Re: A last missing link for interoperable representation

Martin J. Dürst wrote: So rich text technology is already way ahead when it comes to styled text. Do we want to encode background-color variant selectors in Unicode? If yes, how many? Yes. You would only need one. Background colour was a feature of teletext in the United Kingdom from

Re: Encoding italic (was: A last missing link)

Mark E. Shoulson wrote: …, since italic fonts generally are narrower than roman). I remember reading years ago that that was why italic type was invented in the first place in the fifteenth century, so that more text could be got into small format books that could conveniently be carried

Re: Encoding italic (was: A last missing link)

Hi You are the gentleman who kindly made the Gentium typeface open source. Thank you for your generous gift to the world. > Use of variation selectors, a single character modifier, or combining characters also seem to be less useful options, as they act at the individual character level

Re: Encoding italic (was: A last missing link)

Asmus Freytag wote: This is an effort that's out of scope for Unicode to implement, or, I should say, if the Consortium were to take it on, it would be a separate technical standard from The Unicode Standard. I note what you say, but what concerns me is that there seem to be an increasing

Re: A last missing link for interoperable representation

Yesterday I wrote as follows. I suggest that a solution to the problem would be to encode a COMBINING ITALICIZER character, such that it only applies to the character that it immediately follows. So, for example, to make the word apricot become displayed in italics one would use seven

Re: A last missing link for interoperable representation

James Kass wrote: For the V.S. option there should be a provision for consistency and open-endedness to keep it simple. Start with VS14 and work backwards for italic, … I have now made, tested and published a font, VS14 Maquette, that uses VS14 to indicate italic.

Re: A last missing link for interoperable representation

I suggest that a solution to the problem would be to encode a COMBINING ITALICIZER character, such that it only applies to the character that it immediately follows. So, for example, to make the word apricot become displayed in italics one would use seven COMBINING ITALICIZER characters, one

Re: Encoding italic (was: A last missing link)

Doug Ewell wrote: And indeed, the forthcoming Unicode Technical Note we are going to be writing to supplement the introduction of the characters in L2/19-025, whether next year or later, will recommend ISO 6429 sequences like this to implement features like background and foreground colors,

Re: Encoding italic

Andrew West wrote: Just reminding you that "The initial character in a variation sequence is never a nonspacing combining mark (gc=Mn) or a canonical decomposable character" (The Unicode Standard 11.0 §23.4). This means that a variation sequence cannot be defined for any precomposed letters

Encoding colour (from Re: Encoding italic)

Egmont Koblinger wrote: Should this scheme be extended for colors, too? What to do with the legacy 8/16 as well as the 256-color extensions wrt. the color palette? Should Unicode go into the business of defining a fixed set of colors, or allow to alter the palette colors using the OSC 4 and

Re: Encoding colour (from Re: Encoding italic)

Previously I wrote: A stateful method, though which might be useful for plain text streams in some applications, would be to encode as characters some of the glyphs for indicating colours and the digit characters to go with them from page 5 and from page 3 of the following publication.

Re: Encoding colour (from Re: Encoding italic)

Philippe Verdy replied to my post, including quoting me. WJGO >> Thinking about this further, for this application copies of the glyphs could be redesigned so as to be square and could be emoji-style and the meanings of the characters specifying which colour component is to be set could be

Re: Vendor-assigned emoji (was: Encoding italic)

James Kass wrote: Nobody disagreed and I think it’s a splendid suggestion.  If anyone is discussing drafting a proposal to accomplish this, please include me in the “cc”. I too would like to receive copies of any discussions please. In relation to the proposal, I opine that the facility

Re: Spiral symbol

I seem to remember from reading a book many years ago, maybe around fifty years ago, something about one of the early chemists (Lavoisier?) having used two symbols, each a spiral, mirror images of each other, for two different things, maybe oxidation and reduction, in his manuscript but he had

Re: Encoding italic

Doug Ewell wrote: …, just as next to nobody is using the proposed VS14 mechanism … Well, of course not because use of VS14 in a plain text document to record a request for an italic glyph version is not at the present time an official part of Unicode. The next scheduled Unicode Technical

Re: Encoding italic

Asmus Freytag wrote; Other schemes, like a VS per code point, also suffer from being different in philosophy from "standard" rich text approaches. Best would be as standard extension to all the messaging systems (e.g. a common markdown language, supported by UI). A./ Yet that claim of

