Re: IUC27 Unicode, Cultural Diversity, and Multilingual Computing / Africa is forgotten once again.

2004-12-08 Thread Patrick Andries
John H. Jenkins a écrit : On Dec 8, 2004, at 3:57 PM, Patrick Andries wrote: Azzedine Ait Khelifa a écrit : Hello All, The subject of this conference is really interesting and veryusefull. But once again Africa is forgotten. I want to know, if we can have the same conference AfricaOriented

Re: Pour sauver la patrimoine de l'Imprimerie Nationale de France

2004-12-06 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : Voir http://www.garamonpatrimoine.org/ Note the use of Unicode in http://www.garamonpatrimoine.org/petition.html P. A.

[Fwd: Re: Re: Relationship between Unicode and 10646]]

2004-11-29 Thread Patrick Andries
] From: "Patrick Andries" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Enfin, je ne suis plus si sr que les socits amricaines considrent encore Unicode comme quelque chose de stratgique, il s'agit surtout d'efforts individuels de la part de t

Value of U+1E20

2004-09-16 Thread Patrick Andries
Would any one know what is the value of U+1E20 ? Is this (also) used in Semitic transliterations ? For which value ? Could it be a fricative G ? Many thanks, P. A.

Re: Unicode V4 and ISO

2004-09-01 Thread Patrick Andries
Martine Brunet a crit: Hello, I am new on this list and I have a question about very special characters and the standard Unicode v4. I sought much the answer to this question at www.unicode.org but without success. Can somebody say to me if the characters of the 4 following standards

Re: Errors in TUS Figure 15.2?

2004-08-03 Thread Patrick Andries
Doug Ewell a crit: Peter Kirk peterkirk at qaya dot org wrote: The situation is even more confused in that some Unicode characters, e.g. U+0152 LATIN CAPITAL LIGATURE OE, are called LIGATUREs in their character names but are unambiguously single Unicode characters (e.g. they have

Re: Much better Latin-1 keyboard for Windows

2004-07-27 Thread Patrick Andries
Mike Ayers a crit: RE: Much better Latin-1 keyboard for Windows [Alain] As I said in my previous mail, these definitions are not the best of definitions. The distinction is but intuitive, you have to see the diagrams where labeling makes the difference: SNIP/ I don't have

Re: Changing UCA primar[l]y weights (bad idea)

2004-07-12 Thread Patrick Andries
Alain LaBonté a écrit : It would be much better to make sorting, matching and searching consistent with tailored tables of either the UCA or ISO/IEC 14651. Unfortunately that is not what happens in most products, except in some good search engines (Google, Altavista and the like, which are

Re: Arabic written in Syriac? Arabic written in Tifinagh?

2004-07-09 Thread Patrick Andries
E. Keown a écrit : Elaine Keown Tucson Hi, I'm trying to track down a reference for Arabic written in Syriac (by Syriac Christians). Well, the keyword « Garshuni » may help here. I did a little work on Tifinagh 2-3 years ago. I discovered that it is used to write Arabic by

Re: Arabic written in Syriac? Arabic written in Tifinagh?

2004-07-09 Thread Patrick Andries
characters.. Patrick Andries wrote: Do you have any letters in mind ? Some such letters could very well be missing I did have a short list of such Tifinagh characters--6 or fewerfrom 3 years ago.but the U.S. Post Office lost two of my boxes this spring, and the Arabic- etc notes were

Re: Looking for transcription or transliteration standards latin- arabic

2004-07-07 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a crit : On 07/07/2004 07:08, Raymond Mercier wrote: This is a possible derivation. If this is Gerd's source, he failed to make the point that istimboli was not a Greek name of the city but a colloquial pronunciation of a phrase. And the source of that may be the following old German

Re: How to find character corresponding to code

2004-07-07 Thread Patrick Andries
Mike Ayers a crit : From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Say, I have given a 2-Byte Unicode character code. How can I quickly find out, how the corresponding character *should* look like according to the standard? From the Unicode standards page (FAQ

Re: Looking for transcription or transliteration standards latin- arabic

2004-07-06 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a crit : On 03/07/2004 00:07, Patrick Andries wrote: o very different political realities (before and after 1453). Cities change names without going through transliterattions, cf. Berlin (Ontario) becoming Kitchener in 1916. But Constantinople - Istanbul is not in fact this kind

Re: Looking for transcription or transliteration standards latin- arabic

2004-07-06 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a crit : So the change is more like Beijing - Peking than Berlin - Kitchener. Without a political change Constantinople would not have changed name in a matter of days (at least as far as the officials were concerned). In any case, it is not a transliteration problem (Beijing

[OT] Dutch letters was [Fwd: Re: is n with tilde used in French language ?]

