Stéphane Zuckerman wrote:
netsql a écrit :
So are you saying Hibreante for big complex or iBatis for big complex?
I don't know about iBatis, but Hibernate is definitely for medium to big
projects. The real complexity of Hibernate is in its configuration
(there is more or less one Java
Pilgrim, Peter wrote:
I think the jewel in the crown with the EJB 3 specification
is actually the new persistent model sub part of it.
Following Linda De Michels and Scott Crawford presentations
at JavaONE this year, you should be able to persist POJOs
with any O/RM implementation that
don't think this fully answers your question but it's a start.
Mariano Hernandez
-Original Message-
From: Access Denied [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2005 8:50 AM
To: Struts Users Mailing List; Ed Griebel
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
I bought James
Hernandez, Mariano wrote:
we use EJBs, although I and a colleague
have tried to persuade our architech to use ANYTHING other than EJBs.
Consider having a email Dear Achitect, thanks for meeting w/ us, we
brought you some good reasons not to use EJB; we understand you do want
to use them.
Leon Rosenberg wrote:
Von: Michael Jouravlev [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 7/25/05, Leon Rosenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think the problem is rather that none of the dbs scales.
To scale you need something in front of db in the business layer
(middleware), so it's no difference
Clustering in general has two purposes... load distribution and failover
capabilities. Both of these factor into scalability, load distribution
moreso obviously.
In our environment, we have a 3-node Oracle cluster in production. We
have seen efficiency gains across the board in terms of query
Ted Husted on 22/07/05 18:12, wrote:
The truth is that iBATIS is very easy to use, and there isn't much to
learn that you don't already know. Basically, iBATIS lets you put a
wrapper around SQL statements and use disconnected POJO objects for
input and output. The user guide covers all the
Not that I have seen.
I have used it on a project with 800GB of data + 40-50 concurrent users.
Vic will probably chime in on this thread as well...
Larry
On 7/25/05, Adam Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Ted Husted on 22/07/05 18:12, wrote:
The truth is that iBATIS is very easy to use,
Larry Meadors wrote:
I have used it on a project with 800GB of data + 40-50 concurrent users.
I wasn't directly involved in the project, but coworkers used it for
less data (100G maybe?) but substantially more concurrent users (100-200
or so).
Dave
I used iBatis 2 w/ 7000 concurent users and subsecond response time
(each users requested data from a page that had many tiles, 1up.com)
It's much faster than others becuase of a simple row based cache.
I am one of few SQL instructors certified to teach PT, I would argue
it's by far the most
I think the problem is rather that none of the dbs scales.
To scale you need something in front of db in the business layer
(middleware),
so it's no difference whether you use ibatis or sql. Could be nasty with
hibernate though,
at least you need to turn off the lazy loading...
leon
On
I think the problem is rather that none of the dbs scales.
To scale you need something in front of db in the business layer
(middleware),
so it's no difference whether you use ibatis or sql. Could be nasty with
hibernate though,
at least you need to turn off the lazy loading...
leon
On
On 7/25/05, Leon Rosenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think the problem is rather that none of the dbs scales.
To scale you need something in front of db in the business layer
(middleware),
so it's no difference whether you use ibatis or sql. Could be nasty with
hibernate though,
at least
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Michael Jouravlev [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Gesendet: Montag, 25. Juli 2005 21:19
An: Struts Users Mailing List
Betreff: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
On 7/25/05, Leon Rosenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think the problem is rather
Leon Rosenberg wrote:
I think the sentence clustering will help you scaling is an urban myth :-)
Leon
+1
--
.V
People are conversing... without posting their email or filling up their
mail box.
roomity.com http://roomity.com/launch.jsp
No sign up to read and search.
Yo Rick!
I think that statement was in regard to self-implemented (inflicted?)
POJO DAOs,
not IBATIS in particular.
The fact that you state:
You'll spend all your time writing grunt-work plumbing and error
handling and maintenance is a nightmare.
only shows you haven't even tried
PROTECTED]
Skype: jmitchtx
- Original Message -
From: Rick Reumann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Struts Users Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2005 11:43 AM
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
Larry Meadors wrote the following on 7/22/2005 10:43 AM:
Books
On 7/22/05, Larry Meadors [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You just lack appreciation for the finer things in life Buddy.
Classical Persian poetry is really quite good. ;-)
On a serious note: Basing tech decisions on who has more books out is
similar to making them on the company with the higher
On 7/21/05, Nitish Kumar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Never worked with IBatis, so can not comment.
