Re: [whatwg] Font metrics

2010-04-06 Thread Mathieu 'p01' Henri
On Sat, 03 Apr 2010 17:23:39 +0300, Greg Brown gkbr...@mac.com wrote: OK, that makes sense. Thanks for the info. However, a extra readonly attribute float height to the TextMetrics interface should be fairly trivial to implement for browser vendors and would greatly help web developers

[whatwg] Forms feedback

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010, NARUSE, Yui wrote: In 4.10.19.4 URL-encoded form data, The application/x-www-form-urlencoded encoding algorithm, it says: For each character in the entry's name and value, apply the following subsubsteps: If the character isn't in the range U+0020, U+002A,

Re: [whatwg] Will you consider about RFC 4329?

2010-04-06 Thread James Kerr
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Mon, 5 Apr 2010, Swampert wrote: In your HTML5 draft standard, the default value for type attribute in script element is text/javascript. While according to RFC 4329, the MIME type text/javascript is

Re: [whatwg] Proposal for secure key-value data stores

2010-04-06 Thread Jeremy Orlow
Sorry for misunderstanding your original suggestion. On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 1:13 AM, Nicholas Zakas nza...@yahoo-inc.comwrote: I certainly can't argue against a focus on JS crypto. :) What I'd like to do is eliminate what I believe will be a repeated pattern for developers in the future. It

Re: [whatwg] Forms feedback

2010-04-06 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 2:00 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: Well you currently can do this by using the onbeforeprint and onafterprint hooks, though that's not exactly pretty. Hopefully it will also be possible with media-specific CSS, though that depends on how details ends up working in

Re: [whatwg] HTMLCollection and HTMLAllCollection suggestion

2010-04-06 Thread Perry Smith
On Apr 5, 2010, at 1:04 PM, David Flanagan wrote: Perry Smith wrote: On Apr 3, 2010, at 11:58 PM, David Flanagan wrote: Perry Smith wrote: HTMLCollection has a namedItem method that returns either null or one object. [1] HTMLAllCollection has a namedItem method that returns either null,

Re: [whatwg] Forms feedback

2010-04-06 Thread Anne van Kesteren
On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 17:32:49 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 2:00 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: Well you currently can do this by using the onbeforeprint and onafterprint hooks, though that's not exactly pretty. Hopefully it will also be

Re: [whatwg] Forms feedback

2010-04-06 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 9:55 AM, Anne van Kesteren ann...@opera.com wrote: On Tue, 06 Apr 2010 17:32:49 +0200, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 2:00 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: Well you currently can do this by using the onbeforeprint and

Re: [whatwg] Will you consider about RFC 4329?

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, James Kerr wrote: Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Mon, 5 Apr 2010, Swampert wrote: In your HTML5 draft standard, the default value for type attribute in script element is text/javascript. While according to RFC 4329, the MIME type text/javascript is obsolete, the

Re: [whatwg] Will you consider about RFC 4329?

2010-04-06 Thread James Kerr
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Apologies, I've just noticed that I accidentally sent a couple of further posts directly to Anne instead of to the mailing list. I include them and Anne's response here for the benefit of the list discussion... -

Re: [whatwg] HTMLCollection and HTMLAllCollection suggestion

2010-04-06 Thread Boris Zbarsky
On 4/6/10 12:17 PM, Perry Smith wrote: I'm confused by the spec at this point. The title for section 13 is obsolete features but then 13.3 is Requirements Right. Just because a feature is obsolete doesn't mean that UAs aren't required to implement it in a particular way. I test a little

Re: [whatwg] HTMLCollection and HTMLAllCollection suggestion

2010-04-06 Thread Perry Smith
On Apr 6, 2010, at 12:24 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote: On 4/6/10 12:17 PM, Perry Smith wrote: I'm confused by the spec at this point. The title for section 13 is obsolete features but then 13.3 is Requirements Right. Just because a feature is obsolete doesn't mean that UAs aren't required to

