i am impressed by pete's on-going comments on this whole issue. thoughtful, smart and on the money.
my husband bill and i own a small, quality construction firm. non-union, so it has some impact on what jobs we can and cannot take. sometime we take even a small union job (a kitchen in a union bldg) and pay a guy who never shows up. that's the bargain you have to strike. bill was in the carpenters union and left because he was tired of seeing guys waste time and even more so, waste materials. carpenters would dry wall a room where the plumbing still needed to be roughed-in to piss off the plumbers and the plumbers would have to rip out the dry wall (more work for the carpenters again). guys would throw out sheets of drywall with only a little section used. good wood would be taken to the dump instead of salvaged. boxes of nails thrown away. it's true that you shouldn't have to join a union and that unions should not have such a stronghold on the city. not only are they doing all the stuff people have been complaining about, but there seems to be a mindset that says look out for your interest first, rather than society, the city, the environment. that's sad. i worked in non-profit for many yrs and when i'd say that people should have a choice and that some unions were not good, they'd look at me like i had three heads. it seem to go w/o saying to them that labor is always right and the man is always wrong. i have a lot of friends, myself included, who own small, marginally profitable businesses- making us the man. and all those people i know with small business do more in the interest of their community than any union i ever worked with. it really turned me against the "progressives" which I was once part of. -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Pete Coyle Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 10:38 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Halle Tempest Subject: Re: [UC] Philadelphia as "Shakedown Street" You shouldn't have to join a union. Life should be filled with variety. If you don't want to join a union, that should be a decision you make without repercussions. Our shop doesn't really have full time employees. We hire freelance artists, musicians, woodworkers, sometimes we even hire Cobraman. We don't offer job security or health insurance, and it's not because we are evil. It's because there are people who prefer this type of employment. They have a variety of jobs, they are self employed, they want freedom. To quote the Dead Kennedy's "Real freedom means responsibility". Sometimes they grow older, buy a house, and join the union. We can co-exist. Sometimes the unions act like thugs, and it's shameful, and primitive. Pete On Thursday, March 18, 2004, at 10:02 AM, Christy Bracken wrote: > I don't >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > own self interest - not the interest of "Real" workers and >> > [...] >> > and "real" workers will bear the brunt of the backlash. >> i'm curious who you think these "real" workers are. >> $7/hr wal-mart employees with no benefits? or maybe you're referring >> to >> any of the other 40 million americans lacking health insurance. >> "real" >> workers like that couldn't possibly benefit from union representation. >> mark > > I have been trying my best not to engage in this banter, but I just > can't help it. I guess I'm one of the "real" workers being referred to > above. No, I don't belong to a union, but yes, I do all right > income-wise. I don't live in a cardboard box or halfway house and I > have sufficient income to be able to shop at Whole Foods with a > certain amount of regularity. I have health and dental insurance and a > 401K plan. I do not understand this prevailing idea that in order to > have any sort of financial independence and/or benefit plan > whatsoever, that one must belong to a union. Someone please explain. > Seriously. I know lots of folks who have decent jobs that pay decent > wages and benefits in this city, and not one belongs to a union. > > Christy > > _________________________________________________________________ > All the action. All the drama. Get NCAA hoops coverage at MSN Sports > by ESPN. http://msn.espn.go.com/index.html?partnersite=espn > > ---- > You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the > list named "UnivCity." To unsubscribe or for archive information, see > <http://www.purple.com/list.html>. > ---- You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named "UnivCity." To unsubscribe or for archive information, see <http://www.purple.com/list.html>. ---- You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named "UnivCity." To unsubscribe or for archive information, see <http://www.purple.com/list.html>.
