On Saturday 18 November 2017, Ilya Zverev wrote: > john whelan wrote: > > No you need to build up trust again and it takes time. Only then > > will your ideas start to gain acceptance. > > Oh come on. I've been a mapper since 2010, I've hosted dozens of > events, I've written many articles and tools, some of which you might > have used, I'm on the Board currently, and still my proposals and > pull requests fail again and again, because there is no trust in > OpenStreetMap. There is nothing you can to to build up trust. Your > ideas will never get acceptance, it's just nitpicking and "unwritten > rules" all over.
I hope you are aware that with this you deny everyone who has ever voiced critique on any of your proposals and pull requests to have a competent opinion on the topic in question. I understand and partly share your frustration that it can be difficult to effect change in OpenStreetMap because of strong inertia but most of the subjects we are talking about here with proposals and pull requests are complicated matters and it is always good advise to be a bit humble and consider the possibility that even if you have looked into a matter in depth and think you know what the right thing to do is there might be others who have a deeper understanding and more experience on this matter and based on that disagree with you - on the facts and independent of if they trust you as a person or not. I have been in this situation from both sides - as someone who wrongly thinks he knows what is best and thought people should just trust him and as someone who sees the ideas of others and is aware exactly what knowledge and experience they are missing to recognize the flaw in their idea. The key to solving this kind of problem is respectful and considerate communication, caring about each other's opinions and reasoning - and above all patience. People are always more likely to accept and support change if they come to realize the need for it themselves, at their own pace. And a rejected idea does not necessarily need to be considered failure. It is an opportunity to talk to the people who have rejected it, re-evaluating your assumptions and motives and maybe develop a better solution (or let others do that when they recognize the need). I have seen lots of examples where a failed attempt at something created the impulse for a better and successful solution. (Changed the subject because this of course does not have much to do with the original subject of this thread - still i think this is an important topic to discuss) -- Christoph Hormann http://www.imagico.de/ _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
