask an OpenLayers question can it support a fall back on the tile server. So one machine has priority covering a specific area, and when that area is left another machine takes over? I'm aiming for this to be totally offline, i.e. the machine this runs on being totally disconnected from the web. Which means this doesn't really apply to me. Rory signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Offline can mean a number of things - Offline accessible maps. The tiles are created and stored on the local computer or network. A laptop can be configured with the OSM stack (mod_tile+mapnik), or any number of other stacks that work with OSM data files (OpenGeo, Sahana). Or the software could be configured to run from a USB stick .. don't know if anyone has attempted this yet for OSM rendering. The data is the other point. Planet is currently around 6.2 GB, compressed. That could fit on two DVDs. Probably better is to filter what's needed somehow, by using osmosis to cut a bounding box. Or download the relevant pre-sliced files from CloudMade or Geofabrik. - Offline map editing. In places with temporarily or permanently low or non-existant bandwidth (where many NGOs operate), the win would be capturing local data in the course of operations, and synchornizing with main OSM back at the main office, or when bandwidth became available again. The rails app could be set up to run on a local computer. The trick is how to synchronize. If there's been no other edits in an area, I suppose just sending sending over a series of changesets would do. The problem is merging if there's been exisiting edits at the same time. - Devices. iPhone has an offline maps app. It's easy to make maps for Garmin devices. -Mikel From: Rory McCann r...@technomancy.org To: OSM Talk List talk@openstreetmap.org Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 8:16:36 AM Subject: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ? Hi all, A team has formed amoung the Ubuntu community to help make Ubuntu work well for NGOs (Non-Govermental Organisations, aka charities) [1] [2]. I myself have done some volunteer work sending ubuntu computers to Africa with Camara [3]. One problem with many places in the developing world is non-existant or poor internet bandwidth. Many people have made an Offline Wikipedia, Camara has done and it has been very successful. It occured to me that having good free offline maps would also be very valuable, i.e. an offline OpenStreetMap. Has anyone done this with OSM? If not, it should be easy enough to generate and create a CD, which leads me to my next question. Approximatly how big are all the map tiles? I doubt you'd fit the whole planet on a DVD. There might be ways to make it simplified, less zoom levels, black white vs colour, restricted area, etc. Thanks Rory [1]: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NGO [2]: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-ngo [3]: http://camara.ie/___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
I'm curious if it'd be better to pre-generate all the images before, and then you're just serving static files, or if it'd be better to have some sort of web server / database / the whole tile rendering shebang on there. Pre-generating probably won't be the good way to go, I saw some figures for OSM tileserver and tiles for whole world at largest zoom were in order of several hundred terabytes (I think it was like 10^10 tiles for whole world) - though only tiny fraction of them are actually generated and cached. You will end up with map of either quite small area or map that is missing some of the zoom levels Whole world dump (bzip2 compressed) is 6.2 GB, but for practical use you have to convert it to some better format (large bzipped file does not allow random access or queries like return ways at this bbox), which will likely make the resulting file larger. Theoretically you may fit on dual layer DVD with whole world, but I doubt it If you limit yourself on one continent, you can probably fiot that on a DVD quite fine. Perhaps you can combine it - use pre-generated map for very high zooms (whole world) and then generate the maps for the continent that is present on the DVD on the fly (with some cache) Martin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
--- On Thu, 2/7/09, Mikel Maron mikel_ma...@yahoo.com wrote: - Devices. iPhone has an offline maps app. It's easy to make maps for Garmin devices. AndNav2 (Android) has an inbuilt pre-caching option, this can be slow, the alternative is some apps that precache maps for trekbuddy (J2ME) also work for making AndNav2 tile packs too. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
