Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 1:25 AM, Axil Axil wrote: > How does "and pay Rossi what is agreed upon." mean "this troll here > defending a vulture capitalist outfit ". Something is wrong with my writing > or your reading. > No, something is wrong with _your_ reading. My use of

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

How does "and pay Rossi what is agreed upon." mean "this troll here defending a vulture capitalist outfit ". Something is wrong with my writing or your reading. On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 12:41 AM, Che wrote: > > > On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 9:10 PM, Axil Axil

[Vo]:Re: MFMP GS5.3 - a replication

Eric-- My experience is that the devil is in the details and the demise of the devil is the job of the instruments and they are not cheap. I think the MFMP understands that and my hope is that they guess the ones that will get the devil out. That being said I hope that they have two or three

[Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Dave-- Why do people run marathons and win sometimes at great physical expense? Bob Cook From: David Roberson Sent: Monday, April 11, 2016 8:34 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb I will be disappointed if the ERV report is not released in

[Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Eric-- Per my recent comment, (I had not read yours) I agree with your comment about many unknowns and lack of straightforward relationships. Anharmicity is not a straightforward happening. Bob Cook From: Eric Walker Sent: Monday, April 11, 2016 8:31 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject:

[Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Eric and Dave-- I have thought that there may be other controlling parameters, such as pressure affecting volatility of Li and potentially other fuel constituents, or magnetic field which enhances with INCREASING temperature by the resultant establishment of SSP’s. I think there are many

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 9:10 PM, Axil Axil wrote: > Thomas Darden shall not avoid the requirements of the Licence Agreement > and pay Rossi what is agreed upon. The positive ERV is the ONLY requirement > for payment defined in the LA. Even the Pope must follow the law. Being

Re: [Vo]: MFMP GS5.3 - a replication

Guys, lets hope that the radiation does not escape the system if we ever want to see any of these units become adopted in large numbers. Be careful what you hope for! I would be far more satisfied to find that the original measurement was not accurate. If this radiation signal is for real,

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Eric, I agree that there are many unknowns with respect to these devices that need to be researched. But I do think that there are thought experiments that can be conducted which reveal general tendencies that we should not be afraid to attempt. Carefully applied logic is a powerful tool

Re: [Vo]: MFMP GS5.3 - a replication

On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 1:35 PM, Bob Higgins wrote: We are all hoping for a repeat performance of the "signal", the gamma burst > output. In GS5.3, the team is much better prepared to monitor the > radiations. Time bases for all of the data acquistions have been

Re: [Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

I will be disappointed if the ERV report is not released in less than a month. Rossi will likely benefit by that release since he remained confined to that hell-hole for most of last year in order to coax it along. Why would he be so inclined to personal torture unless he was convinced that

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Dave, My point is not a strong one. It is largely a comment to the effect that there are many unknowns, and the relationship between amount of fuel and the heat that is produced in a LENR system may not be straightforward. To answer your questions, suppose that for a given current (100 mA, say)

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jed, how would you know that he can publish the report without a release? Have you seen any documentation to that effect? I do not have a clue about any agreement that may be in force. Dave -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell To: vortex-l

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Eric, the fuel is strongly activated by its temperature. How else would one explain the thermal run away processes that have been a problem with these systems forever? If the outside temperature does not increase by adding more fuel to the chamber then you are assuming that no additional

[Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jed-- What I remember Rossi said was that he would release the report when his legal advisors said it was ok. His legal advisors may have other issues associated with the release than mere legalities. And there may be some legalities as well as contractual issues to consider over an above

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Lennart Thornros wrote: > I doubt that it will come. If he wanted to release it, he would have > already. > > He has stated he will publish as soon as the legalities are cleared. > He is lying. There are no legalities preventing him from publishing. He could publish it

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 12:01 PM, David Roberson wrote: Now, if you double the amount of fuel contained within the volume you can > be quite certain that the outside temperature will increase, correct? Not, it seems, to me, if the LENR activity is directly proportional to

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

Thomas Darden shall not avoid the requirements of the Licence Agreement and pay Rossi what is agreed upon. The positive ERV is the ONLY requirement for payment defined in the LA. Even the Pope must follow the law. Being a sainted person does not give that person the right to ignore a legally

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

What really upsets me is that folks are defending Rossi here versus Thomas Darden, a successful leader who has worked hard to invest and advance environmental technology. Also someone who cut cheques of 11M plus to Andrea Rossi, by all public reports, a convicted fraudster who spent time in

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

The study of LENR now requires a study of the law. Reading how the 89M is paid has nothing to do with IP. Final payment is strictly based on a positive ERV report. IMHO, I.H. cannot holdback payment because they are not satisfied with the distribution of IP. Any IP issues are red herrings with

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

No, Thomas Darden is a committed environmentalist who's been working on these things for his whole life. His whole network of friends are supportive of environmental causes. This sort of thinking is what makes vortex a bit scary at times. The reality is that patents / etc are all meaningless.

