well in practice.
tl;dr - only in makes no sense unless the action is actually shell specific
and not application specific. i'd go so far as to suggest that shell specific
actions are unmaintanable in practice and would drop that 'feature'
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dropping the feature makes sense imho.
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-by-application basis.
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On Wednesday, July 3, 2013 19:27:16 Sebastien Bacher wrote:
Le 03/07/2013 17:29, Aaron J. Seigo a écrit :
in the specific example given, i really don't understand why a start Qt
project would have anything whatsoever to do with the shell.
Because when you use an environment
API, preventing churn in the already implemented DBus
services underneath.
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(in terms of DBus interfaces)
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the first actual release of the spec with
at least one production implementation. thoughts?
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On Tuesday, January 11, 2011, Jeff Mitchell wrote:
On 1/10/2011 6:30 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
hi...
super-massively-belated-response(tm) ...
On Thursday, October 14, 2010, Vincent Untz wrote:
It's all at http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xdg/xdg-specs/
+ free media player
On Tuesday, January 11, 2011, Marco Martin wrote:
On Tuesday 11 January 2011, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
so while i agree with your suggested workflow in general, i suggest we
define agreed upon as meaning at least the first actual release of the
spec with at least one production implementation
On Tuesday, January 11, 2011, Cornelius Schumacher wrote:
On Tuesday 11 January 2011 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
anything else that should be included? any thoughts on format?
For reference here are some proposals from a while ago:
http://gitorious.org/~cornelius/xdg-specs/xdg-specs-spec0
to bring up the topic of metadata in the repository ... but
i'll start a new thread for that i think...
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be easy enough: a file with a standard name (status? adoption?
metadata?) in the top-level directory of each spec.
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and this addition does not achieve consensus approval,
we do have .protocol files in KDE already and it would be nice (and sensible)
to use something that already exists instead of reinventing new wheels of
incompatibility.
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of the .protocol files. it
would be far too slow otherwise. i think the general implementation is not
that different, only in the detail of is the mimetype system a good place to
put additional sort-of-like-but-not-quite application associations? question.
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specifications for good reason.
I agree that we need to continue to work on, and in some cases re-work, the
specificaton on fd.o. I hope you'll join, productively and constructively, in
helping us achieve that. Thanks ...
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, is that what you point out won't affect only notifier
items, but all communication done over DBus. It's a more general problem that
will only be addressed by making it easy (as in transparent) to route DBus
over the same network that the X session is on.
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once we start using the technology in question
extensively, which brings people to work on it because they now have a good
reason to. If we all just wait around, nothing happens, nothing gets done, and
our platform stagnates. Not good.
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something using DBus. work trumps talk/hope/expectation/desire.
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with well defined constraints and
allowances.
This may well be a difference in philosophy with some other viewpoints. It is,
however, the one some of us are taking and we really have no desire to go
backwards on it. It's paying off too many dividends for us to do so. :)
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(qdbus and dbus-snend can't do that), such that the
back-end discards the inhibit requests almost immediately.
do you have use cases (e.g. code) that we can test with?
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is: resurrect the dbus
spec for org.freedesktop.PowerManagement, move it into the git repository and
ratify it.
same for org.freedesktop.ScreenSaver, btw.
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On February 17, 2010, Daniel Stone wrote:
On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 12:24:50PM -0800, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
but it is linked to from the next sentence in the paragraph on the main
page. the linked sentence itself is: See AccountRequests for
information on how to obtain CVS access to a project
On February 17, 2010, Daniel Stone wrote:
On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 09:59:30AM -0800, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
You can now edit the wiki to your heart's content, but please try to
restrict your edits to actual reflections on how things today work,
rather than your vision of how you believe
. ditto for thumbnails. dfaure already covered trash; sound
names / theme and secret aren't, i don't think anyways?, widely employed yet
so aren't critical targets.
