On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 1:23 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:
H Veeder hveeder...@gmail.com wrote:
He claimed that DGT learned Rossi's trade secret. He did not say DGT
stole it. He stated this publicly because he wanted to persuade people
that DGT could build a working reactor
Crap like this is so obscene that it seems like the concoction of its
enemies or of some continuation of what many hypothesize is Rossi's
perverse strategy of surrounding the E-Cat with repellent so he has time to
work out his own problems before serious players stomp on him.
On Thu, May 22,
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
Really? In Italy, he was granted. Only there. An it is extremely unlikely
that he will get anywhere . . .
His ability to make the machine work is intellectual property whether he
has a patent or not. It is a trade secret. Stealing a trade secret is
The more you say, the worse it gets.
2014-05-18 11:07 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
Xanthoulis was bragging in the press that he steals trade secrets from
his business partners.
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
Let us extend this line of logic a bit more.
If a partner of one joint venture was engaged with another company while
still in that partnership to produce a device that is similar in function
to the product that was the commercialized object of the original
partnership, is that side activity to
The partnership between Rossi and DGT had be terminated when the alleged
act occurred and is therefore not a violation of the partnership.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 10:50 AM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.comwrote:
The more you say, the worse it gets.
2014-05-18 11:07 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell
I allege the Gamberale was aiding another company to produce a LENR device
while in a joint venture with DGT and that is way the Mose/DGT joint
venture was dissolved.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 11:00 AM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Let us extend this line of logic a bit more.
If a
Yes, I also allege that. I wanted to get in there subtly, but as my wife
says, I am not subtle!
2014-05-18 12:14 GMT-03:00 Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com:
I allege the Gamberale was aiding another company to produce a LENR device
while in a joint venture with DGT and that is way the Mose/DGT
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
I allege the Gamberale was aiding another company to produce a LENR device
while in a joint venture with DGT and that is way the Mose/DGT joint
venture was dissolved.
Okay. Do you have any evidence for that? Any corroboration?
I assume that is a joke. It
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
The more you say, the worse it gets.
2014-05-18 11:07 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
Xanthoulis was bragging in the press that he steals trade secrets from
his business partners.
You mean when I repeat what Xanthoulis himself
You are taking a very vicious interpretation from something inocous that he
said.
2014-05-18 12:57 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
You mean when I repeat what Xanthoulis himself said in press interviews,
that makes my case worse? I do not think so.
You are saying that we
I wrote:
It Defkalion did not prevent these tests, I think it is up to them to
publish a statement explaining why the tests were not done until after
ICCF18. Let them tell their version of the story.
To be fair, I should point out that Xanthoulis indirectly addressed the
gentlemen's agreement
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
You are taking a very vicious interpretation from something inocous that he
said.
No, his statement was quite clear. I discussed it with Rossi and with some
of the potential customers Defkalion and DE were negotiating with. Rossi
said he did not
You said once he was not technologically savvy and now you trust him. Of
course, that might refer to people who gave him an information, but that
just changed the subject of the sentence, not the issue you raised.
And I keep wondering what these memos you are referring to. If that's from
NASA,
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 10:07 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote:
Xanthoulis was bragging in the press that he steals trade secrets from
his business partners. You would be crazy to sign a contract with someone
who says that.
He claimed that DGT learned Rossi's trade secret. He
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
You said once he was not technologically savvy and now you trust him.
I do not trust him. I am saying that if he was telling the truth that they
stole the trade secrets, he is unethical. If he was lying and they did not
steal any secrets, he is crazy.
2014-05-18 14:08 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
He is not technologically savvy because he said that the cell temperature
can be used to measure heat even when the flow rate is not known. That is
incorrect.
Oh, but Rossi did that too with the hot cat too!
The memos
H Veeder hveeder...@gmail.com wrote:
He claimed that DGT learned Rossi's trade secret. He did not say DGT
stole it. He stated this publicly because he wanted to persuade people
that DGT could build a working reactor without Rossi's help.
He said they examined the powder with a mass spec in
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
He is not technologically savvy because he said that the cell
temperature can be used to measure heat even when the flow rate is not
known. That is incorrect.
Oh, but Rossi did that too with the hot cat too!
As far as I know, Rossi has not used
See, temperature can be used to measure energy. You agree with Xanthoulis.
You just had to calm down a little bit :)
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
BTW, it was not a big deal that Defkalion did mass spectrometry. Remember:
Rossi showed one to Krivit:
http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2011/37/3726appendixd4.shtml
And as I said, it's easy to copy Rossi, and mass spectrometry do not help
much with that.
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
I should not respond but . . .
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
See, temperature can be used to measure energy. You agree with Xanthoulis.
Do you speak language?
Do you have the slightest idea what you are babbling about? Have you ever
looked at a flow calorimeter, or the data from
I meant to write: you are out of line flooding this forum with nonsense.
