Hello again, Doug and all Unicoders!
After reading through your currnet response, I was thinking about your issue with ISRISEO: about the symbols (especially) within the 0×80-0×BF (=positions 128-191) subrange, I origianlly planned ISRISEO to be *closer to ISO 8859-3 (Latin-3)*to have the
Mark Davis wrote:
I need to get a list of Latin characters that are generally considered
vowels. I partitioned the characters as in the list below, but there
are lots of oddball ones for which I can only guess (LATIN CAPITAL
LETTER OU? LATIN LETTER WYNN?...).
Martin Kochanski wrote:
To expand: su can mean his her their as well as the
polite your. In this context, el marino, el hermano de su
madre risks being felt as a complete phrase in itself (the
sailor, the brother of his mother), so you need de usted to
anchor it firmly to the second
At 11:43 +0200 2002-09-09, Marco Cimarosti wrote:
Anyway, here are a few comments:
1. List Vowels - probably not vowels:
U+00AA # (¬) FEMININE ORDINAL INDICATOR
U+00BA # (¬) MASCULINE ORDINAL INDICATOR
U+2071 # (ű) SUPERSCRIPT LATIN SMALL LETTER I
Of course these are
At 00:32 -0400 2002-09-09, John Cowan wrote:
Mark Davis scripsit:
If someone familiar with any of the weirder creatures in the Unicode
Latin Zoo could quickly scan the list over to see if there are any
errors, I'd appreciate it.
The following are not vowels.
The so-called OI is really a
On Mon, Sep 09, 2002 at 11:43:52AM +0200, Marco Cimarosti wrote:
Mark Davis wrote:
I need to get a list of Latin characters that are generally considered
vowels. I partitioned the characters as in the list below, but there
are lots of oddball ones for which I can only guess (LATIN CAPITAL
Radovan Garabik scripsit:
A bookcase full of old (~100 years) hungarian books has just got into
my posession. I noticed that J is there often used as a vowel
at the beginning of word before consonant (where modern hungarian has I).
However, before vowels, J stands for consonant /j/
Radovan Garabik wrote:
Originally, of course, latin had only capital letters
Well... This reminds me of people who say that language XYZ only has one
gender. :-)
I mean: if there was just one set of letters, how do you say they were
capitals or not? Are Arabic letters capitals?
Seriously
A clarification of the work generally; I realize that what
constitutes a vowel is heavily language-dependent. For example, y,
as has been pointed out, is a vowel in some languages, a consonant in
others, and both (sometimes a vowel and sometimes a consonant) in
others (e.g. English, Spanish).
De: "Marco Cimarosti" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Mark Davis wrote: I
need to get a list of Latin characters that are generally considered
vowels. I partitioned the characters as in the list below, but
there are lots of oddball ones for which I can only guess (LATIN
CAPITAL LETTER OU? LATIN
Ah, now I understand the 'guilty' part.
The UTC decided that rather than change the base rules in #29, it
would provide a prominent example of how those rules would be tailored
for French and Italian, citing those rules in that section. So for
that section, the only requirement is the set of
What I am doing is making a initial categorization based upon
information I have ready to hand, then asking for other feedback. I
have found that the best way to get feedback is to do a first cut --
that way people can concentrate on the more exceptional cases.
I am, sadly, not omniscient, and
Mark Davis wrote:
Ah, now I understand the 'guilty' part.
OK, now I feel relieved...
The UTC decided that rather than change the base rules in #29, it
would provide a prominent example of how those rules would be tailored
for French and Italian, citing those rules in that section. So for
Peter Constable kindly responded to my question in the original thread.
Would the encoding that would be intended to be used in the long term use
of Unicode be to use one of the characters from the range U+FE00 to U+FE0F
following the main character code so as to indicate the glyph alternate?
I
Radovan Garabik garabik at melkor dot dnp dot fmph dot uniba dot sk
understands:
Conclusion? It is pointless to talk about vowels and consonants,
if you are speaking about a _writing_ system (especially disregarding
the language it concerns).
Vowels and consonants make sense when speaking
Patrick Andries wrote:
- W and Y with typical vowel diacritics are almost certainly vowels.