2004-07-05 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a écrit : http://www.evertype.com/alphabets/french.pdf Several remarks : ü seems not be be listed (see « würmien », « le würm », « argüer» now acceptable according to a recent spelling reform). Population of France is now 61,7 millions (including around 1,7 millions French

Re: Looking for transcription or transliteration standards latin- arabic

2004-07-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Philipp Reichmuth a crit : Except there is no v sound, only an f sound in the Russian pronunciation of due to regressive assimilation. Chykoffskee is pretty accurate, actually. I'd say Tchaikovsky is just a spelling taken over from French at a time when French was pretty much the

Re: is n with tilde used in French language ?

2004-07-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Cristian Secar a crit : According to Michael Everson's site, The Alphabets of Europe page, the French .pdf, character and (Latin small / capital letter N with tilde) is used by the French alphabet. Not any alphabet taught in primary school I would say. But caon is in my Petit Larousse illustr

[Fwd: Re: is n with tilde used in French language ?]

2004-07-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Message original Sujet: Re: is n with tilde used in French language ? Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2004 21:31:28 +0100 De: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Pour: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Références: [EMAIL PROTECTED] At 21:50 +0300 2004-07-04, Cristian Secara~

Re: Mandombe

2004-07-02 Thread Patrick Andries
Anto'nio Martins-Tuva'lkin a écrit : Anyway, no clear indication on which language or languages is supposed to be served by this script -- though it seems to be aimed for Bantu languages, perhaps kiKongo (where ombe means black). It apparently means (in kiKongo) the Black people's own or For the

Re: Mandombe

2004-07-02 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a écrit : Anto'nio Martins-Tuva'lkin a écrit : Anyway, no clear indication on which language or languages is supposed to be served by this script -- though it seems to be aimed for Bantu languages, perhaps kiKongo (where ombe means black). It apparently means (in kiKongo) the Black

Re: Mandombe

2004-07-02 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : At 07:00 -0400 2004-07-02, Patrick Andries wrote: It is basically a script promoted by a Church (rather important one), a bit like Deseret. It is a pretty dreadful writing system. I find it hard to believe that anyone could actually read it or that anyone actually

[totally OT] Mohawk, Re: Looking for transcription or transliteration standards latin- arabic

2004-07-02 Thread Patrick Andries
Mike Ayers a crit : From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Chris Harvey Sent: Friday, July 02, 2004 11:17 AM Perhaps one could think of Ha Tinh as the English word for the city, like Rome (English) for Roma (Italian), or Tokyo (English) for Tky (English transliteration

Re: Looking for transcription or transliteration standards latin- arabic

2004-07-02 Thread Patrick Andries
Jony Rosenne a crit : -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John H. Jenkins Peking for Bejng. :-) Or Constantinople for Istanbul. :-) Two very different political realities (before and after 1453). Cities change names

[OT] Re: Still some educational work to do

2004-06-30 Thread Patrick Andries
Ted Hopp a écrit : I was listening to that program, too. When I heard the explanation of Unicode, I turned off the radio. :( [PA] This kind of experiences always makes me wonder how much « misinformation » I'm listening to or viewing on subjects about which I know less... P. A.

