I totally respect what you are trying to do with the database idea, but the
problem with managing and keeping track keeps re-appearing - that is, if you
are suggesting getting the data from a database. In fact, now you have
added another series of steps:
"what variables do we have, where are we using them, lets now go do a search
in the database to see what we have, lets now see where we use it."
It's like working with database normalization. You first normalize, then
you de-normailze to eliminate complexity. In this case I will always need
to know what text appears on what page. If they are bundled together than
it is a matter of finding the associated text file for that page. Otherwise
I have to go hunting and querying. Want to add a page? Add a text file.
Want to change an item on a page? Change it in all the associated text
files (one for each language translation). Yes you cant make a global
change. But you CAN do a global search and replace!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Deadman, Hal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 01, 2001 12:18 PM
Subject: RE: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> Let me preface this by saying I haven't given this much thought. Since
> struts already supports multiple bundles (i.e. with the bundle attribute
on
> bean:message) would it make since to have struts read all the resource
files
> from a particular directory or path and use the base filename of the
> property file as the name of the bundle? That would allow people to break
up
> their properties files however they want to. The default file with the
> bundle key Action.MESSAGES_KEY would still be used whenever a bundle was
not
> specified.
>
> I think if I were going to have a huge number of bundles like one per
page,
> I would pull my resources from a database using a custom
> DatabaseMessageResourceFactory. I have considered writing a such a factory
> and the accompanying webapp to maintain the translations but I haven't
> followed through.
>
> Hal
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jonathan Asbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 9:30 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> >
> >
> > The problem we found was that a master list is impossible to
> > manage. For
> > instance, on the soon to arrive 10th page of the property
> > file, you will
> > have to search all of the previous pages to check to see if
> > you already used
> > the property name already. Chances are that you did use the
> > name already
> > because an individual tends to think in their own way and
> > come up with the
> > same naming schemes, and you will have more for the property
> > name "name" in
> > many many other pages. Then some designer or manager tells
> > you to add a
> > form field which you recognize that you could use "name" as the field
> > property and realize you have to rethink the way you have
> > been and will
> > continue naming things, such as "signup_name", "logon_name",
> > "search_name",
> > "artist_name", "publication_name"...... after completeing
> > the 30th jsp page
> > you say to yourself, "man(sigh), if I just had a properties
> > file for each
> > page or include, than I wouldnt have a 3000 line properties
> > file with which
> > I cannot sort, group, or categorize all of the property names nicely".
> >
> > It was easier for us to:
> > 1) know what was on any page (just look at the like named
> > proerties file)
> > 2) fix or add to a page without thinking if the name was
> > used, and whether I
> > thus have to come up with a naming scheme for this one or all of them.
> > 3) just hand over translatable content to the translators on
> > a page by page
> > basis.
> > 4) if you later decide to keep it in the database you can
> > because you just
> > associate pageName with propertyName
> >
> > logon.jsp user.name
> > logon.jsp user.address
> > logon.jsp
> > signup.jsp user.name
> > signup.jsp user.password
> > checkout.jsp user.name
> >
> > This is much easier. Try it. You will see how managing this
> > grand list
> > sucks ;^)
> >
> > If your developers are anything like places I have worked
> > for, than you know
> > how things
> > get out of control. I just take this as a given. With my
> > way, at any time,
> > I can email out new pages and text to be translated (by a
> > clerk, designers,
> > editors). I send a visual and typeographic pair of items
> > that go together
> > and that an editor can say, "yes, this is what I want the
> > caption to say on
> > this page". Do I repeadedly send the editor chunks of a
> > 3000+ item list and
> > then say:
> > (me) "can you tell me what you want to say in these new lines
> > of text?"
> > (editor) "which lines?"
> > (me) " the ones I highlighted"
> > (editor) "which of these lines of text is on this page we are talking
> > about?".
> >
> > Do you see why I say the benefits from a big list loose out
> > to a small list?
> > What if I delete one. What pages does it effect? Which ones
> > have been left
> > orphaned? You dont know in any easy way. For search and
> > replace you now
> > have to search each particularly named item. If they all were called
> > "user.name" I could just search and replace it everywhere
> > below a directory.
> > If one is "logon.user.name" and another "search.user.name"
> > you now have to
> > search and find each unique one. Could you get them all, or
> > did you miss
> > some because someone was using "logon.User.Name" instead of
> > "logon.user.name" or "logonUserName".
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Nanduri, Amarnath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 5:50 PM
> > Subject: RE: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> >
> >
> > > Hi Guys,
> > >
> > > From my personal experience it would not be a bad
> > idea for struts
> > to
> > > support multiple resource bundles. I will explain my reasons below.
> > >
> > > At present struts has one resource bundle in which you can
> > include error
> > > messages , confirmation messages , labels on html fileds
> > etc.... For a big
> > > application ( like i am on right now. We are going to have
> > > 50 jsp pages
> > > minimum) it is quite a pain in the neck to add properties
> > to a single
> > file.
> > > Besides the developers having to compete with one another
> > to checkout the
> > > properties file ( from source safe ) maintaining it is an
> > another pain.
> > >
> > > One more problem we encountered is nested exceptions
> > deep in the EJB's.