I insist on the w^ in Chichewa which is, I believe, a consonant : a
bilabial fricative.
That's why I put it in my group 4: ambiguous [...] probably vowels. But I
guess that Chichewas could see a
William Overington wrote:
Would a variation selector sequence be something specified
and encoded by the Unicode Consortium [...]?
Yes. See
http://www.unicode.org/unicode/reports/tr28/#13_7_variation_selectors:
Only the variation sequences specifically defined in the Unicode
Character
Patrick Andries scripsit:
I insist on the w^ in Chichewa which is, I believe, a consonant : a =
bilabial fricative.
In Welsh, it's the vowel [u:]. So which wins, Welsh or Chichewa?
--
John Cowanhttp://www.ccil.org/~cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Please leave your values|
glides, and GOK what else. Of course, Mark was only differentiating
between vowels and non-vowels, but that may not make things much
easier; I still wouldn't know where to put English y.
Off-hand, it seems that in English y mostly* is [j] if in initial position,
otherwise it's either [i] or
On Mon, 9 Sep 2002, Marco Cimarosti wrote:
Mark Davis wrote:
4. List Nonvowels - ambiguous letters that are probably vowels:
U+0059 # (Y) LATIN CAPITAL LETTER Y
U+0079 # (y) LATIN SMALL LETTER Y
I would consider all these as vowels, although I know there is much room for
errors:
And isn't W a vowel in English too? As in the word few?
And even Websters 9th Collegiate (the closest dictionary I can pick up with one
hand) lists cwm and crwth -- which have w as their only vowel.
Phwl
[EMAIL PROTECTED] scripsit:
Off-hand, it seems that in English y mostly* is [j] if in initial position,
otherwise it's either [i] or [ai]. So it's either one consonant, or one or two
vowels...
English vocalic y is only [i] if it's final, with few exceptions
(machine, e.g.). Otherwise it
Hi Phil.
At 13:38 -0400 2002-09-09, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And isn't W a vowel in English too? As in the word few?
The thing is, vowels and consonants are spoken. Orthographies
(alphabets and other kinds) may represent those with one-to-one,
one-to-many, many-to-one, or many-to-many
On Tuesday, Sep 10, 2002, at 01:56 Asia/Tokyo,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
glides, and GOK what else. Of course, Mark was only differentiating
between vowels and non-vowels, but that may not make things much
easier; I still wouldn't know where to put English y.
Off-hand, it seems that in
Dan Kogai scripsit:
And how about an 'i' for Linux? A vowel ? or a diphthong?
Only if you say Lie-nux, in which case millions of Linn-ux and Lee-nux
fans will do the nasty on you! :-)
[Da][n] [Ko][ga][i], 5 Japanese Syllables, 3 English Syllables
5 moras, 3 syllables, actually.
--
You
At 04:37 PM 9/9/2002 -0400, John Cowan wrote:
[Da][n] [Ko][ga][i], 5 Japanese Syllables, 3 English Syllables
5 moras, 3 syllables, actually.
A new vocabulary word for me, so I looked it up...
mo·ra
n. pl. mo·rae or mo·ras
The minimal unit of metrical time in quantitative verse, equal to
Barry Caplan scripsit:
I think that I shall never see
a Kogai lovely as a tree
In English, strict-meter poems depend on the number of syllables, where
syllable is a very hard-to-define concept except that we know one when
we see it, with some special cases like flower, which can be one
I'm happy to report that the Apple tech note on installable keyboard
layouts for Mac OS X 10.2 has been published:
Tech Note 2056, Installable Keyboard Layouts
http://developer.apple.com/technotes/tn2002/tn2056.html
Please report any problems directly to me.
Deborah Goldsmith
Manager, Fonts
On 09/09/2002 02:43:52 AM Marco Cimarosti wrote:
1. List Vowels - probably not vowels:
U+212B # (Å) ANGSTROM SIGN
Given that this is canonically equivalent with a-ring, does it make sense
to consider one a vowel but the other not?
- Peter
On 09/09/2002 08:20:41 AM William Overington wrote:
Would a variation selector sequence be something specified and encoded by
the Unicode Consortium or by some other standardization body or would it
be
a matter for end users on much the same basis as Private Use Area
allocation
please?
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