Re: Encoding italic (was: A last missing link)

Mark E. Shoulson wrote: It doesn't just take someone saying "out of scope." It depends who it is. The theory is that people post in the mailing list as individuals, yet some people have very great influence. It also has to *be* out of scope! Maybe, it depends who says what. If

Re: Encoding italic (was: A last missing link)

Andrew West wrote as follows: … (note that the colored characters do not change the color of the emoji they are attached to [before or after, depending upon whether you are speaking French or English dialect of emoji], they are just intended as a visual indication of what colour you wish the

Re: Encoding italic

Is the way to try to resolve this for a proposal document to be produced for using Variation Selector 14 in order to produce italics and for the proposal document to be submitted to the Unicode Technical Committee? If the proposal is allowed to go to the committee rather than being ruled out

Re: Encoding italic

James Kass wrote: William’s suggestion of floating a proposal for handling italics with VS14 might be an example of the old saying about “putting the cart before the horse”. Well, a proposal just about using VS14 to indicate a request for an italic version of a glyph in plain text,

Re: QID Emoji and their applications

There has been a development in that the following document has been published yesterday. https://www.unicode.org/L2/L2019/19203-wd-uts51-17-draft.pdf I refer to Annex C.2 of that document. In that section the use of U+1F194 SQUARED ID is suggested as the base character for QID emoji. I

QID Emoji and their applications

There are two versions of a proposal document for QID emoji currently available, the original and a revised version. https://www.unicode.org/L2/L2019/19082-qid-emoji.pdf https://www.unicode.org/L2/L2019/19082r-qid-emoji.pdf I sent in two comments about the original proposal and they are

Re: New Public Review on QID emoji

Hello everyone I have been reading about QID emoji and what is proposed. At present I have a question to which I cannot find the answer. Is the QID emoji format, if approved by the Unicode Technical Committee going to be sent to the ISO/IEC 10646 committee for consideration by that

Re: New Public Review on QID emoji

Asmus Freytag wrote as follows. Just because a select group of people engages in communication about the arcane details of a proposed specification it doesn't mean that the outcome will benefit some entirely different and larger group communicate better. This is logically true. However the

Re: New Public Review on QID emoji

Asmus Freytag wrote as follows. If leading standardization was such a good thing in communication, why don't we see more "dictionaries of words not yet in use"? After all, it would be a huge benefit for people coining new terms to have their definitions already worked out. Nothing inherent in

Re: New Public Review on QID emoji

Asmus Freytag wrote as follows. While I have a certain understanding for the underlying concerns, it still is the case that this proposal promises to be a bad example of "leading standardization": throwing out a spec in the hopes it may be taken up and take off, instead of something that

RE: New Public Review on QID emoji

WJGO >>Yet if QID emoji are implemented by Unicode Inc. without also being implemented by ISO/IEC 10646 then that could lead to future problems, ... Peter Constable wrote as follows. Neither Unicode Inc. or ISO/IEC 10646 would _implement_ QID emoji. That is correct. I should have made

New Public Review on QID emoji

Hello everyone I have recently learned that there is a new Public Review Issue on QID emoji. https://www.unicode.org/review/pri408/ Also the closure date for PRI 405 has been given an extension. http://www.unicode.org/review/pri405/ https://www.unicode.org/review/ William Overington

QID emoji and screen readers

There is currently a Public Review, number 405. http://www.unicode.org/review/pri405/ It is about the following document. http://www.unicode.org/reports/tr51/tr51-17.html The issue of screen readers is mentioned in the document. I have thought of a possible solution. However I am not expert

Re: HEAVY EQUALS SIGN

On the matter of my document proposing using Variation Selector 14 for requesting an italic glyph for a letter, Unicode Inc. has also published a Notice of Non-Approval. https://www.unicode.org/alloc/nonapprovals.html It is indeed interesting that the Notice of Non-Approval itself uses

Re: Could U+E0001 LANGUAGE TAG become undeprecated please? There is a good reason why I ask

Hi Thank you to everybody who replied to this thread, both online and offline. Sławomir Osipiuk wrote: As for "concatenation of such plain text sequences" where each sequence is in a different language, ... Actually I was meaning the concatenation of a number of messages, one from each

