On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 8:09 AM stevea <stevea...@softworkers.com> wrote: > The topic begs the question as to what such (usually very) old, > poor-condition (where they ARE poor) roads should be tagged (we limit > ourselves to US roads here because this is talk-us), and at what granularity. > (Volker COULD do detailed tagging, but I hear loud and clear he prefers > high-granularity tagging, as do I, though we all recognize how tedious this > can be). And "old 66" is a quintessential example, many segments are a > century old or older: it is known as "the Mother road" by many. BTW, many > public agencies under the umbrella of Southern California Association of > Governments are working on developing USBR 66 in California for cyclists (the > route number choice is no coincidence as some alignments follow the old > Mother road). This was actually in OSM as an early proposed route, but was > removed to conform to USBRS proposed route conventions. If/as USBR 66 turns > into a Caltrans (DOT) route proposal to AASHTO, OSM will re-enter these data. > It makes sense to pay close attention to the underlying infrastructure > tagging (tertiary, surface, smoothness...) as we do so since these are > important to cyclists.
It really depends on what we're talking about here. Are we talking about the places that are bannered with the 'Historic US 66' sign (with the appearance of a US Highway banner from the 1930s), roads named 'Old US 66', or the actual ways comprising the historic route of the road. 'Historic US 66' is a bannered and numbered route because of its history, not because of its current importance to the road system. The constituent ways should be tagged as whatever they are currently in the road network. In many places, 'Historic US 66' no longer follows the historic route of the road because the road is no longer passable or no longer has good connections to the highway network. For example, from Flagstaff, Arizona to the New Mexico state line (except for brief detours through Winslow and Holbrook) the bannered 'Historic Route 66' is highway=motorway because the construction of I-40 obliterated or disconnected the old route. (I don't know whether I-40 actually bears the signage anywhere.) There are places where the old road exists on the ground and bears the name, but are not bannered because a road fails to connect or is no longer reliably passable to low-clearance automobiles. The route can be followed for some distance east and west of Exit 303, for instance. It's at most an 'unclassified' road and connects mostly to tracks. At the east end of that run, there's no crossing of I-40, and the road simply turns right onto another track. On the other side of the freeway, the pavement resumes, but in Petrified Forest it's unmaintained and has deteriorated to where it is neither safe nor lawful to drive. East of there, it's a track at best, and again ends at a freeway crossing without an interchange. On the far side, it's a minor rural road (County Road 7385) https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/16792461, then crosses the freeway at McCarrell and becomes the freeway frontage road in Chambers. If memory serves, some of the tracks that remain in use are no longer public rights-of-way, and neither the ranchers nor the Navajo Nation welcome visitors on them. In western Arizona, from Kingman to Seligman, the historic way is in service, is bannered 'AZ 66' and is at least 'secondary'. East of Seligman, it exists as Crookson Road and 'Old US 66, but diminishes to a track and disappears at a corner where it crosses neither I-40 nor the Phoenix spur of the Santa Fe. Between there are Flagstaff, there are fragmentary tracks, and some, such as https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/16792461 are entirely isolated from the road network. West of Kingman, it's County Road 10, and at least it used to be challenging to drive because it was a narrow and badly deteriorated road in mountainous terrain. The only community on the route is Oatman, which has enjoyed something of a resurgence as a tourist destination, "come see the ghost town where wild burros roam the streets." I'd say it's probably 'tertiary' because in that desert, it doesn't take much to make a road important. For the whole route, I'd say, 'tag the constituent ways as what they are, and maintain the 'Historic US 66' relation only where the historic route is marked, or at least named.' The 'Old US 66' concept is best left for OHM. > Are there any fresh, eager readers of this list who wish to delve into a > fairly tedious sub-project in OSM: tagging "their" portion of 66 (and its > many remnants, bypasses, used-to-be-segments...) that they know? The right > classifications (as they render) and surface=* and smoothness=* tagging > (though, they do not render) would be very welcome ongoing improvements to > our fine project. It could be a state-at-a-time effort to drum up OSM > community, it could become a "WikiProject" (though that concept seems to have > fuzzied as of late), it could be a topic at Meetups or Mapping Parties in the > appropriate geographical venues...it seems like a good fit to build a kernel > of effort to "get this right." May we see better 66 tagging going forward! Alas, it's not my project. I may be eager, but I'm surely not fresh. I haven't lived in the Southwest for many years and no longer have current local knowledge. -- 73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin _______________________________________________ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