Re: Thrilling varia from the Library of Congress

2004-06-30 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : Found a book on the Tulu script. Found some of Doke's 1925 phonetic characters cited in a 1975 source. If a few citations of author specific characters are enough are sufficient for encoding I have a few more characters to propose Note : I don't know which I really

Re: Still some educational work to do

2004-06-30 Thread Patrick Andries
successfully proposed Tifinagh a major script used in a large part of Africa (Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya, an oasis in Egypt, Mali, Niger and part of Burkina Faso,...). Patrick Andries - o - O - o ISO 10646 et Unicode en français http://pages.infinit.net/hapax

Re: Still some educational work to do

2004-06-30 Thread Patrick Andries
Donald Z. Osborn a écrit : And a lot more yet... In some parts of the world that could benefit most from actively working Unicode, such as much of Africa, there is still relatively little knowledge of it. Even among techies. In fact, there is still an undercurrent of dissatisfaction among some who

Tifinagh (Projet de norme marocaine 17.1.100) (was Re: lines 05-08, version 4.7 of Roadmap to BMP and 'Hebrew extensions')

2004-06-28 Thread Patrick Andries
Marco Cimarosti a écrit : Rick McGowan wrote: I mistakenly thought Tifinagh was rtl. That's OK. It has been, and sometimes still is, written right to left, hence it was roadmapped in a right-to-left allocation block. However, in modern usage, and in the Moroccan national standard

Re: Tifinagh and Roadmap

2004-06-28 Thread Patrick Andries
Marco Cimarosti a écrit : Is the draft of this Moroccan standard on-line somewhere? TIA. _ Marco Speaking of Tifinagh, I notice the block allocated to it has been modified but not the document referenced in it. See http://www.unicode.org/roadmaps/bmp/, row 2D. I believe it should point to

Re: Bantu click letters

2004-06-10 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : At 10:00 -0400 2004-06-10, John Cowan wrote: And today, if I were reprinting it, I'd commission a digital font (your effort, my expense) and put the characters in the PUA. Not if you wanted, as an Africanist, to be able to represent the text as it was originally

Re: Bantu click letters

2004-06-10 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a écrit : Michael Everson a écrit : Practice your tongue-twisting. Proposal to add Bantu phonetic click characters to the UCS http://www.evertype.com/standards/iso10646/pdf/n2790-clicks.pdf :-P Are these letters used in any other book than Doke's book on Kalahari Bushmen ? P

Re: Bantu click letters

2004-06-09 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : Practice your tongue-twisting. Proposal to add Bantu phonetic click characters to the UCS http://www.evertype.com/standards/iso10646/pdf/n2790-clicks.pdf :-P Are these letters used in any other book than Doke's book on Kalahari Bushmen ? P. A.

Re: Phoenician, Fraktur etc

2004-05-26 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a écrit : If Fraktur and ordinary Latin are the same script, then it couldn't be said that the Germans abandoned the Fraktur script after WWII. Yet, that is what available references say did happen. Fraktur was actually abandonned during the Nazi era. In an ordinance dated

Re: Multiple Writing Directions in One Script

2004-05-25 Thread Patrick Andries
Dean Snyder a écrit : Archaic Greek could be written right-to-left, left-to-right, or boustrophedon. I'm asking for technical advice as to how such variability in writing direction streams in the same script can be, and should be, handled in Unicode, and how it should be dealt with in a Unicode

Re: Multiple Writing Directions in One Script

2004-05-25 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : At 14:02 -0700 2004-05-25, Patrick Andries wrote: I believe is similar to what exists in Old Italic. Please refer to the Old Italic proposal. Old Italic is no longer a proposal. It has been encoded. I know, Michael. But there is still a document called the Old Italic

Re: Response to Everson Phoenician and why June 7?

2004-05-24 Thread Patrick Andries
saqqara a écrit : I showed my 5 year old some Fraktur (lower case only) for the first time today. He is only just getting to grips with reading simple English words. And the verdict .. 'funny and silly' but he could still read the words back to me. Anecdotal perhaps but Dean, do you want me

Re: Response to Everson Phoenician and why June 7?

2004-05-24 Thread Patrick Andries
Doug Ewell a crit : And when shown the Stterlin, he couldn't read it but certainly recognized it as handwriting. So would he when submitted with a Cyrillic handwriting ? P. A.