What should or should not be encoded in Unicode? (from Re: Egyptian Hieroglyph Man with a Laptop)

Hans Åberg >>> From the point of view of Unicode, it is simpler: If the character is in use or have had use, it should be included somehow. Shawn Steele >> That bar, to me, seems too low. Many things are only used briefly or in a private context that doesn;t really require encoding. Hans

RE: Could U+E0001 LANGUAGE TAG become undeprecated please? There is a good reason why I ask

Hi At the time, I thought that my post yesterday concluded the thread. However, later something occurred to me as a result of something in the post by Sławomir Osipiuk. The gentleman wrote as follows: Sending multiples of the same message in different languages is really only applicable

Re: What should or should not be encoded in Unicode? (from Re: Egyptian Hieroglyph Man with a Laptop)

The solution is to invent my own encoding space. This sits on top of Unicode, could be (perhaps?) called markup, but it works! It may be perilous, because some software may enforce the strict official code point limits. I have now realized that what I wrote before is ambiguous. When I

Could U+E0001 LANGUAGE TAG become undeprecated please? There is a good reason why I ask

Hi Could U+E0001 LANGUAGE TAG become undeprecated please? There is a good reason why I ask There is a German song, Lorelei, and I searched to find an English translation. I found the following video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJ3JhxOUbw0 The video is an instrumental version and is

Re: What should or should not be encoded in Unicode? (from Re: Egyptian Hieroglyph Man with a Laptop)

eady exist for entities? Best wishes, jk -- Joel Kalvesmaki Director, Text Alignment Network http://textalign.net <http://textalign.net> On 2020-02-14 15:52, wjgo_10...@btinternet.com via Unicode wrote: The solution is to invent my own encoding space. This sits on top of Unicode, could be (

Re: New Unicode Working Group: Message Formatting

A person in England, who knows no German, wants to send the parcel to a person in Germany, who knows no English. The person in England wants to send a message about the delivery to the person in Germany.. English: “The package will arrive at {time} on {date}.” The person want to send the

Re: New Unicode Working Group: Message Formatting

I notice that in the web page https://github.com/unicode-org/message-format-wg/issues/3 there is a request to add more features. One of those requested features is as follows Inflections (genders, articles, delensions, etc.) So I am wondering quite what formats will be covered by the

Re: New Unicode Working Group: Message Formatting

The reply from Mr Verdy has indeed been helpful, as indeed has also been an offlist private reply from someone who has, thus far, not been a participant in this thread. Mr Verdy wrote: You seem to have never seen how translation packages work and are used in common projects (not just CLDR,

Free emoji (from Re: Videos on YouTube)

Johannes Bergerhausen wrote: West is located in the former US embassy, a brutalist building by Marcel Breuer (Bauhaus): www.westdenhaag.nl On that web page is a link to the following web page. http://www.westdenhaag.nl/exhibitions/20_02_Alphabetum_6 The title

Re: emojis for mouse buttons?

I read Philippe's post and I remembered the following thread that I started in the High-Logic forum. https://forum.high-logic.com/viewtopic.php?f=10=3818 Are these of any interest as designs? Best regards, William Overington Tuesday 31

Re: emojis for mouse buttons?

How about the following. Expand Philippe's idea of the theta shape to having a three by three grid of cells, rounded at the two lower outside corners to suggest the shape of a mouse unit. The three columns left to right referring to the left button, the centre button and the right button

Videos on YouTube

I searched on YouTube for Gutenberg Mainz and filtered for This week and I found 12 videos uploaded 3 days ago about a symposium called Alphabetica 2019. Apparently held in Amsterdam. It seems that the videos were listed for that search as the notes include "Presented in collaboration

How is meaning changed by context and typgraphy - in art, emoji and language

I received a circulated email from MoMA, the Museum of Modern Art in New York. I am, at my request, on their mailing list. There is a link to a web page. https://www.moma.org/magazine/articles/257 There is a video embedded in the web page, 8 minutes. I watched the video and found it

Base character plus tag sequences (from RE: Is the binaryness/textness of a data format a property?)

Doug Ewell wrote: When 137,468 private-use characters aren't enough? In my opinion, a base character plus tag sequence has the potential to be used for many large scale applications for the future. A base character plus tag sequence encoding has the advantage over a Private Use Area encoding