I mean that. This is not the place for empty rhetoric, or tit-for-tat
zero-sum argumentation. If you do not understand why the flow rate affects
the cell wall temperature, please try to learn. Do not reflexively deny
that
He said measuring the temperature of the cell. He doesn't say on what
conditions. You assume with flow.
I am serious. I am not cursing you, I am not telling you a liar, ad
mouthing you, I am seeing problems with your assumptions and how you build
the arguments from there, speaking about them.
My statement is an allegation in the same way that all your assertions are
based on your allegations. I will attempt to substantiate this allegation
to arrive at a more perfect truth. The level of infidelity in a partnership
my be relatively slight and need not be as rigorous as the types of
I have said many times that I know Rossi's trade secrets as a result of the
unguarded things that Rossi says publicly. At the next level, I am not
privy to the vast amount of information the Jed gets from private sources
that he uses to support his statements, allegations and system ideas.. When
He said they examined the powder with a mass spec in violation of
agreements with Rossi, and without Rossi's knowledge
Agreements made in a joint venture are null and void after the partnership
is terminated by the principle party(Rossi) on any information producing
activity that occurs after the
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
He said measuring the temperature of the cell. He doesn't say on what
conditions. You assume with flow.
He was talking about the ICCF18 demonstration, in which flow calorimetry
was used. He was responding to the Gamberale report. Let me repeat the
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
He said they examined the powder with a mass spec in violation of
agreements with Rossi, and without Rossi's knowledge
Agreements made in a joint venture are null and void after the partnership
is terminated by the principle party(Rossi) on any information
If DGT terminated the joint venture to the financial disadvantage of Mose,
then Mose should take DGT to court to recover damages by presenting proof
of such damages.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 3:49 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
He said
From the DGT web page:
NEW ANNOUNCEMENT
SUBJECT: MATS LEWAN LUCAS GAMBERALE REPORTS DEFKALION DEMO PROVEN
NOT TO BE RELIABLE.
DEFKALION HAS EVALUATED THE SITUATION, TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE
POSSIBLE HIDDEN INTERESTS AND AGENDAS BEHIND SUCH REPORTS AND
INTERVIEWS, THAT ONLY SHOW PARTIALLY AND
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
I have said many times that I know Rossi's trade secrets as a result of the
unguarded things that Rossi says publicly.
I doubt that you do. I do not think you can replicate one of his cells. The
people at Defkalion cannot replicate one.
At the next
Since fold fusion is currently not a valid technology from a legal point of
view, any process that get information about the process is not illegal.
It's every man for himself since cold fusion is currently outside of the
protection of the legal system.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 3:55 PM, Jed
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
If DGT terminated the joint venture to the financial disadvantage of Mose,
then Mose should take DGT to court to recover damages by presenting proof
of such damages.
I believe the people at the joint venture itself terminated it themselves,
after they
Cold fusion replication has no legal standing and is totally subjective in
the mind of the observer. There has been no regulatory standards establish
to judge when a could fusion system is working and when it is not working.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:01 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Since fold fusion is currently not a valid technology from a legal point of
view, any process that get information about the process is not illegal.
That can't be true! That argument would never stand up in court. A court
cannot decide what is valid
A legal action cannot be made in the field of could fusion because it is
not a recognized and commercializeable technology.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:06 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
If DGT terminated the joint venture to the financial
Cold fusion is in the same legal position as the Santa clause character in
the movie, the *Miracle* on *34th Street* .
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Since fold fusion is currently not a valid technology from a
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Cold fusion replication has no legal standing and is totally subjective in
the mind of the observer.
That makes no difference at all. As I said, you can be sued for stealing a
trade secret consisting of marketing plans and advertising jingles, or a
movie
What startles me it is the supposition that all, ALL, controversial issues
surrounding Rossi, is the result of naivete from all parties. Like a
competition to who can be the most idiot
2014-05-18 17:11 GMT-03:00 Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com:
A legal action cannot be made in the field of
The currently excepted position of society is that Cold fusion is an
invalid non patentable dream or fantasy. You cannot steal information about
a dream or a fantasy.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:17 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:
Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Cold fusion
Lewan might well be writing about the system development processes of Puss
and Boots as far as the real world is concerned..
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:23 PM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
The currently excepted position of society is that Cold fusion is an
invalid non patentable dream
Currently, the rules in the field of cold fusion are what we say they are.
I say that Jed's roles are malarkey. I like my rules better.
On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 4:33 PM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Lewan might well be writing about the system development processes of
Puss and Boots as
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
What startles me it is the supposition that all, ALL, controversial issues
surrounding Rossi, is the result of naivete from all parties. Like a
competition to who can be the most idiot
Yeah, I agree. I sympathize with Gamberale. He seems smart and
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
I wish you'd believe me he did not get the result in that way. :)
Ask him. If Kim tells me he observed experiments himself, I will believe it.
I will still consider him naive. Even if he observed experiments, he could
not have checked the flow rate.
I didn't ever mention he merely got data or just observed it.
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
The problem is that, it is how easy is to make HENI, as DGT calls the high
yield cold fusion. The mere seeing of it for one month, or a few weeks,
you can figure out. This is why Rossi is so paranoid.