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to find and track. splitting them up into many
repositories raises the bar on that one without much benefit. at least, imo.
what are the benefits of separate repositories in your mind? (i didn't really
see a rational in your email, but i assume you have some good thoughts on the
matter :)
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i'm starting a new thread for this because it really is a parallel issue and i
don't want to hijack Vincent's thread to discuss it
On February 16, 2010, Daniel Stone wrote:
On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 10:21:02AM -0800, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On February 16, 2010, Vincent Untz wrote:
I learnt
status, imho. i don't
know when we will get to such a thing ourselves (Marco, myself) due to time
constraints, but if anyone else would like to contribute such a table that
would make it happen a lot quicker.
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git checkout -b notificationitem origin/notificationitem
(Marco: could you merge the notificationitem branch into the main xdg-specs
repo as a branch there? that might make it easier for others to follow as
well; i've added your gitorious account to the xdg-specs repo members list)
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to
interpret what scrolling results in :)
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, but if it helps it helps and it
should go in.
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itself as taking an icon or an animation)
What if you want to provide an animation in multiple sizes?
this is indeed an unresolved problem, and why you probably want to define
animations by theme name in the first place rather than pixmap data if at all
possible.
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On January 18, 2010, you wrote:
On 01/18/2010 03:12 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
Also, you need to give *some* indication of what this is for. Eg,
currently it could mean anything from Please raise the indicated window
if the user clicks on the status item to Please hide the indicated
window
On January 18, 2010, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On January 18, 2010, you wrote:
On 01/18/2010 03:12 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
Also, you need to give *some* indication of what this is for. Eg,
currently it could mean anything from Please raise the indicated
window if the user clicks
On January 18, 2010, you wrote:
On Mon, 2010-01-18 at 18:17 -0800, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On January 18, 2010, Matthias Clasen wrote:
The spec is full of awkward
naming (StatusNotifierHost, ServiceRegistered, etc),
as noted in my replies, i agree that ServiceRegistered should/could
On January 13, 2010, you wrote:
On Tue, 2010-01-12 at 10:13 -0800, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On January 12, 2010, Aurélien Gâteau wrote:
I remember one of the outcomes of the freedesktop.org discussion we had
at Gran Canaria Desktop Summit was that a spec didn't have to be fully
finalized
. is there someone from GNOME who is
willing to put the GNOME name in the supporters column with a commitment to
implement? if so, then i don't see what more needs to be discussed, as long as
this is recorded in the metadata file alongside the spec proposal.
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enough as is, and without turning it into a full
sentence i don't think we'll find something better. the name is the easy
thing to discuss, though, relative to the actual spec so it's what people tend
to discuss. it's the what colour is the bikeshed part of this spec ;)
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the 4.3 release.
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important than where they are for the moment.
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On September 8, 2009, you wrote:
Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
Since this spec aims to be desktop independent, whether notification
bubbles and notification items should be visually grouped is an
implementation detail. It should not be up to the spec to suggest this.
it doesn't suggest this, it just
or stylistic format.
it's a slightly different matter, as the former says which characters are
legal and the latter suggest how to use those characters. (to state the
obvious)
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, be relied upon
* deprecate use of characters outside that character set, and put a sunset
date on its usage (some years out)
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of this, as well, as
that tends to prove a design well (and highlight weaknesses yet to be
uncovered).
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-local parts to this
system today, it likely will eventually have to deal with such things.
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existing ones like DeviceKit
using '-'s in properties along the way.
i also don't see the necessity for more character variety in property names
than in signals, methods or other identifiers in a D-Bus service. what's the
use case, exactly, beyond preserving existing malformed services?
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On September 7, 2009, you wrote:
On Mon, 2009-09-07 at 16:53 -0600, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
i also don't see the necessity for more character variety in property
names than in signals, methods or other identifiers in a D-Bus service.
what's the use case, exactly, beyond preserving existing
needs to
be able to integrate with one of the supported Qt event loops however. Qt,
KDE, Gtk+, Windows and Mac are all supported.
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home in a couple days, which will make that easier)
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than introducing yet more new stuff? ;)
even more importantly, it would be more new stuff that would need to be
translated. it would be better to fix the .desktop files which need to be
fixed because they are broken rather than add yet more work for the
translation teams.