> > > Trying to throw the error msgs (which ofcourse have to be
> > internationalized)
> > > and showing it to the user, it was somewhat of a problem to
> > define all the
> > > correct error messages in the same property file. After
> > sometime we were
> > > able to coordinate properly and get stuff back on track
> > (without losing
> > > tempers).
> > >
> > > I would propose that struts 1.1 make it a standard to
> > have separate
> > > Resource Bundles for different categories. I do not agree with one
> > Resource
> > > Bundle per page as this would lead to too much confusion.
> > >
> > > For example, all the error msgs would be in a Resource Bundle by
> > > themselves. Confirmation msgs would have their own Resource
> > Bundle. HTML
> > > related fields will have their own Resource Bundles etc ..
> > >
> > > From a performance point of view which would be more
> > efficient ? Having
> > a
> > > single Resource Bundle (or) Multiple Resource Bundles ?
> > Which one can give
> > > the user faster lookup access ?
> > >
> > >
> > > At present we have close to 2000+ (properties + error msgs) in the
> > > properties file and the number would most likely quadruple
> > by the time we
> > > take it to production. I would certainly like to hear your
> > opinions on
> > > this....esp from people who have deployed their applications...
> > >
> > > just my 2cents
> > >
> > > cheers,
> > > Amar..
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Jonathan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 10:28 AM
> > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Peter. Read the whole thread and you will see some good
> > examples as to
> > > why I want to do this.
> > >
> > > I think I will end up doing some surgery on the struts
> > classes. I will
> > > associate the page I am forwarding to with a properties
> > file, maybe inside
> > > the struts-config. That will mean I will have to look at the dom
> > > manipulation which gets the values and ad another group of
> > items (the
> > > associated properties file) to a hashtable or object. I will put the
> > > properties files in the same directory as the jsp page but
> > protected. I
> > > will try to protect all files that end in ".properties".
> > >
> > > I would love to hear suggestions from Niall, Ted, Craig, Hal, Jeff,
> > Nanduri,
> > > Dave etc....
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Peter Alfors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 10:03 AM
> > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification - is there a work around
> > >
> > >
> > > > We are currently using two different resource bundles.
> > One for our
> > > messages and
> > > > another for our constants (that define
> > > > web look and feel). To do this, we overrode the init()
> > method in the
> > > > ActionServlet and added another method to initialize a
> > second bundle
> > into
> > > a
> > > > different session attribute.
> > > > This works well for 2 different bundles, but it would not
> > be practical
> > for
> > > a
> > > > large number or bundles (one per page).
> > > >
> > > > Maybe there would be a way to initialize all of the page
> > bundles at
> > > startup?
> > > > Some sort of loop or somethine?
> > > > I don't have any suggestions on how this would work, but
> > maybe it is a
> > > starting
> > > > point??
> > > >
> > > > One supporting reason for a single bundle would be
> > this... It allows
> > you
> > > to
> > > > easily keep consistent naming across your app.
> > > > For instance, if each of your pages has the label "Id",
> > but then later
> > on
> > > you
> > > > (or the customer) decide that "Name" is a better choice,
> > you only have
> > to
> > > change
> > > > it in one place. There are other situations as well,
> > this is just one.
> > > > Also, creating new locales is as simple as handing a
> > single resource
> > > bundle over
> > > > to your translater, rather than 100 different bundles to
> > duplicate.
> > > > As for naming problems, there is a simple solution. Use a naming
> > strategy
> > > for
> > > > each key.
> > > >
> > > > <pageName>.<Key>=Value
> > > > or
> > > > common.<Key>=Value <-- if this is common across all pages.
> > > >
> > > > HTH,
> > > > Pete
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Jonathan Asbell wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Thanks Pete. However it just seems strange that Struts
> > just offers
> > one
> > > big
> > > > > resource file for each Local. I have developed 3
> > international sites,
> > > and I
> > > > > can safely say that when a set of resources are
> > associated with a
> > > particular
> > > > > page it is much easier to manage than 1 resources for
> > all pages. Has
> > > anyone
> > > > > hacked at the Struts code to get around this? I dont like the
> > > concatenating
> > > > > idea because it is too easy to have duplicates; and you
> > probably want
> > to
> > > use
> > > > > the same resource names anyway to keep a consistency.
> > Anyone else
> > have
> > > any
> > > > > ideas?
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Peter Alfors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 9:33 AM
> > > > > Subject: Re: Resources clarification :^)
> > > > >
> > > > > > You could combine all of your property files during
> > your build.
> > > > > > This would allow you to have as many different
> > property files as you
> > > > > > want.
> > > > > > However, you need to be careful that you do not have
> > duplicate names
> > > > > > across multiple files.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > HTH,
> > > > > > Pete
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jonathan wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hello all. It appears that the ActionServlet points to a
> > resources
> > > > > > > file, and not a ResourceBundle object. Is this
> > true? The reason
> > is
> > > > > > > that I would like to group in the same directory
> > the following:1)
> > a
> > > > > > > particular ActionForm2) the Action class that works
> > with that
> > > > > > > ActionForm3) the resources (strings) that work with that
> > > > > > > ActionForm The reason is that it is much easier to
> > manage the
> > > > > > > artifacts on a page by page basis.How can I do this
> > > > > > > properly ThanksJonathan
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