Re: [Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

tax fraud is tax fraud. Even if he was cleared in court of other things, a pattern exists. Anyways, the real point here is it's time for his fan base to tell him to put up or shut up. On Monday, April 11, 2016, Alain Sepeda wrote: > It is wrong to say Rossi have a

Re: [Vo]: MFMP GS5.3 - a replication

Ólafsson has gotten the reaction (LENR?) to work without LASER activation...just by using heat. I remember somebody tell us about this a few days ago. On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 3:45 PM, Jones Beene wrote: > *From:* Bob Higgins > > > > Jones, can you elaborate on Holmlid's

RE: [Vo]: MFMP GS5.3 - a replication

From: Bob Higgins Jones, can you elaborate on Holmlid's call for replication? He (Ólafsson) did not suggest anything specific, but it will be helpful when/if someone starts a dedicated site (or subsite addition) for experimenters to use specifically for the Holmlid effect, since there

Re: [Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

the claim is an article in Il coriere dela serra where the unbiased journalist was really upset that he was only condemned for environmental infrigment and tax fraud.. I gathered many article in that thread http://www.lenr-forum.com/old-forum-static/t-2384.html . 2016-04-11 18:36 GMT+02:00

[Vo]: MFMP GS5.3 - a replication

Alan Goldwater, Bob Greenyer, Skip Reynolds, and Mark Jurich (hope I didn't miss anyone there) have begun a replication of the GS5.2 experiment, deftly named GS5.3. The experiment is in the early phases of heat treatment of the Ni powder I believe. The live video feed links can be found at:

Re: [Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

It is true, a patent troll with distribution rights could be well positions to stop the sale of the LENR product. On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 2:09 PM, Che wrote: > > This thought must have occurred to others -- even when things were going > swimmingly... but I don't see

[Vo]:Rossi/E-Cat lawsuit: A long-in-the-making set-up job..?

This thought must have occurred to others -- even when things were going swimmingly... but I don't see mention of it bobbing to the surface here. Q: Could this entire undertaking with these present U.S. venture capitalists have been a set-up job all along -- *intended* to embroil and sink Rossi

RE: [Vo]: A plea for patience

From: Bob Higgins Since the Rossi/IH announcements, Vortex-L has been deluged with useless and boring posturing and insulting angry remarks. In a month we will all wonder why we wasted so much of our collective time - like waving fans in the vacuum of space to improve the convective cooling.

[Vo]: A plea for patience

Since the Rossi/IH announcements, Vortex-L has been deluged with useless and boring posturing and insulting angry remarks. In a month we will all wonder why we wasted so much of our collective time - like waving fans in the vacuum of space to improve the convective cooling. Soon data will emerge

RE: [Vo]:Re: More from Goat-guyRe:

Adrian-- I believe you! Bob Cook > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > From: a.ashfi...@verizon.net > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Re: More from Goat-guyRe: > Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2016 13:38:43 -0400 > > Bob, > "I do not think what you have said fits this definition very well. I bet > your pay is 0 lbs sterling,

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jones, I can not get into the mind of Rossi or Darden for that matter and understand exactly why we are seeing such an unpleasant circumstance. We would all rather see the issue resolved and LENR advanced but this is what we have to deal with. There have been many occasions when I would have

Re: [Vo]:Re: More from Goat-guyRe:

Bob, "I do not think what you have said fits this definition very well. I bet your pay is 0 lbs sterling, maybe a shilling. :0)" Keep in mind I used that analogy because I was replying to Jones who was getting hot and bothered about foreign engineers and licenses. But there do seem to be

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

The self sustain mode can only be produced when the reactor is configured for the Cat/Mouse setup. Also control (no meltdown) requires that the mouse must be low powered (COP = 1,2) On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 1:18 PM, a.ashfield wrote: > Axil Axil wrote. "Rossi uses the

Re: [Vo]:Re: More from Goat-guy

Because the situation is so complex, any violation of common sense is unhelpful to understand what has and is happening. To understand the situation, making political points using spin and an appeal to emotion must be identified and called out. A law suite is a complex situation where untruths

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Axil Axil wrote. "Rossi uses the Mouse/Cat setup to amplify the COP by using multiple satellite unpowered reactors. Nobody has replicated this setup yet." Yes, I had the same thought and mentioned it to Mats. I did not want to publish it in view of the pending court case... I believe the

[Vo]:Re: More from Goat-guyRe:

"Shill can also be used pejoratively to describe a critic who appears either all-too-eager to heap glowing praise upon mediocre offerings, or who acts as an apologist for glaring flaws. In this sense, such a critic would be an indirect shill for the industry at large, because said critic's