Re: [whatwg] HTMLCollection and HTMLAllCollection suggestion

2010-04-06 Thread Boris Zbarsky
On 4/6/10 1:37 PM, Perry Smith wrote: Gack! probably. document.compatMode returns CSS1Compat so I'm in no-quirks-mode which is probably what you mean by standards mode. Yep. -Boris

Re: [whatwg] Forms feedback

2010-04-06 Thread Jonas Sicking
On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 8:32 AM, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 2:00 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: Well you currently can do this by using the onbeforeprint and onafterprint hooks, though that's not exactly pretty. Hopefully it will also be possible

Re: [whatwg] Directory upload via input type=file directory

2010-04-06 Thread Ojan Vafai
What about drag-drop? I should be able to drag a directory, a file, or a list of files onto an input, no? If not, how is this distinction shown to users? How will it be clear to users when they can do one or the other? Ojan On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 3:53 PM, John Gregg john...@google.com wrote:

Re: [whatwg] Directory upload via input type=file directory

2010-04-06 Thread John Gregg
That's a fair question, but how is it clear today whether an input can accept multiple files vs. a single file using drag-and-drop? Currently if I drag multiple files onto an input that doesn't have 'multiple', I get only the first one. (In Chrome.) Some good default text from the UA, like

Re: [whatwg] Directory upload via input type=file directory

2010-04-06 Thread J Ross Nicoll
In cases where we're having users upload content, we definitely wouldn't want to block them uploading individual files, while also allowing them to upload directories. I would be tempted to make name the fully qualified path to the file (so it remains unique), and add a third filename

[whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Mounir Lamouri
Hi, For input element in telephone state [1] specs say User agents may change the punctuation of values that the user enters. I do not really get it. What is the idea ? [1] http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/forms.html#telephone-state Thanks, -- Mounir

Re: [whatwg] Directory upload via input type=file directory

2010-04-06 Thread Ojan Vafai
It's unfortunate that users need to distinguish between single and multiple file inputs. That's not something we can change at this point. The web started with single file inputs. We can avoid adding a third type of file input they need to understand though. Also, what should happen if you drag

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Ashley Sheridan
On Tue, 2010-04-06 at 23:12 +0200, Mounir Lamouri wrote: Hi, For input element in telephone state [1] specs say User agents may change the punctuation of values that the user enters. I do not really get it. What is the idea ? [1] http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/forms.html#telephone-state

Re: [whatwg] Directory upload via input type=file directory

2010-04-06 Thread John Gregg
The most relevant issue is that in Windows/Mac/Linux, there are no system dialogs that let the user select either a folder or a file. They each have separate choose a file and choose a folder dialogs. I think the logical reason for that is that when selecting a file, clicking a directory means

Re: [whatwg] Directory upload via input type=file directory

2010-04-06 Thread Ashley Sheridan
On Tue, 2010-04-06 at 14:28 -0700, John Gregg wrote: The most relevant issue is that in Windows/Mac/Linux, there are no system dialogs that let the user select either a folder or a file. They each have separate choose a file and choose a folder dialogs. I think the logical reason for that

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: For input element in telephone state [1] specs say User agents may change the punctuation of values that the user enters. I do not really get it. What is the idea ? For example, if I enter 1 650 253-, the user agent is allowed to change that

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Mounir Lamouri
On 04/07/2010 12:37 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: For input element in telephone state [1] specs say User agents may change the punctuation of values that the user enters. I do not really get it. What is the idea ? For example, if I enter 1 650

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Wed, 7 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: On 04/07/2010 12:37 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: For input element in telephone state [1] specs say User agents may change the punctuation of values that the user enters. I do not really get it. What is the

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Mounir Lamouri
On 04/07/2010 12:55 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Wed, 7 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: On 04/07/2010 12:37 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: For input element in telephone state [1] specs say User agents may change the punctuation of values that the user enters.

