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Original message --------------
From: "David Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
The job of the apostles was not to write the Bible, Matthew, Mrak (probably under the supervision of the
Apostle Peter), John's gospel and letters, Paul's authorship
including Hebrews, James, and (perhaps) Titus author all of the NT
books except three (Luke/Acts and Jude) !!!! and
the apostles did not suddenly disappear once the Bible was "complete." The recording of "scripture" ended with the death of
John. Coincidence? I think not. Most of the
apostles left us no Scripture at all, including the chief apostle,
Jesus Christ himself. true. And I am
not saying that they all did. But, if we were to delete Luke/Acts
and Jude, we would still have all of NT teaching - and all of it
done by or under the tutelage of the apostles.
Most authors of the Bible were not apostles. We have Matthew, John, Paul, Peter and James writing
23 books and three writers authoring 4 books. It is
doubtful that James the Lord's brother was an apostle and yet, 21 lines from now (not counting salutations
and headings) you argue for the apostleship of James !! and
Jude the Lord's brother probably was not either. The author below did
not comment on Mark that author thought
DM was aware of the opinion of many that Peter supervised the writing
of Mark and gave Mark most of his information - since Mark was not
around Christ as far we any of us know or this other
Jude Jude was , indeed, an oversight but
my point remains as restated above when he says, "with
this group of men, we have the writings of all the NT
scripture..."&n
bsp; Then the author here casts modern day theologians
into prophets? Such could not be further from the truth. The
theologians of today are more analogous to the scribes of Jesus day.
Think about it.
"Prophet" as in apostles and
prophets, the foundation of the household of God (Eph 2:20) can have
one of [at least] two meanings. The first, a prophet as one who
predicts the future and the second, as one who reveals or explains the
revelation of God. I think the later notion gives us a better fit,
the apostles loose and bind, present revelation and the prophet (for
all ages) continues to illuminate this revelation. I can't insist on
this idea as excathedra, but I can certainly teach it. The effect of
this teaching is important. If one is a prophet, has the ability to
present and explain and excite the mind of the student and he/she does
not --------------- what does that mean for them personally? If
Bill Taylor, for example, is gifted with the ability to tie Chruch
history and the Revelation of the written word and the reality of the
Living Christ together into something that is a
t least understood by the evangelist, the pastor, the teacher and he
decides to do something else -- well, how should he view his
stewardship of the gift given?
And then there is the false assertion that all the miracles of
the NT were performed by Jesus or one of the apostles. Let's look at what John actually said, shall
we: The apostles were
charged with world mission, binding and loosing and the performace of
miracles as an extension (in the Spirit) of who they were. All the
recorded miracles of the NT scripture are performed by Jesus or one of
the apostles. The phrase "as
an extension of who they were" is very important to me. All of what
was promised in Mark 16: applies to the apostles. Peter could walk
by and people were healed. Paul could be hung on the wall of a jail
cell, knowing all the while that God had placed his opponents into his
hands - that he would be the victor. Stephen is an exceptional
case. He is singled out in scripture as being full o
f faith and the Spirit and power. I certainly do not beleive that
miracles ended with the passing of the apostles !! God continues to
use men and women to this day to accomplish even the miraculous - it
is a gift, one of many. But I do not believe in "faith healers."
And why? Because I believe that only the apostles could do such
things by way of ministry assignment , as a result of who they were
and not just how they were gifted. The apostles were the complete
package.
There is no reason to believe
that they continued beyond the first century (except, perhaps, John).
Consider Ananais who brought sight back to Saul and imparted
to him the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, and Stephen who did many
miracles among the people, as did the evangelist Philip, preaching in
Samaria.
Following is something I wrote about apostles and prophets
back in 1992. Although dated, perhaps it will help you in your
thinking about apostles and prophets.
Peace be with you.
David Miller.
-----
Original Message -----
Sent:
Tuesday, December 27, 2005 1:53 AM
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] apostles and prophets
Within the church , God has placed apostles,
prophets, evangelists, pastors and teacher. There collective
ministries are given a threefold purpose, but the specifics of each
functionary is unique and even exclusive.
The apostles and prophets are a case in point. They are
a part of those named in Eph 4:11 ff while , at the same time,
considered apart from the remaining categories (evangelists, pastors
and teachers). It is the apostles and prophets who are the foundation
of the "household of God" (Eph 2:20.) Because they are named as the
foundation of the Church, we can be confident that their ministries
compliment each other.
The apostles are given an identify -- the "12" -- while,
in fact, their numbers include the original 12, Matthias, Paul,
Barnabas, James the brother of Jesus, and arguably Apollos, Silvanus
and Titus. With this group of men, we have the writings of all NT
scripture except the historical record of Luke (Luke/Acts). most of
the time cute little rich girls are spoiled pagans.
> Do you
> > know of one cute little rich girl celebrity who
> > is a "steadfast" believer in the Lord Jesus Christ? If not
then
> this is
> > not a description of Linda.
Their counterpart is the prophet. Whereas the apostles
were given to the First Church, the prophets continue with the church
throughout the ages. It is not the prophets work to continue the
addition of scripture. That work was completed with the apostles.
The scriptures were finished with the passing of the apostles. In
time, the Church Catholic was challenged to identify those
scriptures and, with the providential consideration of God, the Bible
was the result. The prophet, named as a part of the foundation of the
church (Eph 2:20) is, in reality, those we commonly refer to as
"theologian." He is the one who continues the work of the apostle as
he illuminates the message, keeping the biblical message at center
stage and fresh for each new era within the church. People like
Athanasuius, Eusebias, Origen, Tertullian, Calvin, Luther, Barth are
prophets to the Church Catholic while others, less catholic in
function, add to this illuminary function, men like Wesley,
Torrance, NT Wright, and, finally, those who have read and are
acquainted with the above and have a good working knowledge of the
written word, people like Debbie Sawczak, Bill Taylor, Victor
Shepherd, Jon Hughs and the like. It is the prophet that keeps the
word alive and helps to keep us centered on the Christ.
The evangelist, pastor and teacher benefit from these
prophets and give their (the prophets) conributions meaning to those
within the church who have a better understanding of the common man
and his language. And, so , the church at all levels is benefited,
edified, regenerated with the living word without adding more and more
scripture and bigger and better phenom. A truly divine arrangement.
jd