--- On Thu, 2/7/09, Mikel Maron mikel_ma...@yahoo.com wrote: The data is the other point. Planet is currently around 6.2 GB, compressed. That could fit on two DVDs. Probably better That's assuming you leave it in OSM format, you can probably reduce this size if you switch it to some other format specifically developed for portable devices like garmin etc. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 6:20 PM, Rory McCannr...@technomancy.org wrote: I'm curious if it'd be better to pre-generate all the images before, and then you're just serving static files, or if it'd be better to have some sort of web server / database / the whole tile rendering shebang on there. What about using a navigation software like navit that is able to render the data at realtime? Also, what area would be needed? whole world? or just nearby areas? i believe that the current extracts for the whole africa in navit format could fit even on a single CD -- Elena ``of Valhalla'' homepage: http://www.trueelena.org email: elena.valha...@gmail.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
El Jueves, 2 de Julio de 2009, Rory McCann escribió: [...] I'm curious if it'd be better to pre-generate all the images before, and then you're just serving static files, or if it'd be better to have some sort of web server / database / the whole tile rendering shebang on there. IMHO, it'd be better to have the rendered tiles on the DVD. If you want to have a tweaked ubuntu liveDVD with postGIS, mapnik, mod_tile and the whole shebang, fine. But I guess that doing so will disrupt the workflow of the people using the computer. I do think that you should experiment with setting up your own tile server, and run generate_tiles.py for Africa - that will get you directories full of tiles, ready to be burned into a DVD along with a small OpenLayers webpage. My guesstimation is that you could fit the tiles for the whole of Africa up to zoom 12 o 13 in a DVD. Cheers, -- -- Iván Sánchez Ortega i...@sanchezortega.es In America, anybody can be president. That's one of the risks you take. - Adlai Stevenson (1900-1965) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
By the way: you should get in touch with Engineers Without Borders[1] and similar NGOs. They sure have some experience deploying GIS in the developing world. [1] http://www.ewb-international.org/ Cheers, -- -- Iván Sánchez Ortega i...@sanchezortega.es If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything. -- Mark Twain ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
Whole world dump (bzip2 compressed) is 6.2 GB It would be possible to filter this to produce a smaller (but less precise) version, which might be ample for your requirements. For example a sweeping curve may be drawn in OSM with a node every meter, taking 100 nodes. When in reality it is derived from GPS data with 6m accuracy. Distilling this down to a way which is 'not more than 5m away' from the original might save a considerable amount of space. You can also strip out all of the data/tags which you are not interested in rendering. Obviously you would not want to upload any of this 'tainted' data back into the OSM database. Simon. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
You can also strip out all of the data/tags which you are not interested in rendering. Obviously you would not want to upload any of this 'tainted' data back into the OSM database. If you do now want to edit, just use the data to display a map (and perhaps do some routing, etc , you need less data (no created_by or other useless tags and things like highway=residential can be translated to some index into specific lookup table) GpsMid (app to display OSM maps on a cellphone and route in them) can take ~72Mb bzipped dump and produce ~36Mb .jar with the app and (almost) all the usable data in the OSM. So maybe there is some way to get 6.2 GB planet dump and produce some ~3Gb file that would contain entire OSM in a manner that would allow easy displaying and perhaps routing. Though nobody have written such program yet :) Martin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
--- On Thu, 2/7/09, si...@mungewell.org si...@mungewell.org wrote: Distilling this down to a way which is 'not more than 5m away' from the original might save a considerable amount of space. You can also strip out all of the data/tags which you are not interested in rendering. Or you could use some binary format that reduces all the bloating produced by xml. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 John Smith wrote: Or you could use some binary format that reduces all the bloating produced by xml. ...or database [files] as Rory McCann suggested, for direct usage. Stefan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEAREKAAYFAkpNdPkACgkQYH1+F2Rqwn1F4gCaAl+K2N2f7IFtNca4A95PKvd5 Cq0An2GaVvZbWAvgZWDZOfOXYE2JX8Gq =rp+3 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Making an offline OpenStreetMap CD/DVD ?
--- On Thu, 2/7/09, Stefan de Konink ste...@konink.de wrote: Or you could use some binary format that reduces all the bloating produced by xml. ...or database [files] as Rory McCann suggested, for direct usage. I'm guessing the database files would take up more space due to overheads and indexing, although I've no idea how garmin stores data but they store it in such a way that it fits on a reasonably small storage device that can be used for routing not just map display. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