I think I would still like to have the freedom of writing normal SQL
queries
while having the flexibility of using a mapping tool. I guess Hibernate
does
provide that kind of flexibility.
Frank W. Zammetti wrote:
It has not been unusual to estimate three months
for something, and that's fairly realistic to do it right, and the
business says nope, 1.5 months is when we need it.
I need you to paint the house, but I only have budget to wash my hair?
That is no respect and a bit
Larry Meadors a écrit :
I think I would still like to have the freedom of writing normal SQL
queries
while having the flexibility of using a mapping tool. I guess Hibernate
does
provide that kind of flexibility.
Wo, you did a great job of describing iBATIS for not ever using it:
It uses
Stéphane Zuckerman wrote:
Larry Meadors a écrit :
I agree with previous comments saying that Hibernate is useful
if your project is quite large. Otherwise, the time taken to set it up
would be better used to do something else. It does add some complexity
when thinking through a new project,
All too often that's how it works. If you say no, there are people
that will say yes. Even if they end up taking as much time as you said
it would, they've got the project, not you. Sometimes the short time
is understandable, possibly due to uncontrollable situations, but most
of the time it's due
netsql a écrit :
So are you saying Hibreante for big complex or iBatis for big complex?
I don't know about iBatis, but Hibernate is definitely for medium to big
projects. The real complexity of Hibernate is in its configuration
(there is more or less one Java class for each table in your
/2005 09:47 AM
Please respond to
Struts Users Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
To
Struts Users Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
cc
Subject
Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
netsql a écrit :
So are you saying Hibreante for big complex or iBatis for big complex?
I don't know
I bought James Elliott's Hibernate (O'Reilly Developer Notebook
Series 2004), but a search for iBATIS on amazon returns books like
Pocket Guide to the Birds of Britain and North-West Europe and An
Introduction To The Mystical Use of Classical Persian Poems. Is
there any timely definitive
[EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit :
Hibernate Synchronizer is an Eclipse plugin that generates the config and
mapping files as well as the VO/DAO classes. So, unless you want to
hand-crank it OR you are an anti-Eclipse zealot, I suggest that you visit
http://hibernatesynch.sourceforge.net/. Takes
netsql wrote:
Frank W. Zammetti wrote:
It has not been unusual to estimate three months
for something, and that's fairly realistic to do it right, and the
business says nope, 1.5 months is when we need it.
I need you to paint the house, but I only have budget to wash my hair?
That is
Ed Griebel wrote:
All too often that's how it works. If you say no, there are people
that will say yes. Even if they end up taking as much time as you said
it would, they've got the project, not you.
Again, that's a situation where you are involving consultants. Consultants
are expected to
Again, that's a situation where you are involving consultants.
Consultants
are expected to know the technology and not learn it on their customers'
time. When a company has its own IT staff, there are rarely opportunities
for somebody else to underbid them.
Really? the majority of the work
Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
To
Struts Users Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
cc
Subject
Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
netsql a écrit :
So are you saying Hibreante for big complex or iBatis for big complex?
I don't know about iBatis, but Hibernate
Here's the address for the IntelliJ plugins homepage:
http://www.intellij.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IntelliJPluginsHome
-Original Message-
From: Access Denied [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 22 July 2005 14:57
To: Struts Users Mailing List
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
Are you asking me or Stéphane?
I suspect most people who know me, know my answer: If I have a database and
a choice, I am using iBATIS. :-)
Larry
On 7/22/05, netsql [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Stéphane Zuckerman wrote:
Larry Meadors a écrit :
I agree with previous comments saying that
Please respond to
Struts Users Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
To
Struts Users Mailing List user@struts.apache.org
cc
Subject
Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
I just shelled out $300 for JetBrains' IDEA because of recommendations
from Larry and Rick from this list. Are there plugins
You just lack appreciation for the finer things in life Buddy.
Classical Persian poetry is really quite good. ;-)
On a serious note: Basing tech decisions on who has more books out is
similar to making them on the company with the higher stock price. Sun:
$3.85; MS: $26.44...gosh, what does
I think the jewel in the crown with the EJB 3 specification
is actually the new persistent model sub part of it.
Following Linda De Michels and Scott Crawford presentations
at JavaONE this year, you should be able to persist POJOs
with any O/RM implementation that supplies a
Larry Meadors wrote the following on 7/22/2005 10:43 AM:
Books are not always a
requirement...do you have a book on bicycling or going to the bathroom?
I guess some people do, but 99% of us do not because we can do it well
enough without them.