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On Wednesday 22 July 2009, Michael Pyne wrote:
On Wednesday 22 July 2009 23:48:32 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday 22 July 2009, David Faure wrote:
Why is it so hard to acknowledge that if you want to show a piece of
text as one unit in the interface, it needs to be presented as one
and document that information.
one. step. at. a. time.
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destination. personally, i'm ready for a few
years of effort here before we're in a place i'm personally happy with. :)
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of that? twice that i can remember. in 10 years.
let's not make this more complicated with possible-but-not-realistic issues.
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On Thursday 09 July 2009, David Faure wrote:
On Thursday 09 July 2009, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
* we provide a process in which ALL projects can register their
acceptance, implementation, rejection, etc of specs
Yes, actually that's what was suggested during the meeting.
The initial idea
On Thursday 09 July 2009, Olivier Goffart wrote:
Le Thursday 09 July 2009, Aaron J. Seigo a écrit :
points of contact and decision making are not necessarily the same thing.
our release team has enough to do as it is, [...]
The role of the 'release manager' would be to read the mailing list
. i'd recommend
adding at least one person with admin status from each involved project (KDE,
GNOME, XFCE, LXDE, etc.) so we have true shared ownership of this artifact.
cheers, and i'll see you all on the flip side ... :)
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certain
emotional and even political aspects that shouldn't exist in the process.
accept, reject, abstain, implement are much more value-neutral words.
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. The process would be that a spec is
accepted as freedesktop.org spec, if the release teams of both GNOME and
KDE accept the spec.
this sounds great; but it's very high level, so let's talk implementation.
On Wednesday 08 July 2009 23:01:54 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday 08 July 2009, Olivier
critical for 3rd party developers to figure out our mess ;)
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to solve.
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fingers
or getting polemic. just describe what you wanted to see happen, and what
actually happened instead.
with concrete examples on the table, we can work through them. together.
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On Saturday 27 June 2009, Brian J. Tarricone wrote:
On 2009/06/26 18:05, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
applications activate notifications by their identifier (+ any
specific-to- that-instance-of-the-notification data), and knotifyd
handles the routing from there.
Ok, so this sounds a lot like
On Friday 26 June 2009, Julien Danjou wrote:
At 1245966208 time_t, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
i think such a system would alleviate the bulk of future issues without
bogging us down in bureaucracy.
While I totally agree with you, I've learn that talking in the FOSS
world is (too) often a lost
, that might be a good place to keep a working list as keeping it all
straight on the mailing list is a bit of a chore :)
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), it's just not the
full puzzle.
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with
something less capable thing again with my KDE teammates.
galago and knotify have essentially zero overlap in functionality. in fact,
knotify provides a notification _system_ that feeds the service defined in the
galago spec with data to show.
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need to ensure that we don't repeat
them.
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.
if you wish for people such as myself to be productive and moving forward
minded, you need to start providing support for productive and forward moving
initiatives. that was actually my first approach to this set of issues.
fair?
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use
galago; i don't think it could be done in a purely backwards compatible way)
and, once again, need a new galago to do what galago is doing right now for
us (communicating between knotify and the visualization(s)).
i hope that clears it up somewhat.
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getting deeply involved with the discussion.
[3] that may not be everyone, but the goal should be everyone, or as close
as we can get to that
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and common APIs really belong here! I think
+1
we all want this. What we're facing here IMHO is a governance problem,
agreed. now how many of us are able and willing to be part of the solution?
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) this particular request actually has a very real purpose behind it: it's
confusing naming, and some of us would like to see a full notifications
specification landed at some point that includes not just visual notifications
the request (c) should be justifiably considered due to (a) and (b)
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. where were you in past years? that's why it's
gotten to this point, and while i wish there was another way to do it, it
would be just more status quo is status quo, let it ride openly broken. and
that is not acceptable.
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be run this way and thereby avoid creating more poor
results.
this is a vote of no confidence in fd.o as it stands, and the cause of that
lack of confidence is galago in how it represents the broken / lack of
processes here.
start arguing about that and we'll get somewhere.