[Vo]:we are advised why and how to stop the VUCA orgy- mad battles

http://egooutpeters.blogspot.ro/2016/04/apr-11-2016-how-to-finish-vuca-orgy-now.html I am angry- too few LENR stuff today? Perhaps later...? peter -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com

RE: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Dave, One other thing. I mention this because your opinion is important here, so please consider this: Tom Darden says that he has seen no thermal gain from Rossi. Tom Darden is an honest man and put $10 million of his money up front. Jed Rothwell has visited him and affirms that he is an

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Yes Jones, but I have always maintained the fact that COP can be raised whenever the beginning point is greater than 1. I do not agree that it has a limitation as long as the geometry can be adjusted. For example. take a design that has a fixed surface area and volume with a measured amount

RE: [Vo]:More from Goat-guyRe:

AA. "Another ad hominem rant from the specialist. I suppose you think the Wright Bros should have been put in jail for designing, building add flying a machine without an AMERICAN degree or any of the proper licenses. " Jones. "Ashfield, Once again, you expose yourself as an unthinking

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

>From Rossi’s blog. Teemu: I knew the Customer in the office of my Attorney Henry Johnson. They were enthusiast to test our 1 MW plant, to see if it really worked, because they were ( and are ) interested to buy more plants for their facilities in Europe. They wanted not to be exposed, though,

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Rossi uses the Mouse/Cat setup to amplify the COP by using multiple satellite unpowered reactors. Nobody has replicated this setup yet. On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 9:25 AM, Jones Beene wrote: > *From:* Jack Cole > > Thanks Dave. I would love to see a solid report. I still

[Vo]:Re: More from Goat-guy

Axil-- Are you saying this: “Who ever came up with this criticism of the ERV is full of hate and has lost any credibility IMHO,”? If so, I agree with you on this issue, but I am surprised at these words coming from you. Bob Cook From: Axil Axil Sent: Monday, April 11, 2016 9:15 AM To:

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

I.H employees where at the plant to monitor the performance of the ERV. On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 8:04 AM, a.ashfield wrote: > Craig, > It is hard to tell who said what in this format. > I was talking about Rossi's prior demos when I wrote that. The 1MW plant > is a

RE: [Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

From: alain.coetm...@gmail.com It is wrong to say Rossi have a pattern of fraud. He is cleared of that in court… Alain – Not so fast. Answer me this, even Rossi has NEVER said he was cleared of all of the many felonies he served time for in Italy – only the one from Petroldragon. Most were

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Patent law requires that Rossi be identified as inventor even if he did not know that the patent was filed. I.H. has the right to file patents in Rossi;s name and claim co assignment as inventor. On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 6:55 AM, Roarty, Francis X < francis.x.roa...@lmco.com> wrote: > Perhaps

RE: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

From: David Roberson If you accept that Rossi can achieve a COP of 1.5 then you must realize that adding insulation can be used to increase that number to any desired level. Not true at all, Dave The COP of 1.5 requires good insulation to begin with. We have been thought this before,

[Vo]:Re: Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Dave-- I would agree with that assessment. All Rossi had to do in the contract was to produce 100 C steam or hotter. Some insulation and a slight pressure above atmospheric would achieve that. Assuming the control system did not take to much power and the system was self sustaining with no

Re: [Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

It is wrong to say Rossi have a pattern of fraud. He is cleared of that in court, and the pattern of the affair in italy looks more like bad industrialization facing mafia of wastes. he have however a pattern of : - industrialization problems(Petroldragon, BiTe TEG, E-cat) - loose evidences (TEG,

RE: [Vo]:More from Goat-guy

Operation of boilers is inherently dangerous. Hundreds of lives have been lost in boiler accidents. If these two are the unlicensed "engineers" responsible for operating a boiler without a proper license, then yes - that is a violation of municipal code. Fines can be large. Does someone

Re: [Vo]:More from Goat-guy

Rossi has said that there was both security and employees of the customer at the plant when he was there. How could one man run a plant 24/7/465? It takes a large crew to cover the operation of an industrial plant full time without interruption. This is usually done in three shifts: day, swing and

RE: [Vo]:More from Goat-guyRe:

Ashfield, Once again, you expose yourself as an unthinking shill. Are you being paid to post this nonsense? Get lost.