Inscription in Punic and Neopunic

2004-05-24 Thread Patrick Andries
Apparently the following book Kanaanische und aramische Inschriften, by H. Donner-W Rllig, Wiesbaden, 1962-64 (3rd edition 1971-1976) on page 161 (if I read properly the reference) contains a sample of an inscription that would be partly written in Punic and partly in Neo-Punic. I have

Re: Inscription in Punic and Neopunic

2004-05-24 Thread Patrick Andries
James Kass a crit : Patrick Andries wrote, The inscription was found in Cherchel (Algeria) and is apparently dedicated to Micipsa. Would anyone have access to the aforementioned book ? Could that person be so kind as to see whether such an inscription is indeed illustrated

Re: Proposal to encode dominoes and other game symbols

2004-05-24 Thread Patrick Andries
John Hudson a écrit : Michael Everson wrote: Here. Chew on this. :-) N2760 Proposal to encode dominoes and other game symbols Michael Everson 2004-05-18 http://std.dkuug.dk/jtc1/sc2/wg2/docs/n2760.pdf This could get out of hand very quickly. Chinese and Japanese (shogi) chess pieces? To

Re: Phoenician and software development

2004-05-21 Thread Patrick Andries
saqqara a écrit : Unification of the Phoenician script with Hebrew would certainly eliminate some short term problems - the Hebrew script is fairly well supported nowadays among applications and we'd eliminate the Plane 1 issue. Terribly confusing to users however - the majority do not read

Re: [OT] What is Langues'O

2004-05-21 Thread Patrick Andries
From: John Cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Philippe Verdy scripsit: Please go to Langues'O for this commentary. As I wrote, you will be probably answered with the historical context. C'est quoi Langues'O ? Où est-ce ? Please check http://www.inalco.fr/ As the splash page shows it is «

Re: [OT] What is Langues'O

2004-05-21 Thread Patrick Andries
Philippe Verdy a écrit : Please check http://www.inalco.fr/ As the splash page shows it is « Langues O' ». Yes but only on the splash screen. Elsewhere on the site (the top banner, and menu, and the logos in PDFs of its brochures, letters and publications) it uses Langues'O which means

Re: ISO 15924 French name Gotique: a typo...???

2004-05-21 Thread Patrick Andries
Philippe Verdy a écrit : To find proof that gotique is incorrect in French, I looked for some official French resources, notably the list of language names published and used by the BPI: http://www.culture.gouv.fr/culture/dglf/bpi/list-langues.html clicking in the allemand language name gives

Re: ISO 15924 draft fixes

2004-05-20 Thread Patrick Andries
Antoine Leca a crit : The French name for Hang looks strange. It happened to be hangul (hangul, hangeul) (after quite a bit of discussion.) The name in ISO/CEI 10646 (F) is hangl from a Corean dictionary and a Corean grammar published by the Inalco (Langues O'). Another suggested form in

Re: Response to Everson Phoenician and why June 7?

2004-05-20 Thread Patrick Andries
James Kass a crit : Ernest Cline wrote, In order for Phoenician to be disunified from Hebrew, it must first have been unified with Hebrew. This is not the case. Well then, nonunification if you wish to be picky about it. Sorry if I offended. Many on this list have referred to the

Re: Compatibility equivalents, was: Qamats Qatan

2004-05-16 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a écrit : Well, at least façade and facade collate together at the top level, with the default collation weights, and so one will match the other in simple searches. [PA] I was simply trying to say -- not that I always express myself well -- that adding some characters may force

Re: Qamats Qatan (was Majority of community important, inclusion not forcing people to do anything)

2004-05-15 Thread Patrick Andries
Jony Rosenne a écrit : -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Andries Sent: Friday, May 14, 2004 11:16 PM To: Michael Everson Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Majority of community important, inclusion not forcing people to do anything

Re: interleaved ordering (was RE: Phoenician)

2004-05-14 Thread Patrick Andries
[EMAIL PROTECTED] a crit : Dean A. Snyder wrote, The issue is not what we CAN do; the issue is what will we be FORCED to do that already happens right now by default in operating systems, Google, databases, etc. without any end user fiddling? That's the question. Since search engines

Re: [BULK] - Re: Interleaved collation of related scripts

2004-05-14 Thread Patrick Andries
[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Peter Kirk scripsit: Well, I accepted somewhat reluctantly that Phoenician should be separately encoded because a small number of users want it to be, although a majority apparently do not want it to be. Neither you nor anyone else knows what the majority