If I want to be the next Lance Armstrong or
Access Denied wrote the following on 7/22/2005 9:56 AM:
I just shelled out $300 for JetBrains' IDEA because of recommendations
from Larry and Rick from this list. Are there plugins for IDEA
similar to those available for Eclipse?
Yup: http://plugins.intellij.net/plugins/
--
Rick
Daniel Perry wrote:
Again, that's a situation where you are involving consultants.
Consultants
are expected to know the technology and not learn it on their customers'
time. When a company has its own IT staff, there are rarely
opportunities for somebody else to underbid them.
Really?
Access Denied wrote:
it seems no one is writing their own DAOs anymore.
No one except those of us who have no choice. :) I use a multi-valued
database, IBM's UniData, which does not [easily] speak JDBC. (The DBMS can,
but there is a third-party app sitting on top of it that severely limits my
Wendy Smoak wrote:
At one time I thought JDO was going to help, and Bean Managed Persistence
has always sounded promising. Unfortunately, all of the examples are SQL
based and I don't immediately see how to plug in this strange API that does
not have Connection or DataSource.
Has anyone else
On 7/22/05, Access Denied [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Is there any timely definitive literature available for iBATIS?
The definitive literature about iBATIS is published by the iBATIS team.
* http://ibatis.apache.org/downloads.html
Pro Spring also has an excellent chapter on iBATIS, and covers
Pick one. I use hibernatebut I'm sure iBatis is fine too. Either
is preferable to writing your own.
Lee
On 7/21/05, Access Denied [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Alls,
I can't seem to get a convincing answer to the question of using an
ORM utilitiy, DB interface framework, or home-grown POJO
I like vi, it is way better than emacs.
Good grief, I hope we do not have another one of these three month flame-wars...
If you want ORM, use Hibernate.
If you want SQL mapping, use iBATIS.
Larry
On 7/21/05, Lee Harrington [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Pick one. I use hibernatebut I'm sure
: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
I like vi, it is way better than emacs.
Good grief, I hope we do not have another one of these three month
flame-wars...
If you want ORM, use Hibernate.
If you want SQL mapping, use iBATIS.
Larry
On 7/21/05, Lee Harrington [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Pick
The problem is that there's not a one-size-fits-all answer to the question.
A lot depends on the size and scope of your application, the state of
your database, and the preferences of your developers.
Of the three, what your developers think might be the most important.
People can make any
On Thu, July 21, 2005 1:25 pm, Ted Husted said:
If the application isn't important enough to code some trials, then
it's not important enough to sweat the decision either. Pick one and
have at it.
At the risk of going off-topic, I have to say I really don't agree with
that statement. I think
Ted Husted wrote:
People can make any system work, but they have to *want* to make it
work.
That is deep! And very true.
.V
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- Original Message -
From: Ted Husted
To: Struts Users Mailing List , Access Denied
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2005 13:25:02 -0400
Lindholm, Greg wrote the following on 7/21/2005 1:01 PM:
If your building anything bigger then a toy project then forget POJO
DAOs. You'll spend all your time writing grunt-work plumbing and error
handling and maintenance is a nightmare.
I give a big thumbs-up to Hibernate!
I'd argue just
Frank W. Zammetti wrote:
The business wants that new product NOW. They want the efficiency gains,
the added functionality, whatever, NOW. They would say it is extremely
important. But, they tend to not really care too much about the
technology. In such cases, the application IS important
I have to agree with Rick. I have said this before, and will again -
Hibernate is fine if all you want is persistence.
Hibernate is a major PITA if you need to share the database with other
applications, or if you have to work with a LARGE database, or if you
have to work with a legacy database
Frank W. Zammetti wrote:
In such cases, the application IS important enough to code
trials, but the business won't allow you to but they STILL want you to
sweat the decisions! This is a typical way of doing things, going by my
experience.
It depends what _your_ job is. If you're a
@struts.apache.org
Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 5:25 PM
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
Frank W. Zammetti wrote:
In such cases, the application IS important enough to code
trials, but the business won't allow you to but they STILL want you to
sweat the decisions! This is a typical way of doing
, 2005 5:25 PM
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
Frank W. Zammetti wrote:
In such cases, the application IS important enough to code
trials, but the business won't allow you to but they STILL want you to
sweat the decisions! This is a typical way of doing things, going by my
: Friday, July 22, 2005 7:55 AM
To: Struts Users Mailing List
Subject: Re: [OT] Hibernate vs. iBatis vs. POJO
I'd have to agree... It has not been unusual to estimate three months
for something, and that's fairly realistic to do it right, and the
business says nope, 1.5 months is when we need
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