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Davis Peixoto
Hello fellas, I agree with Mounir. Thing is UA is allowed to do that, but without clear rules, this can be a mess. If for date and time, where we have a lot of formats and standards for internationalization, how can UA specify and be no type mismatch, if we do not have any standard about phone

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Wed, 7 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: Well the alternative is to not have the user agent change the value at all, in which case you still have to do server-side canonicalisation, so I don't think it really makes any difference. If the UA is not changing the value, we are sure at

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, Davis Peixoto wrote: Thing is UA is allowed to do that, but without clear rules, this can be a mess. If for date and time, where we have a lot of formats and standards for internationalization, how can UA specify and be no type mismatch, if we do not have any standard

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Mounir Lamouri
On 04/07/2010 01:08 AM, Ian Hickson wrote: On Wed, 7 Apr 2010, Mounir Lamouri wrote: Well the alternative is to not have the user agent change the value at all, in which case you still have to do server-side canonicalisation, so I don't think it really makes any difference. If the UA is

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 4:13 PM, Mounir Lamouri mounir.lamo...@gmail.com wrote: As Davis said, there are too many phone numbers format out there so we can't let the UA do a formatting because it will be a bad one in most of the cases. For example, in France, we use 2-digit blocks but in the US

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Mounir Lamouri
On 04/07/2010 01:18 AM, Tab Atkins Jr. wrote: On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 4:13 PM, Mounir Lamouri mounir.lamo...@gmail.com wrote: As Davis said, there are too many phone numbers format out there so we can't let the UA do a formatting because it will be a bad one in most of the cases. For example,

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Eduard Pascual
On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:10 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: If there was a true standard, then the spec would refer to that, but as you say, it's very varied in practice. There is quite a standard, even if an implicit one: (almost) no punctuation. Have you ever dialed a ( or a - when

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Davis Peixoto
When I was using MacOS X, I hated how the contact application was restyling my phone numbers. By the way, it lets me think about something: the telephone state can still be used for autocomplete with phones from contacts. -- Mounir Good one, Mounir. Tab, this does not means only

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Ashley Sheridan
On Wed, 2010-04-07 at 01:28 +0200, Eduard Pascual wrote: On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:10 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: If there was a true standard, then the spec would refer to that, but as you say, it's very varied in practice. There is quite a standard, even if an implicit one:

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Davis Peixoto
Other than that, the only safe alternative would be to leave the values untouched, so the page can say what it wants, the user honor it, and the server get it as expected; or gracefully degrade to an error message that actually points to the user error (rather than an error introduced by an

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread timeless
0-9, *, #, p, w http://www.wikihow.com/Add-Pauses-to-a-Phone-Number recognizing the difference between a 'P' and a 'p' (or a 'W' and a 'w') is moderately painful.

Re: [whatwg] using postMessage() to send to a newly-created window

2010-04-06 Thread Dirk Pranke
Sorry for the delay in replying ... On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 1:31 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Mon, 21 Dec 2009, Dirk Pranke wrote: In the course of testing something today, I attempted to create a window and immediately post a message to it, and was surprised that it didn't seem

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Eduard Pascual
On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:31 AM, Ashley Sheridan a...@ashleysheridan.co.uk wrote: On Wed, 2010-04-07 at 01:28 +0200, Eduard Pascual wrote: On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 1:10 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: If there was a true standard, then the spec would refer to that, but as you say, it's

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Davis Peixoto
The goal of fool-proofing phone fields is a quite noble one but, let's be honest: it's quite near to an utopia. Any solution that may cause valid inputs to break is definitely bad. If fixing wrong inputs risks valid ones to break, we are not only not solving the problem, but we are moving

Re: [whatwg] Changing punctuation value of input element in telephone state

2010-04-06 Thread Kit Grose
On 07/04/2010, at 9:21 AM, Mounir Lamouri wrote: When I was using MacOS X, I hated how the contact application was restyling my phone numbers. I'm surprised this was an issue; the Mac OS X Address Book contains a dedicated preferences screen to allow you to define custom formatting rules if

Re: [whatwg] some thoughts on sandboxed IFRAMEs

2010-04-06 Thread Ian Hickson
On Thu, 4 Feb 2010, Tab Atkins Jr. wrote: On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 5:12 AM, Ian Hickson i...@hixie.ch wrote: On Mon, 25 Jan 2010, Tab Atkins Jr. wrote: Adam Barth rightfully points out that this only stops certain classes of data exfiltration attacks, and so probably isn't worthwhile as a