Majority of community important, inclusion not forcing people to do anything (Re: [BULK] - Re: Interleaved collation of related scripts)

2004-05-14 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : At 12:08 -0700 2004-05-14, Peter Kirk wrote: ell, I accepted somewhat reluctantly that Phoenician should be separately encoded because a small number of users want it to be, although a majority apparently do not want it to be. I really don't know if those who spoke for

Re: interleaved ordering (was RE: Phoenician)

2004-05-14 Thread Patrick Andries
Kenneth Whistler a écrit : [on slow implementation of some collations by certain manufacturers and service providers] And the answer is to democratize the approach. I agree on the ideal solution, it has independently been mentioned to some large manufacturer's technical respresentative who

Re: Coptic/Greek (Re: Phoenician)

2004-05-13 Thread Patrick Andries
[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Peter Kirk scripsit: I support Coptic disunification on the grounds that it was requested by the user community. Initially I opposed Phoenician disunification because there was no evidence of demand for it from users. As such evidence has now been produced, I

Re: Coptic/Greek (Re: Phoenician)

2004-05-12 Thread Patrick Andries
D. Starner a crit : Doug Ewell [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Peter Kirk peterkirk at qaya dot org wrote: Because each such case has to be judged on its individual merits, according to proper justification and user requirements. There can be no hard rules like always split or always join.

Coptic/Greek (Re: Phoenician)

2004-05-11 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a crit : And these two cases are hardly a good advertisement for the expert's reputation. The Coptic/Greek unification proved to be ill-advised and is being undone. I'm rather surprised by this comment. If the Coptic/Greek unification proved to be ill-advised how could you

Script vs Writing System

2004-05-10 Thread Patrick Andries
At 12:12 -0700 2004-05-10, Mike Ayers wrote: But all this leads me to finally ask: what does script mean? It seems clear to me that although the term has been used throughout the Phoenician debate, not everyone is using it the same way. I know that there is a definition of script that is

Re: Phoenician

2004-05-08 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Jacobi a écrit : Patrick Andries [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [on tailored collations] [PA] I suppose this would be true in principle, but how long before this is implemented in the **actual tools** used by user such as MS Word or MS SQL Server ? [...] (yes, I know with a bit of tailoring

Re: New contribution

2004-05-07 Thread Patrick Andries
Doug Ewell a crit : It's clear to me that the reason my colleague and I can read this font is not that we have any special knowledge of both scripts, but because it's a stylistic variant of Latin. And thus he cannot read a Vietnamese text in Stterlin, as you said, because it is not a

Re: Phoenician

2004-05-07 Thread Patrick Andries
Dean Snyder a écrit : Of course. But that does not make tagged text a minefield - in the absence of your nice Phoenician font Hebrew would show up instead - precisely what is used by and large by Semiticists right now. [PA] I also got this feedback from Lionel Galand (of Tifinagh and Libyan

Re: Phoenician

2004-05-07 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Constable a écrit : [PA] I also got this feedback from Lionel Galand (of Tifinagh and Libyan fame) about Punic : «Je peux vous dire que j'ai souvent travaillé sur des répertoires de documents puniques qui étaient publiés en caractères hébraïques. » This could be multiplied a

Re: Phoenician

2004-05-07 Thread Patrick Andries
[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Jony Rosenne scripsit: A possible strong negative argument would be if having it would cause problems for those who do not think they need it. For example, if it would make searching more difficult. This argument has been raised, but I am not convinced the possible

Re: New contribution

2004-05-06 Thread Patrick Andries
Doug Ewell a crit : As I've said before, I don't know enough about the historical relationship between Phoenician and Hebrew to get involved in this bloodbath. But for the life of me, I can't figure out how Fraktur keeps getting dragged into it. For heaven's sake, it's not THAT unrecognizably

v and u positional variants (Re: New contribution)

2004-05-06 Thread Patrick Andries
Jim Allan a écrit : Similarly _v_ and _u_ were for long only used as positional variants. For very long, which explains for example why French has a non etymological h in « huile » (oil) : to distinguish vile (she-bad) and vile (oil) written the same way but pronounced differently when the h