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support to. do you?
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this enough times in this thread yet? i hope everyone's getting
it by now. if not, let me know and i'll happily repeat it ;)
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and remove barriers to efficiency for you guys.
my only question is whether or not this is something that the various
participants in working on the icon spec are in favour of? i assume/hope so,
but as it hasn't been mentioned, i feel compelled to ask for clarity.
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On Thursday 25 June 2009, Brian J. Tarricone wrote:
On 06/25/2009 12:52 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
c) this particular request actually has a very real purpose behind it:
it's confusing naming, and some of us would like to see a full
notifications specification landed at some point
On Thursday 25 June 2009, Brian J. Tarricone wrote:
On 06/25/2009 01:27 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Thursday 25 June 2009, Brian J. Tarricone wrote:
Thank you -- that's exactly how I feel like this conversation is going.
As a notifications daemon implementer, I *really* don't appreciate
various other things that are sticking with the current spec, and while
i find some of them dubious i don't think they are worth squabbling over. the
name of the service on the bus, however, is.
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On Wednesday 24 June 2009, Aurélien Gâteau wrote:
Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday 24 June 2009, Aurélien Gâteau wrote:
There are patches for libnotify, notification-daemon, kdebase and
notify-osd.
org.freedesktop.Notifications ... *sigh* sorry, but that's not
acceptable.
Most
that too.
[1] http://www.gnome.org/~mccann/gnome-screensaver/docs/gnome-screensaver.html
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On Wednesday 24 June 2009, you wrote:
Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
the correctness issue:
these are not notifications, they are a subset of notifications. what do
we call a spec that actually does notifications? FullNotifications? there
is no point in collaborating if there is no collaboration
here. :)
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client-side API, as what it should look like will change
between devices, between philosophies and between decades.
but yes, i agree with a lot of what you observe :)
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this one starts to get really
ridiculous, and should be discouraged in the spec; the point that it's
'possible' stands).
imho, the spec should outline that if image_data is sent, that image_path is
to be ignored even if defined.
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are the real world use cases?
i really don't want to write, test and maintain image conversion code if i
don't have to, and i thus far fail to see the benefit. it sounds a lot more
like a theoretical issue rather than a practical one.
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Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
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On Saturday 13 June 2009, Brian J. Tarricone wrote:
On 06/13/2009 05:12 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Saturday 13 June 2009, Brian J. Tarricone wrote:
I'd say might as well throw in the image format as well. It's a tiny
extra bit of information, and it's not a big burden to require it from
don't think it belongs in this spec :)
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Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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and we can turn them into action together. the last
time we actually managed to discuss this, it resulted in a number of good
improvements.
this email does represent my last attempt to get this going.
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1
account, i'd be happy to add you
to the xdg-specs team and you could have a go at adding the thumbnailer spec
to the repository.
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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it is that's sub-par with fd.o's
social/political machinery.
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Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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the current system, which in turn was implemented
due to inherent limitations with it's a directory structure approach (mostly
related to third party additions).
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored
, for example, merging the context menus seamlessly and without
hassle.
but yes, this is indeed the sort of thing the new spec has been designed with
in mind.
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt
On Thursday 23 April 2009, Ted Gould wrote:
On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 18:03 -0600, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
this is probably the typical implementation we'll see in general, because
it's consistent with legacy tray behaviors. but it could just as easily
be a voice driven system, a text interface
, comments are desired.
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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On Monday 20 April 2009, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
* there is a long-running d-bus service that keeps track of the items and
the visualizations (in the case of KDE, a kded4 module, though each
environment could and should provide its own)
something that came up during a private conversation
)
using a different icon means they are using an icon from the icon theme, or a
custom icon not included in the icon spec?
Packages using notify_notification_set_icon_from_pixbuf: 19
and these don't use app_icon at all, i take it?
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209
say should work because right now, to be perfectly frank, it doesn't
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Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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above a certain
size may be silently dropped and the d-bus communication canceled (to prevent
DOS, for instance) ...
--
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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