2014-05-17 15:21 GMT-03:00 Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com:
I didn't ever mention he
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
I didn't ever mention he merely got data or just observed it.
Ah. I thought that is what you were referring to. I do not know what you
mean, if not that.
Anyway, there is no data. There are only meaningless numbers from a
mistake. Or from fraudulent
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
The problem is that, it is how easy is to make HENI, as DGT calls the high
yield cold fusion.
Apparently it is not easy. Not for DGT, anyway. They have not made
anything. No one has ever seen their system work. Or if someone has, the
report is being
Jed, do you really understand how the two valve one flowmeter works
and can be used to multiply the flow reading/recordings ?If not, please ask
a company that manufactures flowmeters and you will learn that reverse flow
is not recorded. The trick is what the French call trouvaille.The Italians
say
Peter Gluck peter.gl...@gmail.com wrote:
Jed, do you really understand how the two valve one flowmeter works
and can be used to multiply the flow reading/recordings ?If not, please
ask a company that manufactures flowmeters and you will learn that reverse
flow is not recorded.
If the reverse
How can a flowmeter give counts- and 1 Liter per minute is much when
nothing goes through it? I just tell that this trick cannot be used to
obtain
increased number of counts with consistent values as recorded during the (
hours demo I was watching till late night.
And please do not say DGT has no
Peter Gluck peter.gl...@gmail.com wrote:
How can a flowmeter give counts- and 1 Liter per minute is much when
nothing goes through it?
You tell me! You are the one with insider information. Ask Xanthoulis or
Hadjichristos. They were the ones who insisted that Gamberale set up the
system that
On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 12:54 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote:
They were the ones who insisted that Gamberale set up the system that way.
When he tried to install additional equipment to confirm the flow rate,
they ordered it removed without discussion. They stopped him from doing
True, and the nature of the problem was not estabilished. For example, it
could be an understimation of the flux or an overstimation. It could be
anything. But it did not mean at all that it could necessarily be 0.
2014-05-17 18:15 GMT-03:00 Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com:
He acknowledged
Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com wrote:
With all confidence, you repeat Gamberale's assertion that Defkalion
prevented Gamberale from doing common sense tests, as though it were
established fact. What is the basis for your confidence?
There is corroboration. In retrospect this is the only
Well, you have a contradiction, if he bragged stealing intellectual
property (which Rossi doesn't have and is unable to acquire!), he'd have
something working! Aren't you the one tarnishing your own reputation?
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 7:43 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:
It Defkalion did not prevent these tests, I think it is up to them to
publish a statement explaining why the tests were not done until after
ICCF18. Let them tell their version of the story. If they do not respond, I
Really? In Italy, he was granted. Only there. An it is extremely unlikely
that he will get anywhere which will render the rest of what you wrote is
completely meaningless regarding intellectual property.
You are really the one without sense Jed. You are driving a tower of
speculations over your
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
Where did you get that Defkalion Europe was a joint venture?
The Gamberale report:
In November 2012 an Italian company based in Milan and named Mose srl
signed an exclusive contract for the european industrial development of
this technology. This
Right, so they sign a business without even knowing what they were getting
into? Complete transfer of technology? This is full of bull.
2014-05-16 16:11 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
[image: Boxbe] https://www.boxbe.com/overview This message is eligible
for Automatic Cleanup!
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
Right, so they sign a business without even knowing what they were getting
into? Complete transfer of technology? This is full of bull.
How do you know? Did you read the contract?
Do you think they could perform industrial development without a
There is nothing abnormal here. Before signing a contract, they'd better
certify that what DGT had was legit. Or just don't sign. You said even a
plumber could do that. So, before signing they were naive and just got
slightly below the level of expertise of a plubler after the signing and
just a
He never took part after this incident.
2014-05-16 19:14 GMT-03:00 Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com:
There is nothing abnormal here. Before signing a contract, they'd better
certify that what DGT had was legit. Or just don't sign. You said even a
plumber could do that. So, before signing
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
There is nothing abnormal here. Before signing a contract, they'd better
certify that what DGT had was legit. Or just don't sign.
I agree! I wouldn't have signed. Or, as I said, when Gamberale was in
Vancouver he should have test the flow rate.
You
Come on Jed. So Kim is also naive? Is Cyclone also naive?
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
Well, I must admit, Cyclone is only slightly naive, but still...
2014-05-16 21:59 GMT-03:00 Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com:
Come on Jed. So Kim is also naive? Is Cyclone also naive?
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote:
Come on Jed. So Kim is also naive?
Yes, unfortunately, he is, in my opinion. This is not the first time he
accepted a result without careful consideration, and without sufficient
proof.
- Jed
I wish you'd believe me he did not get the result in that way. :)
Oh, well, what can I do! That's life! Beggars are not choosers! Hehe! But
did I learn a lot of physics and I will always be thankful, despite
whatever the outcome of this story is!
2014-05-16 22:49 GMT-03:00 Jed Rothwell
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