Süterrlin (was A New Contribution)

2004-05-06 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a écrit : OK, maybe not such a good example. So let's go back to Suetterlin. I would expect a much higher rate of recognition among German users of normal Latin script than among American users of normal Latin script. So a test of recognition in America might seem to indicate that

Re: New contribution

2004-05-05 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a crit : Mark E. Shoulson a crit : Well, it doesn't need to be a wedding invitation, does it? I'll give it a try; I've downloaded a Stterlin font, and I'll type up a small document and see if I can get some English-readers to read it or recognize it. Even if they can't read

Re: Yoruba Keyboard

2004-05-05 Thread Patrick Andries
John Hudson a crit : For details, see http://www.bisharat.net/ and, for mailing list subscription, http://lists.kabissa.org/mailman/listinfo/a12n-collaboration If you are more at ease with French (yorouba ?), there is a Unicode-Afrique mailing list. To subscribe send a message to [EMAIL

Re: Pal(a)eo-Hebrew and Square Hebrew

2004-05-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Dean Snyder a écrit : Patrick Andries wrote at 8:55 AM on Monday, May 3, 2004: I got this answer from a forum dedicated to Ancient Hebrew : « Very few people can read let alone recognize the paleo Hebrew font. Most modern Hebrew readers are not even aware that Hebrew was once written

[Fwd: Re: New contribution]

2004-05-04 Thread Patrick Andries
03/05/2004 05:19, Michael Everson wrote: Suetterlin. Oh shut UP about Sütterlin already. I don't know where you guys come up with this stuff. Sütterlin is a kind of stylized handwriting based on Fraktur letterforms and ductus. It is hard to read. It is not hard to learn, ... Since when is

Re: Pal(a)eo-Hebrew and Square Hebrew

2004-05-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Kirk a écrit : On 03/05/2004 05:55, Patrick Andries wrote: Quoted... ... When the Biblical text is written in paleo Hebrew there are no vowel pointings. When the text was written in the paleo Hebrew four of the Hebrew letters were used as vowels - aleph, hey, vav and yud, but were removed

Re: New contribution

2004-05-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Christian Cooke a écrit : Surely a cipher is by definition after the event, i.e. there must be the parent script before the child. Does it not follow that, by John's reasoning, if one is no more than a cipher of the other then it is Hebrew that is the cipher and so the only way Phoenician and

Re: New contribution

2004-05-04 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a écrit : Christian Cooke a écrit : Surely a cipher is by definition after the event, i.e. there must be the parent script before the child. Does it not follow that, by John's reasoning, if one is no more than a cipher of the other then it is Hebrew that is the cipher and so

Pal(a)eo-Hebrew and Square Hebrew

2004-05-03 Thread Patrick Andries
I got this answer from a forum dedicated to Ancient Hebrew : Very few people can read let alone recognize the paleo Hebrew font. Most modern Hebrew readers are not even aware that Hebrew was once written in the paleo Hebrew script. There are also many who believe that the square script is the

Re: New contribution

2004-05-03 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael Everson a écrit : At 08:56 -0400 2004-05-03, John Cowan wrote: Michael Everson scripsit: You can buy books to teach you how to learn Sütterlin. Germans who don't read Sütterlin recognize it as what it is -- a hard-to-read way that everyone used to write German not so long ago. Sure.

Re: New contribution

2004-05-03 Thread Patrick Andries
D. Starner a écrit : Phoenician script, on the other hand, is so different that its use renders a ritual scroll unclean. And I've got Latin fonts, whose use will render a Bible unclean. (Might come in handy for Tantric religious works, though.) More seriously, I imagine some German

Re: Arid Canaanite Wasteland (was: Re: New contribution)

2004-05-02 Thread Patrick Andries
Elliotte Rusty Harold a écrit : At 9:43 AM -0700 5/1/04, Peter Kirk wrote: For the record, I agree that Old Canaanite would be a better name. The reason for this is not primarily to be more Semito-centric, but rather to represent better the range of languages covered. For the same reason, Latin