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jones, If you accept that Rossi can achieve a COP of 1.5 then you must realize that adding insulation can be used to increase that number to any desired level. This is a basic effect that should be obvious to anyone that realizes that the more heat energy that you trap within the system, the

Re: [Vo]:More from Goat-guy

Does taking measurements constitute "running" a boiler? As far as I know no one has ever said that they ran the boiler. (Penon, etc) Robert Dorr WA7ZQR On 4/11/2016 8:14 AM, Jones Beene wrote: In answer to those who claim that Rossi's friends and countrymen - Penon and Fabiani are

Re: [Vo]:More from Goat-guy

Jones, I think the Goat-guy is correct - I just read other things into his statement. Fukushima and Chernobyl both had licensed, well educated experts designing and running the plants - it still went 'BOOM'. The conclusion I draw is not that they are so free from moral that they do not hesitate to

Re: [Vo]:More from Goat-guyRe:

Another ad hominem rant from the specialist. I suppose you think the Wright Bros should have been put in jail for designing, building add flying a machine without an AMERICAN degree or any of the proper licenses. Jomes wrote: "In answer to those who claim that Rossi’s friends and

Re: [Vo]:Copy of Rossi's civil complaint

No wonder people despair -- when they don't just smirk, knowingly -- at the world of Over-Unity research. I have also long-time despaired at the general political naivete exhibited in fora like vortex-L. Engineering and physics knowledge is not nearly enough to see these sorts of efforts through

[Vo]:More from Goat-guy

In answer to those who claim that Rossi's friends and countrymen - Penon and Fabiani are qualified engineers, even though neither has professional certification in this country and both were admittedly illegally operating a boiler within the City of Miami in violation of municipal codes, there is

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jed, In court they do not admit hearsay. You have heard from others that Rossi is hard to negotiate with. You say that you have negotiated with him and it was hard. Well, that kind of increases Rossi's credibility. I doubt he saw that you had anything to offer that he wanted. All negotiations

RE: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

From: Bob Cook The agreement between Rossi and IH specifies that acceptable results would be a COP of 4 to 6 (NOT 6) as I read the document.. Furthermore Rossi frequently indicated that the reactor at the customer was in a self-sustaining mode which may have meant that the COP was quite high--50

Re: Re : [Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

Adrian, I like the new statement you provided. No, it is no proof of Rossi's claim in any regards. However, that leaves a very clear and final message about what is and what is not. To keep any credibility he needs to produce (and sell( Ecats. He cannot do so if he does not show performance. It is

RE: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jones-- The agreement between Rossi and IH specifies that acceptable results would be a COP of 4 to 6 (NOT 6) as I read the document. Further more Rossi frequently indicated that the reactor at the customer was in a self-sustaining mode which may have meant that the COP was quite high--50 as

Re : [Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

You could just as well argue that attacking Rossi without evidence is naive. Andrea Rossi April 11 "I have enough money to spend to start the mass production, the rest must arrive from the products sale. I want not to sell paper, I want to sell products. I am an industrialist, not a yuppy or

RE: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

From: Jack Cole Thanks Dave. I would love to see a solid report. I still have no alternative explanation for some of the early results I saw in my own experiments, but the lack of reproducibility makes me suspect that I missed some unknown error. I just have trouble believing that Rossi

[Vo]:Defending Rossi at this point is an action of the absolute naive

Look, I am hopeful he actually has 50x COP... But seriously folks. Thomas Darden had an impeccable reputation. He also went out on a limb and gave Rossi 11m plus USD. Rossi, on the hand, has absolutely nothing but a pattern of fraud and deceit. 50x COP is an absolute crazy number when he

Re; [Vo]:GoatGuy's 1MW Explanation

Jack, "Thanks to Brad for finding the comment from GoatGuy on Next Big Future. I have had a chance to examine and think through the arguments. I'm not an engineer, so maybe someone else can do a better analysis. It seems like this explanation would work only if the plumbing connected to

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Craig, It is hard to tell who said what in this format. I was talking about Rossi's prior demos when I wrote that. The 1MW plant is a different story. The proof is supposed to come from an independent third party - the ERV. ">>>He says he has not read the Penon report yet, so he cannot

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Jed, Jed. "I know how the people at I.H. do it," AA. How do you know that? Jed. As I said, I have met with them and discussed this with them. AA. Tell us more. If you heard Rossi discuss it you might believe him too. What is actually done is another matter.

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Perhaps Rossi NEEDS to take it back in court so any patent applications made by IH that are based on Rossi materials and IP are stripped and assigned to Rossi. He certainly wants the money most but I think he is also very concerned about the new IH patents and how much IP that IH has shared

[Vo]:GoatGuy's 1MW Explanation

Thanks to Brad for finding the comment from GoatGuy on Next Big Future. I have had a chance to examine and think through the arguments. I'm not an engineer, so maybe someone else can do a better analysis. It seems like this explanation would work only if the plumbing connected to the water

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

Thanks Dave. I would love to see a solid report. I still have no alternative explanation for some of the early results I saw in my own experiments, but the lack of reproducibility makes me suspect that I missed some unknown error. I just have trouble believing that Rossi would send a lawsuit to

Re: [Vo]:Next Big Future - goes out on a limb

>From wikipedia:: "Filing by other than inventor: An entity can file an application on behalf of an inventor who assigned or is under an obligation to assign the invention rights to the entity (or if the entity otherwise has financial interest in the invention), without seeking the inventor's