Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-10 Thread Dan Watson
Thanks for all of the replies, very useful. Also for the recommendations on the 74LVC1G74 and 1G80. I don't know why I didn't check for a 7474 in this technology, of course they would have that available. But it looks like the 1G80 will do just exactly what I need in a smaller package, so I think

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-09 Thread David McGaw
One thing that is hidden in AC and later CMOS is very tightly controlled edge-rate to combat ground bounce. The original AC components were so fast, the ground bounce could be measured in volts and they had to be quickly redesigned. For the D-FF function, you might consider using one section

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-09 Thread Hal Murray
watsondani...@gmail.com said: Let's say I have a 20MHz TCXO. I want to square up the output signal and divide by two. Easy, just a buffer or inverter and a flip flop. But looking at the pinout of the 74LVC1G175 (D flip flop) it doesn't have a Q not output. So now I need a second inverter to

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-09 Thread Dan Kemppainen
Hi Dan, 74LVC1G80. See: http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/sn74lvc1g80.pdf Might be worth looking at. Dan On 6/9/2015 4:24 AM, time-nuts-requ...@febo.com wrote: Let's say I have a 20MHz TCXO. I want to square up the output signal and divide by two. Easy, just a buffer or inverter and a flip

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-09 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The isolation in the package is likely better than the (practical) layout you will do to mate up with them. In fact, the single gate stuff probably does a better job of isolation than the multi gate stuff, simply because you can spread it out on the board. In the case of dividing by two,

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-09 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The question is always “good isolation compared to what?”. If you are expecting 180 db of isolation on a SOT-23 package at 10’s of MHz, it’s not going to happen. It’s also not going to happen with a practical pc board layout even without the SOT-23 involved. If something around 120 db is

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-08 Thread Dan Watson
I have something of a follow up question. How good is the isolation inside these devices (74LVC, SOT-23 package) between gates? Let's say I have a 20MHz TCXO. I want to square up the output signal and divide by two. Easy, just a buffer or inverter and a flip flop. But looking at the pinout of the

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-01 Thread D W
Thanks for the replies! Very informative. Dan Sent from my iPhone On May 31, 2015, at 6:23 PM, Attila Kinali att...@kinali.ch wrote: On Sun, 31 May 2015 14:06:26 -0400 Dan Watson watsondani...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone used or experimented with the 74LVC series of ICs? I have found

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-01 Thread Vlad
I am curious, how the integrated gates could be compared for those created on discrete elements ? Let say simple gates like this: http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electronic/trangate.html Regards, Vlad On 2015-05-31 18:23, Attila Kinali wrote: On Sun, 31 May 2015 14:06:26 -0400

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-01 Thread Tim Shoppa
The example circuits given on that webpage will be inferior in every way to RTL and DTL logic from the 1960's, which itself is inferior to late 60's/early 70's TTL. A good reference on how to do discrete transistor logic design from the 1960's, is TI's book Transistor Circuit Design. I just poked

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-01 Thread Attila Kinali
Moin, On Mon, 01 Jun 2015 11:00:31 -0400 Vlad t...@patoka.org wrote: I am curious, how the integrated gates could be compared for those created on discrete elements ? Let say simple gates like this: For the same implementation: Worse. There is much less control over the exact building of

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-06-01 Thread Andy
The gates on that page http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electronic/trangate.html use bipolar transistors. The 74LVC parts are CMOS. There are various effects caused by that difference. And those examples have vastly inferior control over input switching levels, compared to just

[time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-05-31 Thread Dan Watson
Hi, Has anyone used or experimented with the 74LVC series of ICs? I have found them quite useful in projects. Supply voltage of 2-5V, and two inverters or a single gate or flip flip in a SOT package. They make for much cleaner layouts than large DIPs. I'm wondering if they are acceptable

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-05-31 Thread Bob Camp
Hi The 74HC series is an “old and slow” CMOS family. In some cases people use their low speed to do filtering (they won’t follow a fast glitch …). Other than that sort of thing, the AC and LVC should be fine replacements for them. The HC might pull a little less power with nothing going on. If

Re: [time-nuts] Performance of 74LVC series ICs

2015-05-31 Thread Attila Kinali
On Sun, 31 May 2015 14:06:26 -0400 Dan Watson watsondani...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone used or experimented with the 74LVC series of ICs? I have found them quite useful in projects. Supply voltage of 2-5V, and two inverters or a single gate or flip flip in a SOT package. They make for much