Re: New contribution

2004-04-30 Thread Patrick Andries
Ernest Cline a écrit : [Original Message] From: John Hudson [EMAIL PROTECTED] But your proposal specifically states that the 'Phoenician' characters should be used to encode Palaeo-Hebrew, as if somehow Hebrew and Hebrew are different languages when they look different. No more so

Re: New contribution

2004-04-30 Thread Patrick Andries
Ernest Cline a écrit : How about the following: When deciding how to encode ancient scripts in Unicode, sometimes arbitrary distinctions must be made between scripts that had a continuous evolution from one form into another. Depending upon the point of view of the author, a text written in a

Re: U+0140

2004-04-15 Thread Patrick Andries
Anto'nio Martins-Tuva'lkin a écrit : However I advise removal of the note Catalan under U+0140 and U+013F, and perhaps replacement of the whole note with «for Catalan use U+006C U+00B7» (resp. U+004C). Did you get an answer on this ? Why is there no decomposition associated to this character ?

Re: U+0140

2004-04-15 Thread Patrick Andries
Patrick Andries a écrit : Anto'nio Martins-Tuva'lkin a écrit : However I advise removal of the note Catalan under U+0140 and U+013F, and perhaps replacement of the whole note with «for Catalan use U+006C U+00B7» (resp. U+004C). Did you get an answer on this ? Why is there no decomposition

Re: U+0140

2004-04-15 Thread Patrick Andries
Philippe Verdy a écrit : From: Patrick Andries [EMAIL PROTECTED] Anto'nio Martins-Tuva'lkin a écrit : However I advise removal of the note Catalan under U+0140 and U+013F, and perhaps replacement of the whole note with «for Catalan use U+006C U+00B7» (resp. U+004C). Did you get

Re: U+0140

2004-04-15 Thread Patrick Andries
Kenneth Whistler a écrit : Did you get an answer on this ? Why is there no decomposition associated to this character ? Thanks to Eric and Patrick for digging out my answer on this perennial question from a couple years back, and saving me the trouble of having to rummage around to find it.

Re: U+0140

2004-04-15 Thread Patrick Andries
Philippe Verdy a écrit : From: Patrick Andries [EMAIL PROTECTED] Peter Kirk a écrit : What is U+2027 intended for? The name suggests that it might be what is needed for Catalan. [PA] Isn't this the one that should be used in dictionaries ? See http://www.unicode.org/unicode

Re: names of the chars?

2004-04-07 Thread Patrick Andries
Tobias Stamm a crit : Greetings to all standartisers! I'm new here so forgive me my stupidness. I just have one little question to which I didn't found the answer in the whole homepage: What is the standard of the characters names? * The valid English names of ISO 10646 are defined in Annex

Re: French typographic thin space (was: Fixed Width Spaces)

2004-04-01 Thread Patrick Andries
Asmus Freytag [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Have you folks noticed the addition of Narrow Non Break Space? Yes, but I have not been able to find a font with a narrow enough glyph (I just looked again at Code 2000). Does anyone know of an appropriate font for French in this regard ? P. A.

Re: Version(s) of Unicode supported by various versions of Microsoft Windows

2004-03-05 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter said: People *really shouldn't* ask Does product X support Unicode version N? They should be asking questions like Can product X correctly perform function Y on such-and-such characters added in Unicode version N? This makes for a rather long list of questions if you want to know what

Re: Version(s) of Unicode supported by various versions of Microsoft Windows

2004-03-05 Thread Patrick Andries
Peter Constable a écrit : Well, there is no way to answer a question like What version of Unicode does Windows XP support with anything other than a vague summary statement like somewhere between 3.0 and 4.0 or a bunch of details. And since people tend not to find a vague summary very useful, I'm

Re: [OT?] Modifying (Unicode) sorting of languages using diacritics in MS Word and MS SQL Server

2004-02-27 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael (michka) Kaplan a crit : From: Patrick Andries [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have the same question for MS SQL Server 2000... Similar answer to the one Chris gave for Word, though with a slightly older version of the Windows sort tables Finally, I would like to know

Re: [OT?] Modifying (Unicode) sorting of languages using diacritics in MS Word and MS SQL Server

2004-02-27 Thread Patrick Andries
Michael (michka) Kaplan a crit : [PA] Let me be reasonable as you kindly suggest, how about proper French Canadian (CAN/CSA Z243.4.1 standard (which you most probably know) and ISO/IEC 14651 with the delta corresponding to the latter) or Khmer sorting ? I am unaware of any specific

[OT?] Modifying (Unicode) sorting of languages using diacritics in MS Word and MS SQL Server

2004-02-22 Thread Patrick Andries
SQL Server 2000... Finally, I would like to know if it is possible for a user to add an additional language to the ones appearing in the Windows regional and language options, so as to assign to it, for instance, some keyboard layouts. Many thanks, Patrick Andries P.-S. : Do Word

Re: Detecting encoding in Plain text

2004-01-08 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: John Delacour [EMAIL PROTECTED] Given any sizeable chunk of text, it ought to be possible to estimate the statistical likelihood of its being in a certain encoding/[language] even if it's in an unspecified 8859-* encoding. It would be quite an

U+0488 and U+0489

2004-01-01 Thread Patrick Andries
Hello everyone, Does anyone have any background and usage information relative to the two characters named below ? Some rendered examples would be very much appreciated. U+0488 COMBINING CYRILLIC HUNDRED THOUSANDS SIGN U+0489 COMBINING CYRILLIC MILLIONS SIGN Many

Re: Mathematical exist and forall in Unicode

2003-12-30 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: Mirek [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hello, I am not sure if it is the proper place to discuss the case if missing characters, but haven't found better place. I tried to find out two characters in unicode and encountered the following problem. There are two

Looking for more samples of _| (power tower)

2003-12-30 Thread Patrick Andries
I have found an interesting form of a power tower (_|, see the third line here http://pages.infinit.net/hapax/images/puissances.jpg). I was wondering if anyone else knew of other occurrences of this sign? Many thanks, Patrick

Re: Mathematical exist and forall in Unicode

2003-12-30 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: D. Starner [EMAIL PROTECTED] These can probably be used as glyph variants, i.e., by selecting a US vs. European font (or whatever is the distinction). I thought glyph variants were supposed to look at least somewhat similar. Any reference to this

Re: UNICODE OTHER STANDARDS

2003-12-29 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: Markus Scherer [EMAIL PROTECTED] It looks to me like Christopher is not after an analysis of what standards could somehow be squeezed to use Unicode charsets, but rather a list of standards that _specify_ (actively, not potentially) Unicode/10646. The

Re: [hebrew] Re: Ancient Northwest Semitic Script (was Re: why Aramaicnow)

2003-12-28 Thread Patrick Andries
-Message d'origine - De: "D. Starner" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Indeed, by the same argument, we could encode a lot of scripts together. ISCII did it for Indic scripts. I'm sure we could do some serious merging among syllabic scripts - 12A8(#4776;) is the same as 13A7(#5031;) I

Re: Aramaic unification and information retrieval

2003-12-27 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: Patrick Andries [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Message d'origine - De: Michael Everson [EMAIL PROTECTED] At 17:46 + 2003-12-26, Christopher John Fynn wrote: (Though the Roman style Fraktur style of Latin script are probably more different from each

Re: Aramaic unification and information retrieval

2003-12-24 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: D. Starner [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yup, if you make a grid patten of sufficient size and complexity you can fit any relatively simple shape like a letterform into it. And this grid doesn't even particularly fit the characters. Two big rules of Latin

[OT] Size of Latin Capitals (was Re: Aramaic unification and information retrieval)

2003-12-24 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: Doug Ewell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Patrick Andries Patrick dot Andries at xcential dot com wrote: And this grid doesn't even particularly fit the characters. Two big rules of Latin typography are that the capital letters are all of the same size (visually

Re: [OT] CJK - CJC (Re: Corea?)

2003-12-15 Thread Patrick Andries
- Message d'origine - De: Don Osborn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Although I admit to not quite understanding the motivation for this suggestion, Request by 22 MPs that want to modify the English spelling by law. Because according to the articles this was the original English spelling before

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